Betrayal in polyamory?

GalaGirl, thanks so much. What a great post. I mean it.

I think you summed it up perfectly: having the talk match the walk.

It did sting going to get tested because of this situation. I was so upset that day.

He did it because he did it. Maybe he likes the "secret thrill" of maybe getting caught. It's an adrenalin rush. I'm not saying it is ok to cheat on agreements. But some people do do that -- chase the rush by taking risks.

That's an interesting point. I'll think more about that to see if I can pinpoint some more adrenalin-rush-seeking behavior.

He lied, minimized, backpedaled, and now flips it around on you like you are the one who is messing up by being disappointed in his actions. Basically, he doesn't sound like he owns his stuff and takes personal responsibility for how his actions can affect others.

Maybe you are just now getting a good look at the "real him" -- where before on the visiting trips he was on best behavior "just for show."

It's a blow. You moved to live with him in another city. Maybe to show increasing commitment to him in this relationship. And he shows increasing commitment to you by doing what? Blowing off his agreements with you when he could just be up front about it because you are in an Open relationship.
Galagirl

I love that part of your post. He did do all those things, exactly as you are describing them. Because I don't only have to deal with the lying (it'd be a lot easier if, for example, I found this out and he owned up to it and is apologizing) but on top of that he's minimizing the situation, disregarding my feelings and 100% backpedaling. He even said, "I never thought it would take you this long to deal with something as insignificant as this." And it's been 11 days! Is that a long time? I don't think so. At all. But even if it was, even if I was taking me 11 months to deal with it, I said to him that he needs to respect my time, stop complaining and criticizing my reactions. I have a right to react and he can't comment on if I'm doing it "right" or "wrong".

I think I've reacted as well as I can to this, considering. I don't fight with him, we are on good terms, he's trying to be overly sweet. And whenever I feel like I need to talk about it, we talk about it calmly. What I haven't been doing, as I mentioned somewhere before, is having sex with him. Is no punishment or anything, I simply don't feel very sexual towards him right now. I even really tried a couple of times, but just couldn't.

And it most definitely is a blow that I did move here to be in a committed relationship with him, while he's been doing this. No commitment on his part, it makes me feel like he doesn't value me. I'm honestly kind of thinking of at least taking some time for myself, maybe going back to my city to stay with some friends for a while, since I do not have a place of my own anymore. Perhaps a little time will give me some clarity on what to do?

Again, thank you for your words. You manage to express my feelings better than I could at this moment. It helped.
 
Thanks for your words of wisdom Magdlyn. I actually read all the links you suggested.

Of all the things, what I completely didn't know about is the triangulating behavior. Since I'm new to polyamory, I didn't even know of the concept. It makes sense, and reading what it is, it helps me understand why I felt uncomfortable when he separately called his other partner and explained things to her. I don't really know what he said to her. I will for sure talk to them both about this particular point.

I agree that I see a lot of red flags. I see that he does have some narcissistic traits, but not all of them. For instance, he was never charming in the beginning. I don't mean to say he's not cool and nice, but he's not particularly charming. Most people find him kind of rude and you need to get passed the rudeness and introverted behavior to actually get to know him. Also, he doesn't try to isolate me from friends and family, he actually encourages me to see them and make new friends. He's also not competitive in nature.

But I feel like he does manipulate, it can be subtle, even in the way he just phrases a sentence. He obviously lies, which I didn't know until recently. He does blame everybody else for things wrong in his life, he doesn't take accountability and it's like bad things "happen" to him, like he had nothing to do with it. I agree as well with the gaslighting, which is in his manipulative nature.

I feel like he's selfish and he's acting in an abusive way towards me with this whole situation. I feel like he blames me for reacting to it. And that he will probably do it again.

The articles were very helpful and I'll keep reading on these subjects, because they obviously relate to my situation.

Thanks!
 
This may sound ridiculous, but who stole your phone? I'd almost suspect he did, so you'd need to borrow his, and end up seeing messages from this secret gf, so he could enjoy torturing you with the revelation.

Call me crazy, lol, my mind just went there. Narcs love trouble. They love to feel their women are fighting over them. It makes them feel big and powerful and desirable.

I understand why your mind went there, but no, it wasn't him. We got mugged on a bus with a bunch of people. They took his camera.
 
He doesn't sound particularly regretful, does he? It doesn't sound like he particularly cares what impact it has on you. Two things that tell me he is irresponsible and uncaring.

From there it is downhill. He appears to be deflecting, making you feel guilty for having a problem with.... well, a problem. This is gaslighting and emotional abuse.

Unless you see any sign of regret and amends, I think the faster you are rid of him, the sooner you can begin to heal.

True. I'm so disappointed and kinda heartbroken. I think I'm still giving him the chance to actually apologize properly and make amends.
 
What have we built up In that past that put marbles into the Trust Jar (Taken this quote liberally from Gabrielle current LDR),
Against another list that says:
What has he torn with lack of trust, that removed marbles from the Trust Jar.
That's an interesting exercise. I'll give it a go.


This felt like, a power play move, and was a yellow if not red flag to me on behaviour. Seeing as he likes to keep people in the dark by cheating in the first place, controlling communication is another tactic of people who like to fiddle with peoples heart strings :(
I agree is a red flag. It saddens me so. =(

And yes you're right to be worried that she had engaged in cheating first. Have you heard this directly form her however? This may be a falsehood created to make his cheating look palatable as he was a victim so he cheated because he was cheated on.

How does him cheating on you have anything to do with him being cheated on? :confused: You didn't cheat on him or retaliate on him with cheating behaviour now?

I have heard it from her, yes. At the very beginning, her and I sat down to talk a few times, to get to know each other better. She mentioned this on her own and explained that this was really hard for him for a long period of time and that she is grateful that he was able to forgive him. At the time I didn't asked that much more, but it seemed like there were issues there.

And also he didn't mention what happened with her now, he mentioned it ages ago. I'm just the one making the connections, but he hasn't brought it up.

Sounds like he's putting his sexual needs first in all cases, both in cheating, and now blaming you to get you to have sex with him.

I agree with this. I feel his sexual needs are more important than anything else to him, I see a selfish tendency here.
 
Just as a general kind of update. I know he's behavior is abusive and hurtful. Trust me I know. I'm really upset and so sad. But I also want to say he has good things. People are complex, have good and bad and act in certain ways for a variety of psychological reasons. There's some things I absolutely love about him, for instance, I find him brilliant, he's a PhD in Physics, he's a vegetarian (I am too), he makes documentaries and is a Greenpeace activist. He is a good person, generally speaking, but has lots of issues, as you can see. He is emotionally abusive and he's a manipulator. I'm having a hard time putting things in the balance and have the adequate perspective.

Anyways, I'm thinking of taking a break and going back home for a few weeks. Maybe that will give me clarity.

Thank you all for your messages!! This forum is simply awesome and I've learned so much already.

=)
 
He is emotionally abusive and he's a manipulator.

Glad you see that.


I find him brilliant, he's a PhD in Physics, he's a vegetarian (I am too), he makes documentaries and is a Greenpeace activist

One can admire a person's body of work, and not admire how that person treats other people. Intellectual maturity is a different thing than emotional maturity or social maturity. He can be super great in the first category, and not so hot in the other ones.

He is a good person, generally speaking, but has lots of issues, as you can see.

Him having issues? He could take personal responsibility for himself and his issues and seek professional aid to help him with the issues.

Him having issues does not mean he gets to abuse/manipulate you to make himself feel better about whatever the issues are.

You have inherent worth and value. You deserve to be treated WELL.

For you to be treated well, he would have to have the emotional maturity to own his stuff and take personal responsibility for how his actions can affect others, and the social maturity to apologize when he steps on toes.

Doesn't sound like you are being treated well here.

I'm having a hard time putting things in the balance and have the adequate perspective.

Maybe it feels like...

"I don't want to leave him. I just want the bad behavior to stop. But am not sure that it WILL stop."

Is it something like that?

In case it helps you make more sense of your feelings... scroll to the middle where the stages are.

https://speakoutloud.net/articles


No commitment on his part, it makes me feel like he doesn't value me.

Well, if he's lying and manupulating you, it sounds like he does not value you.

He's mad he's not getting sex right now and mad you are "taking so long" to get over it so he can get back to the sex. Sounds like he values what services he can get from you rather than you as a person.

I'm honestly kind of thinking of at least taking some time for myself, maybe going back to my city to stay with some friends for a while, since I do not have a place of my own anymore. Perhaps a little time will give me some clarity on what to do?

I think that would be a good plan.

Again, I'm very sorry you deal in this. It's heartbreaking for you. :(
Galagirl
 
Last edited:
These scenarios are the worst. And, let me soapbox a little- as women, we are kinda taught from the beginning that we need to be 'nice' and 'sweet', etc. These types of conditioning do nothing but aid in us not listening to our discomfort. He betrayed you, your trust, and is back peddling to deflect from the real issue. He lied.
I have done this. Ignored huge red flags, stuck around when I knew I shouldn't. It's sometimes hard to see the forest through the trees.
Good luck to you. I hope you find peace with whatever decision you come to. <3
 
Hi Alodia,

I would ask a couple of questions about your boyfriend. Do you trust him? Could you trust him? What would it take for you to be able to trust him?

I don't think he'd lie unless he thought the lie would benefit him somehow. Maybe he doesn't trust you to be okay with his additional relationships, and that's why he hides them from you. He doesn't believe that honesty would benefit him.

It all puts you in a bad predicament. :(
With sympathy,
Kevin T.
 
Agreed wholeheartedly. At this point....he can't be trusted.


Cheaters cheat, liars lie.

You've caught him out not in one mistruth, but a whole string of whoppers.

What's he gonna lie about next? STD testing? causing a pregnancy? moving a new girlfriend in? getting married on an out-of-town trip? smoking meth? throwing your stuff on the curb while you're out?

:rolleyes:
 
Hi Alodia,

I would ask a couple of questions about your boyfriend. Do you trust him? Could you trust him? What would it take for you to be able to trust him?

I don't think he'd lie unless he thought the lie would benefit him somehow. Maybe he doesn't trust you to be okay with his additional relationships, and that's why he hides them from you. He doesn't believe that honesty would benefit him.

It all puts you in a bad predicament. :(
With sympathy,
Kevin T.

Hello Kevin. Thanks for your reply.

To answer your questions, before this, yes I would've said I trusted him so much. Personally, I've never been as honest with anyone before, not just ex boyfriends, but anyone in my life, I shared with him things I've never told before. I was very direct and open with him and thought he was the same with me.

Now, of course, things have changed and I don't trust him anymore. Now I think things like, "That time he told me he was going over the weekend to see his father, was he really or was he seeing this other person?" Because to keep this hidden, meant he lied to me plenty. And it hurts.

He didn't just lie to me, but to his other partner as well.

In the midst of it all, he did say that he wasn't able to find "the right time" to tell me, that he never felt "comfortable" to tell me. Well, my first reaction to those explanations was that it was a load of BS. But then I really thought it over. Was I not making him "comfortable" that in 9 months he never found the "right time"? I think of myself as an understanding and supportive GF. Was I not? Was I really not? I did think all of that, I've had to re-think everything because that's what lies do.

I even specifically remember a few occasions when I asked him, very open and calmly, if he had met anyone new, if there was anyone new that he was interested in. He always said no. Those questions came in moments when he asked me about the 2 guys I was seeing, I would reply things like "Things are all right. Next Thursday I'm gonna see F. What about you? Anyone new in mind?" Were those not good moments for him to tell me the truth? I'm seriously asking. Would like to know.

But yes, I think he believed honesty wouldn't benefit him. I just can't understand why.

I think that to trust him again he would first have to apologize sincerely, I need to know he realizes what he did was wrong, because he has said things like "I'm so sorry you are in pain" and that he's "really sorry things are like this now". But I haven't heard "I screwed up, I'm so sorry. It was wrong of me to hide this from you". I need to know he knows not to do this again, that is not cool and is not what I want in a relationship.

I think actions build trust. So I am observing how he treats me these days. He did cut things off with that other girl. I guess I'd have to see how things go and what he does to mend them. I really have to think about what it would take for me to trust him again.

Thank you for your words

=)
 
Were those not good moments for him to tell me the truth? I'm seriously asking. Would like to know.

Those were good moments. I think he's making excuses when he says there was "no good moment."

Galagirl
 
Maybe it feels like...

"I don't want to leave him. I just want the bad behavior to stop. But am not sure that it WILL stop."

It most definitely feels exactly like that.

Anyways, I'm going back home tomorrow. I already packed my things. I am so incredibly sad, feel so cheated.

Thank you all!
 
feel for you

Always difficult to move to a city for a guy - mono, poly or anything.

Seems that he is not sonopen in this open relationship.

You could not help seeing the first text and anyone with a heartbeat would have looked further onwards in the cell phone.

The guy is being defensive and rather child-like I would say and surely you are justified in your very natural feelings towards these warning signs.
 
It most definitely feels exactly like that.

Anyways, I'm going back home tomorrow. I already packed my things. I am so incredibly sad, feel so cheated.

Thank you all!

I'm glad you're leaving him. I know it hurts, a lot, to be duped by a narcissist. I felt so foolish! But some con artists are really good at their cons (cough*trump*) It's no shame to have been a victim. Just learn to watch out for this kind of person. I came across another one after I dumped my narc bf. That guy lasted 3 or 4 dates before I recognized the red flags. I got out relatively unscathed.
 
Back
Top