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  #11  
Old 08-11-2013, 01:06 AM
bookbug bookbug is offline
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Originally Posted by alinpaul View Post
I will suggest it. I think that is a good step for him. He needs objectivity which I try my best at providing but is impossible to do.

UPDATE: he said he'd get an account on here after work. I've been here a few days and it's really helped me just from reading other posts.

Thank you all who have commented. Your thoughts are greatly appreciated!!
Excellent! It is not just a matter of how objective (or not) the spouse is - it is hearing different experiences and points of view til things start to click. One can be totally objective, but it is impossible to catalog all the knowledge.
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  #12  
Old 08-11-2013, 01:49 AM
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My first thought upon reading the title was "Why does it matter?" When I saw that you had answered the question for yourself and trying to change your husband's mind, I'm not sure my reaction changes.

If your goal is to convince your husband that you can love another person without falling out of love with your husband, then just go ahead and do it. No hypothetical argument is as convincing as evidence and reality. It doesn't sound like he's trying to stop you from dating, so just go with that and let the chips fall where they may.

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Originally Posted by alinpaul View Post
So I do need advice on getting hubs to see dating is going to be great.
Maybe it will, maybe it won't. You can't really convince anyone that the future will be one way or another, because no one ever really knows until it's the past. Barring, of course, psychic powers of prediction, in which case can you give me some good stock tips for next year?

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Originally Posted by alinpaul View Post
I'm starting to think he's more mono than poly
It sounds like you're doing exactly the same thing he is: trying to decide for him whether he's poly or not. Perhaps if you both spent more time listening to the beliefs and feelings of the other and less time deciding what the other is or is not, you could move past this roadblock.

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Is this normal for one partner to feel these things when starting out in the poly world?
I love that line from Forrest Gump... "What does normal mean, anyway?"

But yes, it's pretty common for people to be all over the place minute-to-minute as they begin exploring the world of nonmonogamy.

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It's funny because he's the one who suggested and now he's the one having resistance to it.
Also surprisingly common. People don't always think through the fact that opening doors means anyone can walk through them.

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He loves sharing me sexually (as long as he can be there) but I've discovered he is not ready to share me emotionally.
I personally try to avoid possessive language like "sharing me." To me, it implies that he owns you and he's allowing you to do this or that. You own you, and only you get to share you.
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  #13  
Old 08-11-2013, 03:33 AM
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Originally Posted by SchrodingersCat View Post
If your goal is to convince your husband that you can love another person without falling out of love with your husband, then just go ahead and do it. No hypothetical argument is as convincing as evidence and reality.
The bold above is so true. I could argue it and argue but until I fall in love and still love him, I'll turn blue in the face trying to convince him verbally.

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Maybe it will, maybe it won't. You can't really convince anyone that the future will be one way or another, because no one ever really knows until it's the past. Barring, of course, psychic powers of prediction, in which case can you give me some good stock tips for next year?
I wish I was psychic, but I find when I don't listen to my instincts, I regret it later. And that is true as well, trying to convince anyone of the future. I do know after almost 18 years of marriage he and I have gone through a few separations (more than 3) & moments of not being in love with each other. And today, here we are still loving each other & communicating the best we ever have due to each of us discovering more about ourselves individually. I feel like I will still love him as much as now if I fall in love with another. I've been there before in our past, I just didn't know it was polyamory those many years ago.


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It sounds like you're doing exactly the same thing he is: trying to decide for him whether he's poly or not. Perhaps if you both spent more time listening to the beliefs and feelings of the other and less time deciding what the other is or is not, you could move past this roadblock.
The funny thing is, I don't want to decide for him if he is poly or not. He has to do that for himself. I do want him to discover more about polyamory, discuss with a forum what he is feeling and just be open to the concept. If it isn't right for him; then we should discuss how to be mono with a poly, if it is a workable lifestyle.

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I love that line from Forrest Gump... "What does normal mean, anyway?"

But yes, it's pretty common for people to be all over the place minute-to-minute as they begin exploring the world of nonmonogamy. Also surprisingly common. People don't always think through the fact that opening doors means anyone can walk through them.
Good point to remember as we start this journey.


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I personally try to avoid possessive language like "sharing me." To me, it implies that he owns you and he's allowing you to do this or that. You own you, and only you get to share you.
Funny thing about this is, I asked him today if he really loved me or does he feel like he owns me? I pointed out that loving me doesn't mean I am his possession (I feel like I am one at times). That love is unconditional.

Those above are issues, he and I, need to resolve, individually and together. We spoke briefly (he's working) and will talk tonight when he gets home.

Thank you for your input. I'm realizing more about myself with each comment.

Last edited by alibabe_muse; 08-11-2013 at 03:37 AM.
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  #14  
Old 08-11-2013, 01:14 PM
sparklepop sparklepop is offline
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Hi

What strikes me after reading your thread is that hubby is basically feeling envy and also feeling like things are out of control. Both entirely normal feelings when one is new to poly (or even when one isn't).

I also think that what you are going through is the 'normal' response to suddenly having a world of men at your fingertips. It's exciting. You're getting lots of messages. It's all fresh and new. Of course you want to date - and probably keep dating until you find someone you really click with. As you say, it won't go from one email to love. It can't even be pushed in that direction. Connections will be as they will be.

When hubby is saying "you're acting like you just want to sleep around" what he's really saying is "I'm uncomfortable/envious about the amount of attention you are getting" and "I'm uncomfortable about the idea of you going on lots of dates."

My GF and I have been together for just over two years and poly from the start. When we both started really dating others, she was at it like a bull at a gate. We laugh about it now and, understandably, it still irks her a little bit that I call it her Dating Mania phase. She went on something like seven dates in five weeks and there were men coming at her (perhaps pun intended, perhaps not) left right and centre. It felt like she was constantly talking to men, at all hours of the day, and that her head, heart and whatever else was fully engaged in that.

For me, it just felt out of control. Every time I turned around, there was a new man on the go; some new entity to 'get used to'. I also struggled with my own moral/biographical differences, because I've always had long term relationships and very few sexual partners, whilst she has always been... well, what's the word? Promiscuous I suppose. I don't like that word. But oh well, it's the only one I can come up with.

Nowadays, I accept her for who she is. If she's lucky enough to find men attractive and therefore falls into the pool of getting lots of attention (unlike, say, your hubby and myself who are interested in women; and women more rarely make the first move) then I am very happy for her.

I'll be really interested to read your husband's posts, if he does decide to come onto to forum.

Overall, I'd say that perhaps there needs to be less emphasis on what the end goal is, even though it's good to have a common one in mind. Perhaps the issues, as you are discovering, are coming from the here and now. Perhaps there is a lack of agreement between you two about being poly in general? Or about what this entails? Perhaps there are expectations that are unrealistic, unfair, or not being met? Perhaps there needs to be more communication in the here and now? For example, perhaps your husband needs to know that you want to date and that you would actually be happy to date many, be happy to stay casual or develop further, or whatever it is that you are feeling. Perhaps he feels that you are saying one thing, but doing another? That's what it actually sounds like to me.
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  #15  
Old 08-11-2013, 05:36 PM
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alibabe_muse alibabe_muse is offline
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Originally Posted by sparklepop View Post
Hi

What strikes me after reading your thread is that hubby is basically feeling envy and also feeling like things are out of control. Both entirely normal feelings when one is new to poly (or even when one isn't).
He says it is envy.

There is also fear that he'll loose me in the end. He says that is what is consuming him the most. A fear that I'll meet someone who really isn't into poly, but because I fall in love with this person, this new guy would convince me to go back to mono and leave him.

Another situation where I could try to convince him as much as I could but until we are there, he will never know if this fear is a reality. And I could never be mono again.

Quote:
I also think that what you are going through is the 'normal' response to suddenly having a world of men at your fingertips. It's exciting. You're getting lots of messages. It's all fresh and new. Of course you want to date - and probably keep dating until you find someone you really click with. As you say, it won't go from one email to love. It can't even be pushed in that direction. Connections will be as they will be.
I tell him I can't control who contacts me & I think he realizes that. I rarely send a message to a guy. I've done one but all this guy wants is to have sex, so I'm not meeting him.

Quote:
When hubby is saying "you're acting like you just want to sleep around" what he's really saying is "I'm uncomfortable/envious about the amount of attention you are getting" and "I'm uncomfortable about the idea of you going on lots of dates."
Like I said above, it's what will happen in the end he is fearful of. He sort of has a doomsday perspective about us (not sure why, we've made it this long together and I don't daydream about not being with him when I'm too old for sex).

He read poly hell last night and realized he has separation anxiety issues. A story his mother loves telling everyone about is when he was about two weeks old, she went into the bank, set him on a chair, finished up her business and walked out, without getting her baby. I think parents sometimes don't realize what they do to their children by recounting a tale that seems funny but actually has devastating emotional impact.


Quote:
My GF and I have been together for just over two years and poly from the start. When we both started really dating others, she was at it like a bull at a gate. We laugh about it now and, understandably, it still irks her a little bit that I call it her Dating Mania phase. She went on something like seven dates in five weeks and there were men coming at her (perhaps pun intended, perhaps not) left right and centre. It felt like she was constantly talking to men, at all hours of the day, and that her head, heart and whatever else was fully engaged in that.
I am trying my best to limit my interaction with other men. When hub is home, it's all about him. I ignore texts, emails, okc messages so my focus is on him. I'm trying to set boundaries for myself so I'm not intruding on his time with me.

But when he's at work (jealousy maybe) he's thinking about how I have free time to contact other men and that I'm not thinking about him. I do think about him but he's working, so he doesn't reply back to me immediately. And I'm raising our kids and watching other kids so I'm not always on my cell.

Quote:
For me, it just felt out of control. Every time I turned around, there was a new man on the go; some new entity to 'get used to'. I also struggled with my own moral/biographical differences, because I've always had long term relationships and very few sexual partners, whilst she has always been... well, what's the word? Promiscuous I suppose. I don't like that word. But oh well, it's the only one I can come up with.
I'd say he is much like you. I was "promiscuous" in both high school & college. He has had very few sexual partners. It sounds like your gf and I are a lot alike.

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Nowadays, I accept her for who she is. If she's lucky enough to find men attractive and therefore falls into the pool of getting lots of attention (unlike, say, your hubby and myself who are interested in women; and women more rarely make the first move) then I am very happy for her.
I hope he does come to accept me for me and finds happiness in my joy.

Quote:
I'll be really interested to read your husband's posts, if he does decide to come onto to forum.
I gave him the link to the forum and suggested he sign up. We agreed to not get upset with each other's posts here; otherwise we'll be in a bigger poly hell.

Quote:
Overall, I'd say that perhaps there needs to be less emphasis on what the end goal is, even though it's good to have a common one in mind. Perhaps the issues, as you are discovering, are coming from the here and now. Perhaps there is a lack of agreement between you two about being poly in general? Or about what this entails? Perhaps there are expectations that are unrealistic, unfair, or not being met? Perhaps there needs to be more communication in the here and now? For example, perhaps your husband needs to know that you want to date and that you would actually be happy to date many, be happy to stay casual or develop further, or whatever it is that you are feeling. Perhaps he feels that you are saying one thing, but doing another? That's what it actually sounds like to me.
We are working on it. My end goal is another lover, only one, not two or three. He and I would like a unicorn as well, but men are more my focus at this stage in my life.
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  #16  
Old 08-12-2013, 06:58 AM
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Originally Posted by alinpaul View Post
I wish I was psychic, but I find when I don't listen to my instincts, I regret it later.
I completely agree. It took me a long time to learn to trust my gut, but I did finally get it through my head that sometimes my intuition knows things my conscious can't agree with. I can't remember ever trusting my gut and regretting it, and I can count dozens of times where listening to my brain instead of my instincts has gotten me in all kinds of trouble.

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The funny thing is, I don't want to decide for him if he is poly or not. He has to do that for himself. I do want him to discover more about polyamory, discuss with a forum what he is feeling and just be open to the concept. If it isn't right for him; then we should discuss how to be mono with a poly, if it is a workable lifestyle.
Realistically, he may be "neither." Many people go in and out of phases all through their lives. There may be times when he feels capable of loving multiple people, and times when he just wants you.

Whether he's poly or mono isn't as important as what behaviours you choose and how he chooses to respond to those behaviours. Even if he discovers that he is polyamory, it really won't make it one iota easier for him to deal with any emotions that come up. It may even make it harder.

I'm trying to learn to stop wanting things for other people. They have to come into them on their own terms. While I love education and always support people trying to learn as much as they can about a thing, you really can't force people to inform themselves. Letting him choose whether or not to learn about polyamory is one way of respecting his autonomy.

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Funny thing about this is, I asked him today if he really loved me or does he feel like he owns me? I pointed out that loving me doesn't mean I am his possession (I feel like I am one at times). That love is unconditional.
My, what a difficult question! I mean, obviously there's only one "acceptable" answer... Who, in this culture, is ever going to admit that they believe they own their spouse?

Some love is unconditional. Most is not. Everyone has their breaking point.
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  #17  
Old 08-12-2013, 06:59 PM
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alibabe_muse alibabe_muse is offline
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Red face Update - guilt projection

Late last night, more it was really early this morning, we had a late night of fun, he tells me he had sex a couple times with his co-worker. The roller coaster of emotions he has been projecting at me have been caused because of guilt. We are definitely moving forward in a good direction.

I was not angry, very happy for him that he is finding others who find him attractive, but did let him know it was not fair how he could not be honest with me & instead made me feel bad that I am poly. This was a good conversation.

I am also letting him be aware of my boundaries. I do want to know who he is seeing but going into details about physical aspects I am personally not into hearing. I have my own insecurities about baby scars & i know he loves me & my body. I am just not ready to hear about physical perfectness of a woman many years younger than me (does that mske sense)?

It's his day off today so we're relaxing & cuddling.

Thank you everyone for helping me get through these last few days. Today is good, tomorrow could go either way, but I am so happy I can evolve personally & look forward to what life has to offer.
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  #18  
Old 08-13-2013, 01:07 AM
bookbug bookbug is offline
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Originally Posted by alinpaul View Post
Late last night, more it was really early this morning, we had a late night of fun, he tells me he had sex a couple times with his co-worker. The roller coaster of emotions he has been projecting at me have been caused because of guilt. We are definitely moving forward in a good direction.

I was not angry, very happy for him that he is finding others who find him attractive, but did let him know it was not fair how he could not be honest with me & instead made me feel bad that I am poly. This was a good conversation.

I am also letting him be aware of my boundaries. I do want to know who he is seeing but going into details about physical aspects I am personally not into hearing. I have my own insecurities about baby scars & i know he loves me & my body. I am just not ready to hear about physical perfectness of a woman many years younger than me (does that mske sense)?

It's his day off today so we're relaxing & cuddling.

Thank you everyone for helping me get through these last few days. Today is good, tomorrow could go either way, but I am so happy I can evolve personally & look forward to what life has to offer.
Does sound like some awesome communication! It was wonderful you could handle his confession with such objectivity and support. Unfortunately, many people are emotionally conditioned to behave with an exclusive mono mindset, even when they *know* that is not what poly is about. So he had sex, he told you and he gets to see that the world did not come to the end.
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  #19  
Old 08-13-2013, 03:14 AM
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LovingRadiance LovingRadiance is offline
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How, in discussions with hub, do i get him to realize that my ability to meet someone off-line is impossible & that starting off as a fwb is a possible way for me to meet another potential poly-mate? I'm a sahm who has a very limited social life.
I was a sahm for years. Now I am a part time student.
But-at no point in time did I ever have an issue meeting people in real life. In fact, I don't understand how you even come to the conclusion its impossible.

As for the rest-it's all personal preference and many here have issue with my view on this-but as far as I am concerned-once you add sex to the equation-the probability of building a healthy long term relationship (if you haven't already managed to address that) is reduced exponentially.

NRE is a bullshit excuse for rushing the relationship train to the bedroom.

I was clear as day with my SO's. If they choose to fuck before a friendship is established between ALL OF US and the other party-that person won't ever be a part of our family dynamic. Period.
They are free to fuck whoever they want-they can have fwb with whomever they want. But those people aren't welcome to participate in our family dynamic.
If they want someone to have the opportunty of being a part of OUR family dynamic-they can table sex until we have established a functional friendship with them as a family.
(and no-we don't date together-we all have very different tastes in lovers)
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Old 08-13-2013, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by alinpaul View Post
Late last night, more it was really early this morning, we had a late night of fun, he tells me he had sex a couple times with his co-worker. The roller coaster of emotions he has been projecting at me have been caused because of guilt. We are definitely moving forward in a good direction.

I was not angry, very happy for him that he is finding others who find him attractive, but did let him know it was not fair how he could not be honest with me & instead made me feel bad that I am poly. This was a good conversation.

I am also letting him be aware of my boundaries. I do want to know who he is seeing but going into details about physical aspects I am personally not into hearing.
It's good that he confessed and that the conversation was productive. However, have you thought about the woman he fucked? Was there honesty all around? Does she know he is married? If so, does she know his wife consents to a non-monogamous arrangement? It's important, if he is going to continue fucking and seeing her, that she not be deceived into thinking she could eventually be his "one and only."
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