Looking for advice

Remmi

New member
Hi all. Gonna dive right in. I have been involved with a poly household for almost 10 years. For many years it has been my boyfriend, his other girlfriend (and my best friend) and me. As far as we knew he was sterile and has been fairly vocal about not wanting children so we both got iuds for birth control.

He and i live together and my friend lives separate and comes home as often as she can dur to work. We took in a friend to help her get on her feet and to be a fwb for him. We all talked about it and were copacetic with the situation.

About two months ago we found out that she wasn’t on the birth control she had said she was on. Had a long talk about it and she was supposed to get on it. Well she seems to be pregnant. We are getting a blood trst to confirm.

The advice i need is how to handle this. On the one hand a child would be a miracle abd for that i am over the moon. On the other i feel like she put off the doctor banking on him shooting blanks and i am furious with the entrapment angle. He is nervous and trying not to get excited(until bloodwork comes back) and i do not want to “rock the boat” so not sure how or if i should say much of anything. It’s not like starting an argument is going to change anything other thab breed animosity. Also bears stating that they have talked and unless there is a medical necessity abortion is not an option.

I feel conflicted abd confused and was hoping some of y’all might have some wisdom to help with those feelings and well like minded people can be a grat support and perhaps with that i can br the support for them brcause if there is a child, regardless of how i feel, it is an innocent life tgat deserves the best i can give. Thanks in advance.

Also pleas excuse typos. I am using mobile and my keyboard is acting up.
 
Hello Remmi,

I, personally, have to admit that I don't feel good about this pregnancy. But it sounds like you need to find a way to be okay with it. I suppose the thing to do for now is, focus on being a support for them, because if there is a child, that is an innocent life that deserves the best you can give. Also I don't know, maybe it is time to start thinking about having the IUDs taken out. After all he does not seem to be as opposed to having kids as he said he was.

If you're willing, keep us updated as your situation evolves. Let us know how the blood test comes out. And we'll try to give updated advice.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
I guess you could wait on test results.

As far as we knew he was sterile and has been fairly vocal about not wanting children so we both got iuds for birth control.

I am surprised there. If he was this adamant about not wanting children, it is his responsibility to do HIS end of BC. Be it vasectomy, condoms, whatever. Not just assume he's sterile.

I feel conflicted abd confused and was hoping some of y’all might have some wisdom to help with those feelings and well like minded people can be a grat support and perhaps with that i can br the support for them brcause if there is a child, regardless of how i feel, it is an innocent life tgat deserves the best i can give. Thanks in advance.

The unborn kid (if there is one) is indeed innocent. Cannot lay the responsibility for the parents' behaviors at their feet.

But the potential parents could take responsibiltiy for their own their behavior.

She's not been keeping her agreements about using BC/seeing doc.
He's not taking care of his BC stuff.

If you decide no longer want to participate in this network due to lax behaviors? That's up to YOU.

You signed up for a 3 people thing. Then renegotiated for a 4 people thing. Now it might be becoming a 5 people thing, where one is an infant. And you did not have a voice in that conversation.

To me? That changes the deal. You do not have to "automatically" be up for that. Your continuing consent belongs to YOU.

So I suggest soul searching during the wait.

Galagirl
 
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A dilemma indeed.

Right now, there is no way for the four of you involved to know HOW to react, and how best to proceed... or for the forum to know WHAT advice to offer until more information comes to light and the answers to a few questions can be determined. For example you'll need to figure out:

- IF this woman is truly pregnant, and how far along she is.

- WHO the biological father of the child is. (Does she have other male partners, or has she had sex with anyone else during the past few months other than your boyfriend? Is she willing to have tests done to determine the parentage?)

- If you can trust what she tells you about the above, or anything else, going forward... since according to you, she lied/misled your polycule about being on the agreed-upon form of birth control.

- What she plans to do about the pregnancy when and if it's confirmed. (You say you let her move in to "help her get on her feet", which implies the deal wasn't for her to live there indefinitely.)

**********

Yes, there is now (potentially) an innocent child involved, and this changes the game for ALL concerned. The child cannot be held accountable, but the mother and your partner must be.

Without knowing the answers to all of the above, this situation strikes me as the worst of (what had always turned me off) polyamory - because on the surface of it at least, it appears to be a situation where the man is getting HIS needs met by, and making demands of, multiple female lovers... while all the responsibility and sacrifice falls on those same females.

You don't specify if you and your best friend (your bf's OSO) also have/had other partners, or if you're a triad... but your OP leads us to believe that your boyfriend has enjoyed the company of two female long-term partners who have taken the full responsibility for birth control thus far, because he made it plain HE didn't want children (did either of you want them? I assume you had a say in this).

Then, more recently, you consented to him taking another female FWB; even agreeing to let her move in in order to help her out (how? financially? And was this a joint decision?) - a trust she betrayed immediately by lying/misleading your boyfriend and yourselves about the precautions she was taking to avoid pregnancy.

Given that she was obviously having some difficulties providing for herself (which is why she's currently living with you and bf?), the suspicious side of me could be forgiven for seeing "entrapment" writ large - which you alluded to yourself in your OP, Remmi - but without knowing the answers to the above questions or hearing new girl's side of the story, it'd be premature to jump to such conclusions.

Regardless, it IS an emotionally fraught situation, for you and your best friend in particular. I think you seem to be reacting in a very generous manner, though it'd be understandable if your feelings veer between empathy, apprehension and even anger.

As GalaGirl said, the current situation goes against all agreements - AND now what? - YOU are going to be expected to live with the results of other peoples' lack of responsibility for the next eighteen years?

Given your boyfriend's former adamant stance re: not wanting to become a parent vs his budding "excitement" over this pregnancy with a woman he's only been casually involved with for a few short months, you and his other girlfriend would be within your rights to ask all the tough questions that occur to you, to demand honest answers, and from there, to decide where you stand and IF you even want to be standing there anymore.
 
I will absolutely give updates as i get them.

To clarify a few points

Fwb is an old work buddy/friend that had fallen on rough times and was living in an area where jobs were difficult to find at vest and better where we are. We did bot set a time linit on living together just so long as the arrangement was beneficial.

As far as being generous that fluctuates a lot. I just keep reminding myself that animosity breeds animosity and that isn’t good for the baby.

The way we were set up is that while us girls were allowed to have other partbers by and large there’s just not anyone we have bern interested in vesides him for years. Not any more than drooling over a cute butt anyways(because cute butts are wonderful-i deal with stress with hunor a lot). As far as children, i have a daughter from a previous marriage(not related to my So by blood) and not really interested in more hence the iud(plus no monthlies sacrs a bundle and we are fairly low income which is abother stressor in all this malarky)

I know that ultimately he is responsible for his own contraceptive supplies but with him being so upfront about fluid bonding as it seems to be called and all and probably because of my enotions i am more upset with her thab him.

As far as her having other partbers. She swears that it has vern only him(she isn’t sexually attracted to females so sexy time is between him abd her alone)

Today i am heartbroken listening to them giggle over a commercial with a toy motorcycle, planning names, and just bonding. And that’s the part i really need help coping with. Just having a place to say this without being judged as stirring the pot or overreacting is a blessing i hope y’all understand. It means so much that total strangers are willing to reach out and advise and support. Truly. Thank each of you for your replies.

Again i will update as i know, on that front. Anyone know when is tye soonest a paternity test can be done? I am really hoping not to have to spend the next nine months in limbo. Not sure i can stay objective that long living with and unknown without going bonkers.
 
According to Wikipedia, "Current advances in genetic testing have led to the ability to determine who the biological father is while the woman is still pregnant through a non-invasive method. There is a small amount of fetal DNA (cffDNA) present in the mother's blood during pregnancy. This allows for accurate fetal DNA paternity testing during pregnancy from a blood draw with no risk of miscarriage. Studies have shown that cffDNA can first be observed as early as 7 weeks gestation, and the amount of cffDNA increases as the pregnancy progresses. There are only four companies with headquarters in the United States offering a noninvasive prenatal paternity test: DDC, Viaguard Accu-metrics, Ravgen and Natera." The other prenatal option is invasive and has a small risk of miscarriage.

It is good if you can turn to this forum to vent and get further advice. It sounds like that has been helpful to you so far. I hope we can continue to help.
 
I have been involved with a poly household for almost 10 years. For many years it has been my boyfriend, his other girlfriend (and my best friend) and me. As far as we knew he was sterile and has been fairly vocal about not wanting children so we both got iuds for birth control.

As far as you all knew, he was "sterile." But you got IUDs? Excuse me, what? If he's sterile, there is no need for birth control (except condoms for disease protection if anyone is having sex outside the main group.) If he "thinks" he is sterile, it was up to him to have his sperm tested to make sure. There are plenty of people who have not been pregnant or not gotten someone pregnant who are not completely "sterile," just on the low end of fertile.

So, bf was being irresponsible. He wants to not use condoms, to be fluid bonded? If so, it's up to him to get the snip snip.

He and i live together, and my friend lives separate and comes home as often as she can, due to work. We took in a friend to help her get on her feet and to be a fwb for him. We all talked about it and were copacetic with the situation.

This confuses me. There are 3 women and just one man? And he doesn't want to get anyone pregnant, so all 3 women were supposed to have gotten IUDs? (Since he's too special to go to the doctor to get tested or get himself a vasectomy, apparently.) So he's banging 3 chicks who are all so infatuated they are willing to be responsible for birth control because he can't be bothered, even though HE is the one who doesn't want kids?

About two months ago we found out that she wasn’t on the birth control she had said she was on. Had a long talk about it and she was supposed to get on it. Well she seems to be pregnant. We are getting a blood test to confirm.

"WE" aren't getting a blood test. ONE of your man's other partners is getting a blood test to determine pregnancy (and possibly paternity in case she was cheating on him). You're all individuals.

We need nicknames. I can't tell if there are 3 women or only 2. And which one is pregnant. I know it's not you. I think you live with your man, and another woman who you call his "FWB" lives with you too, and there is yet another woman who doesn't live with you. And she's the possibly pregnant one (who did NOT get an IUD, while both of the other 2 women did)?

The advice i need is how to handle this. On the one hand a child would be a miracle, and for that I am over the moon.

A "miracle" since you thought your man was sterile? OK... Do you wish you'd have been the one to get pregnant though? Are you envious? Be honest.

On the other, I feel like she put off the doctor, banking on him shooting blanks, and i am furious with the entrapment angle.

This is valid!!! What kind of person gets herself knocked up while lying about being on birth control? At the least, she is immature and irresponsible (as your bf is irresponsible, so maybe they are a match ... :rolleyes:)

At the worst, she is conniving and indeed entrapping him (and you, and the FWB, if there is one. But maybe the FWB will be out of the house soon and won't have to sorry about all this crap).

He is nervous and trying not to get excited (until bloodwork comes back), and I do not want to “rock the boat,” so not sure how or if i should say much of anything. It’s not like starting an argument is going to change anything other than breed animosity. Also bears stating that they have talked, and unless there is a medical necessity abortion is not an option.

Why can they talk, and you can't?

You can decide if you want to be involved in this accident. Do you want to be entrapped for life in raising another woman's child who was conceived by accident, with your man who doesn't seem to want to be bothered to be sure he is not fertile? You can back out at any time. It's an option.

I feel conflicted and confused and was hoping some of y’all might have some wisdom to help with those feelings. and well, like minded people can be a great support, and perhaps with that i can be the support for them, because if there is a child, regardless of how i feel, it is an innocent life that deserves the best i can give.

You don't owe anything to this possible fetus. You can be envious, you can be resentful of both your bf and this other woman. You can be resentful he has 2 or 3 partners and a possible new baby on the way, and you have one partner and a kid from a previous relationship. He gets all the fun, you gals get all the work. It's always this way. Men get to spread their seed and the women are left responsible for their entire lives changing, their bodies changing, the discomfort of pregnancy (nausea, constipation, anemia, bloating, hormonal emotional upsets, food aversions and cravings, etc., etc.), the learning curve of breastfeeding and sleepless nights, the messes, the crying, the taxiing, the doctor appointments, the orthodontist, the sports or dance lessons, etc.. etc. Also, whose money is going to pay for this kid for the next 21 or more years? (I always laugh when people say 18 years, as if you stop being a parent after 18 years. What about college, clothes and supplies and books and computers and housing at college, what if the kid has mental problems or autism, or is bullied, or is gay or transgender or other special needs, or becomes addicted to drugs, etc., etc.?)

Do you really want to be involved in any of this just because your guy, who said he didn't want kids, is all of a sudden going goo goo over toys and baby names? And he and his OSO couldn't be bothered to use birth control? Why is that something deserving of "YOUR" best? They don't seem to be doing "THEIR" best!
 
Today i am heartbroken listening to them giggle over a commercial with a toy motorcycle, planning names, and just bonding. And that’s the part i really need help coping with. Just having a place to say this without being judged as stirring the pot or overreacting is a blessing i hope y’all understand.

Who is telling you that you are overreacting or stirring the part? BF? If anything I think you are UNDER-reacting.

Because basically in this situation?

  • He was lazy about his BC.
  • She lied about her BC.
  • And if they end up pregnant? The 4 people deal where he has two GFs and her as FWB is DONE because they went and changed it. Their carelessness affected the whole group in a major way.

This to me is a deal breaker. You signed up for a "4 people no kids thing."

If they want to renegotiate? They have to apologize and make serious amends because this isn't like borrowing your sweater and staining it. This is pregnancy due to not even trying to use BC. Not like a condom broke, but not even trying.

You say you already have income stress. You don't have to be saddled with helping to raise their kid and deal with MORE income stress. You do not have to be automatically up for it and put your funds towards the maintaining of them and this child. You did not have a voice in this decision.

If either of those two calls you names like "overreacting" or "stirring the pot" -- I think it is adding insult to injury. They change things in a major way and you are supposed to just smile and lump it? If they are blame shifting on to you? I think they are doing it so they don't have to take personal responsibility for their poor behavior. They change it to be how YOU have poor behavior complaining. Without acknowledging what they did to provoke your complaint in the first place. If that is happening here? That is not fair.

Anyone know when is tye soonest a paternity test can be done?

She can pee on a stick and if it is +, you can move out til they sort out paternity. You don't have to be there waiting til 10 weeks into pregnancy for a paternity test to see if it is his or not.

Whether you and other GF move out together, or you go to friends or family on your own? Moving out solves this...

I am really hoping not to have to spend the next nine months in limbo. Not sure i can stay objective that long living with and unknown without going bonkers.

You don't have to spend the time in limbo.

You don't have to be objective.

And you don't have to go bonkers because you simply decide that a ("not even trying to use BC in order to avoid" oopsie pregnancy is a deal breaker.) And you don't want to deal with any of that.

YOU get to decide what you are and are not up for. Not them.

I suppose while gone you could decide if you even want to get back together with him if it turns out not pregnant or not his. Or if this is a permanent deal breaker because he's shown himself to be so careless/cavalier that you no longer trust him.

You do not owe this unborn child anything at all. It is not your child, and it is not your responsibility.

You can give the child a baby present when born and be kind to baby if you bump into baby on the street. That can be the "best you can give" this child.

But you don't have to sign up to maintain the child for 21+ years. You don't have to sign up to be its parent when it already has some. You don't have to change the rest of YOUR life just because THEY did something to change THEIRS.

Galagirl
 
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For me? If I were in a poly group family with a commitment to not having any (more) children, and other members lied about doing their part and getting BC (whether or not it was reasonable that they had that job) to avoid pregnancy, and someone (a “FWB”?!?) fell pregnant and decided to keep the child, in whose life I’d have no legal standing, and from whom I could be cut off no matter how much I’d invested in supporting its parents and/or it? And my partner was suddenly planning on full-time, live-in co-parenting with this person? I’d be moving on.

A “FWB” metamour who enacts this huge an error (or manipulation, if it was planned) is not someone I’m signing up to be a live-in unofficial co-parent with. And a partner who rolls this easily and quickly to overthrow the plan and the principle he’d been professing and enforcing for years isn’t a reliable counterpart to agreements.

It sounds like you want this to work out well and happily ever after, and you feel guilty for your “naysayer” thoughts. But what is in this for you? How far will you go in waiting and seeing how you feel? How long in trying to figure out what your demoted (and strictly informal) role is? It may be much better for the potential child that you walk away now, rather than that this accidentally formed and (so far) trust-starved family implode in dramatic fashion when the child is old enough to miss you (or other LT gf).
 
The human body is an amazing thing. I was told years ago that I was sterile, and I thought that in our relationship many years ago my husband and I had proved it by a lengthy period of totally unprotected sex. Fast forward a decade and I got pregnant almost as soon as we got married. Sometime between the doctors years ago and my life now, my body either healed itself or God gave me a miracle. We had every reason to assume I couldn't have children....

I think you've got only a couple of issues to consider in all this -

1. Was the omission of birth control by one/both parties justified, careless, or intentional?
2. Do you want to live in a household with kids?
3. Is the pregnancy going to change the father and mother's desire to be poly? (ie. will they suddenly choose to have a traditional, monogamous family?)

Ultimately, you have the agency in this. You have no legal or moral responsibility to a child that isn't genetically yours if you don't want to be involved. I would seriously consider the wisdom of staying in a situation where 3-4 people living together are experiencing "income stress." I've lived in situations with multiple people under one roof, and typically the more people that live together and work full-time, the less "income stress" there is...even in low wage jobs, as per-person costs like rent and utilities are reduced. That money is going somewhere and staying in a situation like that, child or not, it'd be wise to figure out what is going on financially.
 
Promised updates as i have them.

They are at the ob/gyn. I am getting ready for work so that’s why i am not there. My SO is texting me as they go and it is official. She is pregnant. They are waiting for ultrasound tech to come do the procedure.

Not sure what else to post. A few have made the valid point that i am not behilden to either of them to support a life we did not agree to. We had discussed the hypothetical(or so we believed) possibility of conception tears ago but never expected to have to ever deal with it in reality.

If i am honest, part of what has me holding on is that i love him and after almost ten years together cannot picture my life without him or our pups. I know that dogs are just pets but they really are like four legged kids and I cannot just walk away from them. Also, there is a stubborn rage, perhaps spite, that has me digging my heels in. The day we found out ( for sake of clarity we will call my so “red” me “hope” my friend”faith” and the fwb”meg”) meg was pregnant via home test i took her to subway to get some food. While there she made a crack that “I didn’t do it, it’s not my fault” i know she was joking and nervous but i snapped back “it absolutely IS your fault and you DID do it. Had you been on the birth control like you said we wouldn’t be here. If you had gone to the doctor and gotten birth control like you promised after comig clean we wouldn’t be here”. She said he hadn’t asked her about it (birth control) anymore so she dropped it. I replied “that’s because he said you beeded to get on birth control like you said you were and be an adult and expected you to act like an adult” She laughed and said sarcastically that i had “discovered her diabolical plan to get knocked up and keep him all to herself”. I know it was a joke, but in all laughter there is a nugget of truth and i have tried to let it go but i will be goddamned if a twirp of a 27 year old thinks she is gonna use a kid to get rid of me. Maybe that is spiteful but i have put literal blood sweat and tears into this relationship and i will not be run off just because you want him “all to yourself”
 
Hi Remmi,
Thanks for that update.

It seems to me that Red and Meg are taking this all very lightly. Considering that Red supposedly didn't want children. You are in the right to be angry with Meg, but Red's behavior has also been unacceptable so far. Honestly, he should not have just assumed he was infertile and relied on that assumption. If there was doubt enough for you to be safe and get an IUD, then there was doubt enough for him to be safe and get a vasectomy. He declined to do that. That is action, and it speaks louder than words.

If I were him, I fancy that I would be stone cold towards her. Saying something like, "You gave me your word that you would use birth control. You broke your word. You lied to me. Since you lied about birth control, you are now in a situation where you would have to get an abortion in order to make good on your promises. You are refusing to do that. You are continuing to break your word. And my support of you was based on the assumption that you would be honest. As you are refusing to be honest, I will refuse to support you. I will refuse to support this child. You are on your own." I don't know if Meg can legally force Red to support her, but if I were Red, I fancy that I would limit my support to that which the Law forced me to provide (e.g., financial support, and the minimum of that).

Whatever his reasons, Red is choosing to support her. He is choosing to be very friendly towards her about it. So this situation is not just Meg's doing, it is his doing as well. If I were you, I fancy that I would be less than pleased with him. And that may indeed be how you are feeling about this. Not that there's anything you are obligated to do to prove that you feel a certain way, but I wanted to say that I had noticed his part in all of this. Of course, I don't regard her very highly either.

I can see why you would feel that she would "win" if you broke up with Red. You are kind of in a sucky position where you will "lose" no matter what you do. You have my sympathies. It's unfortunate that she did indeed turn out to be pregnant. I hope that you'll be able to make the best of the situation. Do continue to update us sometimes, as long as you're willing. I'm anxious to hear how things turn out.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
If i am honest, part of what has me holding on is that i love him and after almost ten years together cannot picture my life without him or our pups.

That's ok if you cannot picture it right now. These changes are happening fast. This wasn't the plan you wanted for your future. So you haven't had TIME to imagine a different kind of life much less plan for one.

I know that dogs are just pets but they really are like four legged kids and I cannot just walk away from them.

Dogs can come with you.

Also, there is a stubborn rage, perhaps spite, that has me digging my heels in.

Be careful of that. Don't make decisions angry. Perhaps it is easier to be mad at her than him right now. You aren't ready to be upset with him.

Yet he had a role in the situation making. He said he wanted no children but still had unprotected sex with a woman who was not on BC. How does this behavior match the words? They don't.

She laughed and said sarcastically that i had “discovered her diabolical plan to get knocked up and keep him all to herself”. I know it was a joke, but in all laughter there is a nugget of truth and i have tried to let it go but i will be goddamned if a twirp of a 27 year old thinks she is gonna use a kid to get rid of me.

I guess I don't see it as you being "run off" if you decide to leave.

If you decide to leave or ask them to move out? I see it as YOU deciding for your own self what to do and what people you want to hang around with. I think that's fair. You DO get to pick your going or staying. You are in charge of you.

People who are so uncaring about how their actions can affect others? That's a good way to break trust with those others.

Her "jokes" are not jokes at all. They are not funny. They are not kind or loving behavior.

Him going along with all this? No apology? Just baby gaga? You and Faith are supposed to smile and lump it? I could be wrong in my impression but if that's how he's acting... not very kind or loving behavior there either.

It's terrible to get attached to a kid that is not yours, when the kid can be whisked away by the legal parents at any time without caring how it affects you or the child. Not to mentioned strained finances.

I don't see where you "staying from spite" is any kind of "win" for your health and well being. Staying from spite is not staying from anything joy promoting or health promoting. You staying from your own spitefulness/anger/mean to "get back at her" and spread the spite/mean -- that's not really your best self, is it? And what kind of house is that to raise a baby in? What did the baby do? :(

It also seems like maybe some sunk cost fallacy going on here. I can imagine Red treated you well in the past and that's where the love first grew from. But LATELY? Red's being really cavalier and not treating his partners (you and Faith) well if he's so careless with BC/sex health stuff. That doesn't sound loving to me. :(

If you stay? I fear you might be teaching that you might fuss and complain some but basically they can do whatever they want. Including saying one thing and doing another. Or breaking promises/agreements. And you will STILL stick around taking it and there will be no lasting consequence. You will help to clean up a mess you did not make -- raising a kid that isn't yours, paying to support them/their offspring.

I don't think you will get more respect by staying here. :(

I worry you will get LESS. :(

And what happens now for BC? He's still gonna go bareback and she's still gonna be lax? Are there gonna ne MORE children making finances even tougher?

I urge you you to take a time out and do some soul searching. Don't decide things because you are in a rage and mad at her. Please also do not cut your nose to spite your own face.

But calm and collect yourself and then really think what is best for YOUR future well being. The 4 person deal was broken. You do NOT have to automatically renew for this "new deal."

Maybe it means you continue with him but they move out elsewhere. You don't want to be part of their new family/live with a baby.

Or maybe you cut ties entirely with them all.

Galagirl
 
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EVERYTHING that Kevin just said.

I soooo feel for you, Remmi (Hope). :( You have truly been placed in a near-impossible position and none of it is by your own making.

I second Kevin's statement that you - and your other friend, Faith - have a right to be furious with the both of them, Red and Meg. In fact, by virtue of NOT being a nesting partner, Faith will probably feel even more pushed out of the relationship and disconnected by these unforeseen events... although she may not have to witness the results first-hand on a daily basis.

It sounds as though Red is on board with the pregnancy and is being supportive and encouraging (even excited) about it, much to your consternation.

Assuming any pre-natal paternity test confirms that Red is the biological father, he will probably continue to support Meg, emotionally and financially - meaning that she will remain living in the household you all share. This situation is bound to cause a lot of tension all round, if resentments continue to build the way they have been... especially if Meg (who is already "in the wrong" here) continues to make unfunny "jokes" and sarcastic comments about usurping your place.

To my mind, the best (using that word loosely) outcome here would be if arrangements could be made to find Meg (and her baby, when the time comes) alternate accommodation, since nobody can force her to have an abortion if she doesn't want to.

Yes, the law will undoubtedly require Red to contribute financially toward child-support. However, since he and Meg are NOT partners and only have a casual FWB relationship, there is no reason she has to continue to live with you and Red forevermore.

In an earlier posts, you said that money was tight in your household, and a new baby will make things even tighter - financially, and space-wise. Surely Meg has family members or friends who she could live with and who could support her through the pregnancy and neo-natal period(?) As far as I know, she was only a former workmate/friend - so you other three are not responsible for paying her way or making sure she has a roof over her head, though Red will have to be partially responsible for the child, if it's his.

Do you think you and Faith could broach the subject with him sooner rather than later? He may not be willing to live apart from Meg and his kid, of course - and if that's the case, then you (and your other friend) will have to decide if YOU can live with their presence within your household, or if you need to live separately to Red, or break off the relationship entirely.
 
So, after Meg confessed that she wasn't actually on birth control, Red kept having unprotected sex with her? Instead of making sure that she actually got on birth control this time. Instead of putting a condom on. Hmm.

I would be pretty angry at Red, in your shoes.
 
While your anger at Meg is understandable, Red is the one who is really screwing you over. Why in the world are you willing to fight to keep a man like THAT?
 
Powerpuff yours is the easiest to answer:

When my ex husband had sunk so deep into a bottle he literally went insane(reaction to antibuse made him into a paranoid schizophrenic until he could detox off it) red was there, supporting me and kicking my ass when i dragged my heels. We have almost ten years together and he has been a wonderful father to my daughter when her own didn’t want to. For all he has done, for all we have been through, for the love i have for him i refuse to stop fighting just because a twit found a way to trap us all.

I know he has his part and when i can face that fully i will. Right now i can understand what a child could mean to him especially being told all his life ge couldn’t have any and experience throughout his life aupporting that. For that, I cannot ask him to not be excited, to not wonder at the miracle of life. I’m not ready to take that away from him, not yet.

Truthfully I haven’t begun to let myself feel rage. I have disconnected enough from it that i know i am angry, hurt, scared, and sad but it lets me put a smile on my face when i work, to not have meltdowns every five minutes.

But you asked why i am still fighting for a man like that. The answer is because i love him and for all his fault(s) he is worth it in my eyes.
 
For all he has done, for all we have been through, for the love i have for him i refuse to stop fighting just because a twit found a way to trap us all.

It sounds like you really love Red, and feel that walking away would be giving up something good, as well as (maybe?) ditching on some kind of obligation to stick with someone who was solid when you needed that.

My first caution to you is that, as with all "investments," past performance is not a guarantee of future results. Recent experience suggests Red is not being the same kind of reliable for you now that he was back in the day, and in other circumstances. Cherish your memories and always appreciate what he has been for you. But process what's happening *now* and what will likely happen *next* and *later* -- this is where decisions must be made. You don't owe anyone a debt of gratitude or loyalty that limits your future and leaves it subject to the whims of others' irresponsible actions.

My second caution is that no matter how firmly you dig in your heels, you have no power over the other people in this situation. Your choice may be to stay in the picture, but ultimately Meg and Red will decide their future. They may or may not include you, and that may change at any time. This is always true, of course, but it's especially important in the context of parenthood. While I would hope they would proceed ethically and with the well-being of their child in mind, recent experience suggests they don't necessarily act responsibly or ethically to protect trust, and to nurture all the people in the family. Nothing ensures your place in their family. Not your seniority. Not your tenacity.

My third caution to you is that naming (even to yourself) Meg as a "twit" and framing her actions as a "trap" is not going to serve you well if you intend to try to make this work. If you really want a fight, keep those words in mind. If Meg is as scheming as the worst case scenario suggests, she will use your anger and contempt to justify cutting you from her (and Red's, and the child's) life. Even if she is less malicious, such framing is bound to cause friction, and who would want someone around who thinks she's a manipulative twit (assuming someone can be both)? You aren't entrapped, and neither are they -- anyone can choose to leave this family, alone or together. Align your interests with your framing - do you want a fight, or do you want to try to start a family with these people?

Good luck. I do not envy you trying to stake a claim in this mess.
 
I know he has his part and when i can face that fully i will. Right now i can understand what a child could mean to him especially being told all his life ge couldn’t have any and experience throughout his life aupporting that. For that, I cannot ask him to not be excited, to not wonder at the miracle of life. I’m not ready to take that away from him, not yet...

Has a paternity test been done? If not, please urge him to insist on one. It would indeed be a miracle - and less likely things have happened - but there is also the possibility that the baby is not his.

(Oh, and if she balks at the paternity test, waffles or otherwise seems hesitant - that is highly suggestive too.)

Good luck.
 
Hi Remmi,

I want to apologize for my last post, it was insensitive towards how Red must feel with this miracle baby on the way. I do not understand your situation like I would need to to give you the help that you need. You need to see this baby in a positive light. The fact that Meg is the mother should not take away from that. She is family to you now, even if you did not choose her.

Anyway, I hope you'll pardon me for my harsh words earlier.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
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