Hotwife to poly

E

enigmastag

New member
Me and my wife have been on quite the journey and has led us to a place where she has told me she believes she is either poly or demi sexual. We have been in a cuck or stag/vixen lifestyle the last few years, which I initially asked to share her. We started online for a few years and then moved to in person. I always had concerns, because she leaned very emotional and that was always somewhat of a boundary for me, but I still moved forward in the lifestyle.

As we moved forward, we tried to compromise. She required more contact than I initially expected and there was a lot of emotional connection. There began to be breaking of rules and boundary crossing, such as giving of phone numbers, or secret phone calls, and other types of things that happened.

We always chose the guys together. Some guys made an effort to cause issues in our relationships. I would tell her these people made me uncomfortable. Many of our boundaries were crossed and we needed to move on from these people. This caused a lot of conflict in our relationship, as she was very into the connections she made, and just wanted to "have fun," and moving on from people seemed heartless and came off like I was the bad guy in this situation. From my viewpoint, my wife was hiding communicatoin, lying to me at times about what was happening, and this was unsafe for our relationship.

Fast forward to the last situation. She found a guy she liked. She went and hooked up with him, with everyone on board. In hindsight, our vetting could've been better, but we were probably overexcited. The hookup went great.

In the days afterwards, I asked to see her messages. We have always shared messages and gone over updates with these guys. He had actually been telling her to delete the messages, doing a "cheating kink" thing with her, and she deleted their messages. She apologized and said she wouldn't anymore.

I reached out to him and told him it made me uncomforable. He ignored my message, which was weird, as we had talked well in the past. Over the next few days, he continued to tell her to delete messages, which she told me. At this point, I told her I felt uncomfortable moving forward with him, as I felt he had bad motives and was trying to get her to do things behind my back.

Per her request, I reached out to him. The conversation with him went nowhere. He told me after I explained how I felt: "I'm not going to beg you to fuck your wife. We know she wants it, and you're just getting in the way." He dropped her on Tinder where they were talking. She had a very emotional reaction, and went and cried in the bedroom closet for 30 minutes.

She literally asked me every day, for almost 2 weeks, to hook up with this guy again. I told her I could not go down this road and it did not make me feel comfortable. This was an ongoing fight for us. Every day it was discussed, to the point she was talking about breaking up over this guy.

The discussion came up that she was now poly, or demi-sexual. She's realized she needs a deep emotional connection. She wants to pick her partners now and not have them taken away. She told me I am controlling. I don't want to be a controlling partner, but if we agree to rules and they are broken, I don't see how it's fair to continue with those people. It feels unsafe to our relationship. I stood my ground. She would be upset but we would move on eventually.

Come to find out later that she made a secret chat account and started talking to him again. They talked for two weeks. Eventually he wanted to see her again. She told him she couldn't, because of me, but he offered to get a hotel. She went and met him one day when I was at work, and spent hours with him. I found out she wasn't where she was supposed to be and confronted her the next day. She lied about her whereabouts, but eventually confessed. She confessed with a smile on her face and told me she was going to keep fucking this guy. I told her she wasn't, or we couldn't continue. She never let me see another message between them. She continued talking to him for weeks. Sex between us stopped for a while. She still asked several times to go see him again. I told her the guy she cheated on I would never be ok with coming back into the fold.

We are now in marriage counseling and on a full break from all of this. She has finally broken off communication with him, but says that she is poly/demi and needs only 1 person to play with, while I have always wanted to have her play with multiple people. I have wanted this. So her attention is split, but I understand she needs to be herself. Maybe ENM is not for us, but I'm torn as to whether I can truly give her what she wants. I always told her that I couldn't do poly because her being emotionally connected was way too hard for me.

These guys she's finding are just hookup buddies too, so it's a very one-sided emotional connection. Maybe that's not my responsibility, as to whether they truly care about her, but I love her and don't want to see her hurt. I just feel torn in the middle. I really enjoy the part of sharing her.

I have tried to give her more of what she needs, more solo hookups, more communication and more freedom. She believes I have dictated every step of the way. So I'm not sure what to do at this point, and if giving her a hotwife/poly lifestyle is good, or if it will sign the death certificate for our marriage.


Thanks for listening.
 
Hello enigmastag,

It sounds like your wife is in the process of transitioning from stag/vixen to polyamory. This is not what you signed up for in the beginning, she is kind of nudging you towards it by degrees. This latest guy is just aggravating the situation. She very much wants him, even though the way he acts makes you feel uncomfortable. The marriage counseling you are in should help. Your challenge now is how to be more comfortable with her poly/demi side. I hope Polyamory.com can help.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
kdt26417 said:
Hello enigmastag,

It sounds like your wife is in the process of transitioning from stag/vixen to polyamory. This is not what you signed up for in the beginning, she is kind of nudging you towards it by degrees. This latest guy is just aggravating the situation. She very much wants him, even though the way he acts makes you feel uncomfortable. The marriage counseling you are in should help. Your challenge now is how to be more comfortable with her poly/demi side. I hope Polyamory.com can help.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
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Thank you for that. I feel like this is where its heading, either back to monogomy or a version or poly that works for both of us. When she "cheated" and I asked for her to be accountable, she continued to refer to it as not cheating and that she was putting her foot down and finding her voice. I seem to struggle a lot with this and the lies and betrayal is really hard for me to wrap my head around. She has always been a people pleaser, but I feel like she isnt respecting our agreements and coming clean about how she has hurt me. I want to be fair though as this is new to her and if she is truly learning things about herself i want to be sensitive to that.
 
It is big of you to be considerate of her feelings when she is not returning the favor. What saves a marriage isn't that each spouse gives 50%, it's that each spouse gives 100%. Right now you are giving 100%, and she is giving 50%. Hopefully this is just a temporary state of affairs, like you said she is on a steep learning curve at the moment. Kudos for being patient with her, even when you are hurting.
 
Hi! I also read some hotwife/cuckold forums from time to time and this sort of thing can happen.

The problem is that many men see hotwifing as something purely sexual, but people often have emotions. Some wives can keep it physical and they are okay with that, but many can't. Even if not entirely demi, many people develop feelings or want a long-term partner as well not just causal sex.

You initiated the lifestyle, and your wife went along with it. However, it seems she is not okay with just physical hookups. The marriage counseling is a good step. At this point, you need to think about whether a poly relationship is okay with you. You requested the hotwife/cuckold lifestyle, and now your wife is requesting poly. She broke rules and lied, so it is very clear what she wants: a long term relationship instead of hookups. Can you do it for her?

You can perhaps repair the marriage and settle into a monogamous pattern, or you can open up to poly. I feel that the hotwife lifestyle is not something she can handle and might not be possible to continue as before. You need to read a little bit about poly. The questions about your wife is whether she really wants two relationships - can she love you both? Now, because she feels you are controlling there is a strain in your marriage. But if it can be repaired and she can feel you are supportive, perhaps your connection can be strengthened. I feel there is a bit of "I did the hookups for you," and now "I want polyamory" and you refuse it. So, there is this kind of resentment as well.

It is a big jump from sexual hookups to a full-fledge relationship, but perhaps you can accept it once you know more about poly and your wife's intentions. It seems she is also new to poly, and the role of the hinge is not easy. She perhaps needs to understand that a jump to poly is not easy for you, so the three of you might need to slow down a bit and go step by step. It is also important to understand that some people are not polyamorous and they just want to jump from mono to mono relationships. So, it is important to clarify: Is you wife polyamorous? Is her parter accepting the fact that this is a V and not a mono relationship? Only time can tell whether a polyamorous relationship really works.
 
Some people can do hotwife stuff, or stag/vixen, or cuckolding, or swinging, and some can't.

Personally, I think those casual, sport sex approaches are playing with fire, because humans are designed to combine sex with an emotional connection. Women especially, biologically, need to fully trust the men they share their bodies with, because men are physically bigger and stronger, usually, and can overwhelm a woman and rape her. They can also get her pregnant, and then leave her alone to raise a baby on her own. These are just the facts.

So, most of the time, women, deep in their "lizard brains," develop a sense of connection and trust with someone they are entrusting their bodies to. This can be overcome by some women, but not all. I know you tried to make your wife avoid making strong emotional connections by wanting her to fuck each guy just once, wham bam, and then move on to the next guy. This is one strategy designed to keep the sex light and casual. Other techniques are used by some sport sex lovers, like no personal texts or phone calls, no deep eye contact, no kissing on the mouth, no dating one-on-one, no vanilla dates, nothing romantic between the casual "play" partners at all.

But your wife's body and brain are different from what you'd like. She's been trying to renegotiate your "shared agreements," because they obviously do not respect the way she wants to have sex and connections. She may not fall in love fully with these guys (you've never allowed it to get to that point), but she definitely feels infatuation, or "new relationship energy," aka NRE.

Since this is a board for polyamory (many loves), not hotwifing or swinging or the like, the poly folks here are going to come down on the side of love. Many people forget that "poly" is short for "polyamory." Our hearts are as involved as our bodies when we "share ourselves" with multiple people. My partners do not "share me with others." I share myself. I am an autonomous human being with multiple (2) loving relationships. I am a hinge between them. (Both my partners are also hinges.)

You want your wife to be "polysexual," able to have sex with multiple other men, while not loving anyone but you. Put yourself in her shoes. If you were fucking some hot woman other than your wife, would you always be content to just fuck her once, have the sex be great, but never see her again? Not develop fond feelings for her as you gaze upon her beauty, enjoy her charming personality, please her physically? It's hard! It's hard to be attracted to someone enough to enjoy fucking them and also to somehow divorce our feelings from them overall, or keep it to light friendship at most.

NRE, mentioned above, is actually like a drug in our systems, which can, on the contrary, make us obsessed with the new partner, 24/7. This is designed by nature to keep the couple together, invested in each other enough to conceive a baby and stay together to raise it

Your wife loving two people is not what you want. But it is what she wants. She can't have sex with another guy, for your arousal, as if she were a sex robot. That seems to be the reality. To be determined now is whether you can accept this or not. It seems like all you want is to see or hear about is another guy fucking your wife. You might feel left out if she has another full romantic relationship. But, if forced to choose, your wife might choose monogamy with you, monogamy with someone else, polyamory with you, or polyamory with multiple other people. Hotwifing is not her thing; it's not fun or a turn-on.

I'm sorry you two differ in your relationship preferences.
 
Magdlyn said:
Some people can do hotwife stuff, or stag/vixen, or cuckolding, or swinging, and some can't.

Personally, I think those casual, sport sex approaches are playing with fire, because humans are designed to combine sex with an emotional connection. Women especially, biologically, need to fully trust the men they share their bodies with, because men are physically bigger and stronger, usually, and can overwhelm a woman and rape her. They can also get her pregnant, and then leave her alone to raise a baby on her own. These are just the facts.

So, most of the time, women, deep in their "lizard brains," develop a sense of connection and trust with someone they are entrusting their bodies to. This can be overcome by some women, but not all. I know you tried to make your wife avoid making strong emotional connections by wanting her to fuck each guy just once, wham bam, and then move on to the next guy. This is one strategy designed to keep the sex light and casual. Other techniques are used by some sport sex lovers, like no personal texts or phone calls, no deep eye contact, no kissing on the mouth, no dating one-on-one, no vanilla dates, nothing romantic between the casual "play" partners at all.

But your wife's body and brain are different from what you'd like. She's been trying to renegotiate your "shared agreements," because they obviously do not respect the way she wants to have sex and connections. She may not fall in love fully with these guys (you've never allowed it to get to that point), but she definitely feels infatuation, or "new relationship energy," aka NRE.

Since this is a board for polyamory (many loves), not hotwifing or swinging or the like, the poly folks here are going to come down on the side of love. Many people forget that "poly" is short for "polyamory." Our hearts are as involved as our bodies when we "share ourselves" with multiple people. My partners do not "share me with others." I share myself. I am an autonomous human being with multiple (2) loving relationships. I am a hinge between them. (Both my partners are also hinges.)

You want your wife to be "polysexual," able to have sex with multiple other men, while not loving anyone but you. Put yourself in her shoes. If you were fucking some hot woman other than your wife, would you always be content to just fuck her once, have the sex be great, but never see her again? Not develop fond feelings for her as you gaze upon her beauty, enjoy her charming personality, please her physically? It's hard! It's hard to be attracted to someone enough to enjoy fucking them and also to somehow divorce our feelings from them overall, or keep it to light friendship at most.

NRE, mentioned above, is actually like a drug in our systems, which can, on the contrary, make us obsessed with the new partner, 24/7. This is designed by nature to keep the couple together, invested in each other enough to conceive a baby and stay together to raise it

Your wife loving two people is not what you want. But it is what she wants. She can't have sex with another guy, for your arousal, as if she were a sex robot. That seems to be the reality. To be determined now is whether you can accept this or not. It seems like all you want is to see or hear about is another guy fucking your wife. You might feel left out if she has another full romantic relationship. But, if forced to choose, your wife might choose monogamy with you, monogamy with someone else, polyamory with you, or polyamory with multiple other people. Hotwifing is not her thing; it's not fun or a turn-on.

I'm sorry you two differ in your relationship preferences.
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Thanks for your message. What you say about NRE makes sense and we have started to have these conversations. When she is in nre she exhibits behaviors that appear she is really prioritizing this other person so much above me and my needs and boundaries cease to exist so that is problematic for me. On top of that we have found people in a hotwife space so the feelings are not returned so it feels like my wife is throwing herself at someone who doesn’t even return the feelings.

She tells me I judge her feelings and she is just enjoying herself and call her attached when she is not. But I am seeing huge emotional reactions to people she has only known for a week or so and this doesn’t seem like anything but attachment. Seeing her cry and get worked up over these guys while I feel ignored is hard for me.

She said she doesn’t believe she wants a full poly thing or that she want a poly lifestyle w me. Years ago I suspected she was poly which used to upset her but she has slowly come around. She wants a regular thing w only one other guy in her words. She says she doesn’t want to love them though I could see her loving 2 men at one point. She does say she wants a boyfriend so I don’t know how to take that other than poly. She makes regular contact with her guys and talks about dates. I never feel she has been fully honest about her feelings or what she wants, probably sparing my feelings. Or it has taken her this long to figure it out.
 
She might be doing and saying things partly to spare your feelings, but partly because she is battling her own monogamous conditioning. We are all raised in a mono culture. Loving, being married to and sexually/romantically faithful to only one other person is our cultural norm. Anything outside of that needs to be thoroughly researched, examined, discussed and finally, acted upon. It's not the default, so going into it blind is going to lead to disaster.

Her NRE is happening in an extra sore place, since the men she fucks just want to fuck, and they have a kink of cucking you. They don't really want a full-fledged relationship, but then again, they probably get off on how your wife is favoring them over you, not just physically, but emotionally too.

I'd highly recommend you two close your relationship now and work out both of your true desires and needs and boundaries. Most formerly mono couples who are actually successful at opening take at least a year, if not two, of research, discussions, perhaps couples counseling, reading, reading, reading, talking, talking, talking, before actually involving other partners.

And that demotion you're experiencing is addressed in an article we have listed in our Resources list in our Golden Nuggets section:



"poly hell":

kathylabriola.com - ARE YOU IN POLY HELL?

COMMON PITFALLS IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS Many people who are in a primary relationship stumble into an outside relationship either by choice or by chance, and once involved, things can go beautifully or can go terribly awry. Here are some of the most common problems that develop and some ideas for
www.kathylabriola.com www.kathylabriola.com
 
Magdlyn said:
She might be doing and saying things partly to spare your feelings, but partly because she is battling her own monogamous conditioning. We are all raised in a mono culture. Loving, being married to and sexually/romantically faithful to only one other person is our cultural norm. Anything outside of that needs to be thoroughly researched, examined, discussed and finally, acted upon. It's not the default, so going into it blind is going to lead to disaster.

Her NRE is happening in an extra sore place, since the men she fucks just want to fuck, and they have a kink of cucking you. They don't really want a full-fledged relationship, but then again, they probably get off on how your wife is favoring them over you, not just physically, but emotionally too.

I'd highly recommend you two close your relationship now and work out both of your true desires and needs and boundaries. Most formerly mono couples who are actually successful at opening take at least a year, if not two, of research, discussions, perhaps couples counseling, reading, reading, reading, talking, talking, talking, before actually involving other partners.

And that demotion you're experiencing is addressed in an article we have listed in our Resources list in our Golden Nuggets section:



"poly hell":

kathylabriola.com - ARE YOU IN POLY HELL?

COMMON PITFALLS IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS Many people who are in a primary relationship stumble into an outside relationship either by choice or by chance, and once involved, things can go beautifully or can go terribly awry. Here are some of the most common problems that develop and some ideas for
www.kathylabriola.com www.kathylabriola.com
Click to expand...
This all makes sense. We have closed the relationship for now while we make sense of everything and fix our boundaries. We started reading some books together too and have started with polysecure. In her effort to make me happy I think she has agreed to lots of boundaries such as communication and privacy things but as she has gotten deeper with her partners and the emotional bonds she seems to regret or want more freedoM now. She hasn’t came out and said this but these are the areas we fight over and where she has been secretive. I think in a perfect world she would love her own individual dating life. I have freedom to see other women as well. I had a online girlfriend for a little bit but it doesn’t really interest me at all.
 
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