partner and metamour getting married. not sure how I feel

karsa

New member
Hi there,

So I posted a thread a while back looking for advice on my failing poly relationship.
I am still with dh (we are not legally married but have been together for 16 years and have 2 children, a 4 yo and a new born) and his metamour is still living with us. She is from Germany and her visa expires in a few months so dh is planning to marry her so she can stay in the country. We are not religious people so marriage is not so important to us but whenever I think about them getting married I do not feel good about it.
Dh and I are still trying to work out our relationship and the poly relationship is still not at a good point. I understand the practical reasons for them marrying but I feel like it is yet another thing I am being forced to agree to when I dont feel good about it.
Last night we sat down and talked about the issues around the visa and them getting married. There are other visa options that metamour could look into but marriage is the easiest in dh's opinion and most permanent. When he first dropped the marriage bomb on me he said that he didn't think I would have a problem with it if the relationship was going well as we would want to do whatever it took to keep metamour in the country. I agree with him in theory, the problem is that the relationship is not great but he still wants me to be ok with this.
I am already worried that this poly relationship will never be what we had planned (equal closed triad) and that if that's the case dh and I will have to break up as he has made it clear that he only wants me to be poly with his gf, no one else. And sadly if I have to share him with another woman who is not also my partner I don't know that I will get enough out of the relationship to be happy and there is no option for me to "supplement" the love lost, from sharing, with a partner of my own.
I am really trying to make this work and get things to a good point where metamour and I can try to build a more intimate relationship but it feels like everytime things look like they could be stabilizing something new pops up to derail any progress.
I just don't know if my feelings about marriage are simply an emotional reaction which is coming from some bullshit insecurity or if I'm being totally reasonable abount not being comfortable with it.
Also, metamour told me today that she does not like the fact that I refer to dh as my husband as it makes her feel like their relationship is inferior to his and mine. I kind of get what she means but I don't think that it is a problem, just an insecurity on her part. If everything worked out with us I would eventually refer to her as my wife too but she sees these labels as a mono term, where I dont. I also think she thinks I use the term husband as a way to establish superiority over her which is not the case, it's just the easiest way to describe his and my relationship. Do you think it is a problem for me to refer to dh as my husband? And do you think it is fair that matamour expects me to stop calling him this because she is his gf and has been for a year? I wouldn't have a problem with her referring to him as her husband if they had been together for several years, had kids etc. I actually think I feel resentful that now that she is in the relationship I have to 'downplay' my relationship with dh.

Some advice from more experienced and emotionally un invested people would be appreciated.

Thanks
 

Inyourendo

New member
Well it sounds like now that she's marrying him and he's her legal husband she'll no longer have a reason to be upset with you calling him husband.

How does polyamory work with visa marriages? Are you going to move out? You can't lie and pretend that you and him don't have a relationship if you guys are investigatedy because you can get in big trouble. I would not participate in that deception.
 

reflections

New member
Hi karsa,

I'm sorry this has been so difficult for you. I skimmed through your old posts to get some more background information and had a few thoughts. And I mean all of this kindly, okay? :eek:

Like past posters have emphasized, I wonder if focusing on what YOU want and what YOUR behaviors are. You can't control your partner's behavior, or your metamour's. It seems clear that a triad is out of the question (though for some reason, you and your partner keep holding onto this idea??). He can decide to marry your metamour, for whatever reason he decides. But YOU can decide if you want to stay in a relationship with him.

I think it's completely unreasonable for him to expect a triad to happen. It's very rare that you and your partner would love someone "equally" and that that person would love you and your partner back "equally" (whatever "equally" means anyway.) In fact, the only successful triads I've heard about are ones that form naturally, with no expectations prior. It sounds like you get this, given your and your partner's history of triads that never actually work the way you hoped. I also think it's completely unreasonable for your partner to tell you you can't date anyone else. He doesn't own you - you have the choice to decide if you want to date others. Just like he then has the choice to decide if he wants to stay in the relationship with you.

Options:
- You stay with him. He decides whether or not to marry her (sounds likely). You decide to stay monogamous, at his request. You struggle with being in a polyamorous relationship where only he dates others. He may or may not try to work on things in your relationship with him.
- You stay with him. He marries or doesn't. You decide to date others. He decides if he wants to stay in a relationship where his partner has other partners. This is his decision.
- You leave. Get a lawyer, figure out kid stuff, figure out finances. You decide whether or not you want to be in a polyamorous relationship with others in the future. You decide he is a wonky partner for polyamory. You leave the stress and chaos of partner possibly marrying metamour (and like inyourendo said, the possibility of being investigated for a green card marriage). Maybe be able to show your children other healthy relationship models, rather than staying in an unhappy marriage.
- You stay and it turns into a triad. You all fall in love and live happily ever after. He works on prioritizing you, and you decide not to date anyone else. (You can see that this is a highly unlikely outcome. Nor does this sound like something you TRULY want, at least with this partner and with this metamour).

It's not up to you to decide if he marries her. It is up to you to decide what you want. And this seems to matter much more than whether she is uncomfortable by you calling him husband, IMHO. Take care.
 

Shanti

New member
This sounds so familiar to what I went through with my last gf. She was in NRE over a person she had just met and wanted to marry them for visa reasons. That was too much for me, since we were engaged to be married and had decided to be primaries to one another. So I left.

Sounds like you are putting up with a lot of behaviours you are unhappy with to stay in this relationship that's not meeting your needs.
 

Dagferi

Well-known member
Hi there,

I am already worried that this poly relationship will never be what we had planned (equal closed triad) and that if that's the case dh and I will have to break up as he has made it clear that he only wants me to be poly with his gf, no one else. And sadly if I have to share him with another woman who is not also my partner I don't know that I will get enough out of the relationship to be happy and there is no option for me to "supplement" the love lost, from sharing, with a partner of my own.

From this statement right here my advice is get out of this relationship and take steps to protect yourself NOW before they get married. You do realize that if they get married you have no legal protections. I am sure he has not done the legal steps needed to protect you and your children.

So he has instituted a One Penis Policy I see and has told you that it is his way or the highway. That should throw up a HUGE RED FLAG right there. Why does HE get to pick your sexual partners for you? WTH!

I see no chance in this ending well at all. They have given you no input into your own life. If there are other visa options why is marriage the path they are pursuing? Because it is easier. What about you? You know that she is going to probably have a bigger fit about you calling him your husband now. The difference is that she will now have law on her side. She will be entitled to HALF of everything he owns. I hope your name is on the house cars and etc. Why hasn't he legally married you in 16 years?
 

LoveBunny

Active member
So he's allowed to have two women, but you're NOT allowed to have two men, or a girlfriend of your own? Why on earth would you agree to that?

It rarely works out when a couple tries to "share" a girlfriend, emotions and attraction just don't work that way. Usually, one part of the triangle bonds better than the other. Sounds like you and the girlfriend aren't in love, and you should not be expected to have a relationship with her if you aren't really into it. Sounds like he's insisting on a closed triad between the three of you so he can maintain "control" of his women.

I would tell him that if he must marry her, you must be allowed to date others. Why are you letting him make all the decisions regarding your relationship(s) and your love life?
 

GalaGirl

Well-known member
I am sorry you struggle. You have several things going on there.

"Speak your truth." That would be my suggestion for all of the layers of problems.

Don't pretend to be happy with it or try to "get ok with it" or "ignore it" when you are just NOT ok with things. Address the behaviors and problem solve. Not avoid.


MARRAIGE PROBLEM

When he first dropped the marriage bomb on me he said that he didn't think I would have a problem with it if the relationship was going well as we would want to do whatever it took to keep metamour in the country. I agree with him in theory, the problem is that the relationship is not great but he still wants me to be ok with this.

So what's he doing in his behaviors to get the relationship with you to a good point? What would you like him to do at this time?

Or did he mean it like "He didn't think I would have a problem with it if his relationship with her was going well for him as we would want to do whatever it took to keep met amour in the country." And you are not a person of your own to him. You are an extension of him.

I just don't know if my feelings about marriage are simply an emotional reaction which is coming from some bullshit insecurity or if I'm being totally reasonable abount not being comfortable with it.

If he is railroading / rushing you into things you do not want? It is totally reasonable to balk and not feel happy about it! Put on the brakes and say NO. That is behavior YOU can do.

There are other choices for VISA. Or she goes back home and then applies again to come back.

This "false urgency" thing is not a good reason to get married to someone he has known only a year. JMHO.

The marriage VISA process and how it affects you -- something to think about too.

CLOSED TRIAD PROBLEM

I am already worried that this poly relationship will never be what we had planned (equal closed triad) and that if that's the case dh and I will have to break up as he has made it clear that he only wants me to be poly with his gf, no one else.

Do you want be able to see other people? Say so. "I can no longer keep the agreement that I am only poly with you and your GF. I do not want a triad. Since I want another partner, I plan to start seeing other people. Heads up."

He can think it over, and choose continue to participate in polyship with you in a new way or he can decline to participate and bow out.

SHARED VISION / WORKLOAD / NEEDS NOT MET PROBLEM

I am really trying to make this work and get things to a good point where metamour and I can try to build a more intimate relationship but it feels like everytime things look like they could be stabilizing something new pops up to derail any progress.

You alone cannot make this work. Your 100% is only ⅓ of the fuel for a 3 people thing to run. ALL players have to be willing to carry their part of the stick toward a shared vision. IS there a shared vision called "closed triad with them two legally married?"

To me it sounds like...
  • DH wants a closed triad married to her and nothing else

  • You are ok with triad it pans out but want to date others if it does not. You are not ok with him married to her.

  • GF is (?) sounding on triad. But may be playing along for now wanting any access to him or wanting the path to citizenship THROUGH marriage to him.

If this polyship is not meeting your needs, you talk with them to make them aware. If you find your poly partners are not willing to help meet your needs so you call can be together like changing the shape of the polyship so you can date others? OR if there are mutually exclusive things going on?

Rather than put more energy in it might be simpler to bow out. Accept this is not a runner.

I know that's easier said than done since you have custody issues to work out with the shared children. But sound like you are feeling stifled and put upon here.

Why choose to be in a box you do not want to be in that is sucking you dry? :(

Say NO.

METAMOUR NOT LIKING HOW YOU TALK PROBLEM

Also, metamour told me today that she does not like the fact that I refer to dh as my husband as it makes her feel like their relationship is inferior to his and mine.

Her stuff. Her feelings are hers to work through and manage. You are not doing something TO her by calling him "husband." What you call him is part of the (you + him) tier of relationship. If she called him "schmoopy" you might think it silly, but that is not your biz. That is part of the (him + her) relationship.

I feel resentful that now that she is in the relationship I have to 'downplay' my relationship with dh.

Who has asked you to? I just heard her say she felt yucky. I did not hear her asking you if you are willing to stop doing it. And if you are not, you can decline. And she figures out how to solve her yucky another way.

Are you comfortable being assertive?

Galagirl
 
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Tonberry

New member
About the marriage visa... I don't know which country you are from, but here in the US I went through the process of a marriage visa. They check a lot of things. You have to declare if you have children with other people for instance and prove that you are not longer in a relationship with them and don't live together. You need to document the relationship and prove there is no other relationship to avoid a "sham" marriage. They have specific checks to prevent polygamy.

It doesn't seem like she would get the visa. They would realise you have a relationship with your husband. You'd have to move out, stage a fake breakup, have witnessed to that effect, and a bunch of stuff like that. It's not a situation they should be willing to put you in. And even with all that there are high chances you'd be discovered and she would not only not get her visa, but be kicked out of the country without being able to enter it again for a certain amount of time (a few years I believe).

So I certainly recommend they try one of the other possible visas. If they still want to try this one, they should contact a lawyer and have extensive discussion with that lawyer (being honest about you and everything) and see what the lawyer recommends, before taking any steps towards getting married.
 

Vinccenzo

New member
I have a feeling that if they get married, immediately the rug will get pulled out. Suddenly you'll be asked to live apart from them "just temporary" so they won't get pinched for marrying just for her to get citizenship. I don't think this is just so she can stay state side. If they've looked into it at all, they'd know the legitimacy of their union will be investigated. You, in the same house with them, with children by him won't look well.
 

Inyourendo

New member
Sounds like you publicly breaking up, changing all your social media stuff, getting a job, establishing your own residence (a good while before they actually marry) and commiting fraud IS NOT the easiest way for her to get a visa. They want to get married, plain and simple.

Imo I would just leave and let them have each other. They've been gas lighting you and she's a cowgirl
 

opalescent

Active member
Do you have any idea how intrusive the investigation will be to determine if it is a 'real' marriage? They will interview friends, family, coworkers. And there you are - with a long standing relationship with this man and children with him. That will come out. They will not be believed - she will be deported and you and he could face criminal charges. *A poly relationship will mean nothing in the eyes of the immigration investigators and attorneys.*

This is just such a clusterfuck. I'm sorry. If you want more pain, more drama - and possible jail time for you (yes it is that potentially serious) - stay. But I urge you to leave. Figure out how to co-parent as he will always be in your life as the father but please leave. You deserve infinitely better than this.
 

Norwegianpoly

New member
We are not thinking to close the distance with my boyfriend through marriage for exact this reason; it would be very easy for immigration to prove that I continued living with my longest time partner. Not to mention that it would hurt my longest partner a whole lot if I (even officiall) broke off the marriage with him to get married. That is why we are looking into options of work visa, instead. The table is still ours in terms of having a nice party, how I will get pregnant and so on.
 

kdt26417

Official Greeter
Staff member
Hi karsa,

Re (from OP):
"I am already worried that this poly relationship will never be what we had planned (equal closed triad) and that if that's the case dh and I will have to break up as he has made it clear that he only wants me to be poly with his girlfriend, no one else."

Huh? That doesn't sound very fair. For you or his girlfriend.

Re:
"Do you think it is a problem for me to refer to dh as my husband?"

It's not a problem for you, but it's a problem for his girlfriend. You could always tell her to grow a pair, but it's completely up to her whether she does that.

Re:
"And do you think it is fair that my metamour expects me to stop calling him this because she is his girlfriend and has been for a year?"

To be honest, it seems a bit petty to me on both your parts. Since you can't govern her thoughts and behavior, why not be the woman here who sets the better example? (Or alternatively, couldn't both of you call him "husband?")

But as others have pointed out, this visa marriage would be nigh unto impossible to pull off, and dangerous. If dh is going to go through with it, you'd best distance yourself from him as much and as soon as possible. :(

Hope you'll keep us posted,
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 

Memorandum

New member
Pff, they need to find another way. So what if marriage visa is easier, too damn bad because it's not going to work.

Get a lawyer if they don't seem to want to change their mind. Please. Because if they don't change their mind and get married regardless, you will have nothing real fast. They could easily go for another visa route and not even tell you. For all you know that paperwork is already in the mail as a backup.

Seriously, I mean how else would he/they know that it's easier if all options weren't already compared. Without you by the way.
I know me and my OCD self, when I say something is easier it's because I've looked through every possible option (situation etc.) before concluding it out loud. It's only easier in that it takes less time and money (if done legally of course).
 

karsa

New member
Thanks for the feedback everyone.

Just to clarify, before we took on a metamour we did set up some ground rules one of which included that if for whatever reason the closed triad did not work, I would be able to take on a bf or gf of my own. Unfortunately a year into dh and metamours relationship dh changed his mind and said he would not be comfortable with that. We originally had a lot of good groundrules that catered to different outcomes so that we could ensure we stayed together but since he took on his gf every single rule has been broken or reneged by dh. So basically I have been left with an ultimatum, be totally on board with having the relationship structure that he wants, or break up. I know it is incredibly selfish and childish on his part and may ultimately lead to us separating but I want to make sure that I did everything I could to make this work. If that ends up not being enough then I can live with that.

I don't really know how it will work re the visa. I would like to speak to a lawyer to explain the situation and find out exactly what I would have to do (sacrifice) and what the consequences would be if the marriage was deemed fake. But dh is not comfortable with the idea of telling anyone official about the details of our relationship and when I try to explain to him that I am not comfortable with just doing this without knowing what it means for me he gets angry that I'm not just on board with his plan and willing to do whatever it takes to keep this relationship going.
During these talks metamour goes deathly quiet and I have no idea what she thinks. She is usually a more understanding person than dh but is also still very jealous when it comes to dh and I having a relationship so I don't think she always sees just how much I am being asked to give up for her to be with us. The past several months dh and I have had a very strained relationship, to the point that you wouldn't really class it as loving husband/wife anymore. So metamour has not had to deal with her jealousy issues as there has been no intimacy (sexual or otherwise) between dh and I and she has been able to have dh all to herself (I often don't even sleep in my bed with them). I fear that if/when dh and I get back to a good place she will go back to having meltdowns and outbursts about not getting enough time with dh, having to share him and see him in love with and having sex with another person. She might not be like this but I don't feel confident that she will just be fine and in the past when she has had "bad behaviours" relating to dh and my relationship he has effectively "rewarded" her by giving her more time when she has a meltdown and withdrawing from me so that he doesn't have to deal with the stress of metamour being upset.
This is something that I have absolutely no tollerance for anymore and I worry that if I do all this work and am able to rebuild my relationship with dh it wont be enough if he doesn't change his behaviours too, and as I type this I know that I can't control him and that if he chooses to act badly it's not my fault but for now this stuff plays on my mind and I guess keeps me feeling insecure which probably doesn't help to build a better relationship in general.

Sorry, I think I may have ranted on a bit there!
 

Inyourendo

New member
So you're living with a cowgirl and you are basically a roommate. How many years of not being intimate with the father of your children while another woman has essentially taken over are you willing to put up with ? SHe was having meltdowns? That's abusive. You had to cower away to pacify her. Your husband is treating you like shit and your whole situation is fucked up. Just leave , you've lost
 
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GalaGirl

Well-known member
You do not sound insecure in yourself to me. You are simply in a precarious, unstable situation.

You seem to be seeing pretty clear : DH is not holding up his side of things, and she is being the squeaky wheel. You cannot do it all yourself. It requires cooperation and collaboration from the other two. Which you are not getting now and not sounding likely to get. :(

Galagirl
 
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Memorandum

New member
You know this just makes him look like more of a dipwad right? And dangerous, it seems that he just doesn't care about the real possible consequences if caught and it wouldn't be just on him.
Ask him which visa he'd be looking into filing for her. They aren't married so they would have to go the K-1 to K-3 route (fiance adjusted to married/90 days to marry) etc..

Now is not the time to be playing wait and see. At least start looking for a lawyer regarding custody since you're not legally married.
_____

Just realized this is the German woman that you last explained was living in your house. Have you even gone back to live in your own house since then? I also see he's still trying to build things his way regardless of your feelings.
Double time on that lawyer please and don't even worry about what would happen to him. He's already decided.
 
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