How often do you talk to your partner about insecurity?

Polysnow

Member
I'm insecure, due to my own actions and to the...circumstances I'm in.

But I was curious, how often do you talk to your own partner about your insecurities?

How about in a situation when you have talked to your partner about your insecurities and promised to work on them together, but you have days where that ugly demon rears it's head and you just can't "shake" them? Do you tell your partner EVERY TIME you feel them? How do you do deal with them on your own outside of professional therapy?

Just curious...
 

Taramafor

New member
hill stat

I talk to people. Not just "Who I might be involved with" but anyone that wants to talk and listen. Because outsider viewpoints can help with how you see things. With how fears can be irrational.

The only thing I'm insecure about though is fudging things up. Apparently this makes me huggable for some reason.
 

GalaGirl

Well-known member
First I make sure it is just me. And not the situation I am in. It's hard for me to feel secure and stable in a situation that simply is not secure or stable. Expecting to feel secure there is not a realistic expectation.

If the situation is stable enough? And it is my inner thoughts causing my upset or doubts? I have to change my thinking. Rather than fuel "fear" or "insecure" or whatever... I have to fuel "coping-ness" or "I can handle this." So I call up examples from the past where I have coped well, or handled another situation.
I can talk back to the inner critic voice.

If I need to process? I call up a friend or whoever is willing to talk it out and get another POV. Sometimes they can see something I cannot see. (Partner can sometimes help or sometimes not because they might be too close to the situation to be objective.)

How about in a situation when you have talked to your partner about your insecurities and promised to work on them together,

Is that the source of uncertainty? You see they are willing but you don't see HOW?

Maybe you need something more concrete than "I promise to work on them with you."

Maybe you want something measurable like "we will talk each friday night from 8 - 9 PM."

Galagirl
 
Last edited:

CTF

Member
I tried that once, and got burned by it, so I don't talk about it with her anymore. She knows that I am insecure, it's not a secret, but the details are saved for either a therapist, or in an anonymous setting such as here. Even then, I'm an extremely private person & don't divulge any more than I have to.
 

KC43

New member
I talk to my partners about insecurity when I feel the need to do so, which is usually after trying to deal with it myself and not quite succeeding. Sometimes I'm told something unexpected that pings my insecurity button, and in those cases I bring up the insecurity immediately because I know better than to give it time to build up steam.

For me, addressing insecurity only necessitates my partner listening to me express how I feel, and sometimes some of the mental sewage that underlies it (a lot of my insecurities are due to past negative experiences and trauma), and reassuring me that they aren't abandoning me. That's the big FEAR that's at the root of any insecurity I have.

Fortunately for me, Hubby and my boyfriend are both very patient with the fact that reassuring me often includes telling me things they've told me a dozen or more times before. When the fear gets ahead of me, just reminding myself that they've said those things doesn't always get through; I need to hear it again in their voices.
 

Taramafor

New member
I tried that once, and got burned by it, so I don't talk about it with her anymore. She knows that I am insecure, it's not a secret, but the details are saved for either a therapist, or in an anonymous setting such as here. Even then, I'm an extremely private person & don't divulge any more than I have to.

And I've had bad experiences with things. It gave me something to learn from so I could go about them better in future. Things tend to go bad the first time around in general. Especially with "people situations".

I'm seeing two possible issues here. Which tie in with other issues if I am observing correctly. Note that I am only stating a theory.

To begin with you said yourself that your partner doesn't talk to you. That it's saved for "others". I shall counter this right now. "others" aren't the ones being there for you in a time of need. "others" can help, yes, but if this is something important to you and it's going basically ignored by your partner... well let's put it this way. "No one is a replacement". So I hope they care enough to try as well.

Your partner may also be afraid of talking themselves, which might be why they suggested others (unless that was your idea, but who is moot for the purpose of this post). Which is understandable. I get that fear all the time. Of saying something stupid and fudging things up. Your partner might be alike in this regard. You might be too and seem to be. No one wants to get dragged into an argument. Only advice I got here is if it feels like that's happening when you're talking, PAUSE. There's a lot to be said for taking things slowly and thinking things through. Worst that can happen here is to put it on hold and enjoy other things 'till you got it sorted in your head for later. Same logic applies for when you feel like you're "freaking out".

In my experience leaving things left unsaid puts in more distance. What's worse is if something bad happens to the other and it's too late (speaking from experience on this one). Can't force a conversation either but it's also a question of wherever they come to you. Or you going to them. Regardless of what the concern might be. By all means get others to help but in the end it's between you two. So I hope there's a plan beyond others helping.

It's also about HOW to explain things too. Going along with what GalaGirl said. The how and the reasons and the why. Hopefully by talking to others you're getting a better idea of all that and what I mean by it. But ultimately it's down to you because others will never know what you been through in the way that you do. Extra information helps but it's also down to what you know from experience. Perhaps even asking yourself such a simple question as "Why am I a private person" will help you find the answers in how to talk to someone that's a part of your private life. There was a time I hid away myself. Now no longer. When you can't find answers to a question go back to what caused the question to be asked in the first place and work from there.
 
Last edited:

kdt26417

Official Greeter
Staff member
What I have nowadays is not so much insecurity as it is generalized anxiety. It happens all the time, but sometimes it's worse than usual. I don't know when to talk about it, so I usually wait until Snowbunny prompts me with a question. Which usually happens at least once or twice a week. I can't tell whether talking about it helps, but I do want to be honest about it.
 

CTF

Member
And I've had bad experiences with things. It gave me something to learn from so I could go about them better in future. Things tend to go bad the first time around in general. Especially with "people situations".

I'm seeing two possible issues here. Which tie in with other issues if I am observing correctly. Note that I am only stating a theory.

To begin with you said yourself that your partner doesn't talk to you. That it's saved for "others". I shall counter this right now. "others" aren't the ones being there for you in a time of need. "others" can help, yes, but if this is something important to you and it's going basically ignored by your partner... well let's put it this way. "No one is a replacement". So I hope they care enough to try as well.

Your partner may also be afraid of talking themselves, which might be why they suggested others (unless that was your idea, but who is moot for the purpose of this post). Which is understandable. I get that fear all the time. Of saying something stupid and fudging things up. Your partner might be alike in this regard. You might be too and seem to be. No one wants to get dragged into an argument. Only advice I got here is if it feels like that's happening when you're talking, PAUSE. There's a lot to be said for taking things slowly and thinking things through. Worst that can happen here is to put it on hold and enjoy other things 'till you got it sorted in your head for later. Same logic applies for when you feel like you're "freaking out".

In my experience leaving things left unsaid puts in more distance. What's worse is if something bad happens to the other and it's too late (speaking from experience on this one). Can't force a conversation either but it's also a question of wherever they come to you. Or you going to them. Regardless of what the concern might be. By all means get others to help but in the end it's between you two. So I hope there's a plan beyond others helping.

It's also about HOW to explain things too. Going along with what GalaGirl said. The how and the reasons and the why. Hopefully by talking to others you're getting a better idea of all that and what I mean by it. But ultimately it's down to you because others will never know what you been through in the way that you do. Extra information helps but it's also down to what you know from experience. Perhaps even asking yourself such a simple question as "Why am I a private person" will help you find the answers in how to talk to someone that's a part of your private life. There was a time I hid away myself. Now no longer. When you can't find answers to a question go back to what caused the question to be asked in the first place and work from there.


Well, as for my wife, I'm not really sure if her unwillingness to talk has anything to do with my keeping quiet. With her, I believe it was much more about choosing to confide with someone not willing to give her the occasional hard truth. With me, it was about not respecting the boundaries in keeping it between us. I admit my insecurities, but it's not her place to tell them to others.

As for why I'm such a private person... it's simple. I grew up being taught never to air my dirty laundry, and since things like insecurity and jealousy are taught to be negative behaviors... it goes without saying that that's the type of stuff we keep to ourself. One time... just once, I open up & tell her a story that I've never told anyone, next thing I know, she's in the other room telling jersey all about how jealous & insecure I am. This is my WIFE of 16 years. If I can't trust her with my feelings, then surely I can't trust anyone.
 

Taramafor

New member
Well, as for my wife, I'm not really sure if her unwillingness to talk has anything to do with my keeping quiet. With her, I believe it was much more about choosing to confide with someone not willing to give her the occasional hard truth. With me, it was about not respecting the boundaries in keeping it between us. I admit my insecurities, but it's not her place to tell them to others.

As for why I'm such a private person... it's simple. I grew up being taught never to air my dirty laundry, and since things like insecurity and jealousy are taught to be negative behaviors... it goes without saying that that's the type of stuff we keep to ourself. One time... just once, I open up & tell her a story that I've never told anyone, next thing I know, she's in the other room telling jersey all about how jealous & insecure I am. This is my WIFE of 16 years. If I can't trust her with my feelings, then surely I can't trust anyone.

Sigh... So many places. Where to begin? Let's start with "Not her place". Can you understand why I might take issue with this? Who decides what YOUR place is? even a loved one doesn't decide such things. Not beyond dom/sub related things but even then it's not as simple as "Oh, this is my place." It's like I tell my owner (who I'm very much in love with). "If you can't handle me at my worst, you don't deserve me at my best." The logic works both ways, naturally. Right now both you and your wife seem to be at your worst.

Now then. Assumptions and judgement. My stance? "Fuck judgement." You might not "air your laundry" but do you also keep it hidden? Do you have to hide? I just go with the logic of just doing whatever it is I do and let people accept it or not myself. Shouldn't have to hide because people assume stupid things. That's how I see it. But moving on from that. I have a history of trust issues myself. Stems from fear. So... it sounds like your wife has some concerns with you. But if you're telling her where her "place" is then, frankly, I can understand why. There are REASONS why all of this is happening. Find them out. If you can't find them out with each other then just try to slowly build up trust. Yes, she's your wife, but that doesn't mean she's not human. And she certainty isn't your property. She can and will mistrust you. As others have done so with me. That does NOT mean she's other people that you know or have yet to meet that might or may trust you or not. others can and will trust you more. Or less. That doesn't translate into caring more or less either. Though of course trust does help with that. The distance may even be there because she cares and is scared. for both of you.

And your wife is, what, 16? Come on man, grow up. She's got her WHOLE LIFE ahead of her. And has so much to learn about any of this. Of things like fear and hate and reasons behind it. Hopefully both of you will learn and be prepared and have a plan as I wasn't fortunate enough to have done. But for crying out loud, if you start flinging mistrust in her direction it isn't going to help her with trusting you either. That said there's a large difference between mistrust and not letting someone you care about walk over you. Note: Having concerns does not count as walking over you.

Now a question. When you two got together did you do it for the right reasons? I ask this because I was young once and ended up being with someone for the wrong ones. Can you honestly tell yourself that you trust yourself, let alone her? Regardless of the answer can you trust yourself with her?

If you haven't even considered any of this then I strongly advise you do so now.
 
Last edited:

CTF

Member
Sigh... So many places. Where to begin? Let's start with "Not her place". Can you understand why I might take issue with this? Who decides what YOUR place is? even a loved one doesn't decide such things. Not beyond dom/sub related things but even then it's not as simple as "Oh, this is my place." It's like I tell my owner (who I'm very much in love with). "If you can't handle me at my worst, you don't deserve me at my best." The logic works both ways, naturally. Right now both you and your wife seem to be at your worst.

Now then. Assumptions and judgement. My stance? "Fuck judgement." You might not "air your laundry" but do you also keep it hidden? Do you have to hide? I just go with the logic of just doing whatever it is I do and let people accept it or not myself. Shouldn't have to hide because people assume stupid things. That's how I see it. But moving on from that. I have a history of trust issues myself. Stems from fear. So... it sounds like your wife has some concerns with you. But if you're telling her where her "place" is then, frankly, I can understand why. There are REASONS why all of this is happening. Find them out. If you can't find them out with each other then just try to slowly build up trust. Yes, she's your wife, but that doesn't mean she's not human. And she certainty isn't your property. She can and will mistrust you. As others have done so with me. That does NOT mean she's other people that you know or have yet to meet that might or may trust you or not. others can and will trust you more. Or less. That doesn't translate into caring more or less either. Though of course trust does help with that. The distance may even be there because she cares and is scared. for both of you.

And your wife is, what, 16? Come on man, grow up. She's got her WHOLE LIFE ahead of her. And has so much to learn about any of this. Of things like fear and hate and reasons behind it. Hopefully both of you will learn and be prepared and have a plan as I wasn't fortunate enough to have done. But for crying out loud, if you start flinging mistrust in her direction it isn't going to help her with trusting you either. That said there's a large difference between mistrust and not letting someone you care about walk over you. Note: Having concerns does not count as walking over you.

Now a question. When you two got together did you do it for the right reasons? I ask this because I was young once and ended up being with someone for the wrong ones. Can you honestly tell yourself that you trust yourself, let alone her? Regardless of the answer can you trust yourself with her?

If you haven't even considered any of this then I strongly advise you do so now.

Ok, first of all, my wife is not 16 years old, we'd been married for 16 years at the time. As of now, we've been married for 18 years. She's 40 btw.

Now, as for what's "her place"... here's the thing. Divulging things to someone, about someone else, without consent is NO ONE'S place. If two people are sharing a private conversation about a private matter, expecting that discussion to remain private does not mean one treating the other as "property".

While I clearly know nothing about bdsm, so I won't even begin to comment there, but I suspect that everything else is either a clear misunderstanding on your part, and would be pointless to comment on, or you really have a warped sense of boundaries when it comes to those who choose to share matters with people who have no business knowing.

I sincerely suggest you read what I actually said before arguing irrelevant/nonexistent points.
 

Taramafor

New member
Ok, first of all, my wife is not 16 years old, we'd been married for 16 years at the time. As of now, we've been married for 18 years. She's 40 btw.

Now, as for what's "her place"... here's the thing. Divulging things to someone, about someone else, without consent is NO ONE'S place.

I misunderstood the age thing then. My mistake.

If I want to talk about private things about you or even people close to me then that is MY right to do so. My place because I make it MY place. You do NOT get to decide what your wife can do or not. Only SHE decides that and even that can change even if she agrees to what you want from her. Did she at any point in time AGREE with not speaking to others about things? By going "No one" you're very much including your wife. THAT is what I meant. Nothing more, nothing less. That her place is for HER to decide (or find instinctively even). And it can even change. You might not like it or approve, but her place is the place she decides, even if it changes after an agreement. You specifically said it's "no ones place". You're trying to decide the place of others by saying that. Which includes your wife. Her place is HER place. Not the place you or anyone else puts her in.

I got into a conversation with my owner about a "private matter" recently. Seems understanding enough about it. She didn't go "It's no ones place" as you did because she cares about things like "What we might be going through". Someone she knows told me that they used to dom her. Naturally the owner was huffy at first (heard it from me. I believe in no secrets and honesty). But thing is when we talk about "private matters" it's more of a "self motivation" for ourselves. So she calmed down soon after about the person that let it slip. This thought makes me happy so I mention it for example. Does it bother you if I go on about what makes me happy with you? Does it bother you if I mention a problem between us and feel like I might need an outsides viewpoint for my mental health because I can't face walking away from you or talking to you yet? Well if it bothers you it bothers you. Sometimes we need to find answers elsewhere before we're ready to face each other on some things. If you want to go up to your wife and say "Keep things between us" then by all means do that. But in doing so you may end up preventing her from finding an answer elsewhere that may very well even save your relationship.

Does it bother you that I go about things my way? That I might need to talk to others because you're looking down your nose at me? Will you judge me for it? Will you BLAME me for it? Or will you trust that there is a good reason for it? That perhaps the whole reason might even be "because you're looking at me that way"? You mistrust her and you judge her for doing what she does. I'm not talking about the right and wrong of it all, because it's not about that. The fact of the matter is you're looking at her in that way. And yes, it can suck when someone close to you is doing bad things, but thinking "They shouldn't be doing that" is trying to decide for them. Trying to decide how they should be there for you. It's counterproductive. People will be as they be, do what they do and there will be bad times as well as good. Instead of thinking "It's no ones place" how about trying "Ok, did I/others give her any reason to do that". The mindset of none blame due to bad actions can be hard, but right now you're very much biased and I don't think you can trust your own judgement. Which might be why you made this thread. To other people. Most likely without telling your wife. The kind of thing she's doing when she picked up the phone to talk to others. That makes you at least as bad as her in that regard unless you've told her. Now do you understand why I'm seeing this situation in a negative light? Regardless of wherever you did or didn't it's an action that was taken because your afraid and leaving such fears lingering around in your head when your partner can't help makes you look for answers elsewhere or otherwise risk going mad. Sometimes literary. Which is why I never hide things from anyone. A subject my owner is very understanding on. Your wife is going to have moments when she's mad at you and hates your guts. To be unable able to talk to you. My owner has them with me. It can even be a good thing in some ways. But not if you fixate on it instead of moving on to better things. Talking to others can keep us sane, you know. Especially when you're feeling alone (yes she has you, no it doesn't mean she can face you when she's angry).

What's going through your wife's head? Think on it. And I mean REALLY think on it. Without blame and without judgement. And without deciding her place.

Personally I think you're just afraid of people manipulating your wife. And that makes me question your trust towards her. I don't claim you do or don't, I simply ponder it. Hopefully I'm wrong on this account too.

It might also help to think about the GOOD things you and your wife go through. To put aside the bad that is happening. Be there despite it. Perhaps even because of it. Or you can keep going "no ones place" and hope that fixes things. If it helps any I've been known to fixate on problems myself in the past. I learned it only serves to keep people getting worked up about things. Do you "just want your way" or is your mental health at stake? I drop the situation with the former, stick to my guns if the later. That's why I talk to others. Could be why your wife does too. It doesn't mean you're the reason it happens when it does (at first). Just that they're managing themselves. Perhaps even doing it to try and improve their mental well being. Their own thoughts about you even, though it could easily appear to be the opposite case. If you then go "Don't do that, it's no ones place" do you think that helps or hinders the situation? "Just because" logic is never good logic. "Don't do that because it upsets me", sure. But again, "Just a little upset" or "That makes me depressed." Similar to "Just want your way" and "For your mental well being." Does it matter to you MORE then being able to talk with others when it comes to your wife? Because frankly, you make it out like that's the case. I doubt you've checked in with this with her. That you even asked. And she might not to let you right now (though do ask anyway. She'll probably appreciate it). And that sucks, I get that. But go thinking "She's not doing what I want her to do" and that's going to keep her away. Did you fall in love with who she is or the person you want her to be? Right now she's being her bitchy self (no offence to her. We all get that way). Draw your own answer from that. I can be a right dick at times too. I don't get people that love me holding it against me. Not anymore at least (past is another matter). I claim responsibility for my actions and understand people do stupid shit for a reason.

As for "boundaries" my stance in that is a simple one. I can't control you. You can't control me. Let's not try too. Your choices are your own (BIG believer in freedom of choice) unless I give my choices to you. And even this operates on a case by case bases. (THAT'S consent. Not "I decide for you unless I say otherwise because I expect things from you. On that note I don't do expectations and I believe it ruins many relationships). It's never wrong if it's right for you so therefor never blamed because regret is a heavy burden that leads down dark paths. etc. This is also why I never blame anyone even if they're wishing the worst of me and hating my guts. Looking past it has a way of bringing people closer. Though it doesn't mean I'll be walked over. Also one CAN do something but they don't HAVE too. So I don't "do" consent. I just trust and point out "This affects me thusly". Close company only. NOT just a BDSM only thing either. If you don't know about things like that then I'd say it's unwise to be with close company in BDSM. This means I'm into BDSM because of the none BDSM things that came beforehand (which can often be the case when it comes to this). And you call that warped? Ha. Kept on good terms with everyone I've fallen out with in my life. Warped or not I'm happy from it. Yes I'm a little huffy from that warped comment. See what I mean about counterproductive? If that's how you talk to your wife then is it any wonder she's not talking to you? No I'm not just being snarky here, I'm serious. You've gone "That's no ones place" (speaking for others.) and (Your view might be warped). That is not trying to be understanding. Far from it.
 
Last edited:

CTF

Member
I misunderstood the age thing then. My mistake.

If I want to talk about private things about you or even people close to me then that is MY right to do so. My place because I make it MY place. You do NOT get to decide what your wife can do or not. Only SHE decides that and even that can change even if she agrees to what you want from her. Did she at any point in time AGREE with not speaking to others about things? By going "No one" you're very much including your wife. THAT is what I meant. Nothing more, nothing less. That her place is for HER to decide (or find instinctively even). And it can even change. You might not like it or approve, but her place is the place she decides, even if it changes after an agreement. You specifically said it's "no ones place". You're trying to decide the place of others by saying that. Which includes your wife. Her place is HER place. Not the place you or anyone else puts her in.

I got into a conversation with my owner about a "private matter" recently. Seems understanding enough about it. She didn't go "It's no ones place" as you did because she cares about things like "What we might be going through". Someone she knows told me that they used to dom her. Naturally the owner was huffy at first (heard it from me. I believe in no secrets and honesty). But thing is when we talk about "private matters" it's more of a "self motivation" for ourselves. So she calmed down soon after about the person that let it slip. This thought makes me happy so I mention it for example. Does it bother you if I go on about what makes me happy with you? Does it bother you if I mention a problem between us and feel like I might need an outsides viewpoint for my mental health because I can't face walking away from you or talking to you yet? Well if it bothers you it bothers you. Sometimes we need to find answers elsewhere before we're ready to face each other on some things. If you want to go up to your wife and say "Keep things between us" then by all means do that. But in doing so you may end up preventing her from finding an answer elsewhere that may very well even save your relationship.

Does it bother you that I go about things my way? That I might need to talk to others because you're looking down your nose at me? Will you judge me for it? Will you BLAME me for it? Or will you trust that there is a good reason for it? That perhaps the whole reason might even be "because you're looking at me that way"? You mistrust her and you judge her for doing what she does. I'm not talking about the right and wrong of it all, because it's not about that. The fact of the matter is you're looking at her in that way. And yes, it can suck when someone close to you is doing bad things, but thinking "They shouldn't be doing that" is trying to decide for them. Trying to decide how they should be there for you. It's counterproductive. People will be as they be, do what they do and there will be bad times as well as good. Instead of thinking "It's no ones place" how about trying "Ok, did I/others give her any reason to do that". The mindset of none blame due to bad actions can be hard, but right now you're very much biased and I don't think you can trust your own judgement. Which might be why you made this thread. To other people. Most likely without telling your wife. The kind of thing she's doing when she picked up the phone to talk to others. That makes you at least as bad as her in that regard unless you've told her. Now do you understand why I'm seeing this situation in a negative light? Regardless of wherever you did or didn't it's an action that was taken because your afraid and leaving such fears lingering around in your head when your partner can't help makes you look for answers elsewhere or otherwise risk going mad. Sometimes literary. Which is why I never hide things from anyone. A subject my owner is very understanding on. Your wife is going to have moments when she's mad at you and hates your guts. To be unable able to talk to you. My owner has them with me

It might also help to think about the GOOD things you and your wife go through. To put aside the bad that is happening. Be there despite it. Perhaps even because of it. Or you can keep going "no ones place" and hope that fixes things. If it helps any I've been known to fixate on problems myself in the past. I learned it only serves to keep people getting worked up about things. Do you "just want your way" or is your mental health at stake? I drop the situation with the former, stick to my guns if the later. That's why I talk to others. Could be why your wife does too. It doesn't mean you're the reason it happens when it does (at first). Just that they're managing themselves. Perhaps even doing it to try and improve their mental well being. Their own thoughts about you even, though it could easily appear to be the opposite case. If you then go "Don't do that, it's no ones place" do you think that helps or hinders the situation? "Just because" logic is never good logic. "Don't do that because it upsets me", sure. But again, "Just a little upset" or "That makes me depressed." Similar to "Just want your way" and "For your mental well being." Does it matter to you MORE then being able to talk with others when it comes to your wife? Because frankly, you make it out like that's the case. I doubt you've checked in with this with her. That you even asked. And she might not to let you right now (though do ask anyway. She'll probably appreciate it). And that sucks, I get that. But go thinking "She's not doing what I want her to do" and that's going to keep her away. Did you fall in love with who she is or the person you want her to be? Right now she's being her bitchy self (no offence to her. We all get that way). Draw your own answer from that. I can be a right dick at times too. I don't get people that love me holding it against me. Not anymore at least (past is another matter). I claim responsibility for my actions and understand people do stupid shit for a reason.

As for "boundaries" my stance in that is a simple one. I can't control you. You can't control me. Let's not try too. Your choices are your own (BIG believer in freedom of choice) unless I give my choices to you. And even this operates on a case by case bases. (THAT'S consent. Not "I decide for you unless I say otherwise because I expect things from you. On that note I don't do expectations and I believe it ruins many relationships). It's never wrong if it's right for you so therefor never blamed because regret is a heavy burden that leads down dark paths. etc. This is also why I never blame anyone even if they're wishing the worst of me and hating my guts. Looking past it has a way of bringing people closer. Though it doesn't mean I'll be walked over. Also one CAN do something but they don't HAVE too. So I don't "do" consent. I just trust and point out "This affects me thusly". Close company only. NOT just a BDSM only thing either. If you don't know about things like that then I'd say it's unwise to be with close company in BDSM. This means I'm into BDSM because of the none BDSM things that came beforehand (which can often be the case when it comes to this). And you call that warped? Ha. Kept on good terms with everyone I've fallen out with in my life. Warped or not I'm happy from it. Yes I'm a little huffy from that warped comment. See what I mean about counterproductive? If that's how you talk to your wife then is it any wonder she's not talking to you? No I'm not just being snarky here, I'm serious. You've gone "That's no ones place" (speaking for others.) and (Your view might be warped). That is not trying to be understanding. Far from it.

Ugh... so much to take issue with, but I guess I'll start with the obvious. I didn't create this thread, I simply replied to it. Furthermore, I didn't give anything specific in details, so no, I'm not doing the very thing I'm complaining about. Granted, I've gone deeper in other conversations over the last couple of years, but all under the anonymity. No one here knows her, nor myself personally. And had she chosen to vent anonymously to a group of strangers, then it wouldn't have bothered me so much.

I'm glad we don't know each other personally, because with that type of "I'll tell whomever, whatever" attitude, you're not exactly beaming with trustworthiness. One's place is not wherever the fuck they choose it to be. When it comes to whether or not it affects someone else, they have NO business divulging anything without permission. And if you really believe that wanting your private matters private, is telling someone else what to do, even when they clearly have no business doing so, then you need to think long & hard about whether your sense of boundaries is appropriate. You're rights begin & end at the tip of your nose... PERIOD!

Now, you may choose to be an "open book" when it comes to what goes on in your mind. Good for you, but it doesn't make you any more noble than those of us who value privacy. I don't care whether you think you're doing it to help gain outside perspective, it doesn't make it ok when you know that you're violating someone else's wish to remain private. And not I, nor anyone else is obligated to explain why. If I tell you that I don't want anyone else knowing, you don't need to know the reason why. And if you know that I tell you something in confidence, and you tell others anyway, then you violate that confidence, and lose my trust on ever opening up again.

Btw, I'm doing this on my phone, so I may have glossed over some points. Not intentionally, but the words are small. So if there's something that I didn't address that you would like me to, then mention it.
 

CTF

Member
Oh, and just so we're clear. I'm not talking about keeping secrets from people otherwise affected. If I ask you to keep the secret that I stole $50 out of Mary's purse, of course it's your right to speak up.
 

Taramafor

New member
Again, if someone even close to you chose to divulge whatever the hell they wish that is THEIR right to do so. I never said "this can't harm someone". I never said "It might be unwise to do". I'm simply stating that you do NOT control ANYONE regardless of what you might think. And I'm simply saying there can be a good reason for it. Especially when you tell someone not to do it and try to make their choices. Now do you get it? I never said "Your shit doesn't matter". I'm just saying "I got this shit that also matters". Do you not value that? Not "my shit" necessarily, but perhaps someone closer that might be being a little ore public about things.

As for why I don't keep secrets at all from anyone that I give a damn about that's a personal matter. I have my reasons. Suffice to say "In the interest of my mental health". Does that have more or less value? Just as much? How can someone trust you if you don't care about their mental well being? Not once did you bring that up despite me having mentioned it previously. Again, not "mine", but with someone else could might be closer to you.

Also, again, consent is an AGREEMENT. You can't just go around expecting people to do shit for you (though at this point you seem to be in an agreement, but my point is expectations in general). It simply doesn't work that way. And as I said before there might be GOOD REASON why people don't do things you don't approve of. Agreed too or not. Holding a grudge because of "a betrayal" will only build up more mistrust. Oh, I'll point it out. I'll go "You went back on your word." But I'd never BLAME anyone for it. Which is what I'm stressing. That you might be BLAMING people. Because I've been down that dark path. Regret is a heavy burden. Do you not value that? Self blame is the worst of all. Which can build up from blame from others. The ones we love are often the ones we hurt the most. Now do you see why I'm concerned?

Or does only your "private" information matter? And just who's information is it when it's shared with another? It's not "just yours". It's theirs as well. More so when it's "about the both of you."

And my whole point here is that no one can really control anyone. Not even when it comes to D/s. We make CHOICES. And they can have consequences. "No one has the right to" my ass. Everyone has every right to do whatever the hell they please. I never said you had to be happy about it. Nor does being able to do something mean you have to do it. But it's the choices of others to make.

No one here knows her, nor myself personally

Not the point. Sometimes people just need to confide in someone. And if they can't do that with you they'll turn to whoever they can. Or is"I need to talk to someone to keep myself together" not valued? I'll tell you who your wife can talk to when she can't talk to you. ANYONE! Did you consider the fact that she cares about you that much that she needs to do it with others? If she didn't care at all you wouldn't even be a thought... At least when someone's hating you they're keeping you in mind. In a selfish and counterproductive way perhaps, but I've built up to good relations from there myself. Pro tip. Blame and trying to control them doesn't help.
 
Last edited:

CTF

Member
Again, if someone even close to you chose to divulge whatever the hell they wish that is THEIR right to do so. I never said "this can't harm someone". I never said "It might be unwise to do". I'm simply stating that you do NOT control ANYONE regardless of what you might think. And I'm simply saying there can be a good reason for it. Especially when you tell someone not to do it and try to make their choices. Now do you get it? I never said "Your shit doesn't matter". I'm just saying "I got this shit that also matters". Do you not value that? Not "my shit" necessarily, but perhaps someone closer that might be being a little ore public about things.

As for why I don't keep secrets at all from anyone that I give a damn about that's a personal matter. I have my reasons. Suffice to say "In the interest of my mental health". Does that have more or less value? Just as much? How can someone trust you if you don't care about their mental well being? Not once did you bring that up despite me having mentioned it previously. Again, not "mine", but with someone else could might be closer to you.

Also, again, consent is an AGREEMENT. You can't just go around expecting people to do shit for you (though at this point you seem to be in an agreement, but my point is expectations in general). It simply doesn't work that way. And as I said before there might be GOOD REASON why people don't do things you don't approve of. Agreed too or not. Holding a grudge because of "a betrayal" will only build up more mistrust. Oh, I'll point it out. I'll go "You went back on your word." But I'd never BLAME anyone for it. Which is what I'm stressing. That you might be BLAMING people. Because I've been down that dark path. Regret is a heavy burden. Do you not value that? Self blame is the worst of all. Which can build up from blame from others. The ones we love are often the ones we hurt the most. Now do you see why I'm concerned?

Or does only your "private" information matter? And just who's information is it when it's shared with another? It's not "just yours". It's theirs as well. More so when it's "about the both of you."

And my whole point here is that no one can really control anyone. Not even when it comes to D/s. We make CHOICES. And they can have consequences. "No one has the right to" my ass. Everyone has every right to do whatever the hell they please. I never said you had to be happy about it. Nor does being able to do something mean you have to do it. But it's the choices of others to make.



Not the point. Sometimes people just need to confide in someone. And if they can't do that with you they'll turn to whoever they can. Or is"I need to talk to someone to keep myself together" not valued? I'll tell you who your wife can talk to when she can't talk to you. ANYONE! Did you consider the fact that she cares about you that much that she needs to do it with others? If she didn't care at all you wouldn't even be a thought... At least when someone's hating you they're keeping you in mind. In a selfish and counterproductive way perhaps, but I've built up to good relations from there myself. Pro tip. Blame and trying to control them doesn't help.

It's interesting that you keep bringing up "control" in this situation. Despite the fact that the point that I'm emphasizing is one person's desires to keep something about themself private is not controlling anyone. It's possible we're running on 2 different definitions of "place", "right", etc... however, my point is simply this. If I want something private, you have no business sharing it with others, even if you think you're helping. This isn't a legal issue, I'm not talking about that. But it IS an issue with consequences. Maybe I stop trusting you with things that are on my mind, maybe we part ways & never see each other. That's all I'm talking about.

I'm failing to see the relevance of your next paragraph. What does any of this have to do with anyone doing anything FOR anyone? If I tell you, that I have a fear of failure, for example... That's my problem. I'm not telling you because I'm asking for help, and if I say that I don't want anyone else to know, then not only are you NOT helping by telling your friends, but you're causing harm by violating the trust we once had.

No, not only MY private information matters, that's why I don't share ANYTHING she hasn't consented to. And no, not all private information affects them too. See my example above. That wouldn't affect anyone but me if that were my case. Not her, not you, etc...

And no, it doesn't bring me comfort to think she's sharing with me in mind. If I say that I don't want others to know xyz, I mean exactly that. Saying that you were doing it because you care is a cop out. I'm not so needy that I need to be thought about all the time. It's not the compliment/comfort you think it is. At least not to everyone.

And as for why you're so open... again, good for you, but I really don't care why. You say you have your reasons, and it's not my business one way or the other, and you certainly don't have any obligation to explain to me (which is why I didn't ask btw). All I said was that it doesn't make you any more noble that me, for wanting to be so private. You have your reasons, I have mine... the difference is, I'm not trying to tell you that it's okay if others violate your wishes.
 

dingedheart

Well-known member
Again, if someone even close to you chose to divulge whatever the hell they wish that is THEIR right to do so.

Where does such a right come from ?? And I was under impression that poly handbook preached that there is a strict " right " of privacy. Don't these conflict ??

To me this discussion revolves around a few things carelessness, intent, and or just gossip. None it good for building trust.

It seems you're hung up on the phrase " not her place ". Can you think of a situation or information that wouldn't be " her place to share " ?
 

Spork

New member
I don't agree that even gossip is inherently wrong. I share all sorts of stuff. With all sorts of people. About anybody I want.

If I have a secret, I learned a LONG time ago, that the keeping of it is MY burden to bear. Should I decide to share it with anyone, anytime, then I am sharing the burden of it. If I expect them to carry that burden, and then not relieve themselves to anyone else, then I should probably say so up front, and ask them if they are willing. I've got to consider that it is a risk. Humans are highly social animals and frankly just not that great at keeping secrets. If you tell ANYONE then you are opening yourself up to some risk that your secret is no longer secure. And you should never assume that someone in a tight relationship will keep your secret from their own partners, either. If you have told one, assume you have told both (or however many are in the 'ship, as it were.)

The very very few things that I consider to be truly secret, I have told to NO ONE and in fact I do my best not to even contemplate them myself. I have as best as I could, excised them from my reality and my thinking, and I will take them to my grave.

The ones that are merely very sensitive information that I am particular about who finds out, I tell people in very disconnected social bubbles. If I didn't want anyone locally close to me, to know something, and yet needed to discuss it, I'd call my Mom. She lives in the middle of nowhere and she doesn't talk to anybody much. I have taken a calculated risk, which I deemed low.

But I also disclose to my partners that while I am capable of keeping a secret or a confidence, it is NOT my default mode. They need to communicate the need to me, or it's highly likely I won't do it. They get to consent to be in a relationship with someone who has that in their nature, or not. I had one partner when I was actively poly who was beginning to have issues with my "put it all on blast; live out loud" ways, being a far more private individual, and frankly it's one of the biggest reasons I had the sense that our relationship might not work out in the long run and maybe that was for the best. He could have asked me to not talk about him, and I would have respected that, but he never did.

This, like everything, is about negotiation. CTF, have you talked to your wife about this? Maybe you could arrive at some sort of negotiated middle ground where you can structure a time for talks in confidence and explain a need for her to not repeat what you say while under the aegis of "private talk time." It can be harmful to a relationship when you don't feel safe being vulnerable to your partner. Just going on like that can build some serious walls that are tough to live in.

I don't consider it an act of base objective wrongdoing to share my partner's personal stuff with others...but if I have AGREED NOT TO, then I would be breaking an agreement, and that is wrong. The whole "it should go without saying" thing... That is bogus. Not everyone is the same. You may have been brought up to hide your "dirty laundry" but so what if she was brought up to air it, that doesn't make you right or her wrong or vice versa. Means either you aren't communicating your needs and even giving her a chance to understand and abide...or else she cannot meet that need at all and you have a compatibility issue.

In a way I always talk to my partner about insecurities that I have, though it isn't always verbally and face-to-face. I am sometimes awkward in expressing sensitive things out loud. So I write. And write, and write. And my Zen knows about my blog and keeps an eye on it. And sometimes I send him messages or emails, if I need to be more direct just to him. He has come to understand that my insecurities are not what I'd consider problems he needs to fix or wrongs he has done me, but rather my own internal stuff to process. He is willing to help, or just be supportive as I work it out myself.
 
Last edited:

CTF

Member
I don't agree that even gossip is inherently wrong. I share all sorts of stuff. With all sorts of people. About anybody I want.

If I have a secret, I learned a LONG time ago, that the keeping of it is MY burden to bear. Should I decide to share it with anyone, anytime, then I am sharing the burden of it. If I expect them to carry that burden, and then not relieve themselves to anyone else, then I should probably say so up front, and ask them if they are willing. I've got to consider that it is a risk. Humans are highly social animals and frankly just not that great at keeping secrets. If you tell ANYONE then you are opening yourself up to some risk that your secret is no longer secure. And you should never assume that someone in a tight relationship will keep your secret from their own partners, either. If you have told one, assume you have told both (or however many are in the 'ship, as it were.)

The very very few things that I consider to be truly secret, I have told to NO ONE and in fact I do my best not to even contemplate them myself. I have as best as I could, excised them from my reality and my thinking, and I will take them to my grave.

The ones that are merely very sensitive information that I am particular about who finds out, I tell people in very disconnected social bubbles. If I didn't want anyone locally close to me, to know something, and yet needed to discuss it, I'd call my Mom. She lives in the middle of nowhere and she doesn't talk to anybody much. I have taken a calculated risk, which I deemed low.

But I also disclose to my partners that while I am capable of keeping a secret or a confidence, it is NOT my default mode. They need to communicate the need to me, or it's highly likely I won't do it. They get to consent to be in a relationship with someone who has that in their nature, or not. I had one partner when I was actively poly who was beginning to have issues with my "put it all on blast; live out loud" ways, being a far more private individual, and frankly it's one of the biggest reasons I had the sense that our relationship might not work out in the long run and maybe that was for the best. He could have asked me to not talk about him, and I would have respected that, but he never did.

This, like everything, is about negotiation. CTF, have you talked to your wife about this? Maybe you could arrive at some sort of negotiated middle ground where you can structure a time for talks in confidence and explain a need for her to not repeat what you say while under the aegis of "private talk time." It can be harmful to a relationship when you don't feel safe being vulnerable to your partner. Just going on like that can build some serious walls that are tough to live in.

I don't consider it an act of base objective wrongdoing to share my partner's personal stuff with others...but if I have AGREED NOT TO, then I would be breaking an agreement, and that is wrong. The whole "it should go without saying" thing... That is bogus. Not everyone is the same. You may have been brought up to hide your "dirty laundry" but so what if she was brought up to air it, that doesn't make you right or her wrong or vice versa. Means either you aren't communicating your needs and even giving her a chance to understand and abide...or else she cannot meet that need at all and you have a compatibility issue.

In a way I always talk to my partner about insecurities that I have, though it isn't always verbally and face-to-face. I am sometimes awkward in expressing sensitive things out loud. So I write. And write, and write. And my Zen knows about my blog and keeps an eye on it. And sometimes I send him messages or emails, if I need to be more direct just to him. He has come to understand that my insecurities are not what I'd consider problems he needs to fix or wrongs he has done me, but rather my own internal stuff to process. He is willing to help, or just be supportive as I work it out myself.

We've been married for 18 years, and have known each other for 23. Of course we've had conversations about privacy.

While I do recognize that some people were raised to be more open then others, it really has nothing to do with this. Some people don't air their dirty laundry, some do... but under NO circumstances, is it appropriate to air someone else's dirty laundry without their consent. While I get that some were raised differently, I've always looked at it this way. If someone tells me something personal about themself, they're only telling ME. If the next door neighbor is meant to know, he/she will tell them, or at least tell me if it's ok to say anything. It's flat out disrespectful to assume that just because you weren't specifically asked not to say anything, that it's fair game to do so.
 
Top