I'm not finding long-term partners, he is.

awkwardfox

New member
So, I'm approaching my 3 year anniversary with my primary(male). We have been poly from the start and its a core tenant of our beliefs and our relationship. Most of the times things run pretty smoothly and internally we have very little conflict.

However, almost all of his dates and partners turn into longer-term (though not super serious) relationships. For him it's difficult to just find easy hook-ups. For me, it is the opposite. As a female, hookups are easy, but not being ghosted after sleeping with someone is VERY rare. I know this is not a problem for us alone, it's a widespread difference with men and women, poly or not, in the dating scene.

For me, I don't get much joy out of the random hook-ups and I am really looking for something more consistent. My partner also wants this, since many new partners is more difficult for him to adjust to than a few consistent ones. Also safer! Buuut I can't change the persisting culture that subconsciously seems to believe that since I already have a man, they won't or can't get emotionally close to me--they see me as just side sex. Between that and all of the guys that I thought actually did care for me ghosting me over the past few years, I have a badly bruised ego and a sour taste in my mouth for the dating scene. So, I have really slowed down my efforts, and his have stayed the same.

Now, he has on average 3 other consistent partners and dozens of others who come and go depending on season/if they are in relationship/if they are in the state/etc. And I have nobody, leaving me alone when he is out on dates (we live together).

Now logically, I still want to be poly. But I can't ask him so slow down or stop when I have no energy to date, then start up again when I want to. Yet lately it seems like I am getting all of the work and downsides of poly, with none of the benefits. So I am looking for advice on what to do.

It's been nearly a year of the same conversation and now we are both in a rut and can't seem to find a solution. How do I cope if I decide I don't want to date right now but he still does? Or how do I find partners that 'get it'? (even the 'poly' people I have dated didn't really allow themselves to care for me).

**Also as a side question, how many partners to people have and how many is 'too many'? Sometimes I feel like our poly is breakneck pace compared to most of my other poly friends'.**
 
For me, I don't get much joy out of the random hook-ups and I am really looking for something more consistent. My partner also wants this, since many new partners is more difficult for him to adjust to than a few consistent ones. Also safer! Buuut I can't change the persisting culture that subconsciously seems to believe that since I already have a man, they won't or can't get emotionally close to me--they see me as just side sex. Between that and all of the guys that I thought actually did care for me ghosting me over the past few years, I have a badly bruised ego and a sour taste in my mouth for the dating scene. So, I have really slowed down my efforts, and his have stayed the same.

You could try avoiding sex till you have a bit of a relationship established. Probably easier said than done.

Now logically, I still want to be poly. But I can't ask him so slow down or stop when I have no energy to date, then start up again when I want to.

Actually, you can, IMO. There shouldn't be much you can't discuss about your relationship with an intimate partner. Whether he agrees or not may be up to him, but stating your needs in a relationship should never be a taboo.

Yet lately it seems like I am getting all of the work and downsides of poly, with none of the benefits. So I am looking for advice on what to do.

This is definitely a conversation you need to have, if you're feeling like you get the downsides of poly. It means this is not working for you and you need some things to change. In my view, this is not so related with whether you have partners or not, so much as the manner in which the two of you are poly.

How do I cope if I decide I don't want to date right now but he still does?

You already are, from the sound of it.

Or how do I find partners that 'get it'? (even the 'poly' people I have dated didn't really allow themselves to care for me).

If you get the answer to this one nailed, please tell me :D

**Also as a side question, how many partners to people have and how many is 'too many'?

"Enough" partners seems to be a good number to have. "Can't handle" sounds too many.

Sometimes I feel like our poly is breakneck pace compared to most of my other poly friends'.**

This last is screaming you guys probably need to slow down and reconnect and discuss discuss discuss.
 
Yes, when I said "I can't ask him" I meant I HAVE asked, we have discussed. Everything I have written here I have said to him. And by can't ask I mean I agree with a point he made that he cares about his other partners and can't just start and stop with them based on how my mood about dating changes. I agree with that. Ethical poly means treating people like people, and I don't want to cause damage to his other partners. Nor would I think it fair if he asked the same of me. However, I do think it's fair to ask to slow down...which I have...and we have 'tried'...but it never really slowed.
 
on 'avoiding sex'

On Avoiding sex until people get attached: F* that. I get why playing 'the game' works. But I am not that girl. If I want a physical connection and we are both feeling it, I go for it. Sex isn't something I use to barter with or put on this pedestal like its holy. It's an activity that can be very intimate, or not. And it's important to me that the sexual connection is there if I am going to keep spending time with someone. I need to know if I like how they kiss, touch, etc, just as much as I need an intellectual connection.

People keep continuing to suggest this as a solution and I would rather gradually dismantle this archaic view of sex and be lonely forever than fall back into that same paradigm were the boy chases and the girl says no, even though she wants it. Which leads to a culture of "no means try harder".
 
On Avoiding sex until people get attached: F* that. I get why playing 'the game' works. But I am not that girl. If I want a physical connection and we are both feeling it, I go for it. Sex isn't something I use to barter with or put on this pedestal like its holy. It's an activity that can be very intimate, or not. And it's important to me that the sexual connection is there if I am going to keep spending time with someone. I need to know if I like how they kiss, touch, etc, just as much as I need an intellectual connection.

People keep continuing to suggest this as a solution and I would rather gradually dismantle this archaic view of sex and be lonely forever than fall back into that same paradigm were the boy chases and the girl says no, even though she wants it. Which leads to a culture of "no means try harder".

I don't want to speak for anamikanon, but this is not how I interpreted what they said. I don't think it's about playing games or withholding sex -- it's about being on the same page about what your goals are for the relationship. Are these partners ghosting you even after having told you that their intentions were aligned with yours?
 
Ghosters

In the past 6 months I have voiced what I want out of relationship. And the effect was many men saying they were aligned...then still ghosting me.
 
On Avoiding sex until people get attached: F* that. I get why playing 'the game' works. But I am not that girl. If I want a physical connection and we are both feeling it, I go for it. Sex isn't something I use to barter with or put on this pedestal like its holy. It's an activity that can be very intimate, or not. And it's important to me that the sexual connection is there if I am going to keep spending time with someone. I need to know if I like how they kiss, touch, etc, just as much as I need an intellectual connection.

People keep continuing to suggest this as a solution and I would rather gradually dismantle this archaic view of sex and be lonely forever than fall back into that same paradigm were the boy chases and the girl says no, even though she wants it. Which leads to a culture of "no means try harder".


THIS!! I completely and totally feel you on this!! I've had very similar experiences and share a lot of the same sentiments you've expressed here.

Have you tried communicating expectations prior to sex? Something like "Hey, before we jump into this really fun thing, I'm curious what your expectations are here. I'm looking for connections beyond a one-time hookup, what are you looking for?" That might spark a conversation in which you'll be able to determine whether or not the person might be worth your emotional investment (and if not, maybe still have some fun sexy times).

It IS challenging though, and I don't claim to know the answer...

[EDIT: I see now some posts flurried in before mine, so unfortunately this doesn't apply anymore.]
 
In the past 6 months I have voiced what I want out of relationship. And the effect was many men saying they were aligned...then still ghosting me.

Ugh, that's awful. I'm sorry you've had some bad experiences.

On another point that you raised, what do you mean by your poly being "breakneck pace"? As in attracting and dating many partners? As in relationships starting and ending quickly? Or in quick succession? Or as in things getting serious really fast?

I think it is very natural to have one partner be more interested in dating at any one time. I agree that it doesn't make sense to ask your partner to see less of his current partners just because you are not interested in dating at a particular time. I think it is your responsibility to find ways to manage your time when you are not interested in dating. I would suggest spending more time with friends or engaging in a hobby or volunteer work during the times when your partner is dating and you are not. I also think that it's okay to ask that your partner spend time reconnecting with you and not actively seek new relationships at certain times.
 
Breakneck pace

By 'Breakneck pace' I mean that (on both sides) sometimes we introduce the possibility of 2-3 new potential partners a week. Or that sometimes we are dating over 4 other people. They don't ever seem to get too serious (in part probably because we have strong boundaries on time and because they are spread thin due to how many). Each new potential partner takes time and energy to adjust to.
 
By 'Breakneck pace' I mean that (on both sides) sometimes we introduce the possibility of 2-3 new potential partners a week. Or that sometimes we are dating over 4 other people. They don't ever seem to get too serious (in part probably because we have strong boundaries on time and because they are spread thin due to how many). Each new potential partner takes time and energy to adjust to.

Hmm...yes, that does sound exhausting! I don't know whether it is common or typical, but I don't have any guidance for navigating that, unfortunately. We're new to poly and I fell in love with the first poly person I dated and very quickly was no longer interested in pursuing other relationships. My husband became friends with his now-partner and then they both expressed interest and moved from there -- also losing interest in pursuing more relationships for now. So in effect we haven't really experienced the "multiple potential partners" thing. It sounds like it might be working for your partner, but is spreading your time too thin for you to find what you're looking for?
 
On Avoiding sex until people get attached: F* that.

That isn't what I said, that is what you interpreted. What I basically said amounts to "If you don't want hit-and-run sex, don't do it." This, along with your OP sounds like you get into casual sex, but want them to see it as more and take it hard when that doesn't happen. Not all relationships will get serious - not as in in love and committed and all, but even steady, long term things. If you don't want casual hook ups, the only logical alternative is to not do them, and get to the sex part when you feel more certain about the man being on the same page. Or of course, you can fuck that and continue with acting sponetaneously on connections and gamble on them lasting or not.

I get why playing 'the game' works. But I am not that girl. If I want a physical connection and we are both feeling it, I go for it. Sex isn't something I use to barter with or put on this pedestal like its holy. It's an activity that can be very intimate, or not.

I have no idea where this epiphany is coming from. You don't have to raise sex to something surreal in order to put some thought into it before engaging.

And it's important to me that the sexual connection is there if I am going to keep spending time with someone. I need to know if I like how they kiss, touch, etc, just as much as I need an intellectual connection.

If you bring in sex at an initial exploratory level, I don't see how you can avoid relationships not going on to long term. It is the "find out" phase after all - for both of you, not just you. This would be fine if it worked for you, but clearly it also hurts you when they don't grow into something lasting.

People keep continuing to suggest this as a solution and I would rather gradually dismantle this archaic view of sex and be lonely forever than fall back into that same paradigm were the boy chases and the girl says no, even though she wants it. Which leads to a culture of "no means try harder".

If you've got this same suggestion from multiple people, may be worth considering that we aren't all prudes and are actually analyzing what you say you do against what you say you want.

This has little to do with playing games with "no". No woman can be shamed into saying yes on the basis of attraction either, if acting on it doesn't meet her overall goals. There is no rule that says finding someone attractive means you MUST agree to sex when asked. It is not a "game", it is being aware of your own emotional needs in addition to the sexual. There is absolutely nothing wrong with wanting to know more about a person you find attractive before agreeing to sex. This isn't coy/shy/baiting. Nor is the "no" something false that he is encouraged to overcome. A no is a NO. "I find you sexually attractive, but am not sure you meet my emotional needs, so NO, till I know better" is a 100% valid choice. No rule says you have to have sex every time you are attracted to someone or you are dishonest or something.

My suggestion didn't come from a sense of prudery at all. If you're having a lot of sex and having fun, go for it! I was looking at how you were describing your situation "sour mouth for poly" "breakneck pace" "they just see me as side sex" and so on. It didn't sound like you wanted to "dismantle this archaic view of sex and be lonely forever". It sounded like you wanted the result of a more committed view for yourself, as your partner does and didn't know how to go about achieving it. Now you sound like you enjoy hook ups in the moment. So go for that then.

If you go for sex before you build any kind of a relationship, you can hardly avoid feeling like "side sex" - what else is there beyond sex? That is the key. If you want a fuller relationship, you will have to create it before the sex if you don't want to trivialize the sex. Think of it from the other side. If you have casual sex with someone you don't know much of, and later get a feeling that they expect more, but you have no idea if you're compatible, you'd be uncomfortable engaging further too, because a repeat then sort of becomes a de facto agreement! If nothing else, you at least need a very clear communication that you are looking for more than one night stands - before any sex happens.

I get a feeling that you're sort of comparing your dating situation with your husbands and feel pressured to have a comparable amount of sex or something as a way of coping with what you are describing as breakneck poly. You probably should think about what you really would like for yourself and go about achieving that, rather than sex for the sake of sex, or agreeing to sex early on rather than not having anything, etc. Because clearly you are acting on sexual interest in ways that are leaving you dissatisfied with the overall situation of your sex life.
 
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By 'Breakneck pace' I mean that (on both sides) sometimes we introduce the possibility of 2-3 new potential partners a week. Or that sometimes we are dating over 4 other people. They don't ever seem to get too serious (in part probably because we have strong boundaries on time and because they are spread thin due to how many). Each new potential partner takes time and energy to adjust to.

ok. This sort of poly is way out of my imagination even. Let alone experience. Adapting to 2-3 new people a week is my idea of pure hell. I can't even fathom why anyone would want to do that.

Frankly, I think you can disregard my posts. I have absolutely no idea of the sexual or emotional needs or capacity to accommodate them that would apply in such a situation.

Out of curiosity, how are you able to make time for each other at all?
 
On Avoiding sex until people get attached: F* that. I get why playing 'the game' works. But I am not that girl. If I want a physical connection and we are both feeling it, I go for it. Sex isn't something I use to barter with or put on this pedestal like its holy. It's an activity that can be very intimate, or not. And it's important to me that the sexual connection is there if I am going to keep spending time with someone. I need to know if I like how they kiss, touch, etc, just as much as I need an intellectual connection.

People keep continuing to suggest this as a solution and I would rather gradually dismantle this archaic view of sex and be lonely forever than fall back into that same paradigm were the boy chases and the girl says no, even though she wants it. Which leads to a culture of "no means try harder".

If I am looking for a lasting relationship then I will get to know a person before becoming emotionally invested. If I'm looking to just hook up, then I just hook up. If I hook up with someone and determine I like them enough to get to know them better, but they are too busy dating 2 or 3 new people a week to have time for me, then I will most likely move on. I would interpret that as they are not looking for something long term. If that's their game, I don't have the time or energy for that. I've never chased a girl in my life.
 
On Avoiding sex until people get attached: F* that. I get why playing 'the game' works. But I am not that girl. If I want a physical connection and we are both feeling it, I go for it.

You can say fuck here if you want to. :D

I agree wholeheartedly with your view - it's one I very much hold myself.

I suspect that it isn't the sex itself that is stopping you from finding longer term partners - I'd guess lack of time plays a large part. If you are meeting and getting to know the number of new people that you describe every week, it would be hard to find the time to create a bond with any of them.

Also - with the amount of dating and work around dealing with the level of dating that you and your partner do, does it leave little time for other interests? Could it be that you talk lots about how much you are dating and how many partners you have and that that leaves the other person feeling like you won't really have time for them? Could it be that it is so difficult for you to find time to spend with new people that they drift off and find other people to hang out with?

I do suspect that you are struggling with some gendered thinking. Obviously there are wild individual variations but in general, men tend to be brought up to expect women to take care of them and women tend to be brought up to expect to take care of men - which is why if you read round, you'll read about the women here who have more than one male partner and do things like housework in more than one house, getting healthy food ready in more than one house, taking over planning in more than one house, helping men with clothing in more than one household. All of that stuff that subconsciously or otherwise, lots of men come to expect from women.

Is it possible that it is clear up front that you won't have time to do all that nurturing - and that then a longer term relationship with you becomes less interesting to the men you meet?

I'm not suggesting you change if that is the case. Not at all - but it's something to be aware of as it may well make it harder for you to find people who are a good fit.

Just out of interest, how do you have the time for all that dating? Do neither of you work?
 
Now, he has on average 3 other consistent partners and dozens of others who come and go depending on season/if they are in relationship/if they are in the state/etc. And I have nobody, leaving me alone when he is out on dates (we live together).

By 'Breakneck pace' I mean that (on both sides) sometimes we introduce the possibility of 2-3 new potential partners a week. Or that sometimes we are dating over 4 other people. They don't ever seem to get too serious (in part probably because we have strong boundaries on time and because they are spread thin due to how many). Each new potential partner takes time and energy to adjust to.


**Also as a side question, how many partners to people have and how many is 'too many'? Sometimes I feel like our poly is breakneck pace compared to most of my other poly friends'.**


I'm relatively new to polyamory having only been dating more than one person for the last couple of years, but I am not sure yours and your partner's current dating style is strictly within the spirit of polyAMORY.

"Dozens of others who come and go" and "2-3 new potential partners a week" sounds more like you're conducting auditions rather than taking the time and energy you spoke about to develop fully rounded relationships with individuals you have met or "clicked" with on some level. I can't speak for everyone, but I'm not really sure it's even possible to click with so many new potential partners per week.

Certainly you guys are practising some form of non-monogamy, but I think you realise that polyamory is not meant to resemble speed dating or a competition of any kind.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it appears you'd prefer your partner to transition these casual encounters/hook-ups into fewer, more serious, longer-term relationships... so as to allow time and space for you two to reconnect and enjoy each other. But although your partner professes to want the same thing as you, he is not taking the action it requires to actually DO so. Why do you think that is?
 
Awkward

In the past 6 months I have voiced what I want out of relationship. And the effect was many men saying they were aligned...then still ghosting me.

That should not surprise you. Men will say anything you want to hear to get in your pants.

And the simple fact is most men are going to look at a married women eagerly having sex with them with no major commitment or effort on their part as just a casual thing and fun.

Not sure what the two of you both do if you have time to be pursuing relationship with 3-4 people a week. Projecting that out to a year and I wonder how you have time to allow anyone to get to know you well enough.
And remember, no matter what men say, the majority of them will have sex with anyone that attracts them but they do not want to be emotionally involved with someone who is sleeping with multiple people.

I have not read any books that even suggest the majority of men are OK with this. Maybe on this forum, but not in the other world populace.

If i were you, i would stop worrying or competing with your husband with what he is doing or not doing. That may be contributing to your feeling of despair at not "connecting" into a loving relationship.

Hope you work it out
 
For me, I don't get much joy out of the random hook-ups and I am really looking for something more consistent. My partner also wants this, since many new partners is more difficult for him to adjust to than a few consistent ones. Also safer! Buuut I can't change the persisting culture that subconsciously seems to believe that since I already have a man, they won't or can't get emotionally close to me--they see me as just side sex.

You can either blame "the culture" (in which case you have zero influence over your own life) or you empower yourself by seeing the conflict inside yourself and how it's reflected in the relationships you keep creating. Having read the exchanges between you and anamikanon, it's pretty clear to me that your desire to have a long term lover relationship conflicts with your belief that a sexually self-possessed woman should be able to have sex when the desire arises. "The culture" is certainly real, but within "the culture" are always people who find what they want. People whose beliefs do not conflict with their desires find partners who reflect this, no matter the atmosphere of "the culture." If you keep finding yourself emotionally under water after sex, it's not because men just ghost on partnered women, it's because you keep creating relationships in which sexual exploration takes priority over emotional intimacy. To get somewhere more satisfying, take blame out of this and focus on aligning better with what you really want in a parter, but keep blaming "the culture" and "men are like that" and you'll keep finding more of the same.
 
Look, it's an open relationship, rather then polyamory. Nothing WRONG with that, but advice offered for one is often a (very) poor fit for the other. For instance, having random "whoever" sex (while, IMO, quite fun at times) obviously takes time away from creating longterm relationships.

Period.
 
Yeah. I've been practicing poly for close to 9 years, and I have one nesting partner. My goal is always to just have 2 lovers, my female partner and one other (usually male) lover.

I've tried having 3 lovers when I was new to all this, but I find that overwhelming time-wise. I am definitely spread too thin trying to be a good partner to 3 people at once. 2 is plenty.

Right now, my new male partner is out of the country for 5 weeks so while he has been away I have been entertaining myself with the prospect of one other relationship. But that is because my guy is new, and a free spirit, and I am not sure how we will work out long term (though things are looking better and better).

But I never have sex on a first date with someone I want to go long term with. I always meet someone from OK Cupid in public first, a restaurant, for a long in depth conversation, where I can really vet them, their personality, their prior relationship experiences, and their current goals. And that is usually after at least a week of messaging online to see if they are even first date status.

So I rarely get ghosted on once the first date is a success. I will do a nice makeout kiss at the end of a first date, by my car, if he wants to and I like him, but no naked time until the second or sometimes third date. I don't need to assess our sexual chemistry by immediate sex. I find I can tell that just fine sitting across the table.
 
Hi awkwardfox,

It sounds like you have a rather frustrating situation on your hands ... Your primary is able to find long-term relationships ... You, so far, are not. I don't know if my situation is quite the same, I remember back in the days when I was using OKCupid, I had zero luck attracting anyone, and I just got disgusted with it after awhile. I don't know if you guys are dating "too many" people, but over four at a time does sound like a lot. Maybe you could reduce the number of people you're dating, or at least, your primary could, since it sounds like he's the one doing all the dating right now.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
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