I don't want to lose my girlfriend, please help!

teck83

New member
Hi,

I really need some help/insight. I am in a long distance relationship with a girl in France (I'm in North America). We met in Australia and were seeing eachother (not dating) for about 5 months there before I left. She visited me herein Florida and, then she went back home to France. Things were good and we were talking every day. We love and miss each other very much. Anyway, There is a girl, whom I also met in Australia, that is coming to visit me from London (and thus we shall call her London). My girlfriend and I talked about having an open relationship while we are apart and we agreed that we would, we just didn't want to know any details about it. Recently, London decided to post that she got her tickets and is coming to Florida between __ date and __ date. She didn't say she is coming to visit me specifically or whatever because she's not, she has other friends here too buuuut my girlfriend (btw, we are a new couple, only been official for about 2+ months) saw this post, went to Londons facebook page and looked at all her pics and then immediately started assuming the worst and has been in a bad way ever since. We skyped today like we always do but we put everything on the table. I made her tell me exactly what she was afraid of etc and it came down to her giving me an ultimatum. Have sex with London and lose her or don't have sex with London and don't lose her.

I know none of you know me and this just sounds like a dude who wants to bang other girls but this is not the case. I love and care about my girlfriend very much but this is who I am. I have gone through many trials and errors and have been researching sexuality for about a year and have been struggling with this for quite some time. After all the studying and self examination I have concluded that the correct lifestyle for me to follow in order to be the happiest is a poly lifestyle. I just don't know how to transition my partner into it or even talk to her about it.

Feel free to ask any questions you want about me or anything, I'm an open book. I don't want to lose her but I won't lie to her.

I forgot to explain London. She and I met in Aus. She stayed at mine for a night then decided to extend her flight for another 5 days. We have amazing, mind blowing, no limits sex and our flirty, playful personality chemistry is off the charts but we are just friends who fuck, a playmate, that's it. She is the polar opposite of my girlfriend who is sweet, lovable and almost innocent.
 
Innocent? Sounds rather calculating to me.

You really need to make this decision yourself, but I would not be with a partner who only let me be poly on condition I kept my other lovers a dirty little secret. Not only is not fair to them; it's not what I want. I don't want meaningless affairs on the side. I want relationships with men and women who are a significant part of my life. Not possible in the situation you're in.

What is it you want?
 
Hi teck83,

I am confused about why your partner/girlfriend is opposed to you having sex with London. Why is she assuming the worst about London, and what exactly does "worst" entail here?

You agreed to have an open relationship right? as long as you didn't disclose any details to each other? Well, you have kept your part of the agreement. You didn't disclose any details about London. The only "details" were disclosed by London herself, and that was limited to posting about a pending visit. Or do the pics on London's Facebook page show all kinds of "details" of her relationship with you? Did London post explicit pics on Facebook? If she did, I don't think she's supposed to.

So anyway, you have been confronted with an ultimatum. Stay away from London's bed, or your girlfriend will break up with you. Let's assume for the moment that there's no way you could talk your girlfriend out of sticking to that ultimatum. In that case, what are you going to do? What are your priorities? Is your girlfriend being fair about this?

I guess you could assume this was a one-time situation. But what if it's not? This time your girlfriend is vetoing London. What if next time she's vetoing someone else? What if she vetoes one person after another, until in practice, she is vetoing the open relationship itself? Is that going to be acceptable to you? Is your relationship with your girlfriend more important to you than your freedom to be in an open relationship?

I guess you could give your girlfriend the benefit of the doubt for now, and see what happens in the future. It's possible you may end up making some difficult decisions however, eventually.

With more information (details), I might be able to think of more (better?) feedback to post for you. Good luck and hang in there.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
If you and your gf have a don't ask; don't tell policy, how did she know to seek out London's profile? Was she just stalking every female profile you have on your friend list and made a lucky guess?

However it happened, your gf doesn't sound at all into poly. While its clear you'd like her to be poly and you want to keep her, its not your place to make her transition to poly. You wanted to be poly and chose to educate yourself on it. She gets to do the same - if she wants.

You say you've been with her two months? Not very long and certainly not the year of research you had. The best thing to do for yourself and your goal is to stick to your guns and hope she makes the choice to learn and accept poly for her own reasons. Maybe then she'll continue with you.
 
Candiedlove: Hi, my girlfriend doesn't even know that I've been studying up on Poly or that I'm even like that, I'm sure actually that she's never even herd of it. I am going to wait till she gets here to talk about it because it is not something we should talk about when we are this far apart.

kdt26417: Hi, so the thing was that she didn't want to know about it, a kind of don't ask don't tell thing but when London posted on my timeline about coming to Florida that just looks suspicious (to her and I understand) and then it put a face on it and allowed her imagination to run wild. No London didn't post any pics, she doesn't even have any pics of us. The open relationship is only supposed to last till we are together again, once we are together I will talk to her about Poly.

Vinccenzo: (see above about facebook pic question) If I were to talk to her now about poly she would shoot it down but if I wait for her to get here and then slowly start showing her things and talking to her about it maybe things will workout well. She is willing to talk about things and work things out rather than yell and fight about shit and thats a BIG plus. Yes, 2 months we have been official but we have been "together" now for about 8 months now and have known each other for 10.

UPDATE: Ok so we messaged, skyped ad talked last night and I was able to bring the situation down from a red(eminent risk) level to a blue(guarded risk) level. I assured her that this girl is more of a friend than anything and having sex with her is NO BIG DEAL to me, it's not the main focus of her visit. I told her, and this is true, that I will try to be good and not go out of my way or whatever to hook up with London. After that the mood changed and things got much better between us and all day messaging has been on a very good note, very lovey dovy :)

Thank you all for everything, I may be back for some more help later but I think we're good for now.

Much love,
-Teck
 
So you lied and now she's placated. Great.
 
"I will try to be good and not go out of my way," to me sounds an awful lot like my partner's, "I'll try," and "I can't promise not to do anything because I don't know what will happen," from before I was accepting of him having intimate relationships with other women.

That doesn't end well. To give you an idea, I left him for a year. Not that I was in the right for trying to limit his sexual interactions with other women, but just so you know how that comes across.
Note: I do not think her ultimatum is fair, but if you allow her to put limits on you, that's up to you. Just don't lie to her. That is not ethical poly or ethical non-monogamy.

Imo, you should be very blunt with her about whether or not you are intending on sleeping with London if the opportunity presents itself, since she has already brought that up. "Trying" not to sleep with her reminds me of Yoda.
Do or do not; there is no try.

"If I were to talk to her now about poly she would shoot it down but if I wait for her to get here and then slowly start showing her things and talking to her about it maybe things will workout well. "

What does "get here" mean?
Visit?
Move to North America permanently?
I beg you, do not do that to her.
Show her information now. Talk to her about it NOW. Do not wait until you are living together to spring poly on her.
I went through that and it was incredibly painful. I felt betrayed and enraged that my SO would ask me to move hundreds of miles to where he was, away from friends and family, only to tell me a couple months later that he wanted to see other people as well, having never brought it up before, and knowing full-well that I was monogamous and was expecting the same exclusivity from him.
It's a shitty thing to put someone through.

I hope you get this sorted out in a way that works for everyone involved.
 
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Sounds to me like the Girlfriend status is "Ultimatum understood and accepted". I could be totally wrong though... that's just how it sounds... to me.
 
Re (from teck83):
"I told her, and this is true, that I will try to be good and not go out of my way or whatever to hook up with London. After that the mood changed and things got much better between us ..."

So, is your girlfriend now okay with it if you should happen to end up having sex with London? I'm unclear on where the agreement currently stands.
 
I'm confused too. She doesn't know you're poly and you're going to wait till she moves away from where she lives to be with you to tell her? Does she know you did have sex with London ever?
 
Candi: I never lied to her. I don't lie, too may relationships ruined because of that crap. She is French and her English is not so good, also, she is 21 and doesn't know how many levels the sexual realm has. Can you remember back to when you were younger and things were pretty black and white when it came to sex? Now that you're more experienced things aren't so anymore are they? Well that's how she is, she's young and things are pretty black and white. Having the poly convo is gonna have to wait till after she arrives here and we are together for a while.

Invi: ""I will try to be good and not go out of my way," to me sounds an awful lot like my partner's, "I'll try," and "I can't promise not to do anything because I don't know what will happen," from before I was accepting of him having intimate relationships with other women."

You hit the nail on the head, that's exactly the stage we are at.

And I was blunt with her when we were arguing. I told her that I probably will sleep with London. The big deal was that she was under the impression that I really really wanted to sleep with London when in actuality it's really not THAT big of a deal whether we do or don't sleep together. London is my friend and that is really the most important thing. I want to see her and hang out. I had to get that point through to my girlfriend, once I did she calmed down a lot. Like I said, I'll try to be good but London and I have major sexual chemistry and we can't help but flirt and joke about with each other once we have a few drinks. If I do end up having sex with her, it's not a huge thing. My girlfriend was worried that I cared about London more than I do and she didn't want her sleeping in my bed and cuddling me n all that.

No no, she's just coming to visit for two months so that we can talk about the future and if our relationship can even last our regular lives. I'm an English teacher and a Scuba instructor and I love to travel, we need to see if we can make that whole thing work first anyway, that's why the poly convo is taking a temporary backseat.

Kdt26417: It's still kinda unclear for me too. I mean I know she wouldn't like it if I do but she knows now that it's not a major thing for me, if it happens it happens, if it doesn't then it doesn't and I don't care. She thought that it was my life mission or something to fuck London when in actuality I just want to see her when she's visiting because we get along so well and she's really fun to hang out with. The problem started once she put a face with a girl she thought I would have sex with. Once she saw her face it consumed her, it's all she thought about. It was driving her mad.

Vinccenzo: Like I said above, she is only coming to visit for two months. Yes she knows I've had sex with London, I told her that when this whole thing began which, go figure, is what made things go so bad in the first place.
 
Well it sounds like we are operating from the assumption that your girlfriend doesn't mind if you have sex with London as long as you don't have any romantic feelings for London. If you fell in love with London, then we might have a problem.

Hopefully you'll be able to sort all this out with your girlfriend when she comes to visit for a few months. (When will that be?)
 
Hi teck,

Long distance relationships are difficult. They can extend NRE and really getting to know each other.

I think you will have sex with London. You said

We have amazing, mind blowing, no limits sex and our flirty, playful personality chemistry is off the charts but we are just friends who fuck, a playmate, that's it.

You're "friends who fuck." Why would you not fuck her?

One gf is French, one is a Londoner. Makes me think of that old song, I see London, I see France...

I don't know, this all seems kind of a mess. I am not sure what kind of advice to give, other than, make the most of France's 2 month visit and be brutally honest about your polyamorous state of being. It is very possible, IMO, that you would "fall in love" with London, since the friendship is good and the sex is amazing. You can't guarantee France you will never "fall in love" with another. If it's not London it will be someone else. Does little 21 year old France want a guarantee, 2 months into a romantic r'ship, that you will never love another?

Is London also in her early 20s? Are you?
 
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"Sheltering" your partner from your definite intent in the relationship (to be poly) until she is there in person (at some expense, and somewhat at your mercy in a foreign land) is that thing you said you would not do. It's lying. And plotting to communicate the truth only when you have leverage - that's pretty manipulative. Do you have any interest in a more respectful approach?
 
Let me repeat back so I know I got it. Correct me if I get it wrong ok?

  • You and France are dating for the last 2 mos. It is LDR.
  • You both agreed to an Open relationship model while LDR. You are both free to date and have sex with who you please. You both agree to a "Do not Ask, Do not Tell" agreement for this time period.
  • The open relationship is only supposed to last till you and France are together again and no longer LDR.
  • She finds out from your social media page that you have London coming to visit. She breaks the DADT agreement by asking you details about London.
  • She presents you with an ultimatum -- Be with France exclusively NOW or France breaks up with you.

I would say break up. That is the simplest.
  • You want Open, and ultimately Polyshipping.
  • At this time? She wants Exclusive and Closed.

Not compatible.

You do not line up at this time.

Alternative? You have not been up front about wanting polyamory. You could bring it out now. Have the serious talks rather than skipping out on them. If you agreed to (Open while LDR and then Close when together?) And now you want (Poly at the end of LDR) rather than (Closed at the end of LDR?) It is on you to update her on your changing wants. She's not a mind reader. Don't pull a bait and switch. Could be up front:

  • You can tell her you probably will sleep with London. The relationship is currently Open. You are not breaking any agreements by doing so. Do not pussyfoot. Be up front.
  • You could tell her she is breaking DADT by asking. You could tell her if you are (willing/not willing) to renegotiate DADT boundaries from this point on if they are not working for her.
  • You could tell her how you prefer to be approached when she wants to talk to renegotiate boundaries rather than her having a temper fit.
  • You could tell her ultimately you want to polyship.
    • WHAT: You could better define what Open Model it is you want to be practicing.
    • WHEN: Make her aware that this Open thing isn't just during LDR and then once together you Close. You have changed your mind.

YOU could be more forthcoming. Having conversation that is (downplaying sex share with London) is not having (up front conversation about polyshipping future with France.) Skipping the conversations you could be having does not ultimately serve you well. Or anyone else.

LDR across countries gets expensive. Spare yourselves the financial expense and emotional grief by having the serious talks now over phone or Skype -- "I want to polyship in my life. Do you? Before we talk about deeper stuff, you need to know that about me straight up. I have changed my mind about what I want."

Part of the dating process is to talk and find out if you are actually compatible. This is only two months in as a dating relationship. Sort it out now before either gets further attached or invested.

Do not avoid talking it out from fear of what her response might be. Do not spring it on her unaware when she comes to see you. Be respectful.

  • Tell her ahead of time so she can prepare, research and gather her thoughts if she's wants to talk poly in an effective way with you. Rather than "deer in the headlights" about it.
  • Tell her ahead of time so she can cancel her trip if she wants to bow out rather than talk. If she is just not up for poly, she just is not. Better to find that out 2 months in than 2 years in.

It is not your job to "sell" poly to her or convince her of anything. It is your job to clearly communicate what it is you want in your dating life. Articulate clearly what you are seeking. She is not a mind reader. Do your part of the job.

Then she can do her part of the job and tell you what she is up for or not in her seeking. You are not a mind reader.

What lines up does. What does not, does not.

EXCUSES

I could be wrong, but these sound an awful lot like excuses to me:

Hi, my girlfriend doesn't even know that I've been studying up on Poly or that I'm even like that. (snip) I am going to wait till she gets here to talk about it because it is not something we should talk about when we are this far apart.

It IS something you could talk about now to assess basic compatibility. You have talked by phone and Skype before. What's stopping you? Not ability. There are many tools. What stops you is your unwillingness to talk up front.

she is 21 and doesn't know how many levels the sexual realm has

She is old enough to have adult sex. She is also old enough to decide how SHE wants to have sex/relationships in the realms SHE likes best for HERSELF. So?

That is still not a reason for you to skip telling her you changed you mind about (Open for now, Closed when together) and now want (Open for now, Polyship when together).

If I were to talk to her now about poly she would shoot it down but if I wait for her to get here and then slowly start showing her things and talking to her about it maybe things will workout well.

You have access to many tools -- email, snail mail, phone, Skype, etc. Stop postponing and start communicating. Show her things an talk now. That would be what I would do. Stop withholding information about yourself that is pretty critical to compatibility -- you changing your mind about (Closed after LDR). You no longer want that. Now you want (Poly after LDR).

Otherwise you leaving it out can sound too much like stringing her along with lies of omission for now so she gets attached, and then once you finally reveal you changed your mind it is emotionally harder for her to walk away because she IS more deeply attached. Or stranded in your country or whatever.

Not everyone you date will be a long haul runner. It just is what it is. But you could treat everyone you date with courtesy, respect, and up front communication.

GL!

Galagirl
 
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