Not sure whether...

I don't have any hobbies. I don't have any interests. That's the biggest problem. Other than going to Woody's I pretty much don't leave the house except to run errands.
I don't have any hobbies anymore. Writing is a career, and I gave up doing music, other than singing at karaoke, because it was causing more trouble for me trying to let go of S2. The books I usually talk about are the ones I've written; I don't remember the last time I read anything for pleasure. Lately I've been reading books about shamanism, Wicca, crystals, etc. but that isn''t something most guys are going to want to talk about.
I don't think you are being quite accurate here. Or at least you are confusing two things.

You do have interests - you dismiss writing (I don't think it matters that it became a carier), but what about energy healing and all the pagan/wiccan stuff? What about kink?
What about polyamory after all? You can bond with people over your lifestyle, or over the lifestyle of your children (that's another universe).

You seem to think they don't count because you don't leave the house to socialize without Woody, but that's really different.

If you feel like you don't have enough interests, that's not unchangeable (focusing on finding some curiosity inside yourself and putting it in practice should be enough), but I don't think it's the case.

It may of course be the case that your interests are not mainstream of course, so it's a little harder to connect with the majority of people. I experience this - I basically only connect with "geeks", because most people don't appreciate my disinterest in sports and movies. I did however met friends and partners via fantasy and science fiction, astronomy, go, maths and in the last two years this has shifted to polyamory, shibari, tantra (and still, most of the people I connect there with studied something similar to me :D).
I don't think I ever had a friend who had non of these things in common with me.

You don't leave the house to socialize, but I really hope that's not unchangeable either.
It's true that social life often costs money, which is an obstacle :( I hope this area gets better for you soon so you can afford a gathering now and then.
Maybe you can... I don't know... run a writer's meetup group yourself? Or... do barbecue with your neighbours?
 
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Very little advice, but I can sympathize, and blather about what I've tried to do for a bit... :eek:

After my divorce, and once I finally moved out, I had Chops around the new house half-time, and I had my kids around on the weekends, but I had no idea how to get my Extroverting done on the off-days. I'm not comfortable on dating sites because I'm not looking for a relationship, and many of my friends that I've gathered over time are either not particularly close by, or are busy with family themselves. Oh, and I need *some* time to myself so I can do stuff around the house (or when I've overscheduled myself and have to catch up on everything else I've missed!).

Meetup was a mixed bag, especially since my weekends aren't free. I found a Monday night gaming group that I've found to be a lot of fun, but everything else either cost money (honestly, I LOVED making fused glass, but holy heck is that expensive) or fizzled out, or was on the weekends (sigh).

I've tried to expand my network on a onesie-twosie basis as the opportunity presents - meeting the coworker (who was going through a particularly awful divorce) for dinner, meeting up with nearby folks from these boards (hi, Mags!), meeting up with friends I only knew tangentially in college and still live nearby... and some of them have really been surprisingly awesome friendships.

Are there any writers' groups nearby? My public library still has a physical bulletin board where people post things like this all the time. :)
 
Again, not arguing; thinking and processing. And it's just taken me an hour to write a post that didn't sound argumentative to me...

Energy healing and writing are means of earning money for me. Therefore, they cannot, by my definition, be "interests" or "hobbies", because interests and hobbies are things you do solely because they're fun and you enjoy them. If I'm doing something to earn money, I'm not doing it because it's fun and I enjoy it, I'm doing it to earn money. And the need to earn money from them makes them something that adds stress and pressure to my life, which makes them pretty much the opposite of fun...

Wicca-- I don't actually consider myself Wiccan. I have studied Wicca, because Woody gave me books to read, but have found it too restrictive and rules-oriented for my tastes. Likewise with the retreat Woody and I went on; there were times during the group rituals when I felt like I might as well have been sitting in a Christian church sanctuary praying and singing hymns, and standing and kneeling on command. I might call myself a Witch, but not a Wiccan.

The other things you mention (paganism, poly, kink) are, to me, too broad to be considered "shared interests" with anyone. One of the people I've met who I've had the *least* in common with was Highlight, who is also a polyamorous, kinky parent... but those labels, and Woody, were the only things we shared. Personality-wise, and as far as how we do any of those things, there was no bond or connection whatsoever.

(I've also been told I'm not really pagan because I don't do enough with nature; that I'm not really poly because my husband is monogamous; and that I'm not really kinky because for me being submissive is solely service-based and I don't know if I even have any other kinks.)

Some of the things you mention as *your* interests, I would agree are interests. Science fiction, fantasy, astronomy... those are all things that have a narrow enough definition that if you meet someone else who's into it, you are likely to get along and agree on at least some of what those things mean to you. Likewise with shibari and tantra. For others, gaming is an interest through which they meet people, or dance troupes, or certain sports, or whatever. I'm not interested in any of those things... (Woody tried to get me to join his folk dancing group, and I refused because at the time, Lips, along with a few of his and Highlight's kids, were part of it, and because I am not physically coordinated enough to do any type of organized dancing.)

Those things said, my depression and anxiety unquestionably play a role in this as well. Sometimes, because of depression, I feel no interest or joy in anything whatsoever and just go through the motions. Because of the cause of some of my anxiety, being in a group setting is exhausting and sometimes physically painful to me, because I'm in a constant state of mind-whirling about "am I allowed to say this? What if I make them angry? I don't know anything about this, how can I talk to them?" etc., so I avoid socializing with groups as much as possible unless someone is there who I know well, who knows my issues and limitations and will sort of run interference for me if I start to struggle.

Even at karaoke nights, for the most part I only talk to people beyond "hello" or "nice to meet you" if Woody says I have to, or on the rare occasions someone sits down near me and starts a conversation. If I try to think of something to say to anyone to start a conversation, my mind goes completely blank and I start panicking; when Woody tells me I have to talk to people, he has to give me specific things to say or I won't be able to obey. Most of the time, everyone is talking to people they're friends with who are also there, and Woody's bustling around playing host, so I end up sitting by myself being silent until the singing starts.

As for neighbors... I've lived in this town for seven years. The only people I know are a few of Alt's friends (I know the mother of one of them; don't know the others' parents at all), my in-laws, our landlord and her family, and the guy next door. The landlord and her family, I don't get along with because of personality clashes; they're loud and abrasive, which triggers me PTSD-wise. The guy next door recently threatened to vandalize Country's car if she parked in front of his house again--and he has no legal right to tell her where she can and can't park, because it's a public street and Country has a town parking permit, so she can park anywhere on any town street she chooses.
 
YAH, scheduling and cost are definitely two obstacles for me. And although I am open to dating someone, I'm extremely picky about who I even talk to, let alone decide to meet. (The last person I met up with from any dating site was SciFi, back in February...which became a great thing for Mouse.)

I've tried writers' groups in the past and didn't feel like any of them were good fits for me. Too much of "if you aren't doing it this way, you aren't doing it right", or they were focused mainly on genres other than what I write. And one group flat out told me that since some of my romances have gay couples, I wouldn't be welcome at their meetings.
 
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"And one group flat out told me that since some of my romances have gay couples, I wouldn't be welcome at their meetings."

Whew, that's pretty bad ... :eek:
 
I've also been told I'm not really pagan because I don't do enough with nature; that I'm not really poly because my husband is monogamous; and that I'm not really kinky because for me being submissive is solely service-based and I don't know if I even have any other kinks.
And one group flat out told me that since some of my romances have gay couples, I wouldn't be welcome at their meetings.
Where do all these people come from?? :eek: :(
 
Good Lord.

I second Nadya's comment (and Kevin's).
Sounds like you dodged a bullet by not having to be in a group with those folks. >_<
 
Not arguing either, ok? :eek: After all it's your question, I take you'll dismiss anything unsuitable.

Energy healing and writing are means of earning money for me. Therefore, they cannot, by my definition, be "interests" or "hobbies", because interests and hobbies are things you do solely because they're fun and you enjoy them. ...
Ok, let's not call them hobbies any more. But surely they once were your interests... you don't start a writing carrier without interest in writing... so I hope there is some enjoyment left besides the financial struggle?
They will have a similar social function like other people's "work interests" then. You meet someone who does something similar, so you exchange experience...

I have studied Wicca, because Woody gave me books to read, but have found it too restrictive and rules-oriented for my tastes. ... I might call myself a Witch, but not a Wiccan.
So probably not the right group (activity) for you. Although I remember you writing rather nicely about the retreat itself and poeple there..?
Any similar possibilities?

One of the people I've met who I've had the *least* in common with was Highlight, who is also a polyamorous, kinky parent... but those labels, and Woody, were the only things we shared. Personality-wise, and as far as how we do any of those things, there was no bond or connection whatsoever.
Of course not everyone you have a shared interest with will be also an interesting person :(

The other things you mention (paganism, poly, kink) are, to me, too broad to be considered "shared interests" with anyone. ...
Some of the things you mention as *your* interests, I would agree are interests. Science fiction, fantasy, astronomy... those are all things that have a narrow enough definition that if you meet someone else who's into it, you are likely to get along and agree on at least some of what those things mean to you. Likewise with shibari and tantra.
Actually I disagree. A liking of science fiction might be a little more specific then paganism, but not very much. What it did for me was bring me to conventions, where I had opportunity to bond with people over some fun activity.
And tantra is not very specific. Usually when I meet someone who's been to a different group, it's just like - oh, you did that, well, that's not our focus at all. But since we went to a course for half a year or so, with basically the same people each week, I got to know ~2 people I might want to keep in touch with.
Polyamory is not specific. But again, from visiting the local poly group a few times, I know there ~20 people I don't need to meet very often, one that is very much ok to talk too, and one friend I stay in touch with.
And I made another dear friend (we knew each other before as mere facebook acquitances) because she liked a webside about polyamory and I asked her to meet and tell me about her experience. This set up an intimate situation which allowed for a click.
So, it's not about the specificity. I's more about if you find activities which allow you to bond - and those activities are often related to interests.

Those things said, my depression and anxiety unquestionably play a role in this as well. Sometimes, because of depression, I feel no interest or joy in anything whatsoever and just go through the motions.
Those things said, I do get this, I really do :( I am far better then I was, but I remember the neverending blue clearly.

Because of the cause of some of my anxiety, being in a group setting is exhausting and sometimes physically painful to me, because I'm in a constant state of mind-whirling about "am I allowed to say this? What if I make them angry? I don't know anything about this, how can I talk to them?" etc., so I avoid socializing with groups as much as possible unless someone is there who I know well, who knows my issues and limitations and will sort of run interference for me if I start to struggle.
This seems to be the biggest issue then :(
Does this get better if you have already known the people for some time?
I used to be bad with groups, though not this bad, I think. It does get easier for me.
I often prefer one on one meetings. If I meet someone interesting, I will ask him out for tea to have a more intimate conversation. But I had to meet those people somewhere.
edit: So maybe use creative ways to set one on one meetings right away? Online networking, asking people you already know to set you up with someone,...?

As for neighbors... I've lived in this town for seven years. The only people I know are a few of Alt's friends (I know the mother of one of them; don't know the others' parents at all), my in-laws, our landlord and her family, and the guy next door.
I've only suggested this because my mom and a few others started organizing regular neighbour meetings for people from our street and they seem to be really successful. Just an inspiration.
 
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I mean this kindly not meanly, KC, you come across as a caring, vulnerable, self emasculating person.

You want thing to change but you are stuck on this treadmill of I can't.

Sometimes you have to let it go. Who cares what others think in a group situation. You are 40 something years old. They don't pay your bills who cares about their opinions. Not everyone is going to like you in this life. Just like there are people who don't like chocolate.

Get out and enjoy your life. If you want to try something do it. So the wiccans you have run into say xyz so there are others who believe abc. So what some poly people think you're doing it wrong. If it works for you and your partners who gives a crap what others think.

Be yourself. A lot of us here love you for who you are awkwardness and all. Give folks a chance to get to know the real you. I bet you're pretty awesome in person.
 
Tinwen, I knew you weren't arguing :) I just can't always correctly judge how my posts come across to others, so wanted to make sure I identified that one as thinking and processing, rather than arguing. Same thing with this post.

I understand better now what you meant. Part of my issues/awkwardness is that sometimes I am very, very literal, so when you said I could meet people with shared interests by going to groups that are about things I'm interested in, I saw it as "you and these people will have things in common because you're interested in the same thing." Now I understand that you meant "these groups are a place where you could meet people, and you might have more in common with some of them."

I haven't joined any Wicca groups yet. My seeing it as more regimented than I can get into is from the reading I've done and some conversations with Woody. There were some very nice people at the retreat Woody and I went to, and I would enjoy spending more time with some of them, but reaching out, as I posted in my blog not long ago, is something I'm still learning to do. None of them have reached out to me about hanging out or even chatting online, and I don't quite know how to bring up the subject.

Hanging out is another issue... I don't know what people do when they "hang out" together. Like... if I were to contact the woman from the retreat who told me how special I am and thanked me profusely for taking care of Woody, and wanted to ask if she wanted to get together, I would not know what to suggest for "getting together." In my adult life, the only friends I've had who I've "hung out" with have either been guys who understand how confusing it is for me (so we sit on their couch and chat), or guys I'm dating (so we sit on their couch and chat, or occasionally take off our clothes and have sex), or people who live with a guy I'm dating. So I don't know how it works for people who have friends that they get together with and hang out.

Tinwen, no, it doesn't really get easier when I know people better. I still catch myself tensing up and overthinking things even during casual conversations with Woody or Hubby. It is a little bit easier with them than with most people, but that's because they love me and have taken the time to listen and clarify when I've explained my difficulties to them, so I know if I say something wrong or can't get the words out, or take longer to speak than someone else would because I have to compose the sentence in my head first, they'll be patient and understanding.

I wish having someone connect me with other people was an option, but the only one I know well enough to ask for something like that is Woody, who alternates among "Well, I try, but you never seem to want to meet anyone" and "I don't know who to introduce you to" and "I'll think about it."

Dagferi, I recognized the negativity in my post. (Yesterday was a rough day, so some of the negativity came from things not part of this thread.) In some cases, the "I can't" are things beyond my control. Unless someone sits down and gives me an intensive course in "humaning", I think it's going to be difficult if not impossible for me to gain an understanding of how social situations work and what I'm supposed to do in them. I'm 45... I haven't gained that understanding yet, and not for lack of trying. And other than taking the meds I'm on, there is nothing I can do about the anxiety and depression, or the hypervigilance I have when I'm out in public.

But there are things that are within my control that I do need to work harder at. Woody and I were talking about some of that last night and this morning. I've asked him to do for me what he does for Mouse, i.e. flat out teach me how to interact with people in social situations, including roleplaying and giving me a "script" I can fall back on if all else fails, rather than telling me over and over that people like me and I need to be more social and talk to them.

He does the latter every time we go anywhere or talk about going anywhere, and he doesn't comprehend that to me, that's the equivalent of a movie director telling him "Go in front of the camera and do what your character's supposed to do and say your character's lines" without telling Woody anything about the character or giving him the lines and actions to learn. That was the analogy I gave him the other day, and I think it started getting through to him, at least.

Worrying about what people think in group situations... You're right that in general, their opinions don't matter, and I have let go of caring about the opinions of people I've met who I know don't like me (which I know about some of them because they've flat out said so). But in a social group where I'm meeting some people for the first time and want to make a good impression so they'll like me and want to hang out with me or whatever... I feel like the little girl standing at the edge of the playground waiting for someone to invite her to join the kickball game, while being terrified that if someone does invite her, she'll screw up and lose the entire game for her team. I am 45, but at times like that I *feel* like I"m about 7, because that's pretty much my social functioning level. Which is something that can maybe be fixed with practice, I don't know.

It's also hard not to worry about what they think if I'm perceiving the *entire* group as disliking or ignoring me....If it's just some of the people, I can dismiss it, but if it's everyone, then I start wondering why I'm even there and what's wrong with me, and end up leaving. Or having a panic attack. That's something I need to figure out how to work with... if I'm in a group where I connect with at least a few people and can have a conversation, that's good, but if I walk in and no one talks to me and I can't think of anything to say to any of them, and feel no connection at all, that's when it really becomes a problem.

Dagferi, thank you for what you say in your last paragraph. That made me get all sappy-weepy... but seriously, thank you. Woody said almost exactly the same thing (minus the part about people on this forum) to me last night.

Next post...
 
Some of this is stuff I can figure out ways to work with if I get out of my bullshit "I can't do this" attitude. (I do recognize when it's bullshit, I just don't always manage to snap out of it instead of wallowing.) Some of it is stuff Woody can help me with, and has said he will--and has told me to keep reminding him so it doesn't get set aside. Thinking about it, I've asked him to specifically point out things others do that he considers them flirting with me, or them enjoying a conversation with me, and he has consistently said he will, and then not done so and when I remind him, he says, "Well, it's obvious, how can you not see it?" The fact that I *don't* see it is where some of these problems are coming from.

Some would be stuff I would need to work on with my therapist, but that's a whole other issue; my therapist cuts me off in the middle of sentences, and every time I say "I'm having this problem now", instead of saying "Okay, let's solve it," she says, "Well, that's because of this thing that happened in the past, so of course you're that way." Which carries the implication "You can't change, so you just have to deal with it." I told Woody last night that I recognize that I've begun using my past as a crutch or excuse for behaviors that I *can* change if I try...and I realized after sleeping on it that in large part that's because my therapist is reinforcing my doing that. I wasn't doing that last year at this time. I only started it after Woody and I met, which was the same time I started working with this therapist regularly.

I have an appointment with her Monday and am going to talk to her about changing therapists. (At that clinic, you have to ask your therapist to refer you to another therapist if there's a personality clash or something... which, given the level of mental illness and dysfunctionality of some of the clients there strikes me as counterproductive at best and downright cruel at worst. That policy is why I've stuck it out this long with this therapist.) If I am going to work on these things, and actually make progress that stays made, I need someone backing me professionally who's going to encourage me to change and improve, not consistently imply that I can't.

Meanwhile...

Last night, on the way to meet Woody's friends for dinner, we stopped at the home of another friend of his. I met her at Woody's Solstice party, and really enjoyed her "fuck everything and have fun" attitude and our conversation. At the time, she was in remission from cancer. Recently her cancer recurred, and she's been leaning quite a bit on Woody for help. When she was fighting cancer before, he was there as a support and help for her, and he has a lot of resources and information, and understanding, because of his wife. Also, if I've understood correctly, this woman is a former partner of his.

So last night we stopped at her place because Woody had something he needed to drop off for her. He checked with her to make sure it was okay for me to be there with him, because she's in chemo now and so isn't up to dealing with people a lot of the time. When she saw me, she said she remembered me from the party and was glad to see me again, that she'd enjoyed our conversation.

When we met up with his friends, dinner went well, partly because Woody was very obviously making the effort to keep the conversation going around so everyone was included. At the end, the friend who was in the car accident said "I'm so glad we finally managed to do this, because I've really been wanting to get to know you better and I'm glad to have the chance to spend time with you."

So yeah, there are things I clearly miss, or misperceptions on my part about whether people like me... Woody also told me that a few people I met at the retreat have told him how much they liked me and hope to see me again.
 
The intensive course on human-ing... ever read any Captain Awkward? she's an advice columnist that talks a lot about making yourself scripts for difficult conversations and etc - I think her style might appeal to you.
 
I understand better now what you meant. Part of my issues/awkwardness is that sometimes I am very, very literal, so when you said I could meet people with shared interests by going to groups that are about things I'm interested in, I saw it as "you and these people will have things in common because you're interested in the same thing." Now I understand that you meant "these groups are a place where you could meet people, and you might have more in common with some of them."
Yeah, that's kind of the point... but actually I believe in the first one too... just like there will be common mindsets and knowledge among mathematians, there will be common mindsets and knowledge among pagan people. It's just often more visible from the outside than from the inside. While a few common mindsets can make things a little easier, they by no means imply that you will like each other :)
I would not know what to suggest for "getting together." In my adult life, the only friends I've had who I've "hung out" with have either been guys who understand how confusing it is for me (so we sit on their couch and chat), or guys I'm dating (so we sit on their couch and chat, or occasionally take off our clothes and have sex), or people who live with a guy I'm dating.
My default for getting together is to go to a tearoom, sit around and chat. Not that different ;). Sometimes I go swimming with someone.
Unless someone sits down and gives me an intensive course in "humaning", I think it's going to be difficult if not impossible for me to gain an understanding of how social situations work and what I'm supposed to do in them. I'm 45... I haven't gained that understanding yet, and not for lack of trying. And other than taking the meds I'm on, there is nothing I can do about the anxiety and depression, or the hypervigilance I have when I'm out in public.
To me you don't sound, from writing, that you do not understand human interactions. Your writing makes sense overall and you are very sensitive to people on this forum. To me you rather sound terrified.
I may be projecting, but I see social anxiety very much connected with the belief that you are "supposed" to meet outside expectations. It's similar to wanting to do everything right in life (while there is no "right" way). If you want to always meet expectations, you are set up to fail, while at the same time being terrified of failure.
So may I gently suggest, that the idea that you are "supposed" to do something special in social interactions doesn't serve you well?
A better guideline may be to find out what you want to do with other people. Do you enjoy an activity or a way of conversation? Show it. People who enjoy the same will join. Even people with different preferences will appreciate your enjoyment.

Anyway, you seem to be on track finding things you can do. Good luck :)
 
Thanks, Tinwen.

I understand human interactions somewhat. It's specifically social situations (like asking someone if they want to get together, or being in a group of people at a club, or even going out to dinner with my boyfriend and a couple of his friends) that I don't understand.

It's also far easier on a forum than in person, because forums are written communication, which is comfortable and easy for me. I don't worry as much about saying the wrong thing, because I can take the time I need to figure out what I "should" say. In person, I feel pressure to speak immediately or else everyone will be bored or think I'm rude, and that pressure causes me to be unable to think of anything to say, which puts more pressure on me, and so on.

I do see what you're saying about maybe there isn't a specific set of "rules" governing social situations, but I perceive there to be one. I was raised by a mother whose father was a bigwig executive and, for a little while, diplomat, so she was brought up with certain standards and expectations of behavior. She raised me with standards and expectations, but never actually told me what they were until I didn't meet them--and then it wasn't a calm reaction, it was yelling, swearing, and sometimes slapping. I was in an impossible situation; I couldn't meet standards without knowing what they were, but I got punished for not meeting them. Which led to me being constantly anxious and on guard any time I was in any social setting, because I might say or do the wrong thing and not meet the standards, and get yelled at, sworn at, or slapped.

She also got angry and belittled me if I needed to stop and think about how to answer a question or say something; she became impatient and would tell me to stop being stupid, or to shut up if I couldn't hurry up and get to the point. So I worry, when I start having trouble figuring out how to verbalize something, that the people I'm with will react the same way. Hubby also becomes impatient if I have to stop and think or if he feels that I'm taking too long to get to a point, and while he isn't mean about it, he will cut me off and say "Just get to the point" or "I can't listen to any more of this." He's better about it than he used to be, because I managed to get through to him how damaging and disrespectful that behavior was to me, but he still does it. Even Woody and my therapist have done it, so sometimes I just shut down and don't talk at all.

Even though it might not be rational to fear that other people will get angry with me...well, fear isn't rational, and neither is anxiety. Because it became so deeply ingrained, and it's become a facet of the anxiety disorder I've been diagnosed with, correcting it isn't as simple as just thinking "Oh, that doesn't make sense, of course no one's going to get mad if I don't say the right thing" and then being fine...because the fear is coming from a part of my psyche that was damaged by someone getting mad at me, over and over, for not saying/doing the right thing. And since I don't actually know what "the right thing" is, because no one has ever actually told me, there's no way to resolve the fear by thinking "Okay, I know I should say this, and not say that."

That isn't to say I can't change or improve the problem. I can. But it's going to take a lot more work than just telling myself I'm being irrational. I *know* I'm being irrational, and I know what the rational way of looking at the issue is. What I am stuck on is how to translate that knowledge into what I actually *feel* and *believe.*

For people on the autism spectrum, there are sometimes support groups, therapy, or even classes on how to behave in social situations. For example, when Country was in middle school, she was put into a group in which they ate lunch together once a week to practice how to have a friendly, taking-turns conversation in a casual setting; they played games to practice following rules, taking turns, and being gracious when the game didn't go their way; they roleplayed scenarios in which manners and respect were necessary so even if the kids didn't understand *why* those things were necessary, they understood that they were and had the tools to use. The group was run by the school's speech/language pathologist, who also took them to her home twice a year for a small party that involved some of her friends and family members (sanctioned by the school, with parental permission; her home was walking distance from the school) so they could practice social skills in a real social setting rather than a contrived one.

That's the kind of thing I would greatly benefit from, because then I would have some level of comfort and assurance that I can cope appropriately in social settings. Regardless of how accurate my perception is that I *can't* cope, I have that perception because I don't have knowledge. If I had the knowledge, even if it wasn't applicable all the time (or even necessary), I would *feel* like I knew what I was doing. While that kind of thing isn't available to me because I"m not identified as being on the autism spectrum, it is something people--specifically Woody--can do with me informally. Woody and Doll are actors; they can act the roles of people in various social situations so I can practice what to say, and they can correct me if I'm off course.

By off course, I mean things like having someone ask me "How are you" and me responding, for example, "Well, I'm not so great today, I had an argument with my teenager". I don't do that kind of thing *now,* because someone took the time to explain to me that when people ask "how are you" in a social setting--or a store, restaurant, etc.--they aren't looking for an actual answer, they're just being polite, and the "correct" way to respond is "I'm good thanks, how are you." But I had to be *taught* that; before I learned, I TMI'ed just about everyone I met. And even now, I have to consciously remind myself of what I should say in that situation. Most other people seem to take it for granted that "how are you" is not a literal question, but I didn't know it wasn't until I was told.

As for figuring out what I want to do with other people, or talking to other people about what I like doing so they might join in... that's the kind of thing about which my mind goes completely blank. Being with other people is stressful and frightening to me, so my innate reaction is to want to avoid it, and if I can't avoid it--or choose not to, because I'm stubborn and don't actually like having these issues--my innate reaction is to sit quietly in a corner and only speak if spoken to so I don't fuck up. If I'm asked "So, KC, what do you do for hobbies," I'm either going to respond as I did here, "I don't have any," or I'm not going to respond at all because I feel put on the spot and so my mind blanks out.
 
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Re (from KC43):
"Some would be stuff I would need to work on with my therapist, but that's a whole other issue; my therapist cuts me off in the middle of sentences ..."

In my opinion that's an incredibly bad thing for a therapist to do. :mad:

Sorry to hear about how your mother acted. That was really mean (and dumb) of her.

I don't know of a right or wrong thing to say or do in a social situation; being polite and respectful is enough. I'm not strong in social situations myself. I don't usually say much in a typical gathering. It's hard for me to get to know people. It's awkward.

Sorry I don't have any answers for you at the moment. Just a few observations.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
I think that the key to social situations is being able to read nonverbal feedback from other people. That's the hard part, the challenge, and the thing that will make you comfortable or not, make you good at doing social situations or not.

It's OK to be quiet. I am a raging extrovert who LOVES social situations and sometimes even I don't want to talk that much. Maybe I am tired, or my throat is sore because I've actually BEEN talking a ton for a while (happens with some of my bigger get togethers actually.) I have learned when to excuse myself and give myself permission to not be "on" for everybody.

I have yet to meet anyone who had a problem with it, judged me for it, or thought or said that I wasn't living up to any expectations over it.

One of the most socially successful introverts (and I mean extreme intovert) that I know is the lady who runs my local BDSM club. She has mastered the art of the smile-and-nod. It's a brilliant solution to the many times that people in the community want to interact with her, but she just isn't feeling it. Smile and nod. Makes people feel that she is being warm, but doesn't encourage them too much to keep on trying to engage. Eventually if smile and nod is all you're putting out, people will quit buggin' ya...and they won't feel bad towards you when they do.

But as to the "How are you"...lol...I over-share like nobody's business. I'm a TMI machine! But I'm aware of it and do it on purpose. I do my best not to make people uncomfortable, but there are certain details about myself that I WANT people to know. It's a sort of activism on my part to help people be more tolerant of unusual ideas. But "How are you"...oh boy.

When I was a feral teen on the east coast, those casual niceties would be met by inner hostility. "You don't know me! You don't care if I have a nice day! Quit blowing sunshine up my ass!"

Eventually growing up a lot and living in friendlier places changed that. But working in an office, there is a whole world of casual small talk that usually means absolutely nothing flying around, all the time. But I don't like the scripted Q and A. I want to go off script even if people aren't able or willing to give time to a real answer. I'm weird and I will BE weird dangit! So I often answer, "How are you?" with "I don't even know anymore." and "Hey, how ya doing?" with an imitation of Joey from Friends, "How YOU doinnn..." and I sling around made up nonsense like, "Que pasta?" and "De noodles!"

The one I hate though...just...it makes me irrationally annoyed...is when you ask someone how they are doing or something, and they respond with the day of the week. "Hey how's it going?" "It's Tuesday." ...I...have no idea what that even means...and it makes me want to do something silly like point and wink and say, "Plaid pizza." or "Puppy hats." Like hey, I get to make up unrelated answers to questions too, man...

In case it wasn't obvious, I just really like to be silly. People seem to like silly. And it's far easier to maintain than pretty, poised, classy, or perfect. :)
 
Sigh... I miss KC. I hope she's not so freaked out she'll never come back.
 
:confused: Has something happened that would scare her off? I don't mean to take her for granted, I was just wondering.
 
:confused: Has something happened that would scare her off? I don't mean to take her for granted, I was just wondering.

Yes, someone from outside our board stalked her blog, got upset, and NYCindie deleted about a year's worth of posts.
 
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