It's a Texlahoma Story

When I first started dating my ex-husband, I realized I was doing what I called "shrinking to fit." Like those ads for Levi's jeans. I tried to be what I thought my hubby wanted me to be - and this exasperated him to no end! Just be yourself and you'll be fine. No more shrinking to fit, okay, Claire!

I love that phrase! I am going to remember that one!
 
Well fuck.

So I have been sitting here for like two hours writing this email to Dag. And my phone dings, an email from him. Just a long, sweet, kind note about how happy he is with me and how important I am. It ended with this...

Lately, our emails have usually been when something is a bit off, feeling amiss, weird, etc. I wanted to change it up and send you a note that is absolutely positive.

I love you and I can't wait to see you again. As promised, I'll work with you to get some 'us' time established on a regular basis.


How am I supposed to send my "something is a bit off" email now? :rolleyes:
 
I am going to offer up the view that Claire has told Dag what she wants, over and over ad nauseum. She has said that here. The problem is, Dag always says he will, and then he DOESN'T FOLLOW THROUGH.

I think he wants to see her more than once a week. I think he'd love one "date date," out doing something, and one sex date. But he just won't get himself the freedom from his wife and family to do so. And sometimes he won't even follow through on a planned date, leaving Claire hanging time and time again...

To me, this is not a "great guy," who is longing for her to just tell him what she needs and wants, so he can deliver. He seems unwilling and/or unable, to give her the minimum of the kind of relationship she needs to feel satisfied.

Sure, he's fun when he damn well pleases to get together. Sometimes they even get away for a weekend. But by and large, he's leaving her hanging, over and over, and can't see her more than once a week, if that. It isn't enough. He may be just as nice as can be, but he just isn't available enough for a romantic woman like Claire, who assesses friendships and relationships as "drop everything and fly across the country," "stay up all night for several nights in a row counseling," and so on.

It seems to me Claire isn't only trying to shrink to fit. It seems to me that she fears if she didn't push push push, she'd rarely see him. Or never see him.
 
I agree with you, Mags. It reads as though Dag wants to do more with Claire - and agrees to. Then he can't follow through.

It almost comes across as if he is dishonest (with himself as much as with Claire).

I can't remember how old his kids are but until we all grew up and were in college, there is no way either of my parents would have had time to go out alone to see anybody once or twice a week. They were too busy parenting to have much life outside of family.

Trips out without being accompanied by one of us were quite rare while we were children. My Dad was a keen golfer but it wasn't a hobby he could do until we'd grown up - it took too much time away from his family to do. Instead, my parents did hobbies that we could all do. Maybe it just isn't possible for Dag to get out much - but he could be honest and say that if it is the case.
 
Well fuck.

So I have been sitting here for like two hours writing this email to Dag. And my phone dings, an email from him. Just a long, sweet, kind note about how happy he is with me and how important I am. It ended with this...

Lately, our emails have usually been when something is a bit off, feeling amiss, weird, etc. I wanted to change it up and send you a note that is absolutely positive.

I love you and I can't wait to see you again. As promised, I'll work with you to get some 'us' time established on a regular basis.


How am I supposed to send my "something is a bit off" email now? :rolleyes:

Those were interesting words. Just words. Ever hear the expression, talk is cheap?
 
I agree with you, Mags. It reads as though Dag wants to do more with Claire - and agrees to. Then he can't follow through.

It almost comes across as if he is dishonest (with himself as much as with Claire).

I can't remember how old his kids are but until we all grew up and were in college, there is no way either of my parents would have had time to go out alone to see anybody once or twice a week. They were too busy parenting to have much life outside of family.

Trips out without being accompanied by one of us were quite rare while we were children. My Dad was a keen golfer but it wasn't a hobby he could do until we'd grown up - it took too much time away from his family to do. Instead, my parents did hobbies that we could all do. Maybe it just isn't possible for Dag to get out much - but he could be honest and say that if it is the case.


Yes. I am 60. I didn't even start to dabble in poly with my ex husband until my kids were 14, 17 and 19. And I soon saw I didn't have emotional energy or time for it. I stopped and waited 8 more years. One of the kids had a severe mental illness which was very draining.

I don't like to date people who have young kids (or older kids with special needs or mental illness). I've tried it and it's extremely frustrating. Just not worth it. miss pixi can't have kids, and Punk doesn't like them. Makes them much more available for me.
 
What Magdylyn expressed ... That's how it *feels* to me. I don't know if it's the factual reality or not. Maybe I'm too timid in how I ask. Maybe I don't make it clear these are big deal needs, as opposed to "would be kinda nice" things. But I do feel like I ask for things, and don't get them, and then start all over.

Of course, even if I don't know if the problem is the way I ask or the way he responds... Only one of those is something I can control. So, more asking, less letting it go when I don't get needs met.

I managed to respond to Dag's email and still say what I needed to say. Basically I thanked him for his words and reassurances, and admitted I really needed them because I've been feeling anxious and insecure about us lately.

A lot of my frustration just comes from feeling taken for granted... So hearing the words DOES help. It's not face time, but it's something.

IP, Dag's kids are 9 and 12, but the 12 year old has special needs (like, she performs at grade level, but has a special education program, and lots of specialists, and has rough days sometimes both at school and at home.) So his home life is pretty time consuming. He and his wife really do work hard to give each other "nights off" ... But she's a SAHM and gets burnt out sometimes.

His family is definitely the main reason I a) feel guilty for being needy, time-wise, and b) put up with way more scheduling flakiness than I normally would.

Actually, I wonder if I'm melting down *now* because his family has been on vacation for two weeks, but the busy/ flaky factor hasn't changed. Like, the excuse in my head for why our relationship is this way vanished, and I realized, huh, he's just like this with me.

Hmmm.
 
Sounds like he just doesn't have the time and space in his life to be available for the sort of time you need to feel happy. I think it's understandable that he would want a break and time away from his family. I know I would - but it probably isn't realistic.

My mum was a SAHM. There were 3 of us - none having any special needs. We were just pretty ordinary kids. Still - she wanted dad home in the evenings. So did we. We saw way more of mum since she was home all the time. By the time Dad got home from work each night, we wanted to see him. To have him play with us, help us with homework, help with dinner time, hear about our days - and so on.

My sister and her partner are raising 4 kids. They do work quite hard at giving each other time away from the family - maybe once or twice a month one of them looks after the kids while the other goes out. Once or twice a year one of them looks after the kids while the other has a few days holidaying with friends. Other than that, they are busy parenting. None of their kids have any special needs.

I just don't see how it would be possible to parent school age children well while having a partner that is not able to spend time in the family home - unless the partner is happy having very little time spent with them.

Also - Dag is used to doing his own thing, he's used to you not being in his home, he's used to not making plans with you until the last minute and dropping them at short notice. He won't change those habits just because his family are away for a couple of weeks. It isn't enough time to change those sorts of long-term habits. Nothing to do with you at all.

You are a lovely person and are bending over backward for him. I don't think he's being nasty or that he doesn't care - he just isn't available in the way you need.

IP
 
At some point yesterday I just completely burnt out on ~processing~ :rolleyes: Like, I'm pretty sure I don't want to feel any emotions again, ever.

Things with Dag... We shall see, I guess. I want things to work. He wants things to work. That is, sadly, no guarantee that they will.

Andy and I drove up to the lake tonight, in the morning I'll get up early (even for me, lol) and do a sunrise beach walk with my dogs. Then yard work, grocery shopping, and trying to fix the old spare fridge - because boat and cookout Sunday :D

I am in desperate need of a fun, boozy, sun-soaked weekend.
 
Poison ivy on my ankles and a sunburn on my butt - summer!!! :D

Seriously, this was just a PERFECT weekend. Saturday Andy and I did yard work and repairs - we have 2 working refrigerators now! Saturday evening we cheered K's oldest at his performance, and cried during the Father's Day tribute to R, aka The Best (Step)Dad Ever. Then onto a dive bar that was a mix of local good ole boys and pretentious hipster weekenders trying to act like locals.

And Sunday ... K, R, and the boys came up early for a hike, then we all piled on the boat and headed out to one of the islands in the lake. Our lake house next door neighbors (T and D2) came to join us with jet skis in tow, and we all took turns riding those. A whole afternoon of swimming, splashing, and lying on the beach. The boys had mud fights and buried each other in the sand, the adults passed around pina coladas, everyone was in heaven.

Especially me, because finally getting a day with K and my lake house BFF D2 was awesome. Took about five minutes before they turned to me and shrieked, "I LOVE HER!" in unison. K and R are actually musing about buying a place up there when they get finished fixing up their current house! We went back to our place, grilled steaks, and daydreamed about all of us being able to retire up there someday.

Which got me thinking... Why am I 100% thrilled to make life plans with my friends, but terrified of being asked to make them with a metamour :confused:

The obvious answer is that I adore my friends, and I can't know that I'd necessarily feel that way about anyone Andy happened to fall in love with. Also, there's not the same pressure with friends; no one is saying, "If you can't promise to retire next door to me, we have to end our friendship."

But the real reason - and the kinda shameful one? - is that planning this stuff with friends still preserves the default "couple" setting. If for whatever reason plans change, it is assumed by all that Andy and I will still live together, K and R will live together, T and D2 will live together. There's no thought that Andy might somehow decide to live with K instead of me. Couples are a package deal. Whereas if we planned our retirement with a girlfriend of Andy's, and she and I ended up disagreeing on where to live... There's that chance Andy would stay with her, at least some of the time :cool: That pressure - compromise with your metamour, or risk losing your full time husband - that freaks me out. Not a worry with any of our current relationships, but something I think about.
 
I've basically reached the point of just trying not to think about Dag, because thinking about him makes me sad. Kinda hard since we still text all day :rolleyes:

On Friday he said he'd let me know by Monday what would be a good day for our regular date. Then it was never mentioned again. He invited me to a movie Thursday night. Does this mean he wants that to be our regular time? I could ask. Maybe I *should* ask. But I am waiting to see if he says anything. Because I made a Big Deal out of this being important to me, and I'm wondering if he'll follow up, or just forget.

Yup, I've also reached the game playing stage.

There's a huge outdoor concert by one of the lakes near our Dallas house coming up. Always so much fun. It's hotter than hell and crowded with drunken idiots, so the only real way to go is to get a room at the hotel adjacent to the park and watch from your balcony, or the hotel pool. Of course everyone does this, so the hotel is as much of a madhouse as the park, but there's bathrooms and air conditioning ;) I used to go with a friend every year, but she moved last summer, so last year I took Dag. We ended up spending the whole evening in bed and missed the show :eek:

This year, I'm torn. I'd like to go with Dag and actually see the concert! But things feel so weird and stressful and upside down with him right now :( I've been pondering inviting K and R, and seeing if that doesn't convince Andy to give up his standard "too damn hot and crowded" stance on the event.

It just sucks that I'm not excited to make plans with Dag anymore. I don't want to be that way, to stop putting in the effort. But its hard for me right now to muster the enthusiasm.
 
Well I wouldn't call waiting for Dag to make good on his promise "playing games." If he's made a promise he should be able to make good on it without having to be reminded. If he does intend Thursdays to be your night together, surely he would say that. But if I were you I'd wait until he actually does make Thursdays your regular night, instead of getting your hopes up if he said he'd intend it to be the case. He's promised you a lot along those lines.

It feels like he's not learning to speak your love language.

I would suggest you to try to go to the concert with K and R, and with Andy if you can convince him. You know you'll have some much-needed fun with them. At this point surely that's preferable to another tense meetup with Dag, right?
 
It feels like he's not learning to speak your love language.

If only I knew what that was... Is Relationship Escalator a love language ;)

I mean, I've read the love languages book, I've taken the quiz. I always score off the charts on Words and low on everything else. Eh, words are very important to me, but they're not enough all by themselves. I think the way the test was written didn't measure me very well :cool: Physical touch is super important to me, but it's not what makes me feel loved. And I also have a weird hybrid Gifts/Acts of Service/Quality time thing that is hard to explain...

I don't care if someone buys me flowers. But I do cherish gifts from the heart. It made me feel loved when my best friend in high school bought a Barbie car, painted it the EXACT color of my car with Hard Candy nail polish, and put Barbies that looked like us in it for my Christmas present.

Washing the dishes, cleaning the house... I'd rather do that stuff myself so it gets done my way! But I got all warm and fuzzy when R took one look at the lake house plans and started planning how he'd help :)

As for time... The love languages book talks a lot about turning of the tv and staring at each other while talking about feelings, which strikes me as both incredibly boring and somewhat creepy. On the other hand... Celebrating birthdays and holidays together is HUGE to me. It makes me feel loved that I'm invited to all of K's kids performances. It makes me feel loved that D showed up to both my dogs' graduations from puppy kindergarten. It makes me feel loved that T and D2 came out to meet everyone at the lake last weekend.

I just love doing stuff with my people. Not just "fun" stuff but big projects and mundane daily shit. When I was in college, I organized group grocery shopping runs, because why not make the boring crap a fun night out?

My happiest moments are when I'm surrounded by my friends. I was a weird outcast of a kid, with my nose in a book, hippie parents and homemade clothes. I felt so *apart* from the normal kids. I didn't really have friends until high school, when I could finally socialize in a bigger group, and without having to get rides or permission from my parents or my crazy relatives. And it was like heaven, finally feeling accepted, finally feeling like I belonged - finding the family I'd missed out on growing up in crazy town.

Since then I've made my friends my priority, I don't take them for granted, I know how lucky I am to have so many incredibly amazing people to love. I'm also lucky Andy is the same way. Neither of us has ever felt the need to limit or police each other's friendships. Quite the opposite. Seeing Andy with Steph or K or any of his friends... That's the ultimate heart bursting love and happiness. I just love how close he is with them. It breaks my heart in the most amazingly wonderful way.

So hmmmm... Is Hang Out With My Friends a love language? Wait, wasn't that a line in a Spice Girls song :eek:
 
Well I don't see why not. The main problem I have with how most people see love languages is that they assume that others' love languages will be intelligible--or at least understood--by themselves. Having a love language that "doesn't fit" doesn't mean you're odd or outside the norm.

I think of love languages how I think of spoken languages. Some people (like my ex) can express themselves in many different languages. And perhaps that describes you with love languages: you express how you love someone in more than one way. I think a lot more of us are "multilingual" in love languages than in spoken languages...probably less of us males than females.

I used to speak French but I understand a lot of it. I can read a lot of Latin, a bit less Spanish, some German, a lot less Catalan. Although I only express myself in one language, I can understand many more of them. I don't think you need to express a love language to be able to understand it. The Signal's demonstration of love through signs and symbols is something that I don't express myself, but I have grown to understand it. Often I have to be careful with how I display symbols around The Signal. Something that is not as important to me is important to her, because she believes that is one of the ways one demonstrates love, or lack of it.

I don't think love languages are about "talking about feelings"...as you say that's dull and forced. What I think they're really about is how one expresses feelings towards someone else. If The Star felt like "wearing clothes someone got for me" was expressing love (and by goodness she did!), then that was one of her love languages. All it means is the answer to the question "how does one express love?"

I think what's going on with Dag isn't so much that he doesn't share your love language. I've never shared anyone's language really. It's more that he doesn't understand it. I can say to myself, "if I carry up the laundry, The Signal will see that as a loving gesture." Personally I don't care about that (now if someone sewed on a button, rowrrr!) The important thing is that I realize that's how The Signal sees love. And I will do the things that The Signal sees as loving because I want to demonstrate that love to her.

It feels more like an illiteracy of language with Dag. He isn't providing what you are looking for because he doesn't see it as love. And I guess only you can make the call as to whether he will ever understand that. I wouldn't say this is necessarily a failing on Dag's part. Sometimes our pieces do not fit, the words which inspire emotion in one fall flat for another. No one is to blame. But on the other hand can you continue speaking to him when your language means nothing to him?
 
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I haven't been posting here much lately - and honestly life has been better for it. I've realized that the more I write about Dag and about poly, the crappier I feel. When I just live my life - a full, happy, exciting life, of which Dag is a very small part - I'm generally upbeat and positive. When I get into the obsessive mode of Dag-Dag-Dag, I get depressed and down on myself.

I have no idea if Dag and I will stay together or not. Truth? I don't much care one way or the other. I feel guilty about that, because I feel like I *should* care. But, if we broke up, I'd find someone else, or not. Maybe I'd focus my energy on Andy and my friends and my projects.

It's funny to see how much of my "Dag could break up with me at any moment and he wouldn't miss me at all!" panic is me projecting my own feelings onto him. Because, I could break up with him at any moment and, well, I'd miss him (???), but my life wouldn't change. I'd have 3 or 4 hours more free a week for gardening.

I've gotten a lot of advice here to "be true to myself" and "love myself" and a whole bunch of stuff that sounds like New Age gobbledygook to me. But I think maybe what everyone was trying to tell me was that it's ok to be me - even if being me means admitting that I just plain don't want a romantic or sexual relationship with someone who isn't a life partner.

I've also heard a lot of "face your insecurities" and "grow as a person", and I admit I feel like a failure in those respects. I really, really, really tried to be happy in a long term no relationship escalator situation, but I just can't. It feels too shaky to me, too fragile, too fleeting. I like my wedding ring and my joint real estate and my dozens of shared friends. I like waking up next to my partner every single day.

Will I ever try poly again, if things end with Dag? I don't know. If there was someone who was already a close friend, someone I already believed would be a "forever person", maybe. Or the occasional NRE fueled fling. I'm going to work on giving myself permission to end relationships when they stop working for me. It's actually much easier to think about doing that now, when I feel like I tried as hard as I could and still couldn't "fix" things with Dag.

Anyway, that's where I am right now. I'm already crying again, as I always do lately when I write on this blog, feeling like a horrible person with no heart and no soul.
 
I haven't been posting here much lately - and honestly life has been better for it. I've realized that the more I write about Dag and about poly, the crappier I feel. When I just live my life - a full, happy, exciting life, of which Dag is a very small part - I'm generally upbeat and positive. When I get into the obsessive mode of Dag-Dag-Dag, I get depressed and down on myself.

I will miss you greatly if you stop posting, but if not posting is improving your life, then that's definitely the priority! Maybe just check back in (poly or not!) just so those of us who care know you're still alive? :cool:
 
I'm not going to vanish :) I'll be stalking you and Rider for as long as you're writing!!

And I'll always be poly-by-proxy, Steph and Andy will be together forever. I may even blog some occasionally, I just can't keep chronicling the ups and downs of Dag. It gets me too focused on the one part of my life that isn't going so well, and I lose sight of all the good stuff. I need to just let things with Dag be whatever they're going to be, and that's soooo much easier to do when I chill the fuck out about it ;)

Mostly I just need to remember that I have an amazing husband, wonderful friends, work I love, the world's cutest dogs, dreams I'm working toward every day... That's enough. If I can't (or just don't want to) juggle a second relationship, that's ok.

It's hard sometimes to be here, and see how hard everyone works on their relationships, and not wonder what's wrong with me, that I could just walk away from mine. It's hard to hear "all my partners are equally loved and important", and not feel guilty that I could give up Dag, but could never, ever, ever, ever lose Andy. And sometimes it's just hard to be surrounded by folks who love deeply in all manner of crazy situations, and be the weirdo who prefers boring marriage, and not feel emotionally stunted.

So I'm just going to let things settle a little, and see where a relationship with Dag lands on my priority list once I've stopped obsessively blogging about him. Maybe we'll be friends, maybe we'll stay lovers, who knows. But I need to figure out what *I* want, without worrying about what people will think or whether I'll be judged harshly for it.
 
I'm not going to vanish :) I'll be stalking you and Rider for as long as you're writing!!

And I'll always be poly-by-proxy, Steph and Andy will be together forever. I may even blog some occasionally, I just can't keep chronicling the ups and downs of Dag. It gets me too focused on the one part of my life that isn't going so well, and I lose sight of all the good stuff. I need to just let things with Dag be whatever they're going to be, and that's soooo much easier to do when I chill the fuck out about it ;)

Mostly I just need to remember that I have an amazing husband, wonderful friends, work I love, the world's cutest dogs, dreams I'm working toward every day... That's enough. If I can't (or just don't want to) juggle a second relationship, that's ok.

It's hard sometimes to be here, and see how hard everyone works on their relationships, and not wonder what's wrong with me, that I could just walk away from mine. It's hard to hear "all my partners are equally loved and important", and not feel guilty that I could give up Dag, but could never, ever, ever, ever lose Andy. And sometimes it's just hard to be surrounded by folks who love deeply in all manner of crazy situations, and be the weirdo who prefers boring marriage, and not feel emotionally stunted.

So I'm just going to let things settle a little, and see where a relationship with Dag lands on my priority list once I've stopped obsessively blogging about him. Maybe we'll be friends, maybe we'll stay lovers, who knows. But I need to figure out what *I* want, without worrying about what people will think or whether I'll be judged harshly for it.
I hope I didn’t come across as judgmental when I posted the information I did about self-compassion. I wanted to give you a viewpoint that I know I hadn't thought of or heard of until my therapist introduced me to it. I don't think there's anything wrong with loving the way that feels authentic to you. It doesn't matter if it wouldn't be authentic to anyone else here, it's what feels good and right to you and that makes it wonderful for you!
 
I will be sad to see you post less. I value your perspective. But I second reverie in saying do what's best for you. It's been helpful for me to follow your thoughts and see how someone else works poly. For what it's worth I think you do poly well and hate seeing you get so anxious about labels. Please update every so often. You are an intelligent eloquent person and your voice is important. Thank you for sharing your life and thoughts with us Internet folk.
 
I really, really, really tried to be happy in a long term no relationship escalator situation, but I just can't. It feels too shaky to me, too fragile, too fleeting. I like my wedding ring and my joint real estate and my dozens of shared friends. I like waking up next to my partner every single day.

This is such a treasure for you to know about yourself, Claire, and you wouldn't know it so assuredly if you didn't have an experience with something different.

Far from having none, your beautiful heart and soul shine through these pages. Since you arrived and every day since, I have admired and enjoyed your sincerity, your insights and your wit. If the blogging is keeping you focused on the negative, then by all means, back off from that, but I hope you'll keep participating in the general discussions. You contribute so much to our community with your very visible heart and soul. Thank you for sharing your life with us. Even though at times you may feel discouraged, you are a positive presence here because you share with us who you truly are. You are one of the people who keeps me coming here every day.
 
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