Not Coping Well With Others

K

KC43

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Okay, so not a very clear thread title. I was trying to make it relevant without being wicked long...The *post* is wicked long, so there's a tl/dr at the end.

I'm aware that my emotions in this situation might be caused by, or causing, irrational thoughts. I'm also aware that I'm probably being a bit hypocritical, and that some of the problem is caused by my mental health issues and the baggage I haven't managed to unload yet from my last relationship. But knowing things doesn't always mean knowing what to do about them, and I could use some advice here.

I've known Woody for two months now. We've been involved for about a month and a half. On his OKC profile at the time I first contacted him, he mentioned having a partner who had moved "farther away" with her husband. I interpreted that--apparently incorrectly--to mean he didn't see her frequently. And since she was the only partner he mentioned on his profile, I assumed--also incorrectly--that she was the only one he had.

Fast forward to November 10, when he finally got around to telling me he and Highlight were involved. Over subsequent weeks, I learned his "farther away" partner, Stella, really isn't that far away, and he sees her about once a week schedules permitting. At the time he told me about Highlight, he said he started seeing her around the same time as me, but he told me over this past weekend that he started talking to her back in December of last year and met her for the first time in June of this year.

Here's where I'm struggling with a few things.

First, I feel like he wasn't fully honest with me about Highlight.

Second, some of the things he's said about Highlight, and the way he's said them (tone of voice and facial expression), lead me to believe he's putting more priority on their relationship than on his and Stella's or his and mine. This, again, may be entirely my wonked-up perception. He insists that he doesn't do hierarchy, that the only way a partner would have any higher priority at all would be if she lived with him. He insists that he loves Highlight and me equally and we're equally important to him.

Third, the big thing that contributes to the other two. I have not previously had a partner who had other partners, other than one FWB I saw for about a month. And I didn't *want* a partner who had other partners. This is the part that's arguably hypocritical, since obviously *I* have more than one partner.

I contacted Woody initially because even though his profile said he had another partner, I interpreted his phrasing to mean he saw her rarely if at all. I figured I could deal with that, because I wouldn't feel like I had to compete for his time and attention. If I had known Woody was involved with Highlight, or even that he sees Stella as often as he does, I wouldn't have gotten involved with him. But by the time I found out, we were already involved

I could have walked away when I found out the truth, but I wanted to try to become more comfortable with it. So far, I'm failing spectacularly at that. Woody is a good person, and he has been good for me, but I constantly fear that he's only tolerating me because I'm the one who's most available to get together with him. That if he finds another partner, I'll lose what I have because I'm not important enough to keep around. I don't believe him when he says I'm as important to him and he loves me as much as his other partners. When I'm with him, usually everything's good. When I'm not, I keep crying and wanting to break up with him because this is too hard and I don't know if the benefit is worth the cost.

I keep thinking I should be okay with it. I should be able to handle Woody having other partners. I should be confident enough to believe I matter to him as much as they do. But that isn't how it is. I've been honest with him that I'm feeling this way, but that's making it worse because on top of the other fears, I fear that he's going to get sick of the bullshit if I can't wrap my head around it soon.

tl/dr: How can I better handle being involved with someone who has other partners, when I'm having trouble believing him when he says there's no hierarchy or disparity in his feelings for us? Or should I stop wasting my time and his?
 
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KC, it really is ok that you're still struggling. Getting use to other partners isn't easy and it doesn't happen over night. I've been with Blue about 2 years. He's had other partners from the beginning....and I still struggle sometimes. Especially when my anxiety is high for other reasons (and holiday season is a stressor for most of us!). Also that whole HALT thing (hungry, angry, lonely, tired), I'd add sick, grieving, etc. Generally speaking though, it's much, much easier now than it was at first. I'd suggest throwing out all expectations of how quickly you should adjust and what that adjustment should look like...It takes time. Instead of placing expectations on yourself, just acknowledge that it will take time, you will feel anxious and insecure sometimes, those feelings will pass! Be gentle on yourself :) I like to remind myself that FEELINGS ARE NOT FACTS :)

As far as Woody being dishonest... Prior to him telling you about Highlight, did you have a conversation where you explicitly asked him how many partners he had? If you didn't, then I'm not sure that I'd agree that he was being dishonest... Also, 'talking to on OKC' does not equate to 'seeing', in my opinion. If he started seeing Highlight and you both during the summer, then that could be considered 'around the same' time, in my opinion.

Just my honest but gentle opinion, I think you're overreacting. And, I totally get it! I do the same. I enjoy reading your blog...my opinion (from reading that) is that Woody is good for you. And, stretching yourself by being open to a partner with other partners, is a good thing! It just takes time :)

ETA: Maybe focus on where you have made progress? You went to Karaoke night with Woody and Highlight...and you did great! I think you're making awesome progress and you're really stretching yourself! :)
 
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Try looking at it the other way. How do you think he feels about you having a husband and the natural entanglements that go along with that? When you tell him you love him or what he means to you do you think in the back of his mind he's comparing himself to your husband? I personally think it's okay that he may have something a little more serious or just different with another person just like you have something a little more serious or different with your husband. I also know that logically knowing that and emotionally knowing that are 2 completely different things.
 
I am sorry you struggle. I would end it. You are not happy there.

In your shoes with your anxiety and mental health things? And reading older posts of yours?

I'd go for brief and stop "evaluating" so much. Def stop with the "should" thinking. Because too much ruminating can send you into trigger and retrigger mode. Just do a quick tally. If I did it it looks like this to me:

YOUR CURRENT STANDARD

  • You prefer dating partners who do not have other partners.
  • You prefer not to feel like you have to compete for time and attention.
  • Unspoken: You prefer your partner's talk and walk match. Not say one thing, do another.

WOODY

  • Woody comes with other partners.
  • He says one thing (he says there's no hierarchy or disparity in his feelings for us. he says Highlight and I are equally important to him.)
  • But does another. (he makes concessions and allowances for Highlight that he doesn't for me or Stella.)

YOUR BEHAVIOR

  • In his profile, Woody doesn't make the cut.You take up with him anyway. You chose to override your standard.
  • When you learned his background includes Stella AND Highlight, you acknowledge you could have ended it then. But you chose not to. You chose to override your standard.
  • You are 6 weeks in. It's not that long. Yet you keep crying and wanting to break up with him because this is too hard and you don't know if the benefit is worth the cost. You are miserable when he's not around. THIS loud an emotional price tag on so short a time? More than you can afford to pay as an mental health and anxiety patient. This situation is not healthy for you. Get out.

How are you supposed to grow confident and trust yourself when you keep overriding your own stuff? :(

Instead of calling yourself names like "hypocrite" how about just accepting your preferences and standards as being what they need to be to help keep your conditions in check so you can poly without triggering your health stuff? :confused:

SUGGESTED SHORT TERM SOLUTION

  • Stop dating Woody. Friends maybe. Dating, nope.
  • Wait for feelings to catch up to this new behavior. See if you feel better over time.
LONG TERM SUGGESTIONS

  • Since you live with anxiety and other stuff? Keep things easier on you. Don't ADD to your mental health load by ignoring your preferences, standards, and limitations. We all have these things to various degrees. Work with your grain and not against it.

  • Take more time in between break ups. I wonder if you weren't quite done processing S2 when you started with Woody?
  • Vet potentials more carefully. Ask clarifying questions first BEFORE taking up with them. After the initial trial dating period, more firm and more decisive if a potential does not meet your standard after all.
  • Accept that it is a part of dating that not everyone you date will make the cut. Don't keep investing if it just isn't a runner for you any more.

Galagirl
 
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PinkPig said:
KC, it really is ok that you're still struggling. Getting use to other partners isn't easy and it doesn't happen over night. I've been with Blue about 2 years. He's had other partners from the beginning....and I still struggle sometimes. Especially when my anxiety is high for other reasons (and holiday season is a stressor for most of us!). Also that whole HALT thing (hungry, angry, lonely, tired), I'd add sick, grieving, etc. Generally speaking though, it's much, much easier now than it was at first. I'd suggest throwing out all expectations of how quickly you should adjust and what that adjustment should look like...It takes time. Instead of placing expectations on yourself, just acknowledge that it will take time, you will feel anxious and insecure sometimes, those feelings will pass! Be gentle on yourself :) I like to remind myself that FEELINGS ARE NOT FACTS :)

As far as Woody being dishonest... Prior to him telling you about Highlight, did you have a conversation where you explicitly asked him how many partners he had? If you didn't, then I'm not sure that I'd agree that he was being dishonest... Also, 'talking to on OKC' does not equate to 'seeing', in my opinion. If he started seeing Highlight and you both during the summer, then that could be considered 'around the same' time, in my opinion.

Just my honest but gentle opinion, I think you're overreacting. And, I totally get it! I do the same. I enjoy reading your blog...my opinion (from reading that) is that Woody is good for you. And, stretching yourself by being open to a partner with other partners, is a good thing! It just takes time :)

ETA: Maybe focus on where you have made progress? You went to Karaoke night with Woody and Highlight...and you did great! I think you're making awesome progress and you're really stretching yourself! :)
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Thanks. I constantly remind myself that how I feel, or how I perceive things, isn't necessarily reality.

I didn't ask him if he had any other partners, because I assumed he would tell me if he did. When he finally told me about Highlight and I asked why I was only just then finding out, he admitted that he always tells new partners about existing partners and that it was an oversight with me. He admitted he was wrong not to have made sure I knew. And he didn't start seeing me this summer; we met Oct. 6 and became "more than friends" Oct. 30, whereas he met Highlight in June, though I don't know when they decided they were actually involved with each other. But also... I didn't say he *was* dishonest. I said I *feel like* he was.

I have made progress, which is why I say he's good for me, but it's coming at the cost of a lot of pain and crying on my part, and I don't know whether it's growing pains or a sign that I'm just plain not capable of handling this.
 
WhatToDo said:
Try looking at it the other way. How do you think he feels about you having a husband and the natural entanglements that go along with that? When you tell him you love him or what he means to you do you think in the back of his mind he's comparing himself to your husband? I personally think it's okay that he may have something a little more serious or just different with another person just like you have something a little more serious or different with your husband. I also know that logically knowing that and emotionally knowing that are 2 completely different things.
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Woody is the king of compersion... he says he loves it when his partners have other partners who also make them happy, and said he spent 4 years trying to persuade Stella to find another partner because he wanted her to be happier than he believed she was with only him. Based on what Woody's said, I think the only aspect of Hubby being in my life that registers on him at all is that Hubby's someone else that takes care of me.

But I don't have something more serious with Hubby. I have a husband who generally prefers to spend time alone, and occasionally spends time with me, never going out anywhere if he can help it. What I have with Hubby is different only in that I live with him, so he's more entangled in my life. Highlight is also married (so is Stella, for that matter), so if the situation I'm struggling with has anything to do with me being married, or if me having a husband justifies Woody appearing to be playing favorites with Highlight, how does that make sense when she has a husband as well?
 
KC43 said:
He admitted he was wrong not to have made sure I knew. And he didn't start seeing me this summer; we met Oct. 6 and became "more than friends" Oct. 30, whereas he met Highlight in June, though I don't know when they decided they were actually involved with each other. But also... I didn't say he *was* dishonest. I said I *feel like* he was.

I have made progress, which is why I say he's good for me, but it's coming at the cost of a lot of pain and crying on my part, and I don't know whether it's growing pains or a sign that I'm just plain not capable of handling this.
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October and June are different. It could be an oversight...it could be faulty memory...or it could be intentional deception. Is this a pattern with him, or a one off? That's the question I'd be asking.

As for the pain and crying...I wouldn't look at it as an either/or. It could be a sign that this isn't the right relationship for you but I wouldn't take that to mean that it's a sign that you're not capable of handling a partner with another partner. Just may be this particular relationship and/or the timing of it.
 
KC43 said:
Woody is the king of compersion... he says he loves it when his partners have other partners who also make them happy, and said he spent 4 years trying to persuade Stella to find another partner because he wanted her to be happier than he believed she was with only him. Based on what Woody's said, I think the only aspect of Hubby being in my life that registers on him at all is that Hubby's someone else that takes care of me.

But I don't have something more serious with Hubby. I have a husband who generally prefers to spend time alone, and occasionally spends time with me, never going out anywhere if he can help it. What I have with Hubby is different only in that I live with him, so he's more entangled in my life. Highlight is also married (so is Stella, for that matter), so if the situation I'm struggling with has anything to do with me being married, or if me having a husband justifies Woody appearing to be playing favorites with Highlight, how does that make sense when she has a husband as well?
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I wasn't speaking about Highlight having a husband. I don't know how she feels about Woody having other partners, I only know how you say it makes you feel so I was just talking strictly in your case.

In the case of Highlight though is it at all possible that she is more up front in asking for what she wants than you and Stella are?
 
GalaGirl said:
I am sorry you struggle. I would end it. You are not happy there.

In your shoes with your anxiety and mental health things? And reading older posts of yours?

I'd go for brief and stop "evaluating" so much. Def stop with the "should" thinking. Because too much ruminating can send you into trigger and retrigger mode. Just do a quick tally. If I did it it looks like this to me:

YOUR CURRENT STANDARD

  • You prefer dating partners who do not have other partners.
  • You prefer not to feel like you have to compete for time and attention.
  • Unspoken: You prefer your partner's talk and walk match. Not say one thing, do another.

WOODY

  • Woody comes with other partners.
  • He says one thing (he says there's no hierarchy or disparity in his feelings for us. he says Highlight and I are equally important to him.)
  • But does another. (he makes concessions and allowances for Highlight that he doesn't for me or Stella.)

YOUR BEHAVIOR

  • In his profile, Woody doesn't make the cut.You take up with him anyway. You chose to override your standard.
  • When you learned his background includes Stella AND Highlight, you acknowledge you could have ended it then. But you chose not to. You chose to override your standard.
Click to expand...


  • I did override my own standard. I agree on that. I did so partly because at the time, it seemed easier to get involved with someone else who's polyamorous, instead of dealing with another mono guy who can't wrap his head around it, and because I hoped I would be able to handle it. Because it really does seem hypocritical to me that I have multiple partners but am not okay with a partner who does.

    I didn't end it with Woody when I found out about Highlight because I had started to care a lot about him and enjoy spending time with him, and again, I thought I would be able to handle this. But I'm not, so that may have been a mistake.

    [*]You are 6 weeks in. It's not that long. Yet you keep crying and wanting to break up with him because this is too hard and you don't know if the benefit is worth the cost. You are miserable when he's not around. THIS loud an emotional price tag on so short a time? More than you can afford to pay as an mental health and anxiety patient. This situation is not healthy for you. Get out.
    Click to expand...
How are you supposed to grow confident and trust yourself when you keep overriding your own stuff? :(

Instead of calling yourself names like "hypocrite" how about just accepting your preferences and standards as being what they need to be to help keep your conditions in check so you can poly without triggering your health stuff? :confused:
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I'm starting to think that even if I *am* polyamorous, and even though I'm not happy when I only have Hubby given that most of the time I feel like we're roommates seeing each other in passing, I probably shouldn't be doing this. My mental health issues aren't an excuse or a justification for anything. Either I handle my shit in a given situation, or I don't belong in that situation. So if I end things with Woody, I probably wouldn't continue to poly.

SUGGESTED SHORT TERM SOLUTION

  • Stop dating Woody. Friends maybe. Dating, nope.
  • Wait for feelings to catch up to this new behavior. See if you feel better over time.
Click to expand...

Friends, not a chance. Being around knowing he has other partners is hard when I'm one of his partners. Being around knowing he has other partners and I *was* one but now am not (hypothetically speaking) would suck ass, and I wouldn't waste time trying to be okay with that if I can't be okay with this.

LONG TERM SUGGESTIONS

  • Since you live with anxiety and other stuff? Keep things easier on you. Don't ADD to your mental health load by ignoring your preferences, standards, and limitations. We all have these things to various degrees. Work with your grain and not against it.
  • Take more time in between break ups. I wonder if you weren't quite done processing S2 when you started with Woody?
Click to expand...


  • There's no question I wasn't entirely over S2 when I met Woody. I'm *still* not entirely over S2. I've been honest with Woody about that as well.

    [*]Vet potentials more carefully. Ask clarifying questions first BEFORE taking up with them. After the initial trial dating period, more firm and more decisive if a potential does not meet your standard after all.

    [*]Accept that it is a part of dating that not everyone you date will make the cut. Don't keep investing if it just isn't a runner for you any more.
    Click to expand...
Galagirl
Click to expand...

Starting to think I need to just not date anymore ever...
 
PinkPig said:
October and June are different. It could be an oversight...it could be faulty memory...or it could be intentional deception. Is this a pattern with him, or a one off? That's the question I'd be asking.

As for the pain and crying...I wouldn't look at it as an either/or. It could be a sign that this isn't the right relationship for you but I wouldn't take that to mean that it's a sign that you're not capable of handling a partner with another partner. Just may be this particular relationship and/or the timing of it.
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I'm not aware of any intentional deception on his part, and I'm including this as not being *intentional* deception. It's tromping on my trust issues, which is why I'm having trouble with it.

The timing might be the biggest part, but when the issue about my partner having other partners is directly tied to me feeling "not good enough" or "less than", I don't think it's something that would change over time or with a different partner.

WhatToDo said:
I wasn't speaking about Highlight having a husband. I don't know how she feels about Woody having other partners, I only know how you say it makes you feel so I was just talking strictly in your case.

In the case of Highlight though is it at all possible that she is more up front in asking for what she wants than you and Stella are?
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I understand that, but you said it might be okay that he has something more serious with Highlight than with me because I have something more serious with Hubby... my point is, by that logic, she has something more serious with her husband as well, so I'm not seeing how that makes it okay for him to be more serious with her than with me. Highlight has asked for a couple of things that I know of... but I've asked for a couple of things as well, that have nothing to do with her or what she's asked for, and been shot down.
 
Starting to think I need to just not date anymore ever...
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I don't think that's the answer. Esp since when you are Closed with hubby you are not happy then either. :(

My mental health issues aren't an excuse or a justification for anything.
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Not an excuse to not live your life. But a reason to consider your life choices more carefully. If you walked with a cane with a lot of pain, you would probably not take up gymnastics. If you were deaf, you would probably have alternative door bell on the house and another the oven that also flashes the lights. If you live with a cat, you probably have to provide litter boxes.

You have anxiety and some mental health things to manage. You also have a "not good enough" thing to work to dispel. So find appropriate ways to manage and work through these things.

Learn to pace yourself so you don't self trigger by getting into situations that are too much to soon. Cultivate some resilience -- don't give up just because you are learning to fine tune your judgement calls and sometimes make a mistake. That is how people learn.

If you don't know what is realistic, check in with other people with what you are thinking to see if your thinking sounds realistic. Then try and see. Then adjust.

In this case? I suggest you end it with Woody, and this time give yourself more time post break up.

If what you want is to grow more comfortable with having a partner with another partner? Maybe you CAN deal with a far away partner. You have not tried that experience yet.

You went from 0 to 2 frequent fliers. You learned that kind of a leap was too much and too triggery. There's middle ground there though:

  • 1 LDR partner
  • 1 local partner
  • 1 LDR + 1 LDR partner
  • 1 LDR + 1 Local partner
  • 1 local + 1 local partner

I think it was taking on too much too soon from not vetting your potential thoroughly enough. Next time assume nothing. Be ACTIVE in your relating and ask about the things that concern you so the dating situations you get into are more your speed.

Galagirl
 
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Thanks, GalaGirl. I'm not happy when I'm closed with Hubby, true, but at least when he and I are closed, I only have one relationship in which I'm not happy, instead of not being happy in more than one. Or instead of manufacturing reasons to not be happy because I can't believe being happy is something that will last, which is at least partly what I'm doing in this case. And I don't worry about making someone else unhappy.

It is hard for me to be involved with Woody. I struggle when I'm not physically with him because when I'm with him, I *see* him being loving and kind and patient with me, and I see the way he looks at me. Seeing is believing. When I'm not with him, the other issues push the memories of those things aside and tell me "he won't look at you that way for long" and "he's going to lose patience eventually." While there are definitely factors with Woody that haven't been present in other relationships, I tend to hit this point 2-3 months into every relationship I've been in, where I think it won't last, so I should either end it or sabotage it because then I have control over it ending. I haven't actually *done* that in any relationship, because I've recognized the inaccuracy in my perceptions.

(That isn't to say you're wrong that I should end things with Woody. I'm thinking out loud.)

The not being sure what's realistic is why I posted this thread... What I'm feeling and perceiving can seem very real to *me*, but that doesn't mean it is real. I don't know if it's real that he's favoring Highlight, or that I don't matter as much as either of the others, or if that's me feeling like I'm not as good as her. I can only gauge the reality of those perceptions if I ask Woody, because he's the only one who really knows, but then I would still be struggling to *believe* him.
 
Granted I have little experience with anxiety and mental health issues... so keep that in mind, but I still think that Woody could continue to be good for you.

You've said yourself that the holidays are a trigger for you, and that hitting that 2-3 month mark is usually a time of self-sabatoge that you have to get through. The fact that you're at BOTH of those points now makes me wonder if you should delay any decision to terminate the relationship until those things have passed unless there was something blatant that truly merited a break-up (he purposefully disregarded a boundary, purposefully lied, etc.).

If you continually manufacture reasons not to be happy because you can't believe that something happy will last, how can you expect to overcome that unless you eventually push through that manufacturing and see it last? It seems like prematurely ending a relationship with someone who actually loves you, who you love, who currently wants to be supportive of you will only work to reinforce your thoughts that happy things can't last, when the goal should be to realize that happy things don't always last, but they CAN last. Or at the very least, maybe recognize that while unfortunately many happy things don't last, that doesn't mean that you shouldn't enjoy them while they make you happy.

Of course, some would say that you aren't happy because of all the stress and anxiety this is causing you, but when you're not self-sabatoging, LOOK HOW HAPPY YOU ARE! You truly enjoy spending time with Woody and through all your blog entries I feel like you actually ARE making progress.

The fact that you blog on here about things and ask these sort of questions makes me think that even when you're thinking you should end it, clearly some part of you is wanting people to say "KC, you're over-reacting and this is just the anxiety talking. You and Woody seem to be very well matched so try to enjoy that!"

I wonder if it would be useful to write down some things that you can read over when you're thinking like this? I mean, obviously you can always go back to your blog, but I guess I mean writing down specific comments that would combat some of your most common unhappy worries. If common one is whether he's honest about how he feels about you, then when you're in a good mood, write down some of the things that he does that you think help demonstrate that he does care about you just as much, so you can refer back to that.

Speaking of the "loving just as much" or "treating partners equally" issue... I understand that he doesn't do hierarchy, but realistically, no 2 people are identical (er... maybe identical twins?). I think it's reasonable for him to say and feel like he treats his partners equally, but maybe still like certain traits about one person more than another, or find certain activities more enjoyable with one partner over another. He may like something better with you than with one of the other ladies. He may like other things with them more than he does with you. That doesn't mean that overall he cares about any one of you more than the other. It just means that he loves each of you in your own way, because each relationship that he has is unique to the individuals in it.

It's also very different to talk TO someone you love than to talk ABOUT someone you love. I love Sudo but that doesn't mean I get all dreamy-eyed every time I'm having a conversation with him. EVEN when I'm looking at him and saying "I love you." But I know for a fact that TONS of people have told me that when I talk about him I just light up. So it may just be that when you're talking TO Woody, he's not having the same reaction like what you're seeing when he talks ABOUT Highlight to you. But he might have that same reaction when he talks about you to Highlight. It's just a different perspective.

Either way, I hope that you feel better about some of this stuff, no matter what you decide.
 
I definitely understand that equal doesn't mean same. That's how I look at it with my partners. Hubby isn't more important than Woody; Woody isn't more important than Hubby. I think I love Hubby and Woody the same *amount*... but not for the same *reasons*. I don't have any issue with the probability that Highlight and Stella each bring to Woody something I can't bring, because I recognize that I probably bring him something neither of them can. That's kind of the point of having multiple partners, at least in part; no one can bring a person everything they want or need in their life, so everyone brings something different to the table.

When I talk about equal in this situation, I mean not loving one of us more or less than another. I don't mean loving all of us in exactly the same way for exactly the same reasons. Does that make sense?

Thanks for your perspective, breathemusic :) It gives me another way to think about this... and that's a way that's closer to how I see things when I'm not tangled up in depression quicksand. I believe everyone that enters our lives does so for a reason; we learn something from everyone in our lives, whether or not we realize we're doing so. Going from that, I lean toward thinking one of the things I'm supposed to learn from being with Woody is to accept that I *am* "as good as" and "matter as much as" and that kind of thing. And also a continuation of the learning to trust that was begun with (and was derailed by) S2...
 
It is no fun that you're struggling with this... But I do think you've done an amazing job of using this as a chance to learn more about yourself. Whether you stay with Woody or not, you've already gained something from the relationship.

Just from reading this post (I may be missing some of the backstory) it sounds like you are hearing a lot about Woody's other relationships. Things he does with them, how he feels about them, etc. Would it help to hear less?

I don't normally feel any jealousy about Dag's wife. But if he and I spend two hours talking about her, or I'm hearing too many details, I can start making comparisons in my head. I've asked him to give me a "trigger warning" lol... If he wants to talk in depth about his wife that's fine, but he needs to give me a chance to get into the right headspace for it. I don't think I would deal well with a constant conversation about "Highlight and I did abc... Stella feels xyz"... Maybe one-on-one time could focus more on you and Woody, not other relationships?
 
I definitely get that your concern is more about him loving another partner more than you, vs HOW. I guess where I'm coming from is... how do you measure that? He says that he loves you all equally, so there is some action or some combination of HOWs that you're interpreting to mean that he loves them more, rather than taking his word for it. But on top of that those things that you're interpreting as him loving you less, he might interpret in a totally different way. I mean, if I ask you how you know that neither Hubby or Woody are more important than each other, on some level the real answer is sortof "well because I just know" or "because that's just how I feel." Unfortunately actions can mean all sorts of things to different people. So I'm just cautioning you to read to much into using them way of comparing levels of love.

Of course, I say that in the context of comparing with a fine tooth comb. Obviously if someone treats one partner like shit and the other one like gold, I think it's safe to say that actions are speaking quite loudly about how much one partner is loved vs the other. But the little nuances of expressions and the occasional comment are going to be way too in the details to be any sort of accurate "measuring tool" and trying to study it and work it out is only going to lead to more anxiety!

I hope that being with Woody so far HAS helped with some of those feelings and continues to. But another thing to keep in mind is that the way someone has treated you before isn't a reflection of your worth, or how the next person will treat you. We learn from history, trial and error, from being taught. Because of this it's hard not to compare people in our lives. But just remember that Woody isn't all of the people who have treated you poorly before. Does that guarantee that the relationship won't end, or that Woody will never do something shitty or upsetting to you? Nope. But if he ever does, it's not because other people before him have done it and that's just how life goes. They're independent people who take independent actions.

I feel like I'm being a bit convoluted and not really saying this well, but hopefully that all made some sense!
 
I used to struggle lots with feelings of 'not being enough'. When I was younger I felt strongly that I didn't matter enough to have anybody prioritise me. Nothing bad ever happened to me. I think it was a combination of being born with a tendency toward anxiety (or developing it as an infant) and having a much more demanding younger sibling arrive in the family when I was 18 months old and having that sibling suck up most of the time, energy and attention that my parents had previously given to me.

Those feelings gradually went away over a 7 year period of me remaining single. I realised in those years that I don't need to be anybody else's top priority. I'm my own priority and that is enough.

When I realised that, the voices in my mind that used to measure me against others and tell me I was lacking and that used to look at those close to me and tell me that they prioritised other people over me were silenced. Yes - I am lacking in many ways. It doesn't matter. Yes - lots of people that I love prioritise others over me. It doesn't matter.

Once I realised that, I could see how much I do matter to my friends, family and now my partner. I matter enormously to these people. For some I am crucial in their world and I do have priority. And even the ones for whom I am not the centre of their world I still matter. I realised that it isn't necessary that people feel the same amount of love in a different way for me as they do for others in their lives. They can love me less than some others in their lives and I'm still important to them.

Those close to me can even find somebody else, something else that is so much more important to them that I am squeezed from their life and still, I'm enough. The squeezing out is about that person finding something amazing for themselves, something they want or need. If it means they then have no time or energy for me, that decision is about them and not about me. I am still enough.

You are too.

Even if Woody fluid bonds with a partner who is not you. Even if it is true that he prioritises another partner over you.

You are still enough. You are still important. These things are not determined by Woody, by your husband or even by your children. You are important just for yourself. :D

IP
 
GirlfromTexlahoma, I'm not sure whether I think Woody is oversharing about either Highlight or Stella. His philosophy is that if it's something that affects his other partners (a date night, a partner needing more of his support than usual because of something in her life, the fact that he loves all three of us), he shares. If it's something that makes him especially happy (Highlight's gotten an unexpected kid-free night so he gets to see her, I helped him pick out his costume for an acting job he had), he might share. If he's having an issue with something to do with a partner, he might--only with their permission--ask the advice of another partner to get the perspective of another female. He's very careful not to give details or to say anything that might be taken as a comparison.

In other words, his level of sharing with me about them, or with either of them about me and the other, is essentially the same as my level of sharing with him about Hubby or Hubby about him. So I"m not sure whether that's part of the problem.

breathemusic, it's more about *my* issues than his behavior. The bullshit from my past gets dredged up sometimes and makes me believe that I'm less deserving of love, kindness, etc. than everyone else, which therefore makes me believe anyone who loves me will love me less than anyone else in their life. And I do know that Woody--and Hubby, and anyone else--isn't the people who treated me like shit in the past, but the people who treated me like shit outnumber--and were around longer--than the ones who treat me well, so sometimes it feels like the bad guys win over the good guys. Your post makes total sense, though.

Thanks, IP. I'm glad you've been able to reach that point. I hope someday I will. With me, the "you're not good enough" wasn't an internal thing; it was explicitly drilled into my head by my mother, grandmother, and ex-husband, and implicitly reinforced by a father who is incapable of showing or speaking any type of affection. I do realize I'm letting people from my past control my present, and I try not to let that happen, but even when I'm consciously contradicting them those voices are still in the part of my brain that's stuck back in childhood. It's a work in progress.
 
I brought some of this up with Woody tonight, phrased--truthfully--as a component of my depression.

He surprised me with some of his responses. He said he knows exactly how it feels to have irrational depression-y thoughts that others are better than you, or your loved one loves someone else more or whatever. He said he wants me to believe that I am important and valuable to him, solely for myself and the things I bring to the relationship, and he's going to keep trying to prove it until I believe it or until I give up.

I didn't get into everything I posted here (though I did tell him I posted here) because phone call. He actually asked if I wanted to go out to his place tonight to talk, but it was too late by my timeline (I usually go to bed at 9, and I wouldn't have even gotten to his place until almost 8), so we're going to talk more tomorrow, when I go out to his place for the usual Tuesday.

Which is good, because the depression that spawned some of this is lifting for the moment, so maybe I'll be a little more rational by tomorrow night.

I asked him what makes me unique in his life. He said I inspire him to push his boundaries and comfort zone (like singing karaoke the other night; he said even though he'd been sort of considering it, the only reason he did it was because I encouraged him), and that this is a tough time for him because it's his first holiday season without his wife, and I'm helping him with that more than I realize, just by being there. So at least for the moment, I believe I'm a benefit to him...
 
Glad you took action and have a time set to talk with him tomorrow. And that helped lift some of the depression-y thoughts.

Only you can determine how much you want to be investing here. Maybe the talk will help you figure it out?

Galagirl
 
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