Codependence and a competitive metamour, oh my...

Rochelle

New member
Hello, lovelies. Been lurking here awhile, this is my first post.

I'm in a happy, stable relationship with my partner of 6 years, Jean. We haven't always been so happy, though. I used to struggle with codependence, and for years we fought a lot and I'm sorry to say I wasn't always honest with him or myself about what I wanted and what wasn't okay for me. I thought the problem was polyamory, that maybe I was actually monogamous, but it turns out it was codependence!

When I started going to Codependents Anonymous meetings, I got the courage to tell him what wasn't working for me in our relationship, and I even left for a little while. When we were broken up, our friendship and trust in each other deepened and we slowly became lovers again. Since then, our partnership has been founded on nothing but real intimacy and generosity toward one another. It's really beautiful!

I've also realized I LOVE polyamory, and I'm even good at it. I've had a great time getting to know a few of his lovers that have visited recently, and he gives me great dating advice. I really love sharing someone I love with other people I care about.

The problem is that while Jean and I were split up, he began a serious relationship with another partner who combines all my hardest qualities when I was at my most codependent + then some--she's insecure, isn't honest about what she really wants and feels, feels jealous of everyone he's involved with, and fights with him constantly. I feel, and Jean has confirmed, that what she wants is a primary partnership with him (we're all doing non-hierarchical here), and even though she's excessively nice to me, she has no real interest in getting to know me and has twisted things I've said to her when she fights with Jean.

As a recovering codependent, my first impulse is to try to fix their relationship so it won't stress me out as much as it does. I hate seeing him distraught and full of self-doubt after she berates him for spending time with another lover. I hate that he's made the choice to go through this toxic rollercoaster of dishonesty and insecure attachment again. I'm in recovery, but he isn't! And I'm also afraid he thinks things will just sort themselves out if he waits long enough, like it did with me (because I actively worked on my mental health and relationship skills, which he isn't doing).

I know I can't change my partner, and I've stopped trying, but now my codependent brain fixates on this new partner when I wish I wouldn't. I'm happiest when I don't interact with her much, or think about their connection much, which depresses me. That's not how I like polyamory to look. But it seems to be the best way to curb my codependent impulses. She and I will have one slightly snarky interaction (If I say, "Oh, did Jean tell you it's been rainy here for days?" she'll say, "Yes. I talk to Jean every day. He tells me everything about his days. Thank you for letting me know about the rain, but yes, I already knew as I am in very frequent contact with him.") and I'll spend the next few hours writing her letters about how she needs to work on her insecurity and how I'm not trying to compete with her, honestly, and then deleting them because it's would be 100% wrong to ever send them.

Clearly, I'm still working through a lot of my demons about relationships, security, and my own need to control--and they only seem to come up around her. I hate seeing my sweetheart in what looks like an abusive dynamic, but I also trust him to take care of himself and learn his own lessons. I expect we'll all be in each other's lives for awhile yet and I want it to feel easier. How do you think I can best handle interacting with her? I can't always avoid it, and I want to be kind and respectful to her and their relationship, even if I don't approve of it and don't like her personally. Have any of you handled something like this? How did it go? Is there something you wish you had or hadn't done? Should I risk being more honest and vulnerable with her, or would that be a terrible idea? I'd like to be able to cut through the bullshit games, but I've already tried many times to reassure her that I respect her relationship, and I'm scared because she twists what I say, and I'm not always sure she's hearing what I mean.
 
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I am sorry you struggle.

FWIW? I think she's not your problem. You are not picking her out to date. Let her and all the stuff related to her be Jean's problem. He's the one dating her.

As a recovering codependent, my first impulse is to try to fix their relationship so it won't stress me out as much as it does.

I believe feelings ensue after behavior.

  • Behavior: You hang around her.
  • Feelings that ensue: You feel stressed
  • Solution: Stop hanging around her.

You are not in the (her + Jean) relationship. It is not your job to fix anything going on there. It is their job to do.

If the problem is that JEAN is oversharing his problems with her?

  • Behavior: Jean overshares things with me.
  • Feelings that ensue: I feel stressed out.
  • Solution: I can tell him to stop telling me about (him+ her) problems.

If he needs to talk? You can tell him to seek someone other than you to talk to about it because you are working on your codependence recovery at this time and don't need to be triggered. Later on if you become willing/able to be that sound board, you can inform him but right now? No. Be ok telling people no.

I hate seeing my sweetheart in what looks like an abusive dynamic, but I also trust him to take care of himself and learn his own lessons.

You can stop talking to her and hanging out with her and you can ask him to stop talking about her at you. Then you don't have to observe anything annoying/triggery.

You can trust him to take care of himself and learn his own lessons.

I'd like to be able to cut through the bullshit games...

Then stop seeking to reassure her when she isn't asking you to. Don't leap up to "pre-fix" other people just to ease your own anxieties. If hanging around her triggers you, stop hanging around her. Focus on fixing YOU.

Should I risk being more honest and vulnerable with her?

She's not your problem. Be honest with HIM.

Tell him that at this time of recovery, you prefer to keep your distance. You don't much care for her company and find her triggery. He's free to date her, and you want to be respectful of that. But you have no desire to be "tight buddies" with her. You can ask him not to invite you to things with her and not tell you their problems.

How do you think I can best handle interacting with her? I can't always avoid it, and I want to be kind and respectful to her and their relationship, even if I don't approve of it and don't like her personally.

Your time belongs to you. How is it disrespecting her to choose to spend the bulk of your time elsewhere with people you actually enjoy?

If you happen to bump into her? "Grocery clerk"polite is good enough. The same basic level polite you would give a stranger like a grocery clerk or bank teller. You say please, thank you, excuse me. But you don't invite them to go to the movies and hang out. What's disrespectful about that?

It's not like you are going "Neener, never, I like these other people better than you, nyah!"

I'm happiest when I don't interact with her much, or think about their connection much.

  • Behavior: I don't interact with her much or think about their connection much.
  • Feelings that ensue: I feel happy.
  • Solution: Keep doing this!

Again... be polite if you happen to cross paths but don't go out of your way to hang out with her. Ask him not to tell you about their problems while you are working on your recovery. Ask him to talk to other people instead.

Focus on fixing your stuff, not other people's stuff.

I'm sorry to say I wasn't always honest with him or myself about what I wanted and what wasn't okay for me

If in the past you were not clear about what you were and were not up for? That was the past.

This is the present. Change that old behavior. Speak up and tell him what you currently are and are not up for. If hanging around her while in recovery is too much for you? Say so and don't feel bad about it.

I hope you feel better in time.

Galagirl
 
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This isn't really a poly problem. I think it happens in all sorts of relationships. I've experienced similar in a mono relationship with a close friend of my partner. They'd been friends for years before he and I got together and at first everything was fine. We were all friends. All great. Over time, though, my partner's friend started to compete with me, to put me down if the three of us were out together and then to put me down if she and I were out together.

I totally get it. It sucks when a good friend who you spend lots of time with suddenly has a partner and isn't as available as they were. Sucks worse if you are a bit insecure and need to feel attractive to men and wanted by them. I could see where it was coming from and I could feel empathy for how the friend was feeling.

Still, I don't enjoy being put down at all. So after this had gone on for a while with no sign of resolving, I stopped spending time with her on my own or with her and my partner together. My partner is free to see her as much as he wants - I'm not entirely sure how often that happens but I know he is in contact with her sometimes. Things are fine between us. We still talk sometimes and sometimes see each other on group events.

This wouldn't have been my preference for how the friendship should go but it was the best I could make of a situation that sucked on a regular basis.
 
...he began a serious relationship with another partner who combines all my hardest qualities when I was at my most codependent + then some..
I'll spend the next few hours writing her letters about how she needs to work on her insecurity and how I'm not trying to compete with her, honestly, and then deleting them...
I'm still working through a lot of my demons about relationships, security, and my own need to control--and they only seem to come up around her.



1. Nobody can make any kind of competitive remarks to you unless you're competing. It always takes two to hold up the rope.
2. It's never about what you say, it's about how you feel.
3. None of this is about her.
 
Hi Rochelle,

I think you should spend as little time as possible around your metamour, ask Jean to mention her as little as possible, and when you have to be around her, be polite to her but nothing more, don't try to reassure her and don't try to reach out to her. It would be different if she wasn't locked in a pattern of toxic behavior, but she is, so you need to protect yourself. At least this is what I would advise based on the info given.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
I dated a guy last year who had a codependent relationship with his mom. When we first met, he was taking care of her as she died of cancer. They were very close since she'd had him at 16 and they sort of grew up together.

I felt bad for him since she emotionally abused him even as he cared for her every need. I found out after a while, that he also would get into shouting matches with her, giving as good as he got. But that was his row to hoe, not mine. He was fun to hang out with and have sex with. But I never met his mom and didn't want to. It did make me sad to see their unhealthy dynamic, but they had a long history and I knew I couldn't "fix" anything about their relationship. He was an adult and he had his own choices to make.

I was a welcome escape for him since I am pretty chill and fun to be around. I was satisfied with what he was able to give me and he wouldn't spend much time complaining about her. He would apologise when he did, but I allowed him to vent to me sometimes, to a point. He well knew things were not healthy between them, and he started going to therapy to learn how to not feed into the dynamic. That was all on him. I didn't need to spend much time listening to him talk about how he struggled, because he was getting professional help. We had lots of other subjects to talk about, and activities to do.

I don't have codependency issues though. I am sure it is much harder for you. I hope you can back off from his OSO, and protect your own boundaries. There is no reason you need to sit there and listen to him complain about his gf. At least my bf knew he shouldn't burden me with his struggles. If you learn to back off from being his "emotional tampon" he will be forced to go elsewhere to vent, and make your visits with him more about the two of you and not his yuck with the other woman.
 
I don't see why you should interact with her, nor any of his other partners, at all - unless it's truly enjoyable, but especially not if it's unpleasant. It's not a requirement in poly to befriend and schmooze with metamours. I also think you know a bit too much about her and what's going on with her, which tells me that Jean is probably oversharing. And possibly you are making assumptions about her based on information that's seems t be from more than just interacting with her. Are you getting it secondhand from Jean? Is he a bit of a sloppy hinge?

I would say, stop that. Leave that relationship alone, as it has nothing to do with you. Ask Jean not to fill you in on stuff between them, and let them be.
 
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