Jealousy & physical vs. emotional connection

comingaround

New member
So I've read a lot of people expressing less concern about their partners being sexually active with other people, but then saying they would have an extremely difficult time dealing with potential emotional connection between their partners and other people.

Where do people stand on this for real? Which makes you more uneasy and why?

I ask because I am currently navigating the first poly dynamic of my relationship (5+ years) with my partner. We were historically mono/mono up until 1 year ago when we started talking about going poly. She is cis-gender, pan sexual and I am non-binary (female bodied) and attracted to women. I am not involved with anyone else, and never have been but am open to it happening in the future.

We are in a short term long distance situation (2 months, I moved across the country to start a new job while she finishes hers and will join me). But a week after I left she got drunk and made out with this very young guy. This was cheating because we hadn't agreed to anything like that yet. Anyways after getting over the betrayal etc, I have come around to their relationship.

She has expressed to me that she loves him, and that he is her only friend out there. He has kept her company and taken care of her when she was sick, and I am actually OK with all of that, happy actually that someone is there for her. However, today she asked about being physical with him.

I can deal with the discomfort of them kissing, holding hands, making out etc., but she says she wants to take it further than that, not quite intercourse or cloth-off stuff but grinding etc... "scratching the itch" if you will and I feel like this is where I totally draw the line.

She is confused though, saying if she were in my shoes she'd be more concerned with the emotional bond, which is there already. Because of her P.O.V. on the matter she feels my boundaries around their physicality are arbitrary.

Thoughts? I'm open to getting to know this guys and them sharing a loving bond, but I am SO activated at the thought of them having sex or anything like it.:(
 
I am not quite sure I understand your position.

You stated that you and she have been talking about transitioning to an open poly arrangement for a year, and you worded it such that you were mono up until then, so it would seem to me that there was some sort of agreement reached (to "be poly") a year ago.

Yet, you're now saying that she cheated when she kissed that guy two months or so ago because there was no agreement?? How is that possible, if you stopped being monogamous one year ago? And now you are surprised that she wants to have sex with someone she's dating/spending lots of time with?

Didn't the topic of sex come up in your discussions about opening your relationship? If not, why not?

Also wondering... how did you imagine a polyamorous arrangement would work if sex with others is not allowed? Most people with an active libido, who are not asexual nor grey-A, would want or expect that sex is a part of their romantic/dating life. Also, did she know that you draw the line at her having sex with anyone else? What I mean is, did you explicitly state that is a dealbreaker for you during the talks you had about "going poly," or were you just expecting her to know your preference? Were the two of you sure of what polyamory is, and on the same page with regard to why you were talking about poly in the first place?
 
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I guess I also don't quite get your question, but more because you ask what people's opinions and/or feelings are, while you state yours. What difference does it make what anyone else's opinions are, if you know where you stand on this?

I do believe more people get worried over the emotional connection, though, as long as you asked, and I believe it's because with an emotional attachment, there's a greater danger of the partner leaving.

I see it here. I see people state directly that they don't care if their husbands have sex, but don't want a real metamour, no true love interest, for him. I see people who claim they're fine with their husband(s) having real love, yet find problems with each individual metamour, nonetheless.

In my own situation, the wife obviously had no problem with her husband/my BF sleeping with lots of women. They were/are swingers and poly. But when he showed clear signs of being really in love with me, to the point of essentially going poly-fi, doing things for me he'd never done for anyone else--there were problems.

So, yes, I think having a problem with emotional connection more than sexual is very common, and I think it's true that the emotional connection opens the door to a greater danger of a spouse leaving the marriage.
 
We agreed that we both wanted the same type of polyamory. That if either of us found another person, that we would want for the other to have a relationship with that person as well. (not necessarily romantic but at least familiar and amicable). We also both agreed that yes, there would be sex, but that it would occur only when everyone felt good about it. The fact that I haven't even gotten a chance to meet this guy, makes me feel like the potential for emotional connection occurring as a result, and without any opportunity for me to build trust/ familiarity/ or friendship with him makes me feel slighted and like that would be pretty opposite to what we agreed to.. We agreed we didn't want the "don't ask don't tell" model, or the separate lives thing, that obviously SOME things would be private but that everyone involved would move through big relationship changes somewhat together.
Plus the guy is 18, for all I know (because I don't know him) he's saying he is open to poly because he loves her and would say anything. He doesn't owe me anything and only respects me insofar as she wants him to. I don't even know if he genuinely wants to be in a poly relationship...because I don't know anything about him!?
 
...for all I know (because I don't know him) he's saying he is open to poly because he loves her and would say anything. He doesn't owe me anything and only respects me insofar as she wants him to. I don't even know if he genuinely wants to be in a poly relationship...because I don't know anything about him!?

This is all for your partner to navigate, not you. It's not your work to vet her relationships. Polyamery involves a good deal of respect and trust that your partner can make choices that are right for her. If you need to get involved and meet him in order to give the mental seal of approval, you're already headed into an emotional mine field. Wanting to meet him to be supportive and inclusive is very different than wanting to meet him because you have a basic mistrust of either his character or of her ability to run her life. If you two are really going to do poly, allow your partner the dignity and respect of making her own choices with lovers. Let her enjoy and experience whatever she needs to. No one wants anyone looking over her shoulder, evaluating her love life and fretting over all of the possible ways a relationship can go wrong. Often, things do go wrong, but realtionships are for learning and for experiencing. If you really want to be a poly partner, give your GF respect, distance and confidence in her ability to make choices that are right for her so that she can live, learn and love.
 
I second what Karen (FallenAngelina) wrote. Every word of it. I hope you read it carefully and let her sage advice sink in.

We agreed that we both wanted the same type of polyamory. That if either of us found another person, that we would want for the other to have a relationship with that person as well. (not necessarily romantic but at least familiar and amicable). We also both agreed that yes, there would be sex, but that it would occur only when everyone felt good about it.
These agreements are the crux of the problem and will only set you both up for disaster, especially since she is far away right now. Why such a need to be in control?
 
Where do people stand on this for real? Which makes you more uneasy and why?

These questions are helpful only insofar as they might further clarify what's important to you. What you and your GF are comfortable with is what matters, not what 99% or 2% of the general poly population is comforatable with. You don't need "ammunition" or agreement from poly people at large to support your feelings that sex is more intimate than emotional connection. If you are upset about them getting physical, then that's how you feel, end of story. Doesn't mean that you can't come to see a new perspective, but shoring up opinions one way or another won't help you and your GF come to a mutually pleasing place with all of this. If "no sex until all agree" is important to you, then stand by it. If your GF responds that "if she were in my shoes she'd be more concerned with the emotional bond," then you've got some working out to do. But you won't get to resolution by each discounting the other's perspective or trying to back up your position with X number of others who feel the same.
 
This is all for your partner to navigate, not you. It's not your work to vet her relationships. Polyamery involves a good deal of respect and trust that your partner can make choices that are right for her. If you need to get involved and meet him in order to give the mental seal of approval, you're already headed into an emotional mine field. Wanting to meet him to be supportive and inclusive is very different than wanting to meet him because you have a basic mistrust of either his character or of her ability to run her life. If you two are really going to do poly, allow your partner the dignity and respect of making her own choices with lovers. Let her enjoy and experience whatever she needs to. No one wants anyone looking over her shoulder, evaluating her love life and fretting over all of the possible ways a relationship can go wrong. Often, things do go wrong, but realtionships are for learning and for experiencing. If you really want to be a poly partner, give your GF respect, distance and confidence in her ability to make choices that are right for her so that she can live, learn and love.

thanks for this. Ultimately I just am trying to figure out how to get the perspective right in my own head a so that I can be supportive and inclusive. Do people find that it is easier not to know everything? or to do the don't ask don't tell route? I just also want her to be able to feel safe and supported by me if she did want to talk openly about her relationship with him.
 
There is a difference between allowing room for a partner and their lovers to have the privacy that is their right, and DADT. It's generally okay, for example, to ask that you know when a partner is dating, going out to meet someone, or having sex, but they shouldn't be pressured to feel obligated to inform you of every little thing they do. You don't need a blow-by-blow description of their sex life, but should know about anything that could impact your sexual health.

DADT is usually about pretending your partner isn't seeing anyone, and most polyfolk reject DADT situations, unless there's a very good reason for it.

The kinds of agreements you make could be about using condoms and notifying you if that doesn't happen so you can make an informed choice about your own practices, rather than policing her activities, for example.
 
There's a huge range between knowing everything and knowing nothing.

Also, many people (myself included) prefer not to be part of a don't ask don't tell arrangement as the "outside" partner because they feel like a dirty little secret...and very few people like feeling that way.

My personal preference is to set boundaries about how much I can accept hearing, while still making sure I'm informed of the basics. I want to know if one of my partners is talking to a potential new partner, but not what they're saying. I want to know if they have a date with any partner, new or existing, but not what they're doing or where they're going; the desire to know if they're on a date with someone else is mainly so I don't call or text during that time. I want to know the *first* time one of my partners has sex with someone new; after that, I don't need to know *every* time they have sex with another partner, I'm just going to assume that's a thing that will happen.

At the same time, though, I do NOT set boundaries or rules about other people's behavior toward other people. Saying "Don't have sex with a new partner until I'm comfortable with it"... to me, that's flat out wrong, because you are forcing someone else to base their behavior on a decision made without their input. You are controlling them. (Where "someone else" and "them" refer to the "outside" partner.) However, saying "I'd like to know if you have sex with a new partner, and if I'm not comfortable I'll say so" is only making a request of your partner, and that request doesn't impact the choices or behavior of any other partner they might have.

And nycyndie posted while I was typing and said all of this much more concisely than I did...
 
Also... it isn't a matter of whether it's "easier" not to know everything.

It is more fair and ethical, in my opinion, not to know everything. As nycyndie said, there doesn't have to be an obligation on your partner's part to tell you everything. And telling you everything might not be fair to them (they might feel uncomfortable, or they might like having something private between them and their new partner), and has a high potential to be unfair and unethical to the "outside" partner, who might not even be aware that their information and actions are being talked about.

Just as I wouldn't become involved in a DADT situation, I also won't become involved with anyone who insists that their partner has to know EVERYTHING, or anyone who lets their partner read our communications without asking me first, and so on. As far as a partner who wants to know a lot, I'm okay with that--as long as I'm told right from the start that my partner will be sharing things with his other partner and have the option to say "Don't tell her this" about specific things.
 
OK, these are good things to think about. Where are my boundaries with what I don't want to hear about, while having respect for the other person. Also, how would I like to be treated if I were him and how would I like to be treated by my partner when and if I decide to see other people...
 
I have been fully practicing polyamory for 7+ years. My gf is also poly. We have been very tight since the beginning.

We do not police each other's relationships. We have no "rule" we need to meet each other's OSOs right away. Generally it happens organically that we do meet each other's partners eventually, since we live together and we often host our OSOs in our house. On the other hand, if a new lover of one of ours is shy or uncomfortable meeting the other at first, we are discreet, and go out or stay in another part of the house while the date is going on.

We have no big dream of a network where everyone is friends. Some metamours do like or even love each other, some are not all that fond of each other, and strive to be merely polite in passing.

Surely as a lesbian, you know the line of "sex" is different when no penis is involved. Where is the line between making out and "having sex" when you are both women? That is a matter of opinion.

But even when a guy/penis is involved, there can be sex short of penis in vagina intercourse. There can be tit play, frottage, hands in each other pants, oral, there can be kinky behaviors. There is a continuum of sexual activities.

Are you going to be in her head, saying, you can do this sexual behavior, but not that one, when she is attempting to get to know and bond with her new partner? That would be unnatural and unrealistic.

Do you really want to give her a list of acceptable sexual behavior (flirting, holding hands, sitting side by side, cuddling, maybe kissing but no tongues), and what is unacceptable? That sounds almost Victorian. You're both adults. You're not her chaperone or her mom.

Polyamory requires a degree of autonomy many mono couples don't expect. It's not really a "we" thing. It's a "you and I" thing.
 
Hi comingaround,

I'm not sure whether a physical or emotional connection would bother me more, to be honest given my current situation, I probably wouldn't be bothered by either. But it doesn't really matter how I would feel. If you are bothered by a physical connection, that's how you feel, and it's a perfectly valid emotion. In any relationship, it's all about figuring out how each person feels, and working out an arrangement that works for everyone.

Is there anything specific that bothers you about a physical connection? Do you worry that your partner will "trade you in" for the very young guy? Sometimes digging to the bottom of an emotion helps you understand the situation better.

Keep us posted on how things are going for you, okay?

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
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