I don't know if I can do this, but I'm trying. Could use help

BlindBrick

New member
First, some background for context: My boyfriend and I lived together with our children (from previous marriages, none together) for 12 years. It wasn't a pleasant 12 years as far as romance goes, at least the last 5 were not. Almost no sex, and no affection shown from him at all, and my affection always had strings tied or was used to manipulate. We really were in a very toxic relationship, but we had a good friendship and even though we were both quite broken, we did care about each other. We broke up last spring and sold our house. We each took our two kids and bought our own places. Immediately, I hit rock bottom. The loss was almost more than I could take. Many nights the panic attacks were so bad I thought I would die. I got help from counselors and energy healers, and fixed a lot of issues I had, that I was not aware of. I became a completely new person and for the first time in my life I am truly happy, grounded, I love myself, and I have confidence.

Meanwhile, he spent the summer having meaningless sex with whoever he could. We had talked throughout the 12 years about his possible sex addiction, and after our breakup he confided in me that he had cheated on me quite a few times in those 12 years, with meaningless hook-ups. This was hard for me to take at first, but I came to a point where I accepted it and I actually understood why he did it. He didn't want to break up our family, but he had needs that I was refusing to meet. His summer of sex gave him just as much insight and growth for his own issues as my summer of therapy did for me. He became a changed person too.

This fall, we got back together again. We live separately, but have the strongest and most loving relationship either of us has ever had. The gratitude we each feel towards each other is huge. We have been so honest and I just can't explain in words how wonderful things are between us!

One of the things that has come out with our honesty is that he may be poly. Over the years he would comment about this, that it's unnatural to have one spouse and that's why marriage fail, yadda yadda. So, I agreed that I would try this and "let" him have sex with other women if he wanted. He's done that twice. Both times he was honest with me, and it was hard for me, but the honesty and how he cares about my feelings has made it ok. I feel ok with this if these are just hook-ups and nothing more. I understand the need, even though I don't share in it.

Well, he's since let me know that he wants to have a more intimate relationship with other women and would like to have two girlfriends. As we talked he even said it might be nice to live with both of us someday (whoever the other one will be....he hasn't met her yet). But, he's afraid of losing me, so he's afraid to try it.

I am mono through and through, I have no desire for anyone else. I wish he was too because in my mind there is safety and security in a monogamous relationship. But, I don't want to deny him of who he is. I completely understand poly and that it's nothing he can change. So, I said that I would be ok trying it if he could still provide me with the safety and security that I need in the relationship.

But, I am really scared. I am having a really hard time seeing how I can do this! Imaging him having sex with someone else is something I was able to get through....imaging him loving someone else I don't know if I can. Logically, I should though. When I had my second child, I didn't love my first any less. Is that what this will be? He can love two girlfriends the same? Anyone go into this reluctantly, and then made it work? Give me advice and hope please! I don't want to lose him, but I don't want to lose myself either!

Thanks!
 
Oh... dear.

Look, what follows is going to be painful, because you ARE standing right on the ledge of making more choices that I find seriously troubling. I would like you to reconsider, & to step back from the edge. Like, immediately.

We live separately, but have the strongest and most loving relationship either of us has ever had. The gratitude we each feel towards each other is huge. We have been so honest and I just can't explain in words how wonderful things are between us!
I'd disagree. The gushiness is a red flag. I'm seeing a lot of the sort of rationalization & auto-suggestive self-talk that I associate with codependency. Here's you being an enabler:
it was hard for me, but the honesty and how he cares about my feelings has made it ok. I feel ok with this if these are just hook-ups and nothing more. I understand the need, even though I don't share in it.

In my opinion, I would NOT see either of you attempting ANYTHING outside the boundaries of monogamy. The two of you are going to need regular therapy -- as individuals AND as a couple -- in order to to keep the toxicity down to an acceptable level.

he may be poly.
No. He's not. He's been fucking around behind your back for years; now that he can fuck around freely DOES NOT suddenly make him honest or "loving" or give him Magickal Poly Communication skills.

Nowhere does "fucking around with whover" equate to "able to sustain more than one intimate relationship" because, really, he SUCKS at maintaining ONE.

I should warn you that the likely next step will be escalation. Since the "poly" isn't working much better than was the "monogamy," it makes perfect irrational sense to pile on MORE of it. That's how codependent enmeshment evolves into a sort of two-player narcissism, where the enabler acts gets promoted to being a sort of site manager for the narcissist's imaginary kingdom.

Escalation:
he wants to have a more intimate relationship with other women and would like to have two girlfriends.

he even said it might be nice to live with both of us someday (whoever the other one will be....he hasn't met her yet).

Oh, but that's okay, right? You have a big heart (so you'll tell yourself) & his "love" means everything to you because you can't possibly feel more loved by ANYONE else. So, of course you'll take the job.

Better yet if he can feign both neediness AND honesty, so that you can swoop in & make him feel all better & nurse his delusions.

But, he's afraid of losing me, so he's afraid to try it.
No, he's NOT "afraid," but using the word triggers YOU to "reassure" him, specifically by bowing to his whims.

in my mind there is safety and security in a monogamous relationship.
And there CAN BE.

Probably NOT with him. But you are on the slippery slope of taking that CAN BE as somehow transferable to someone with no particular interest in follong the rules of ANY game.

I completely understand poly and that it's nothing he can change.
No -- you DON'T.

What's "not going to change" is that your buddy is a self-interested fool who's more interested in doing whatever the hell he wants than in caring about another human being.

I said that I would be ok trying it if he could still provide me with the safety and security that I need in the relationship.
And he will tell you (over & over) that he's doing exactly that, & you will tell yourself (over & over) that he MUST be doing it because he SAYS he's doing it just like he SAYS he loves you more than anything in the whole world.

Here's a simple guideline: get therapy. Have two or three sessions, individually AND as a couple, so let's say AT LEAST six sessions.

Meantime, your "partner" DOES NOT have so much as a date with some other woman, NOT ONCE. He DOES NOT contact any chicks online or by phone. He DOES NOT mention to you EVEN ONCE how lonely or horny he is, much less how groovy everything will be once you move someone else into this.

If he can't do that, then he's more interested in fantasy than in reality. If you "let him" proceed anyway, then no amount of good advice from others can make it work.
 
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This may not be what you want to hear. I mean it kindly, ok? :eek:

Almost no sex, and no affection shown from him at all, and my affection always had strings tied or was used to manipulate. We really were in a very toxic relationship, but we had a good friendship and even though we were both quite broken, we did care about each other.

I do not see how those sentences add up to "really caring about each other and being friends."

It mostly sounds like it adds up to "toxic relationship." :(

I don't think you CAN be friends with a toxic manipulator.

I am mono through and through, I have no desire for anyone else. I wish he was too because in my mind there is safety and security in a monogamous relationship.

Then why are you dating a person who does not match your preferences for romantic relationship? You want monogamy. He does not. That is not compatible right there even without adding the fact that this is an ex who was a toxic relationship for you and who cheated on you. That is piling on MORE reasons why this is not compatible.

It isn't like polyamory is magically "cheater proof." It's not the relationship shape (ex: monogamy or poly or swinging or whatever) that makes it cheater proof. It is the character of the person and them having and keeping their Word. He doesn't sound like he has a solid Word.

A few moments of him being "honest" is not actual honesty. It may just be a new way to manipulate you into doing what he wants.

But, I don't want to deny him of who he is.

I wonder if you deny who you are? A monoamorous and monogamous person who prefers that style of relating? :confused:

Why is his stuff more important to you than you stuff? I think you could be more concerned with you. Not in a selfish "mememe" way. But in a self care way. You could ask yourself "How does this behavior demonstrate me taking good care of me?"

If you asked yourself "How does taking back up with my toxic ex demonstrate me taking good care of me?".... how would you answer that?

So, I said that I would be ok trying it if he could still provide me with the safety and security that I need in the relationship.

But, I am really scared.

To me it sounds like you recognize that he cannot provide safety and security for you. You will have to make it yourself -- and that might have to start with not hanging around with this guy any more at all. If you being around him discombobulates you, then you have to stop being around him.

Call your therapist, explain the situation, and spend time with the therapist. Not with this guy.

Anyone go into this reluctantly, and then made it work? Give me advice and hope please! I don't want to lose him, but I don't want to lose myself either!

Between those two choices?

  • Lose sight of myself and my values by dating my toxic ex again

OR

  • Keep myself and what I value and give up seeing this ex

I would pick the second choice. You invested a lot to get to this:

I became a completely new person and for the first time in my life I am truly happy, grounded, I love myself, and I have confidence.

You became that AWAY from him.

Then you went back with him and what happens? You become scared, and unsure. :(

I would not call any of this healthy poly. I wonder if you are in the bargaining stages of grief? Still trying to make a thing that won't fly ... fly anyway?

I think the best hope is for you to stop bending yourself into pretzels to be with this guy and go back to being on your own when you were happiest. Listen to your reluctance and your being scared and your not wanting to lose yourself. You have done enough therapy for those voices inside to wake up again.

Become willing to stop dating him and let this toxicity go once and for all. Keep working with your therapist.

Become ok being on your own. Become ok not dating him any more.

You have inherent dignity, worth, and value. You deserve much better treatment than this.

Galagirl
 
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Wow, I have to say that Ravenscroft is right on the money with this.

BlindBrick, no matter where you decide to go with all of this, you have got to know that your BF absolutely cannot "provide (you) with the safety and security that (you) need in the relationship." First of all, you have to be able to provide that for yourself and not need it from another - this is the Zen koan you learn in Relationships 101. Second, neither you nor your BF are anywhere near ready for a peaceable open relationship. Sure, you can have sexual others in your life, but it's going to be full of drama and pain. Before going any further in your story about him, him, him, start looking inside and asking yourself why you are desperate to hold on to a man who is just not emotionally equipped to be any sort of foundation with anyone. Why are you so hopelessly devoted to this man?
 
Hi

Welcome to the Forum!
Please stick around and enjoy the place. I hope you do!

As for the topic, yeah, Humm
I think you could do it with this guy, yeah, of course! And even have fun doing so. But......
Remember that you will still be you. You have been working on you and probably feel ready for a little rest bit from all that learning and self searching.
In the search there is no rest bit! Unfortunately because that rest will likely turn into going right back where you came from, That unsureness and unhappy toxic place.

The way you could do that " relationship with the ex" better is, drum roll,. First find a different guy that has all those qualities you like from the ex! Yeah.. Practice, practice, practice... Then when you are good at relationshiping in mono and poly you'll have the tools needed to hopefully avoid the TOXIC thing with the ex if you so desire. Does that make sense?

Again, please do stick around...mono perspectives are respected and valued always.
Bye
 
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Oddly, I am not going to be as fatalistic as a few of the others.

Sure, it can work. The only thing is you have to do it because you are okay with it, not out of fear of losing him.

The way I see it, he has perhaps come to grips with something about himself. That happens when people separate. You'll both have to accept that you are starting over as new people.
 
Hello BlindBrick,

I'm inclined to lean towards vinsanity0's side of the fence. You can tolerate poly with your ex-ex, as long as he can truly provide you with the safety and security that you need in the relationship. That is, as long as he can love two girlfriends the same, and not put you in second place. I am thinking that what's troubling you is that you are afraid of losing him. You are afraid that he will leave you for someone else. I could be wrong ...

I hope the two of you can work something out.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
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