Confused and Not Sure How to Proceed

I would love to be open with my wife about this, but I just can't. She has her own issues about me. She's also kind of a hypocrite about this, because she still has an ongoing relationship platonic friendship with one of her exes, yet she gets upset at the possibility of me having any contact, online or otherwise, with my exes. She has talked to exes behind my back without consulting me, to the same extent to what I am trying here.

I'm ok with it. I've told her as much. It doesn't bother me, her ex is actually pretty cool; we get along.

I'm not looking to have an affair; my intentions are honorable.

If you would love to be open, then do so. Yes, you can be open if you so desire. The fact that she has done X doesn't mean you need to or are entitled to.

I'm assuming that her ongoing platonic friendship is out in the open. That would make a big difference in how things are viewed.

My wife is incredibly jealous and protective of me. She tends to view every other woman (that she deems to be attractive) as a threat. I don't like this, I tell her so, but its not going away anytime soon.

If there's secrecy around these women, that may be the root cause of feeling there's a threat.

If she's truly that irrationally jealous, maybe you should be spending your time in marriage counseling and working on this problem, rather than seeking out ex girlfriends behind her back, because secrecy only leads to further problems and concerns on her part that she really does have something to fear.

As to the ex girlfriend herself, she didn't make much effort for you even when she was your 'girlfriend.' You told her to call, and she never did. You have sent her a PM. You have e-mailed her. She hasn't answered.

I think that's her answer loud and clear. If she's been on FB at all (presumably that's where you've PM'd her?), she has seen that you sent a PM, and has likely chosen not to open it.

The hard truth seems to be, as someone already said, she just wasn't that into you. This happens. It's a fact of life.
 
Bottom line, it would mean a lot to me if she still considers me a friend. That's all I want out of this. I want to know if I matter to her.
But what if you don't matter to her one bit anymore? It's possible that the time she spent with you just looks like a small blip on her radar screen of life, and that rekindling/maintaining a friendship with you isn't going to be put on on her To Do List anytime soon.

If having a friendship and being important to her "means a lot" to you, you are just setting yourself up for disappointment. You are indulging in a fantasy. Perhaps your wife's jealousy sort of fuels this for you a little bit, but this fascination with wanting to "matter" to someone who let go of a relationship with you years and years ago only keeps you stuck in the past as well as in pipe dreams of the future -- while you could be present in the here and now, working on improving your current relationship with your wife, and seeking happiness in activities and meeting new people, expanding your life forward - not backward.

I say forget her. Don't let people who have moved on live rent-free in your head. You have better things to do with your time.
 
I have a hard time with the "forget the person and move on" approach to life and relationships. I disagree with it on a fundamental level. It assumes that (1) what you have with someone else is finite and specific, and (2) that what you have with someone else is non-unique and can be replaced. I have "dated" a lot of girls in my life. I can say that I don't consider anything I had with any single one of them as a waste of time or similar to any other relationship. These women were great friends to me first and foremost; anything we attempted aside from that was extra, and shouldn't negate our friendship.

I get that "forget the person and move on" is the easiest approach, but I don't believe it is the best approach. If this girl chooses this approach, and chooses not to acknowledge me, so be it. I'd be disappointed in her, and at some point I likely am going to run into her because we are somewhat socially and geographically connected still, it's going to be kind of frosty. Oh well.

As for my wife, I talked to her about what I was going through the other night. I told her that I'm disappointed with the fact that I've become so distant with my friends, both girls and guys. I told her that it doesn't matter what I had with them in the past, it is important to me to reach out to them now. I told her that I envy what she has with her ex, and reminded her that her ex is now a very close confidant of hers whom she talks to on a regular basis. I told her that I wanted that in my life, and I told her how I have no one else to talk to outside of her.

Her only response is as usual. I becomes about her issues. "You don't really love me." "How can you still be thinking about women from 6-9 years ago in your past?" "I don't understand why you would want to do that?" "Why do you think that that is ok?" "You can just leave if you want."

It gets me nowhere. It just reminds me that there are certain times in my life when I am not going to be able to talk to my wife about something, and I'm unequipped for it. I don't have anyone else.

What's funny is that the girls I group together as "my exes" are not really exes. They were girls I was really emotionally close to, I tried to have a relationship with, but eventually did relatively little with sexually. This shouldn't even be an issue.
 
Her only response is as usual. I becomes about her issues. "You don't really love me." "How can you still be thinking about women from 6-9 years ago in your past?" "I don't understand why you would want to do that?" "Why do you think that that is ok?" "You can just leave if you want."

I guess I'd wonder why SHE wants to do it, then. Why is she projecting awful motives on you, if her motives are okay?

You want to reconnect, which is fine, but you've reached out twice, with no response. If you want to reach out again, my advice would be to wait. Wait for her to post something that you GENUINELY relate to, and comment on that. Wait for her birthday to roll around, and wish her well. Your desire to reconnect, and the feelings you've presented here seem to border on obsession, and obsession is easy to sniff out (and be creeped out by). If I'm creeped out, I'm less likely to respond (thinking a response will only encourage more of that behavior). Back off. I'm not saying "forget about her and move on" but just back off. Give her a chance to approach you without feeling backed into a corner.

I do recommend you and your wife keep talking and keep working out this difference between the two of you. Rekindling an ability to talk and confide in HER (if you can) may help go a long way toward alleviating this level of loneliness you seem to have.

Hang in there...
 
Yeah, I do feel creepy, but then again, I always have felt creepy with her. I always had to hound her to get in touch with her. And then it was like no big deal afterwards. I think it's just the way she is, I always got the impression that her good friends had the same problem with her.

I'm emailing her at an address that I'm not sure about. I'm FB pming her which is not a silver bullet either (have a friend that didn't check them for two years, and found all these messages were sent and not received).

It is what it is. I think I have a wall post in me (just letting some time go by) and a pour-your-heart-out letter (FB pm) that I fire off drunk one night if she negs me on the wall just to feel better.
 
It sounds like you made up your mind about contacting the old flame. That part sounds resolved enough.

It gets me nowhere. It just reminds me that there are certain times in my life when I am not going to be able to talk to my wife about something, and I'm unequipped for it. I don't have anyone else.

It sounds like you have other problems with wife though. How do you plan to address this? Because it is true. If wife is not able to hear your concerns through her own filter, then you could choose to better equip yourself by making other friends now. To rely on in future for those times for support and comfort. Wife's not going to be it.

Galagirl
 
It sounds like you made up your mind about contacting the old flame. That part sounds resolved enough.



It sounds like you have other problems with wife though. How do you plan to address this? Because it is true. If wife is not able to hear your concerns through her own filter, then you could choose to better equip yourself by making other friends now. To rely on in future for those times for support and comfort. Wife's not going to be it.

Galagirl

Definitely agree. When I started a relationship with my wife, it was just us. We didn't do much anymore, we just hung out together. It's great that I can feel that way with her and that we have that kind of relationship, but I realize lately that we gave up a lot too, me more than her. I have no support network outside of her. The few friends I have left aren't the ones I can open up to, and I don't have much contact with them anymore either.

It's tough. It's something that, if I was aware of when I started dating, I would have addressed. My parents are in the same boat. They are completely dependent on each other, they have no social contract outside themselves, and now, in retirement, at least my mother realizes this and wants to correct it. I don't want me and my wife to get like that. I feel like we could use more separate lives to some extent: not completely separate, but more independent. I don't think this necessarily needs to negate our current relationship.
 
Perhaps you and your wife could try some couples therapy. There is definitely a problem with communication between you, and you do not feel safe enough to be yourself. You do not have a partnership that works, in that respect.

It makes sense that you get lost in fantasies about reconnecting with a former lover when you are scolded and misunderstood and don't get the kind of acknowledgement you seek in your current relationship.

Indeed, that is why I think it is even more urgent that you set those fantasies aside and not pursue the past - look at what you are living with now and fix that first!!! My point wasn't about forgetting and moving on, it was more about looking at what you have now and finding ways to heal it so you can expand your life. The way things are now, you are just using escapism to cope.
 
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I completely agree with nycindie about the escapism.

If I were in your shoes, I would ask myself, "why now?" You mentioned that you haven't talked to her for a good 6 years. You visited the town she's from, became depressed, but then got better for a bit. What triggered you to escape to this fantasy again? I'm not asking for you to post it on the forum, but more as a personal reflection exercise. Clearly something was going on in your life that left you deeply craving intimacy with another person, and I'm guessing it might be related to your relationship with your wife.

I'll also second nyecindie's suggestion of couples therapy. I don't need to share every little thought with my guys, but I do need to be able to talk to them when there's something that deeply bothers me. When I was struggling with new changes in my and my husband's relationship structure, he had a tendency of taking what I was saying personally and going off on "his stuff" rather than staying focused on the topic. I had to talk to him about THAT process and how it was difficult to talk to him, explore the meta of communicating. But in that situation, he and I were both on the same page about figuring out how to communicate better and learn new skills.

If you find that your wife is not willing to work on your relationship, then you might want to think about what that means for you. Is that the kind of relationship you want? Or are there ways you can find support otherwise? My husband and I used to be quite enmeshed, rarely have friends that we didn't mutually hang out with, spent all of our free time together. But when you're both working on your relationship, you can't rely completely on her support. Finding friends to help you through this sounds like a priority right now.
 
Just a bit of an update on this thread, and what I'm going through right now if anyone is interested and has any further input. I haven't attempted the Facebook post yet; I'm incredibly afraid to. I have been over what I want to say to her, but I don't have a good strategy if she doesn't respond at all (which I figure is what is likely to happen). I would feel devastated if she didn't respond to me, and that is what is stopping me from going forward. It would really hurt. I've always considered her a friend above anything else, and I now feel guilty for even attempting to have a relationship with her all those years ago. If I'd have backed off, maybe we would have become good friends, and I wouldn't have gone 6 years without talking to her.

Good news though about my wife. I have talked to her a lot about my "exes" and why I want to stay in touch with them, and, although she still does get insecure about them at times, she doesn't seem as threatened by my talking to them anymore.
 
Re:
"If I'd have backed off, maybe we would have become good friends, and I wouldn't have gone six years without talking to her."

That's highly speculative. The impression I get is that she was no more interested in platonic friendship than she was in romance. Possibly due to her not being interested in anything that's long-distance; possibly because her attentions are/were sequestered by something or someone else. It wasn't just one person who decided to go six years without talking: She decided that too. Only difference is, I suspect that she's comfortable with the six years and even more comfortable with sixty more years. It's not likely that she's thought much or at all about you all this time. May God grant that I'm wrong, but that's where I'd place my bet.

You mentioned that you'll probably run into her in person sometime. Why not just talk to her then? Then you wouldn't have the stress of always checking to see if she responded to your (prospective) Facebook post, only to find out that once again she hasn't.

Glad to hear your wife's feeling more mellow about talking to your exes.
 
Re:
That's highly speculative. The impression I get is that she was no more interested in platonic friendship than she was in romance. Possibly due to her not being interested in anything that's long-distance; possibly because her attentions are/were sequestered by something or someone else."

I know it's speculative; everything is right now. After the last time we saw each other, she did eventually reach out to me (4 months later), so I guess I'm not conviced she's going to blow me off. Plus I'm the married one; she might just not feel good about contacting me because of that to speculate even further.


Re:
You mentioned that you'll probably run into her in person sometime. Why not just talk to her then?

Running into her seems tricky to me, because I never go to her town anymore. I'd like to because I have a few friends there still, but it is tough for me because of her. I could make this happen if I needed too, and it wouldn't look like I was just going down there to see her, but it would be better if we could chat online first. I'd feel a little more at ease. She is kind of holding a part of my social life hostage in this regard.
 
What Kevin said.

I find that I tend to overestimate what people are thinking/feeling in my own head, and have learned that people have their own lives and things they are focusing on, and really don't pay much (if any) thought to the things I'm worried about, especially if we're not really in each others' day-to-day lives.

Also, if you're coming across to her in the same way that you're coming across to me in these posts, you are coming across as obsessed, which doesn't help rekindle conversation (and in fact, encourages many people to pull away entirely). My recommendation remains the same: cool it. If you see her, then chat with her, but let it go. I also recommend working with a counselor to see why you can't seem to let go of it right now - is it that you're escaping from your current relationship, or is it something else?

Sorry - I know this isn't the answer you want to hear, but if I were the object of this sort of attention, I would only want to reduce contact, not welcome it.

Also, I'm glad that you and your wife are better able to talk about your exes. I hope the increased communication between the two of you continues.
 
What Kevin said.

I find that I tend to overestimate what people are thinking/feeling in my own head, and have learned that people have their own lives and things they are focusing on, and really don't pay much (if any) thought to the things I'm worried about, especially if we're not really in each others' day-to-day lives.

Also, if you're coming across to her in the same way that you're coming across to me in these posts, you are coming across as obsessed, which doesn't help rekindle conversation (and in fact, encourages many people to pull away entirely). My recommendation remains the same: cool it. If you see her, then chat with her, but let it go. I also recommend working with a counselor to see why you can't seem to let go of it right now - is it that you're escaping from your current relationship, or is it something else?

Sorry - I know this isn't the answer you want to hear, but if I were the object of this sort of attention, I would only want to reduce contact, not welcome it.

Also, I'm glad that you and your wife are better able to talk about your exes. I hope the increased communication between the two of you continues.

I know that I must sound obsessed here, but I doubt I sound obsessed to her. After all, I haven't had any contact with her in 6 years, gotten married, and had a life outside of her. My intention is to just say something along the lines of, "Hey, how have you been? It's been a while."

As for therapy, I am considering it. I differentiate my issues into two things: what is bothering me, and my reaction. I think my desire to say hello and start talking to her again is legitimate and something worth doing, but my reaction is not healthy or desirable.
 
Re:
"My intention is to just say something along the lines of, 'Hey, how have you been? It's been a while.'"

That sounds like just the right thing to post on her Facebook, word for word. I guess that is your desire, to post those words to her.

Re (from earlier post):
"I would feel devastated if she didn't respond to me, and that is what is stopping me from going forward."

I guess that's what you mean when you say your reaction is not healthy or desirable. You are investing a lot of your well-being into someone who might not reach out to you in less than four months, or even less than forever. A simple, "Hey, what's up," on Facebook, should be just that, a simple casual greeting, not a desperate message in a bottle.
 
I am glad things are a bit better with your wife.

I am also glad to see you write this and hope you pursue it:

As for therapy, I am considering it. I differentiate my issues into two things: what is bothering me, and my reaction. I think my desire to say hello and start talking to her again is legitimate and something worth doing, but my reaction is not healthy or desirable.

I agree some of your responses are not as healthy as they could be. Saying something like "How's it been?" on Facebook is casual enough. But you seem really wrapped up in one possible response. Thinking she won't respond inspires fear or dread, and then you get caught up in all that and get paralyzed.

To me you seem to be getting into some thinking patterns that don't seem healthy...

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/in-practice/201301/50-common-cognitive-distortions

Perhaps you could postpone contact till you see therapist?

I could be wrong, but to me it sounds like you are lost in the desert, worried about having no friends outside your wife. So you have built up your ex in your mind to play a certain role where she's supposed to be the oasis. :(

Galagirl
 
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Re (from earlier post):
"I never go to her town anymore. I'd like to because I have a few friends there still, but it is tough for me because of her. I could make this happen if I needed too, and it wouldn't look like I was just going down there to see her, but it would be better if we could chat online first. I'd feel a little more at ease. She is kind of holding a part of my social life hostage in this regard."

See, she shouldn't have that kind of power over you. If you want to go to her town to see your other friends there, you should be able to just go. She is like something that started out as a cute plushy tribble, and has multiplied over and over until she consumes everything and that's not so cute.
 
Hi Dev,
I understand that you haven't spoken in 6 years, so she's unaware at this time, but when/if you do speak to her, it's VERY easy to telegraph this need to reconnect, unless you're extremely self-aware of how you're coming across (and then, honestly, you're not really enjoying the moment with HER as much as you are trying to meter your responses).

Maybe talking to a counselor before sending this message, in order to work on being so wrapped up in a response? The fact that you say that *she* is holding your social life hostage? I'm sorry, but no - you are. I can't see any motive on her part, since she hasn't even been in touch in years.

Extra geek points for Kevin's tribble reference, and one more point for truth - it's something sweet that's multiplied well beyond "sweet" into "overwhelming". Take care of yourself before getting in touch with her. It'll help you actually enjoy the meeting, rather than being overly concerned about the outcome.
 
Hi Dev,
I understand that you haven't spoken in 6 years, so she's unaware at this time, but when/if you do speak to her, it's VERY easy to telegraph this need to reconnect, unless you're extremely self-aware of how you're coming across (and then, honestly, you're not really enjoying the moment with HER as much as you are trying to meter your responses).

It's funny that you bring that up, because this is nothing new. When we were actively seeing each other, I would go through this like every week or so. She was very coquettish towards me, and I would go through these periods where I thought everything was crashing and burning. But when I did see her again, I snapped out of it, and we were good together, we'd be laughing and drinking and everything was normal. We'd always wind up in bed together (not that this matters but its a good indicator especially when you're in your 20's) and it was fairly effortless. So, I guess I am better at controlling my emotions than I give myself credit for. I don't talk like I do on this forum to other people in my life, and that's the rational for coming on this forum: I need to get it out.

The fact that you say that *she* is holding your social life hostage? I'm sorry, but no - you are. I can't see any motive on her part, since she hasn't even been in touch in years.

I agree. The reason I haven't been back there for 6 years is my fault, not hers. But that doesn't make it easier. I had a hard time going there when I was seeing her (just brought up a lot of emotions from times earlier), but now, its really hard for me. I feel really out of place now, and there is like a 90% chance I'm going to see her if I do it. The people I would be saying hello to I haven't had much contact with for 6 years, while she has pretty much seen them on a regular basis. It's my fault I don't go back there, but it would be a lot easier if she would just say hi to me and clear the air.

Just my two cents, but my friends still go there from time to time, they know her friends, there is nothing preventing me from just showing up all of a sudden and it would be completely justified. If it was me in that situation, I wouldn't feel like I could successfully ignore the other person if they tried to contact me, but that's me not her I guess.
 
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