Monogamist looking for help

I feel you are beating yourself up unnecessarily. It is hard enough to be feeling devalued and panicked without adding "shoulds" about feelings. Sure it would hurt less if you naturally felt less hurt, but you don't. It sounds like you have time to let your feelings be your feelings, hard as they are to experience. Maybe if you do not feel pressure to extirpate them immediately you will be able to sort them out without the mind numbing effect of panic. Then you can find if they are part of the core of who you are or if you have any means of accepting what she tells you without pain. Be as patient and gentle with yourself as you are trying to be with her.
 
Glad to hear you have taken positive steps and made a counseling appointment.

I think it is understandable to feel unsettled at this time. Your wife told her crush person she likes them. Before telling you. No heads up or anything. She crossed a line. However small, it's a ding. One of the foundations for trust is being able to take people at their Word, and believe they will follow through on that. She tripped up a bit there.

Now she promises to remain Closed and that she'd never do anything without your blessing and goodwill. Well... being Closed was the agreement before. And she broke it. What stops her from breaking it now? I could see some fearfulness being there. You have been unsettled. I think your dream shows you still have that fear thing under there.

Maybe you need reassurance before you can let that fear go and risk trusting her to keep agreements. Then she has a space where she can demonstrate it and thus validate your trust in her.

It can stink if you have done nothing wrong and you are the one who has to pony up the initial "trust re-investment." It's just the nature of the thing though. You get to risk being hurt again, she gets to NOT hurt you, and you can breathe a sigh of relief and go "Yes. I am ok after all."

I assume she has owned that behavior and apologized. Has she? I didn't quite hear that in this bit...



I heard explanation for her behavior. But that's not owning it and apologizing formally. To me all the steps are these

  • I did this behavior. I own it.
  • It was the wrong thing to do. In future I will do...
  • Could you be willing to forgive me?
  • Could you be willing to give opportunity for to make amends?

To me it sounds like this hospital visit interrupted that process midstream. She owned it and said what she plans to do in future. Which is good... but what rest? Did that get done too?

It is you who has to take a risk in trusting again. I wonder if you might feel weird doing that without a full apology first. Could that be what's missing here?

Is there more to it than that? Maybe you want to read those links I posted earlier and take them with you to the appointment? Sort out what else is you might have going on? Hopefully the counselor can help you resolve all that is triggering your present anxiety.

Take it easy on yourself. It's a ding, not the end of the world. Don't blow it out of proportion.

At the same time, it IS a ding, so repair trust together. Don't sweep it under the rug where it might fester.

Not too much made of it. Not too little made of it. YKWIM? Just the right amount of attention on this. Talk it out with you counselor and then with your wife.

Hang in there!

Galagirl

She did apologize, but it wasn't quite to the complete example that you set. She did say that she was sorry, but I also gathered that she didn't fully understand how I could be upset about that. Maybe her logic is telling her that it wasn't wrong to take the approach that she did. She even offered an example. And I'll try to be as relevant as I can, but be patient in case it seems that I'm going off course.

When we first got together, we each had a child from a previous relationship. My daughter is, technically, my step daughter, and my son, is technically her step son. But we've never really cared for that prefix, so they're simple ourchildren. When I told her that, I think that one of the things that bothered me the most, was that I feel that I should have been told, before expressing this to them, she related it to how her Mom felt when she told her Dad about being pregnant first. I tried to explain that I didn't see that as an appropriate comparison. To me, I think it's obvious why they don't relate, but I had trouble putting into words.

And really, it's not that I'm looking for the specific apology. In fact, in a way, I think (and maybe I'm wrong) that by trying not focus too much on the "sorry" aspect, but rather really understanding why she chose that method, that I might better to be able to cope with it, and have peace over it.

And really, what I'm trying the most to do, is understand this. I can see her point in why she went that route, and I'd like to be okay with it. But yes, it does feel like a breech from what we have built.

And I'm definitely not sweeping anything under the rug. Obviously, there needs to be a break in the discussions about it. The last impression that I want to give, is that I don't care about her health, as much as I care about some non-physical relationship.
 
I feel you are beating yourself up unnecessarily. It is hard enough to be feeling devalued and panicked without adding "shoulds" about feelings. Sure it would hurt less if you naturally felt less hurt, but you don't. It sounds like you have time to let your feelings be your feelings, hard as they are to experience. Maybe if you do not feel pressure to extirpate them immediately you will be able to sort them out without the mind numbing effect of panic. Then you can find if they are part of the core of who you are or if you have any means of accepting what she tells you without pain. Be as patient and gentle with yourself as you are trying to be with her.


I tend to dwell on things a lot, there's no denying that. When something bothers me, I seem to obsess about it in my mind until I find a way to either solve it, or understand and cope with it. I also have large chunks of my day, with no human interaction, and no real outlet to move past it. This site helps at times, but the anxiety tends to come back not long after.

I'm trying to be gentle on myself. I'm certainly not apologetic for feeling upset, but I do feel bad for the reactions in letting it consume me. Hopefully, talking this out with a professional - who may have even helped patients with similar instances, will allow me to learn to react in a manner that's less destructive on myself, and ultimately, less destructive on our marriage.
 
Like GG said, your wife has a few crushes. Those online crushes can be fun, but can also be rather shallow. People can misrepresent themselves online easily.

I think all mono couples would do well to deal openly with the issues of crushes or other attractions, even the situation of seeing a hottie walking down the street and wanting to take an extra look, or mention it to your partner.

I'd say there are some people out there, who, once partnered, never do lust after or get a crush on anyone else, ever. But, considering the divorce rate, they are in the minority.

Do you feel she spends too much time online playing these games with friends, leading to crushes, when you'd rather she spent more time focused on you, on dates, etc.?
 
mMagdlyn said:
I think all mono couples would do well to deal openly with the issues of crushes or other attractions, even the situation of seeing a hottie walking down the street and wanting to take an extra look, or mention it to your partner.

I agree with couples being clear about their boundaries. They can open about their attractions is better. That's just noticing beauty in the world. Or they can agree to enjoy it privately and not say anything to the partner. Behavior expectations are clear either way.

People in a Closed thing going to tell a third person they have a crush on them? That's the line to me. She said she would keep a Closed agreement. She did not. To me that behavior is a problem. Telling people you have a crush on them is the smallest of "Open" things, but you guys are not actually Open. What's confusing about that for her? Could she be willing to clarify?

She sounds like she doesn't get it, or maybe does get it and is pretending she does not in order to avoid personal accountability for her behaviors.

You could try to sort that out. Maybe in counseling together? Hopefully she just needs help seeing your point of view.

She did say that she was sorry, but I also gathered that she didn't fully understand how I could be upset about that.

You said you were upset. Is that not enough information to accept that you ARE upset? :confused:

If you say you are upset, she doesn't have to understand why to accept you are upset. YKWIM? She is either willing to modify her behavior or not.

But if you do want that understanding... Maybe this below helps you explain it to the counselor and get their take on it before you talk to wife. Or they can give you a better example to use than me. That example with the kids wasn't quite it.

You seem to be trying to get clear on your feelings and how to express them to wife. Practice with counselor. Then ask wife if she's willing to listen for understanding. If she is willing? Tell her the example and ask if she can see better now how you would be upset. See if that new understanding helps you guys get over the hump.

She does acknowledge that she probably should have told me first, but said that she was just so confused, that she didn't know if she should tell me, and risk me freaking out over something that may not be.

If I were to fill in the gaps to make complete sentences? It sounds like this to me on the crush.

She does acknowledge that she probably should have told me first (before telling the person that she crushes on them). But said that she was just so confused. That she didn't know if she should

1) Tell me (she was going to tell her crush she likes them). And risk me freaking out over something that may not be (if she went there and the crush person had no crush feelings for her)

or

2) (she does not say alternate choice that she is confused between.)

If this were a bank rather than a crush look how it sounds:

She does acknowledge that she probably should have told me first before (robbing the bank.) But said that she was just so confused. That she didn't know if she should:

1) tell me (she was going to rob a bank.) And risk me freaking out over something that may not be (if she went there and it turned out the bank had no money for her)

or

2) (she does not say alternate choice that she is confused between.)

Is she able to see more clearly why you'd be upset with that example?

I guess for me it's not having a crush. That's normal. People feel whatever they feel as it bubbles up. It's how she handled it that is bothersome. People can choose how they behave. First she crossed a line. Next she seems to be trying explain her behavior away. That's minimizing it, not owning it.

Why is seeing you "freaking out" a "risk" for her? You seem pretty calm and reasonable even in your upset. It's hardly "freaking out." You are seeking a counselor. That's commendable -- you are approaching solving it in a healthy way.

Hopefully, talking this out with a professional - who may have even helped patients with similar instances, will allow me to learn to react in a manner that's less destructive on myself, and ultimately, less destructive on our marriage.

I hope so. Hang in there till appointment time!

Galagirl
 
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My experience with rough spots in a relationship is that digging around for perfect behavior and nit picking over how well someone apologized or how the other person bumbled around just makes both people feel worse. Anxiety is feeling trapped in how you're looking at a situation and that is always within your ability to alter. As Dan Savage has said, sometimes you just have to take YES for an answer. Sounds like you both have a lot of good will that is matched by the other, so examining this or that minutiae in the situation will just lead to more anxiety.

Getting off your anxiety train will move mountains here and that is something you can do without waiting for your wife or anyone else to show you preferred behavior. You very well may never understand her fully, not she you, but complete understanding of a partner isn't at all necessary for a happy life together. Finding peace in your heart will go a long way toward softening this situation and that peace is in no way dependent on what anyone perceives as your wife's right or wrong behavior. Don't get stuck on "who needs to shape up" because that just keeps you locked in finger pointing and dependency on her "good" behavior to make you feel better. Sounds like she's asking for a bit of freedom and that can be a great thing for you both. I'm more aligned with Magdlyn's approach here and that is to allow for crushes and silliness. Most everyone feels them and so why not just allow them to be there? Allow them to be the silly crushes that comes and go and come and go. Let your relationship breathe and expand and let your focus be on the good will you share. That is what makes a relationship strong, not picking nits out of each other's behavior.
 
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My experience with rough spots in a relationship is that digging around for perfect behavior and nit picking over how well someone apologized or how the other person bumbled around just makes both people feel worse. Anxiety is feeling trapped in how you're looking at a situation and that is always within your ability to alter. As Dan Savage has said, sometimes you just have to take YES for an answer. Sounds like you both have a lot of good will that is matched by the other, so examining this or that minutiae in the situation will just lead to more anxiety.

I experienced that in my marriage (now divorced). My ex kept wanting me to apologize for being poly and having crushes (and for other "wrongs" like not cutting a thread off of a curtain valance [which "proved" I didnt appreciate our house, as did accidentally damaging new vinyl flooring in our kitchen])over the years. I tried to apologize, but it was never enough. I didn't apologize with enough chagrin in my voice, or often enough, or early enough, or or or...

I do recall once I even played a Dave Matthews song for him (I Let You Down), telling him to sit and listen, it was me talking. And he seemed to think it was OK, but a year later when he was at me again for not being apologetic enough ever, i reminded him of the song and he'd forgotten all about it.

Same thing happened in couples counseling. Our therapist said I was saying and doing everything to try and get along with him, show love, etc.. and he couldn't hear it. She finally "fired" him for stubbornly clinging to his victimized behavior.

Not saying that is what is going on here tho! It's early days. I reread posts to see if they even had an agreement that if either of them ever got a crush, they had to tell the other before telling the Crush him/herself. They did not! I don't know why GG is focusing on it.

I feel that Wife is playing a helluva alot of video games, and chatting intimately with several people. Online chatting can feel very intimate. Why is she seeking "love" in video games? Is there lack of love in her life? Lack of satisfaction with life in general, or not feeling fully appreciated or romanced? Is she depressed?
 
Like GG said, your wife has a few crushes. Those online crushes can be fun, but can also be rather shallow. People can misrepresent themselves online easily.

I think all mono couples would do well to deal openly with the issues of crushes or other attractions, even the situation of seeing a hottie walking down the street and wanting to take an extra look, or mention it to your partner.

I'd say there are some people out there, who, once partnered, never do lust after or get a crush on anyone else, ever. But, considering the divorce rate, they are in the minority.

Do you feel she spends too much time online playing these games with friends, leading to crushes, when you'd rather she spent more time focused on you, on dates, etc.?


I really wish that we were talking about crushes from misrepresented people online. I actually wouldn't feel so bad if that were the case. However, she's known these people for 10-15 years. My wife is 38, and two of the guys are 31. It originally started in the "out of character chat" as teenagers coming to this 22 year old woman with their problems about their parents, school, girl trouble, etc... But now, everyone's in their 30's. Now, if they have been misrepresenting themselves, they've done a really good job at maintaining that appearance. To me, it's the long history with these people that creates a hard time in thinking that this will just blow over shortly.

And we've talked about "crushes". At least, the type that I think of when I hear the word. I really don't see any harm in finding someone attractive. I am a human male, and I do notice the hot woman at the market, or what have you, and I accept the fact that my wife does too. In fact, she was quick to point out that these guys weren't the most attractive people, but I told her that I wasn't concerned about appearances. I don't care if they look like Brad Pitt, or Jabba the Hut. Sometimes people become more attractive when they have a good personality, or a kind heart.

I do feel that she spends too much time doing these things. We've also talked about that. She doesn't work, and spends a fair amount of time online during the day, but most nights, she'd be online once I got home, and stay on until well after I went to bed. And usually doesn't get off until after 2 A.M. She admitted that that was too much, and told me that she would no longer do that during the evening, and spend that time with me instead. However, our evenings lately, consisted of her logging off when I got home (about 6:30 P.M.), and logging back on once I went to bed at around 10, and staying on until 2 or 3. I know she's on a different sleep schedule now, but we haven't gone to bed at the same time once in over 6 months.
 
CTF, this is sounding less like a poly issue and more like a relationship issue. How does "polyamory" really enter into all of this, "amory" being love? It doesn't sound like she is asking for freedom to explore love relationships so much as she is pulling away. Trying to understand. I don't see how polyamory really enters into this picture.
 
I agree with couples being clear about their boundaries. They can open about their attractions is better. That's just noticing beauty in the world. Or they can agree to enjoy it privately and not say anything to the partner. Behavior expectations are clear either way.

People in a Closed thing going to tell a third person they have a crush on them? That's the line to me. She said she would keep a Closed agreement. She did not. To me that behavior is a problem. Telling people you have a crush on them is the smallest of "Open" things, but you guys are not actually Open. What's confusing about that for her? Could she be willing to clarify?

She sounds like she doesn't get it, or maybe does get it and is pretending she does not in order to avoid personal accountability for her behaviors.

You could try to sort that out. Maybe in counseling together? Hopefully she just needs help seeing your point of view.



You said you were upset. Is that not enough information to accept that you ARE upset? :confused:

If you say you are upset, she doesn't have to understand why to accept you are upset. YKWIM? She is either willing to modify her behavior or not.

But if you do want that understanding... Maybe this below helps you explain it to the counselor and get their take on it before you talk to wife. Or they can give you a better example to use than me. That example with the kids wasn't quite it.

You seem to be trying to get clear on your feelings and how to express them to wife. Practice with counselor. Then ask wife if she's willing to listen for understanding. If she is willing? Tell her the example and ask if she can see better now how you would be upset. See if that new understanding helps you guys get over the hump.



If I were to fill in the gaps to make complete sentences? It sounds like this to me on the crush.



If this were a bank rather than a crush look how it sounds:



Is she able to see more clearly why you'd be upset with that example?

I guess for me it's not having a crush. That's normal. People feel whatever they feel as it bubbles up. It's how she handled it that is bothersome. People can choose how they behave. First she crossed a line. Next she seems to be trying explain her behavior away. That's minimizing it, not owning it.

Why is seeing you "freaking out" a "risk" for her? You seem pretty calm and reasonable even in your upset. It's hardly "freaking out." You are seeking a counselor. That's commendable -- you are approaching solving it in a healthy way.



I hope so. Hang in there till appointment time!

Galagirl


Thank you. And I think you might be right about her trying to explain it, rather than apologize for it, and it hurts me to say that. Now, I may be parsing words, but in the interest of fairness, when I brought up that point that it was bothering me, I did lead off with asking her why she didn't come to be first, and told her that that was part of what bothered me more. But, we will speak of it again. Hopefully, there will be another opportunity to straighten that out, and she can own it, and perhaps, move on.

While I like your comparison, I used something more blunt. I compared entering the relationship, with having sex. If she intended to have sex with someone, is it cheating if she does it without telling me first? Or should she have stated that she wanted to, while waiting for my response and opinion?

I may sound like a doormat here, but I can at least take something out of her acknowledging that it should have been handled better.

I saw the therapist this afternoon. It was just the initial consult, so half of the time was spent on questionnaires, and family background. But it's a start. I just love this woman too much to give up.
 
CTF, this is sounding less like a poly issue and more like a relationship issue. How does "polyamory" really enter into all of this, "amory" being love? It doesn't sound like she is asking for freedom to explore love relationships so much as she is pulling away. Trying to understand. I don't see how polyamory really enters into this picture.

Admittedly, I've had virtually no experience with polyamory, so I'm trying to find the real comparisons. However, first off, it was her that claimed her to be poly. Second, she does state that she loves these people very much, that the feelings she has for them is more than simply a deep friendship, and that the potential to want anything sexual might be there in the future.

Look, I understand that my "problem" pales in comparison to some really heavy situations out there. I also acknowledge that things could be far worse. After reading some of the tragic tales out there, I thought that my situation was going to be laughed off, and not deemed worthy of anything more than a sarcastic, mocking response. But where else do I go when trying to find the closest comparison to figure out what I'm dealing with?
 
My experience with rough spots in a relationship is that digging around for perfect behavior and nit picking over how well someone apologized or how the other person bumbled around just makes both people feel worse. Anxiety is feeling trapped in how you're looking at a situation and that is always within your ability to alter. As Dan Savage has said, sometimes you just have to take YES for an answer. Sounds like you both have a lot of good will that is matched by the other, so examining this or that minutiae in the situation will just lead to more anxiety.

Getting off your anxiety train will move mountains here and that is something you can do without waiting for your wife or anyone else to show you preferred behavior. You very well may never understand her fully, not she you, but complete understanding of a partner isn't at all necessary for a happy life together. Finding peace in your heart will go a long way toward softening this situation and that peace is in no way dependent on what anyone perceives as your wife's right or wrong behavior. Don't get stuck on "who needs to shape up" because that just keeps you locked in finger pointing and dependency on her "good" behavior to make you feel better. Sounds like she's asking for a bit of freedom and that can be a great thing for you both. I'm more aligned with Magdlyn's approach here and that is to allow for crushes and silliness. Most everyone feels them and so why not just allow them to be there? Allow them to be the silly crushes that comes and go and come and go. Let your relationship breathe and expand and let your focus be on the good will you share. That is what makes a relationship strong, not picking nits out of each other's behavior.

And that's really what I'm trying to do, believe it or not. Given that she's known these people for a very long time, doesn't tell me that this is likely to go away soon. But I've been trying to work on my approach, and to try & lose the anxiety. That's why I've begun the journey to see a therapist. Ultimately, I'm trying to compromise. But I will certainly never give up my line in the sand about physical intimacy.
 
CTF, I wasn't insinuating that your situation wasn't worthy of discussion - just trying to understand whether your wife was perhaps looking to exit, given how you describe your relationship here:
She doesn't work, and spends a fair amount of time online during the day, but most nights, she'd be online once I got home, and stay on until well after I went to bed. And usually doesn't get off until after 2 A.M. She admitted that that was too much, and told me that she would no longer do that during the evening, and spend that time with me instead. However, our evenings lately, consisted of her logging off when I got home (about 6:30 P.M.), and logging back on once I went to bed at around 10, and staying on until 2 or 3. I know she's on a different sleep schedule now, but we haven't gone to bed at the same time once in over 6 months.
 
I experienced that in my marriage (now divorced). My ex kept wanting me to apologize for being poly and having crushes (and for other "wrongs" like not cutting a thread off of a curtain valance [which "proved" I didnt appreciate our house, as did accidentally damaging new vinyl flooring in our kitchen])over the years. I tried to apologize, but it was never enough. I didn't apologize with enough chagrin in my voice, or often enough, or early enough, or or or...

I do recall once I even played a Dave Matthews song for him (I Let You Down), telling him to sit and listen, it was me talking. And he seemed to think it was OK, but a year later when he was at me again for not being apologetic enough ever, i reminded him of the song and he'd forgotten all about it.

Same thing happened in couples counseling. Our therapist said I was saying and doing everything to try and get along with him, show love, etc.. and he couldn't hear it. She finally "fired" him for stubbornly clinging to his victimized behavior.

Not saying that is what is going on here tho! It's early days. I reread posts to see if they even had an agreement that if either of them ever got a crush, they had to tell the other before telling the Crush him/herself. They did not! I don't know why GG is focusing on it.

I feel that Wife is playing a helluva alot of video games, and chatting intimately with several people. Online chatting can feel very intimate. Why is she seeking "love" in video games? Is there lack of love in her life? Lack of satisfaction with life in general, or not feeling fully appreciated or romanced? Is she depressed?

Well, as I said. I'm not pushing for an apology. As nice as it would be in that situation, I'd really just like to understand the particular method and move past it. It happened the way it did, and it cannot be undone in favor of a particular result.

Yes, she is playing a lot. Back when she was working, things were different. She might play for a short while in the evening after she got home, until I got home, and even for a little while after dinner once in a while. But I'd say lately, she spends probably 12 hours/day easily on that thing.

I don't think she was "seeking love", to be honest. I think that she found it while bored during the day. And yes, there is a huge part of me that thinks that maybe, she isn't satisfied by me. I really try to, and she tells me that that's not the case. But it definitely feels that way some times.
 
Well what puzzles me is trying to figure out why she had to tell the guy, at all, that she was crushing on him. Nevermind whether she told him first. Just sayin' ...
 
Long relationships with multiple kids destroy marriages all the time . 16 years is a long time and people change. Children make us forget about our romantic inclinations towards our spouses. Hours away at work combined with hours at home alone creates distance and separation. Sharing your life with somebody even if it is over the Internet for many years creates intimacy and friendship, that combined with the fact that these men are younger and your wife probably no longer feels attractive is a brewing ground for romance and feelings of love. I saw this happen in my marriage but let me tell you it was way worse than your situation but we are repairing that. I think perhaps if you understand things from her point of view rather than through the lens of your expectations you will come to a closer understanding of how and why it happens. I think it happens pretty much in every marriage but the results are always different because everybody has slightly different expectations about what monogamy means. Of course those expectations are rarely explicitly discussed until someone has stepped over the boundary line. Some people are more forgiving than others, some people are more understanding than others, and some people are more flexible than others . In today's day in age I feel that people are less rigid in their ideas of monogamy but they are also less afraid of the stigma of divorce and hence are more easily able to divorce. Remember that the tree that bends with the wind stays standing whereas the rigid tree breaks.
 
Magdyln said:
I reread posts to see if they even had an agreement that if either of them ever got a crush, they had to tell the other before telling the Crush him/herself. They did not! I don't know why GG is focusing on it.

Because I saw CTF says it bugs him in post #5 -- her approach was not appreciated. He mentions it again in post #30. CTF seems to prefer that she tell him when she's confused or is uncertain that she can keep a Closed agreement.

  • If "Closed" to him means everything closed, even telling crushes things... that it one thing to him.
  • If "Closed" to her means no sex, but telling little crush things is fine, that's another thing to her.

The things do not match. Maybe they did not take the time to "calibrate" to make sure they use words the same. But the couple might not be aware that their ideas of "Closed" don't actually match until something like this happens.

If it is one of those "We thought "Closed" was spelled out good enough. We didn't know we were not actually using the same meanings" type situations? Then I think sorting that out could be part of the solution now. Talk and figure out where it broke down for him. Where it broke down for her. Then straighten up the meanings and behavior boundaries to help move it forward in future more clearly.

What does "Closed" mean to CTF? What does it mean to her? Do they match now?

  • What behavior is green light behavior?
  • What behavior is yellow "proceed with caution and check in first" behavior?
  • What behavior is red light behavior?

My point is that it could be about anything really. It doesn't have to be "telling a crush I like them" stuff. It could be "chores" or "house finances." It's not necessarily "poly" things, but "how do we resolve conflicts together? How to we prevent and minimize misunderstanding when we make new agreements? How do we make sure we're both working from the same page of expected behavior?" stuff.

I think it might be hard for this couple to come to a new understanding of where the breakdown happened and what a new agreement or a new way of going might be if she doesn't seem to be keeping her agreements, explains away her behavior rather than really owning it, or does not see that maybe a line was crossed from his POV.

There's a communication gap somewhere.

While I like your comparison, I used something more blunt. I compared entering the relationship, with having sex. If she intended to have sex with someone, is it cheating if she does it without telling me first? Or should she have stated that she wanted to, while waiting for my response and opinion?

What did she say to your example?

I am glad your first consult appointment went ok though. I think you are doing the right thing on that -- getting outside help with this. Keep trying to reach resolution and hang in there in the meanwhile.

Galagirl
 
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GG, I still think you're going down the wrong road here. I see a woman with several good friends she's known for 15 years, good online friends, but they've kind of grown up together, and shared many intimacies of the heart. Now she's not working for some reason, and spending 12 hrs a day online chatting with friends she considers lovers, basically.

I'd say this couple has drifted apart and have lost intimacy. I flirted a lot online when my marriage was going down the tubes... my ex was no longer providing enough affection or romance, or even respect. He spent up to 8 hours a day playing World of Warcraft. Our marriage was foundering.

All this stuff about "Closed or Open" is off track, imo. I think it's more basic: is there anything left to this marriage but shallow promises of "you'll always come first," while her 12 hrs a day online tells the real truth? Is there any sex, romance, dating, deep conversations, intimacy, joy, laughter, adventure? Or are all her intimate moments with these other people now? And if so, why?
 
CTF, I wasn't insinuating that your situation wasn't worthy of discussion - just trying to understand whether your wife was perhaps looking to exit, given how you describe your relationship here:

And I understand what you mean when you put it that way. I really don't think that she's looking to leave. She's certainly told me that she's not going anywhere, and was relieved when I didn't react by heading out the door the night she told me about this. But as I looked back, there were things that hinted towards the idea that things were drifting apart. Maybe she was taking things for granted. Maybe she felt that I was taking things for granted. These are things that definitely need to be worked on, no doubt about that, and we will.
 
Mag -- I agree that it is another possible layer that's going on. Spending hours and hours online was not apparent to me until post #28. That's a problem too.

CTF -- you sound like you are taking this as best as you can under the "continuing to unfold" circumstances. I'll keep hoping for her speedy recovery and that the marriage too gets some healing.

GL!
Galagirl
 
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