If I'm wrong, let me know

ate2007

New member
Hello, Everyone! Happy Monday! Hope everyone's day is going well thus far. SO I do have a question that you awesome and lovely people might have an answer to.

Has anyone experienced being able to date one sex but not the other? I'm sure the forum is probably full of these type of situations but I'm trying to understand and truly grasp the root of the issue.

Prime example: My husband says I'm allowed to date women but not men (I am bisexual, btw). A little back story - my husband has always known about my bisexuality. He does not mind me having a girlfriend at all (even if he doesn't have a gf of his own).

My bestie says that since I'm allowed to date outside the marriage so should my husband.

My hangup is this - that is fine and dandy - but if I am not allowed to date men AND women as I please but he can all the women he can/wants? Essentially, he has no restrictions while because I'm bi - I'm limited to dating women only. I don't think it's right or fair.



Am I looking at this the wrong way? Please let me know if I am because I more than willing to change my outlook and way of thinking. Maybe I am being a little b^$@!. If I am, I can own that. Just please don't be too mean if this is a ignorant/silly/dumb/foolish question. My apologies in advance if it is. IDK who else to ask. I don't have any poly or bi friends.

Thanks in advances for your replies!
 

Magdlyn

Active member
Honey, you aren't alone and you aren't a bitch. My own ex h tried to impose the One Penis Policy on me when we first opened.

It is extremely common for men to "allow their" woman to only date other women, and feel very threatened when she wants to date another guy. Do a search here for One Penis Policy or OPP.

2 women together is HAWT. Of course no other woman could steal away "my" woman. The sex they have isn't even real! But another guy? Surely he has a bigger harder cock, more stamina, more hair on his head, a bigger car, house, better job, is taller, whatever, and my little woman will be stolen away tout de suite!
 

Bluebird

Active member
OPPs are bullshit. Especially if he's dating the opposite sex.
 

Dagferi

Active member

kdt26417

Official Greeter
Hi ate2007,

Fair is fair. If you're allowed to date all the women you want, he should be allowed to date all the men he wants. ;)

Nobutseriously. The right answer here is for him to lift the OPP. Then you probably won't mind giving him your blessing for him to date.

Regards,
Kevin T.
 

GalaGirl

Active member
Sounds like you guys could talk more. I think you could ask him what the obstacles are, and if that is a soft limit or a hard limit.

My husband says I'm allowed to date women but not men

Is that a soft limit that could change over time, or a hard limit that will never change?

Maybe he is ok with the dating females to start for the first X weeks/months because they have equipment he does not have.
They offer you a different dating/sex experience than he can offer you. Maybe he's thinking "It's not even a competition there. I don't even have that equipment to compete with." He can get used to poly-relating without extra "fear that I cannot compete" baggage on top.

But a man would have his same equipment. And if he's dealing with "fear I won't measure up" baggage, to be dealing with that AND new to poly-relating stuff -- is too much stuff at once for him? Is that his reasoning why he's open to one gender but not the other? :confused:

I could see asking you to avoid dating certain specific "messy people" -- like please do not date my mother, sister, my boss, our kid's teacher, etc. Because people like that can lead to strange dynamics. If you dated his boss, and you and the boss fight, he doesn't need the boss taking it out on him at work passive aggressively. YKWIM?

But cutting out half the population in general? That's not reasonable.

What IS his reasoning?

He fears poly hell stuff?

He fears losing a valued place in your life?

Something else poking the fear button?

Galagirl
 
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reflections

New member
Fair is fair. If you're allowed to date all the women you want, he should be allowed to date all the men he wants. ;)

LOL, Kevin, this is a perfect analogy. Love it!

I would talk to your partner about what makes you dating a man so difficult, yet dating a woman less threatening, from his perspective. And see if he's willing to explore this deeper and do some inner growth around it. It's something that comes up SO often on this forum, so know that you are definitely not alone. And I would never be able to handle a OPP from either of my partners - while I identify as bi, I don't look for partners based on their anatomy.

Keep us posted how conversations with your partner go, and we can continue to provide support! :)
 

ate2007

New member
Thanks everyone! I already know his hang ups as we have discussed this previously- it's all penis and sex related. Oh his penis might be bigger, or thicker or he might last longer, etc. I told him - that's like me saying - oh you can't date other women because their boobs might be bigger or perkier, or their vaginas might tighter or they might be able to deep throat longer..wtfe...

And yes, if he would just agree to both sexes, he could do his own thing.
 

GalaGirl

Active member
Ah. So it is all about the fear he won't measure up. Have you asked him what besides his penis holds you two together as a couple? He doesn't bring anything else of value to the shared relationship? Does he value himself only as his penis?
Is this collection of self-limiting beliefs something he's willing to work on letting GO? Or not?

At this time his offer for opening up is

"You date women only. I don't date anyone."​

You can counter offer.

"I am not up for that as a hard limit. I might be up for that as a soft limit, but in X time I want to be at "I date who I want to date of either gender." I want to know you are going to work on your stuff in that time.

You can date who you want to date. If you do not want to exercise that and prefer not to date, that is up to you."​

Talk it out. Maybe these sheets help in the talking.

But if it boils down to him wanting to stay Closed and you wanting to Open... and neither is willing to give up their want? It may only be solved by breaking up so you each can have what you want. Just not with each other because the wants are mutually exclusive. Hard to feel, but pretty straight up.

I'm sorry I cannot think of anything else. :eek:

Galagirl
 
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reflections

New member
Then I think it is a matter of what GalaGirl said - soft limit or hard limit. Is he willing to do reading on polyamory? (More Than Two is a great resource). Is he willing to talk with a poly-friendly counselor about his concerns? Is he willing to come on here and talk it out on the forum?

He's certainly not the first guy to have these concerns, so I'm guessing a thread search on the forum might help him find another male poster who he can relate to and understand how that man worked through his concerns.

Best of luck!
 

Inyourendo

New member
Yep. Its very common that the man doesn't want another man's penis soiling "his property " and don't find women threatening ie they don't fear that a woman could steal their woman away.

If your husband wants to date people of his choosing then you should be able to as well. Imo being a married man and finding a woman to date is a heck of a lot easier than being a married women finding a woman to date that doesn't expect the husband to join.
 

graviton

New member
I'm going to give you a different point of view

You thus far have been able to explore your bisexuality with very little hurt feelings or drama in your relationship. You have been able to enjoy the best of all worlds, namely having both a male and female lover. It does not sound like your husband has had any need to start relationships of his own. He is comfortable in monogamy and having you explore your bisexuality. Your friend says he should be able to date, and you CLAIM to not have a problem with that (if that is true still remains to be seen). This offer of him being able to date others is not something that he requested and in some ways is being "given" in a very selfish sense. It is being given not because he needs it or has requested it, but because you are using it as bait to call him out on an inevitable double standard where you want to date men and KNOW he will take issue with this.

A lot of people on this site (men and women) take a dim view of the one penis policy because of the inevitable insecurities, sexism, and fragile egos that are inherently attached to it. Pretty much every post on this topic will have people lambasting your husband for it. These are people that have psychologically been ABLE and WILLING to work through the issues of sharing their partner with members of any gender they choose. This is no small feat and can be very difficult, thus the people on this forum are truly exceptional at handling their emotions and defying societal expectations of what a romantic relationship should be.

However because of this they are blind to the MASSIVE problem many men have with sharing their partner with another man. To name a few of the things they have to get over
1. sole ownership of their woman
2. the yuck factor of another penis and semen "spoiling" the sanctity of your body
3. homophobia
4. being taken for cuckold
5. societal expectations that a man should fight and ward off other men treading on their turf

I realize that a lot of these sound childish and cause many here to roll their eyes but it doesn't change the fact that these are VERY POWERFUL social mores that men have been raised with since birth. They are in many ways the very foundation upon which many men judge other men against and few men are willing to have their masculinity called into question.

So here is another view to take into account. Thus far you have not rocked the boat and your husband and you have found a comfortable way to explore polyamory with very little drama. In some sense you are being greedy, you want more. It is certainly within your right to want more and request the ability to see other men. Doing this however will open up a can of worms that will change your marriage permanently. Maybe for the better, but likely for the worse. You will be tipping over the apple cart when you ask your husband for this. He doesn't seem to be all that interested in poly on his end so offering it to him so that you can then open the discussion to seeing men seems underhanded. In order for this to be successful your husband will need to embrace the concept of you loving anyone you wish with joy. If he does it begrudgingly because he is afraid he will lose you then your marriage will be in very deep trouble. He will need the appropriate motivation to become comfortable with such a request, and let me tell you very few men are interested in doing the kind of work that will be required on an emotional level to accept this. Sometimes it is better to be happy with "good enough". I know that human nature generally pushes us to want it all and want it now, but sometimes its useful to see the present for what it is and be thankful for what we have. As your marriage stands now, you have more than most married women who are interested in exploring their bisexuality. Have you thought that maybe the reason he doesn't date other women is precisely because he is afraid you will push for dating men?

By the way, I was your husband and my wife was you. My wife got greedy and completely upended our marriage as a result, admittedly her greed extended into cheating which started the war between us. We hovered at the brink of divorce. Neither one of us practice poly anymore and there are still scars that both of us have as a result. I am more comfortable now and certainly have changed in my views on the OPP, but its pointless now since we have both sworn off poly for the forseeable future. In my view the knowledge that I have gained was not worth the heartache and damage to our marriage.
 
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GreenAcres

New member
However because of this they are blind to the MASSIVE problem many men have with sharing their partner with another man. To name a few of the things they have to get over
1. sole ownership of their woman
2. the yuck factor of another penis and semen "spoiling" the sanctity of your body
3. homophobia
4. being taken for cuckold
5. societal expectations that a man should fight and ward off other men treading on their turf

I realize that a lot of these sound childish and cause many here to roll their eyes but it doesn't change the fact that these are VERY POWERFUL social mores that men have been raised with since birth. They are in many ways the very foundation upon which many men judge other men against and few men are willing to have their masculinity called into question.

I do understand what you're saying, and yes, social mores can, indeed, be very powerful. I have to say, though, that reading it and being reminded that so many men see women this way--as property, as though their inherent value is what they allow between their legs, and that men's value lies in marking their territory and chasing off other males--made me throw up in my mouth a little bit. I don't date men who are like this, because I frankly consider them little better than boys, and I date adults. Of course, these attitudes are probably also why I rarely date men at all, and gravitate heavily towards women.

I wouldn't be "grateful" I was "allowed" to explore my bisexuality in this situation. No one should be "grateful" they're viewed as property. Honestly, marriage to a person who thought of me like that is not something I would want to keep, though I realize many people don't feel that way. Whether I chose to be monogamous (and I have been in mongamous relationships because I am happy in a variety of configurations) or poly, I wouldn't be with anyone who had these views, or who wasn't very seriously willing to try and work through them (though, honestly, I'd probably still not get romantically involved with them until/unless their viewpoints changed). Because it's not about whether I chose to sleep with someone else or not, it's about how I am viewed: I am person, I own my sexuality and my body. I am not property. If I chose to be monogamous with my partner, it's because it's what works for me, and for us.

So, I say, don't be grateful that a partner sees you as property, but allows his property certain things within rules he sets based on that view. Rather, I say, talk to the partner about why he feels the way he does, and on him being able to see his partner as a person with control over their own sexuality and life, regardless of whether or not they end up having an open/poly marriage.
 

graviton

New member
I'm sure you well know that women hold the same view of ownership over their husbands. Society ingrains it into us from a very early age that marriage is ownership to some extent. obviously it is skewed more towards patriarchy but you can't deny that romantic relationships cause feelings of ownership over partners in our society. You (Greenacres) and most others on this board need to be reminded that you are the exception and not the norm. A logical extension of poly is relationship anarchy, yet few people on this board are willing to take the work necessary to become relationship anarchists. RA completely removes any notion of control or ownership over our lovers and friends, something that many poly people aren't willing to do as evidenced by the frequent complaints of one partner having "too many" lovers or "too much" NSA sex. I would argue that making the leap from mono to poly is probably just as hard as going from poly to RA.
 
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GreenAcres

New member
Actually, I don't need to be reminded that those of us who don't view relationships, and people, like that aren't the norm. I'm incredibly aware of it, as, I suspect, are most of the others on this board. That doesn't make the view that people are property (in either direction) healthy, or one that should be encouraged or accepted simply because it's commonplace.

One needn't be poly or open to understand that a person's agency is their own. As a society, we've made strides towards that (not that long ago, a man raping his wife was perfectly legal, and pretty much expected--so, change is happening), but the harm it does to our society is still very real.
 

Magdlyn

Active member
I'm sure you well know that women hold the same view of ownership over their husbands. Society ingrains it into us from a very early age that marriage is ownership to some extent. obviously it is skewed more towards patriarchy but you can't deny that romantic relationships cause feelings of ownership over partners in our society. You (Greenacres) and most others on this board need to be reminded that you are the exception and not the norm.

You mean, you feel the need to remind us because you failed at polyamory.

A logical extension of poly is relationship anarchy, yet few people on this board are willing to take the work necessary to become relationship anarchists. RA completely removes any notion of control or ownership over our lovers and friends, something that many poly people aren't willing to do as evidenced by the frequent complaints of one partner having "too many" lovers or "too much" NSA sex.

There can be objections to a partner having too many other partners or too much NRE sex other than a concept of ownership of said promiscuous partner's body! In my experience, people who are extremely promiscuous are not poly at all. They are not truly loving anyone, they are using other people as sex objects or attention supply in a very shallow manner. This isn't relationship anarchy at all. It's merely rather selfish, or sick, or immature, or narcissistic, or some other personality disorder, and it is sad.

It has nothing to do with the OP, in any case.
 

Marcus

New member
My husband says I'm allowed to date women but not men

Not to put too fine a point on it, but that's entirely on you. He's not your master (unless this is a D/s topic and I missed that clue *again*) and he doesn't get to tell you what you're *allowed* to do any more than you get to tell him what he's *allowed* to do. If you don't like the agreement as it is currently laid out then change it. If you want to change it with elaborate negotiations, time frames, tit-for-tat agreements, DADT bargains or whatever goof-ball bargaining tactics your relationship might employ then have at it... but it's still your agreement.

Do I, personally think it's reasonable that one person should tell another person who they can and can't date? Absolutely not. However, I'm a perfect stranger on the internet so I doubt that really adds much to the greater landscape of your decision making process. You've asked the question and clearly you have already decided that you don't like the agreement you've made... now you just need to decide whether or not you are going to take action.
 

nycindie

New member
Ate2007, you are in charge of your sexuality, your body, and your life. Your husband is a partner, not your boss or owner. He doesn't own your pussy and has no authority over you. You are a full-grown adult and the only person who allows you to live your life as you see fit is YOU. All he can do is accept whether or not he wants to continue being in a relationship with you if you choose to live your life in a way that he doesn't like. But your life is your own. You want to fuck men as well as women, it's up to you and no one else. Time to grow a backbone.
 
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graviton

New member
You mean, you feel the need to remind us because you failed at polyamory.



There can be objections to a partner having too many other partners or too much NRE sex other than a concept of ownership of said promiscuous partner's body! In my experience, people who are extremely promiscuous are not poly at all. They are not truly loving anyone, they are using other people as sex objects or attention supply in a very shallow manner. This isn't relationship anarchy at all. It's merely rather selfish, or sick, or immature, or narcissistic, or some other personality disorder, and it is sad.

It has nothing to do with the OP, in any case.

The same judgments you are making on "too much nre sex" and promiscuity are the same judgments that get leveled at polyamorous people in general. Who are you to decide what is "truly loving?". Yes there may be narcissism but I argue that all romantic relationships are narcissistic to some degree. And no I felt the need to remind you that the board members are the exception not the rule because I feel that in general the people here are quite insightful and have a lot to offer but sometimes forget or have never had to deal with how hard certain aspects of poly can be. I don't see how my " failure " at poly (judgmental much?) should be used as something to beat me with. Instead the OP should see it as a caution. Every one of you damn well knows that this is a can of worms she is about to open in her marriage that cannot be closed, and that MANY people fail at. This board is littered with similar stories and damaged relationships. I'm simply giving her another perspective because the "you go girl" and "nobody tells me what to do with my body" perspective is usually well represented on this forum.
 

Magdlyn

Active member
I don't see how my " failure " at poly (judgmental much?) should be used as something to beat me with. Instead the OP should see it as a caution. Every one of you damn well knows that this is a can of worms she is about to open in her marriage that cannot be closed, and that MANY people fail at. This board is littered with similar stories and damaged relationships. I'm simply giving her another perspective because the "you go girl" and "nobody tells me what to do with my body" perspective is usually well represented on this forum.

OK, so you are the self-appointed monogamous devil's advocate voice on the Polyamory.com forum? I am not sure we need one. Those attitudes are everywhere, and are outmoded and patriarchal. If feminists want to change society's attitudes, we know full well what we are up against without your voice reminding us in a tiresome fashion.

But, it's a free country, dear, so "you go girl.":rolleyes:
 
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