(How) does marriage work with non-hierarchical poly??

Iyourenndo, "sweat equity" is important in any relationship. That's more than just duration, it's also experiences shared, time spent, etc. I'm assuming a LTR that has those things for this discussion, since it's about having more than one primary in the context of being married to one of the primaries and not another/others.
 
I think another point in my perspective is that it no longer matters to me whether I'm a "true primary." I used to care about that. Now, I just take life one day at a time, knowing we can never know all the bad things that could happen to us, so why try to tabulate them?

Whether I'm right or wrong about being a "co-primary," the most important thing is, Do I understand my own value as a unique person? Am I a primary in my own estimation? If so, does it matter whether others (even my closest companions) recognize that primary status? Surely it doesn't matter whether society, church, and government recognize it. They can ruin my life, sure, but they can't ruin my esteem for myself. At least such is my philosophy.

The irony is that I do doubt my value as a person. But those doubts are mine, and I recognize them as such. I don't look to the companions in my poly unit to grant me my sense of value. That's all up to me.
 
And, I absolutely agree with all of that. My value as a person doesn't come from other's opinions of me or my relationships (which is one reason being unmarried entirely, being poly or mono, or having relationships with people I find attractive regardless of their sex all work for me).

But, I am super pragmatic, as well, and value what I invest into a relationship, whether it's as a primary, secondary, or whatever. While I realize that we can never be entirely sure what will happen in life, for me it's important to have some say over the dividends of what I invest. This is true emotionally as well as financially. So, just as i don't want to become deeply emotionally involved with anyone who has a partner that holds veto power, I also do not want to invest a great deal in a relationship where a metamour holds legal powers over my funds (and, if you have any kind of a savings account with a married person, in almost ALL states, their partner has a legal right to half of whatever is in the account and sometimes more, regardless of who's name is on it), access to my partner in times of crisis, etc., which--whether we like it or not--is part of being married (in the US). So, I would choose to not invest my time in what I would consider a primary LTR with a married partner because, for me, part of being a primary partner includes things like saving up for vacations, being part of decisions to move out of the area and the decisions and financial responsibilities that may go with that, taking care of one another if ill, etc. (been there, dealt with a metamour who was married to my partner, and got fucked so hard I still feel the reaming-- and that was just general daily life stuff, not an emergency or death).

But, again, that is my reasoning. For some people, those things are not an issue. Perhaps they make enough money they don't need to save up together to take a vacation or they have no interest in vacationing together, or moving isn't something they'd do regardless, etc. Everyone's needs are different. There's no argument that marriage, in the US, imparts rights that no other contract does, and that many of those rights cannot easily be overcome; but, in some situations, that probably is much less of an issue than it it in others.


I think another point in my perspective is that it no longer matters to me whether I'm a "true primary." I used to care about that. Now, I just take life one day at a time, knowing we can never know all the bad things that could happen to us, so why try to tabulate them?

Whether I'm right or wrong about being a "co-primary," the most important thing is, Do I understand my own value as a unique person? Am I a primary in my own estimation? If so, does it matter whether others (even my closest companions) recognize that primary status? Surely it doesn't matter whether society, church, and government recognize it. They can ruin my life, sure, but they can't ruin my esteem for myself. At least such is my philosophy.

The irony is that I do doubt my value as a person. But those doubts are mine, and I recognize them as such. I don't look to the companions in my poly unit to grant me my sense of value. That's all up to me.
 
I hear ya GreenAcres. My way of living nowadays is rather careless ... I can afford to be careless (and philosophical) because the two poly people who live with me basically take care of everything for me. Honestly, I don't know why they keep me around, let alone move with me to whatever State I fancy I'd like to live in (something they've done for me twice now). I'm so comfortable in the "primary-ness" they bestow on me that I can flatter myself that I'm above all worries about that. I don't have to be independent, I can just feel independent.

I totally agree that the United States (along with many other countries) lays out a tremendous imbalance between married couples and their poly partners. I hope someday the laws will improve. For the moment, my eyes are mostly trained on the hope of same-sex marriage becoming recognized in all 50 States.
 
If only more situations were like yours!

In reality, laws in the US (and, presumably, other parts of the world) create an imbalance for marriage over being single, too (though there are some limited potential drawbacks, like the "marriage penalty" in taxes), which I find unfortunate.

I hear ya GreenAcres. My way of living nowadays is rather careless ... I can afford to be careless (and philosophical) because the two poly people who live with me basically take care of everything for me. Honestly, I don't know why they keep me around, let alone move with me to whatever State I fancy I'd like to live in (something they've done for me twice now). I'm so comfortable in the "primary-ness" they bestow on me that I can flatter myself that I'm above all worries about that. I don't have to be independent, I can just feel independent.

I totally agree that the United States (along with many other countries) lays out a tremendous imbalance between married couples and their poly partners. I hope someday the laws will improve. For the moment, my eyes are mostly trained on the hope of same-sex marriage becoming recognized in all 50 States.
 
Yeah, people who (for whatever reason) aren't married shouldn't be penalized ... Maybe someday being single will be a declared status that the Law treats as equal to marriage. Perhaps today's marital privileges will become like insurance policies: You pay in a moderate amount in case you ever need to take out a big amount. Other than that, a single person should be able to choose who'll see them at the hospital and stuff. Like, it shouldn't automatically default to blood relatives.

Ahem. I acknowledge (proactively) that I may be talking out my ass on any or all of the above points. The only thing I feel sure about is that it's a good idea to invest in a consultation with a competent lawyer.
 
I won't say it's impossible to be married and non-hierarchical, because humans are individually unique and can be damn interesting and innovative.

That said, I guess it depends on how one defines 'hierarchy' and if it is distinct (but not necessarily exclusive) from 'priorities', emotions or other aspects of life.

Like us, if a couple is married, have children, have built a life together and have no intention of dismantling it, then generally speaking, maintaining that becomes a high priority as a matter of practicality at the least.

My spouse's other partner understands this because he is also married, has a child, and holds that side of things in high priority.

Emotion-wise, my spouse does not love him any less than she loves me, and likewise for him and his spouse. At least that's how it seems.

It's really nice when everyone involved is on the same page.
 
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To me, "hierarchy" implies rank. "You're first, he's second, she's third." It implies that one partner is more important and valuable than another.

From that perspective, I think it's entirely possible to have non-hierarchical poly when you're married. You simply choose not to assign ranks to your partners. You consider them equally valuable and important.

If you conflate "hierarchy" with "priority", or with amount of time spent together, or amount of life things that are intertwined, or anything like that, then yeah... most likely the married couple has "hierarchy" over any other partners either spouse has.
 
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