Giant step backward

Nyx

New member
Gosh, where do I start. First off, I haven't been on here in a while sorry about that! I've just started fall semester, having troubles with my eldest child. I hope everyone has been doing well! I will try to read some recent posts and comment a bit.

Last time I was on, I talked about how I was embarking on allowing an open relationship with my bf. He has been poly for years, and something that I am genuinely interested in (after fighting it at first), and given my tendency to feel strangled by overly jealous lovers, I think it could very well work for me too at some point. (With this new perspective, I've already felt the joyous freedom of feeling attracted to someone new and knowing it would be ok to pursue them!)

So my bf has been interested in these two other girls for a while now (few months), hasn't been dating them, just chatting and emailing and hanging out with friends because he's been waiting for me to feel ok with him going ahead with them. I thought long and deep and searched my feelings about him seeing other women and I thought I came to the conclusion that even though it would be difficult, I really felt it was something I could do!

About two weeks ago, my poor bf (gah - I hate that - I have to name him, so I will call him, fictitiously of course, Nick). Anyway Nick was on a fire (meaning he was fighting wildland fires) and while he was gone I just suddenly fell back into my old pattern of thought. I felt jealous and angry, I felt like he just didn't want to spend any time with me and that he was constantly filling up his life with other things. (he's involved with theater, etc)

And so we ended up chatting online while he was gone and I ended up breaking it off with him because he told me that he was planning on spending more time pursuing these two other women when he got back from fire. It went amicably at the time, I just sort of bowed out mainly because this seemed like another thing that was taking what fraction of time he had left for me away! (with me so far?)

Anyway so after that I just got very angry. I don't know - for several days I just started fuming inside about how he didn't care about me, didn't want to be with me in first place, because if he did he wouldn't be doing this, blah blah....I really filled myself with negative, even malicious thoughts. All the ground I had covered in the preceding months just seemed to disappear and the old emotional habits started up again.

I admit I was being horrid, I guess because I felt horrid. And Nick, unconditional lover that he is, still responded with nothing but love. On Sunday, I called him and he said he was having one of his gfs over for dinner. I just felt heartbroken, but what the hell? I don't know why. I broke up with him, and he had already told me he was planning on spending more time with them, why would I feel so hurt by this? I just started imagining that he would use all his smooth moves and they would, well you know..My mind went to all the places it's best not to go.

I was so angry and hurt that when he came by yesterday to pick up some stuff, I was just cold to him. He started to say I love you and I slammed the door in his face :(. We talked later and he said he thought that slamming the door in his face was a fitting metaphor for all we've been through. He said that all he wants to do is love me and all I do is try to get away, or push him away...in effect slam the door on his love.

Well, with the long story out of the way (sorry!!) I just wonder if any other successfully poly relationships have started out this way? I know I have it in me somewhere to embrace this, I don't understand why I totally lost it and all I could do was react to my pain and uncertainty with rage and coldness. I feel so terrible about the way I have acted.

I seemed to just sit and dwell and twist things around in my head. I was thinking things like, he just wants to f*** around, he is so shallow and egotistical that he needs all this attention from women, etc....Just thinking all these poison thoughts that are so ingrained I honestly don't know what's reality anymore! Then I talked to some friends about it (who btw are FIERCELY mono - so not the best choice of audiences) and they were all about adding more poison.

I felt like I was almost there, what happened??

Nick and I talked last night and one question just rings in my head: What is it about romantic relationships that make one feel SO jealous? I mean, people don't generally feel jealous of friends when they go to the movies together or some other innocuous thing....it has to be focused on the sexual part, the physical intimacy part I should say (since even kissing or cuddling can make people rage with jealousy). What is SO threatening about that?? If I could figure that out, maybe I could understand my Giant Step Backward.:confused:
 

MonoVCPHG

New member
And Nick, unconditional lover that he is, still responded with nothing but love. :

He's not unconditional at all. His condition is you have to share him. That's a big condition to ask for the majority of people...never forget that.
 

Nyx

New member
What I mean by unconditional is that even though I screw up time and again, he doesn't hold it against me like every other boyfriend I've ever had. I am a very emotional person and I can't contain strong emotions very well, something I've been working on a long time. Yes, the manner in which we have a relationship is conditional, but his love is not.
 

MonoVCPHG

New member
Yes, the manner in which we have a relationship is conditional, but his love is not.

That is a total contradiction...don't beat up on yourself too much. Stay healthy and do what you heart needs to grow and be whole.

Take care
 

Nyx

New member
I don't see it as a contradiction. You can love someone and not be in an official relationship with them. What is contradictory exactly?
 

MonoVCPHG

New member
I was referring to if you want a romantic relationship with him..then it is conditional. I see where you are coming from now. Sorry for the confusion.
 

Quath

New member
I think you are asking the right questions. The jealousy is telling you something about how you feel deep down. Maybe you worry about losing him and the pain that would cause? So you protect yourself by being cold to him?

You are want more time with him and you felt less important because he is donating more time to other things (and people). How would you have felt if he chose to have a new hobby instead of seeing another girl?

Do you feel that on some instinctual level that if he sees these women that he will like you less?

I think this has a potential to be a growth opportunity. :)
 

vandalin

New member
*hugs*

I think the ups and downs are normal whenever you are trying to make such a huge change in your life. Life is a highway, look for a rest stop and take a moment, that would be asking the questions that fit that part of road you have chosen.

Good luck!
 
C

Ceoli

Guest
About two weeks ago, my poor bf (gah - I hate that - I have to name him, so I will call him, fictitiously of course, Nick). Anyway Nick was on a fire (meaning he was fighting wildland fires) and while he was gone I just suddenly fell back into my old pattern of thought. I felt jealous and angry, I felt like he just didn't want to spend any time with me and that he was constantly filling up his life with other things. (he's involved with theater, etc)

And so we ended up chatting online while he was gone and I ended up breaking it off with him because he told me that he was planning on spending more time pursuing these two other women when he got back from fire. It went amicably at the time, I just sort of bowed out mainly because this seemed like another thing that was taking what fraction of time he had left for me away! (with me so far?)


I think people who are opening up relationships spend a lot of time trying to quash down any negative feelings they may be having towards it for fear of not being open enough for their partner's sake. Also, many people tend to immediately read any negative feelings that come up as jealousy...and for many poly people, that's a dirty word. So we spend a lot of time either just saying we shouldn't feel jealous or pushing it all down.

Well, listen to those feelings. While they may not be indicating the whole truth of the situation, they are giving you some piece of truth. What I just quoted from your OP seems to indicate to me that you're feeling that he hardly has enough time to spend with you as it is. So if you're feeling that he doesn't have the time to even meet your needs in a relationship, it's understandable that you would be upset about him pursuing other relationships when he doesn't seem to have the time to care for yours.

That's a legitimate concern. It sounds like that negative feeling didn't have a voice...so it sort of blew up into an all-encompassing freakout.

So maybe break it down. It's great that he loves you, but if all that love isn't meeting your needs in the relationship, it's completely ok to say that. I don't think it's about him seeing other people. It seems more to be about him having the time to care for you.

So you have a right to voice your needs in the relationship. And in this case, it might take some real examining of what your needs are here. Not the things you think you should be needing in order to be a great poly girlfriend, but your actual needs. Then it just takes understanding what needs are being met and what needs aren't. Once you've figured that out, communicate those needs. Show appreciation for the needs being met and bring up the concerns of the needs not being met. Then just add love and see what happens.

Good luck.
 

redpepper

New member
bring on jealousy! geesh... I have a poly friend that spends so much time skirting around the whole jealousy thing that I fear she is missing the power to release it has. It is worth feeling every bit of it because it's you gut telling you something. I don't know what that is for you, but if you allow yourself to feel it and ask for whatever you say to be taken with a grain of salt because you are just trying to figure out the root, then you will reach a higher knowing of yourself and your situation... perhaps even others. What better gift than jealousy! He is a lucky man to have a woman that can express her emotions at all! It seems he knows that and is patient about your ways of sorting things out for yourself.
 

Nyx

New member
I think the jealousy part is working itself out a little bit....he told me some of the more intimate details of his date the other day (which included oral sex) and I didn't really feel that gut wrenching heartache I thought I would. I just sort of took it in stride. Meanwhile, we have come back together in our relationship and have really sort of started trying to resolve some issues. He has been spending a lot more time with me as well, so I feel he has really heard me this time and is attempting to make things work better. Our love feels stronger than ever!

What remains to be worked out is this other woman with whom he had a date - apparently her other bf is really jealous too and reacted very strongly when he found out about the intimacy. I think what is going to have to happen is a "double date" to get everyone introduced and see how things pan out. I am not sure if I feel strong enough to meet her face to face yet, but what helps is knowing I am not the only one dealing with jealousy and uncertainty (the other bf is dealing with this stuff too).

The other issue is this second woman he is involved with that I really do not feel comfortable with. She is very young and it just seems to me that she is really all about playing around and messing with a lot of guys...she doesn't seem serious at all and Nick even told me that she stood him up once and that he had some uncertainty about her degree of honesty. I don't like the idea of Nick getting physical with someone like that. I asked him to put that relationship on hold for now until we get this other stuff sorted out, but he pretty much refused. I don't know if it is reasonable for me to ask that of him or not...
 

redpepper

New member
I asked him to put that relationship on hold for now until we get this other stuff sorted out, but he pretty much refused. I don't know if it is reasonable for me to ask that of him or not...

Uh, ya... reasonable and a bit of a warning sign...

In case you haven't already read my rule?
I totally go by the idea that things should move as fast as the one that is having the issues... if it isn't then it usually all blows up in everyone's face if someone feels pushed to accept and feel safe within the situation at hand before they are ready (putting the whole thing back a few steps or more) .

Yup, I think he needs to slow down and remember that he is not in this alone and not a free agent that can do whatever he wants.
 

Nyx

New member
Uh, ya... reasonable and a bit of a warning sign...

In case you haven't already read my rule?
I totally go by the idea that things should move as fast as the one that is having the issues... if it isn't then it usually all blows up in everyone's face if someone feels pushed to accept and feel safe within the situation at hand before they are ready (putting the whole thing back a few steps or more) .

Yup, I think he needs to slow down and remember that he is not in this alone and not a free agent that can do whatever he wants.

See that's what bothers me! His gf#1 bf has asked him to NOT have sex with her for a while, and he told him (and in the same thread told ME) that he is "a grown man who can decide for himself when and if he has sex". To me, this is pure selfishness when you are involved with more than one person and sort of a childish reaction to someone requesting a little respect and elbow room. On one hand, he has said he is waiting to have sex with gf#1 because of me and the other bf (even though his attitude clearly says it's begrudgingly), but he won't give me the same grant with gf #2 who has no other lovers. WTF, man? Is it because in the first situation it's two against one??

I really get frustrated when he is so stubborn, but at the same time, when I think if someone was trying to tell me I couldn't have sex with someone, I would be a bit annoyed maybe - I don't know it depends on who it was. Like for example, if "Nick" told me I couldn't have sex with someone I met because he wasn't ready for me to get into that sort of situation yet, I feel I would respect his request (depending on the reason and ultimately depending on our conversations about it). But since he has always told me that he would not put constraints on my relationships (if I had any) I don't think he would ever ask that. It's hard for me to put myself in his shoes and see where he's coming from.

It doesn't seem like a very fair thing to do, poly or not, to have sex with someone, then tell your partner later on....isn't that the same as cheating? But when I have asked him to keep me informed, he said sometimes the moment just comes up to have sex with someone and he wants to be open to that moment happening sometime in the future, and did I want him to call me at that moment and say "i'm about to have intercourse just thought you should know"..?

I guess his way of informing me of his sexual activities is by telling me he is "planning on having sex"???

:confused:I am so confused about the logistics of all this....what do other people do when a new person enters the situation?
 

MonoVCPHG

New member
It doesn't seem like a very fair thing to do, poly or not, to have sex with someone, then tell your partner later on....isn't that the same as cheating? But when I have asked him to keep me informed, he said sometimes the moment just comes up to have sex with someone and he wants to be open to that moment happening sometime in the future, and did I want him to call me at that moment and say "i'm about to have intercourse just thought you should know"..?

I?

Poly is not an excuse to capitalize on every chance to fuck you can. Apparently that is how it works for him. Yes, that is cheating unless otherwise worked out in your boundaries. Move on is my advice. He's not polyamorous, he's polyfucking and you should find someone who fits for you.
 

redpepper

New member
Are you saying you want to know before he has sex with women he is already involved with? Or new women coming into his life that you don't know about yet?
 

Nyx

New member
Ok yes, back up a second. No, he is not talking about acting in the moment to fuck any random person. He is talking about acting on the moment with the two women he is already involved with. He has told me that he intends to have sex with both of them "at some point"...I have asked him to NOT have sex with girl #2 at this time because I want to get a grip on girl #1 first, then go from there.

So, no, he is not out screwing every thing that comes his way. He is talking about being in an intimate situation with the girls he is currently dating that I already know about, and having things go to that level of intimacy and feeling free to have intercourse if it comes up.

What I am confused about is this: Since he has already told me that he plans to have sex with these girls, is that it? And then just one day he will say, Oh I had a date with girl#1 the other night and we had sex. I suppose I should be asking him this......

I guess what I am wanting to know is what are your experiences when it comes to A) meeting someone new and having an interest in pursuing them to B) letting your current partner(s) know you have met someone new to C) negotiating how, when, frequency, etc of dating said new person to D) deciding you want to get physical with them and letting your current partner(s) know this to E) having sex with the new person. Obviously there is no set sequence of events, everyone is different, and it requires talking talking talking to everyone involved.
 

MonoVCPHG

New member
OK, so things are a bit clearer for me now! I think that by accepting his relationships from a dating poly perspective, there has to come a time where you let go of the fact that they will have sex. These are intimate relationships that you are aware he will pursue.

He has been honest with his intentions and, as long as your health is not at risk, this is an expected next step I believe. It would be hard for anyone to maintain a relationship with indefinite celibacy in this instance. That being said if the other women's partners also have issues it will have to be negotiated on their end.

If you are not comfortable with the inevitable sexual aspects of his poly relationships with others, than again you might consider finding a more fitting partner for yourself.

It's ok to let go and keep his friendship. If your heart is not in this it will tear you apart.

Take care
Mono
 

redpepper

New member
To answer your question... I really don't think there has a been a time where I have said, "okay this person is new." I have always kept everyone in the loop when I met anyone, or am interested in someone regardless of where it is heading. That way if the relationship heads down the path of intimacy then there are no surprises. The rest is really just up to the individuals involved and becomes evident with time.
 

Nyx

New member
I discovered that yesterday when talking with Nick - he said the same thing that I need to accept that fact that this is what poly relationships entail: sex and intimacy. So in a way, I think that is the thing that needs to click into place for me. We had a long talk yesterday and I was sort of upset because he wouldn't put the 2nd girl on hold, and he said he is already basically IN a reltionship with her, (a fact that I was aware of, but in denial about) I realized how unfair my request was.

Apparently gf#1 - her bf is having some real issues and is very angry. Nick told me today that the bf has asked to talk to me, I'm not sure what he wants to talk about, and Nick insinuated that we could have a bitchsession. I am NOT about that, I told him. What issues I have I can talk about, and relay knowledge to him but I am not going to bitch about stuff with this guy - all that does is create a cycle of negativity. I am hoping he just needs some support from someone in a similar situation, and is not wanting to conspire to break things up.
 
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