Our children aren't old enough for that, so it would be out of our hands and based on a number of factors or solely at the judge's discretion.
That's great, it starts with an earthquake, birds and
snakes, an aeroplane and Lenny Bruce is not afraid.
Eye of a hurricane, listen to yourself churn - world
serves its own needs, dummy serve your own needs. Feed
it off an aux speak, grunt, no, strength, Ladder
start to clatter with fear fight down height. Wire
in a fire, representing seven games, a government
for hire and a combat site. Left of west and coming in
a hurry with the furies breathing down your neck. Team
by team reporters baffled, trumped, tethered cropped.
Look at that low playing! Fine, then. Uh oh,
overflow, population, common food, but it'll do. Save
yourself, serve yourself. World serves its own needs,
listen to your heart bleed dummy with the rapture and
the revered and the right, right. You vitriolic,
patriotic, slam, fight, bright light, feeling pretty
I guess I don't see the relevance of the excerpt of the poem. Is posting lyrics telling just a passive aggressive way of asking him why he is posting here?
BoringGuy, I am responding to people. That is all. I have taken my own advice. This is my last post. Wish you all well in everything you do. Bye.
#2 If a person was a serial monogamist, a cheater, etc for years (history) ...finally gets married ...commits to a traditional mono marriage.. is happy for several years ...has kids ....more years pass ... not so happy for a period of time and then he or she reads a book see's a tv show has a dream or whatever and boom it clicks I"M POLY ...I"M wiring for non monogamy.2) There's a difference between realizing that poly exists and is a possibility after years of mono, versus realizing after years of poly that you don't really want it at all and were just going along with it to make someone else happy. Sticking with mono because you aren't aware of other options is quite different from sticking with mono OR poly because you're trying to make someone else happy by not being honest with yourself about what you want.
1) You ALWAYS have to consider the spouse and kids, imo. I'm never one to say, "You have to stay married because that's what you agreed to" but he DOES have a responsibility to his kids, at the very least. For those who realize they want poly after years of mono, I say the SAME THING: go SLOWLY. Be gentle with your spouse's feelings. Take BABY STEPS. Remember that other people's lives are entwined with yours and RESPECT that. How in the hell is anything different being said in this case?!?
3) The full stop is the problem. That wouldn't be "celebrated" in a mono-to-poly relationship either. He's making quick, unilateral, devastating decisions. Like if I woke up today and said, "Oh, sorry MC, I've spent the last month or so thinking about it and I don't want to be married to you anymore. I'm going to take the kids and move in with TGIB." Umm, NO, that would NOT be okay, or encouraged, or fucking celebrated. I'd be out of my damned mind and extremely hurtful and disrespectful to the person I chose to have kids with.
Nothing wrong with the suggestion of taking his time and thinking it through. It seems he's being judged for his decision. He British so he's got cultural baggage surrounding repressed emotions. Why can't he have a mono identity? That seem to be belittled by those thing. Her identity must be honored ...and his can be compromised. the compromise is his ideal partnership and life for some time management. How would you do that with gay person ?The general advice is to be patient and provide educational materials, and emotional support to the partner caught flat footed. It's their identity thats who they are except and deal. In this case it's the opposite....compromise ...His identity for her time management and being a "co" partner. He doesn't want to be a co partner . Fuck that ....that doesnt matter it's his culturally caused repressed emotions causing a knee jerk reaction.
Yeah, the general advice is to be patient and LEARN MORE. So what's the problem with applying it here?? Learn what these feelings really are, where they come from, and take TIME to figure out if they can be gotten past/dealt with. It took 12 YEARS to get here, I don't understand what's so awful about recommending 12 MONTHS to figure out where everyone wants to go from here.
Recently on 3 active threads the struggling spouse or mono partner was advised to end the relationship....if ya cant get a handle on your emotions ....if your miserable all the time end it, Chalk it up to relationship life cycle, hard limits, knowing when to say when.....incompatibility. But not in a case of reverse awakening.
It just seems you cant have it both ways ....it seems unfair.
I assume to all here thinking these thought that their transition from mono to poly was met with complete love and understanding.
It's all about how much time has been put into it, in either direction. The wife has put 12 years into her poly relationship as the hinge in a V before learning that her husband didn't want poly. I put 10 years into my relationship with my husband before I added a boyfriend, and MC knew the entire time that I was non-monogamous. If he suddenly decides one morning that he doesn't want this/me/my lifestyle then yeah, he damned well BETTER be prepared to put some time in to working through things. We may still end up split if our differences turn out to be irreconcilable, but he's not going to be able to just walk out and "decide" to remove himself from the equation. Not when he married me and decided to have kids with me knowing EXACTLY who and how I was.
Yeah ....i didn't force my wife either. I asked along the way ...even paid for marriage counseling for god knows how long. Funny enough I chose to believe mine too. How do you slow down on an Identity ?Matt's wife didn't force him to be part of something he didn't want. He CHOSE to and told her he was okay with it, and funnily enough she chose to believe her spouse. So pardon me if I think slowing down before drastic actions are taken is his price to pay now.
Different point of view does not equal confused.TGIG ....I think you're confused on a couple of things .
No, not in the sense that you're using the word. A sudden realization? Sure. A sudden realization that MUST be acted upon RIGHT NOW?? No.First let me ask if you think its possible for someone to have an awakening.?
Understand, sure. Even sympathize with (especially now after Matt's more extensive explanation, which laid out far deeper issues than just "I don't want to be poly anymore" and a more balanced outlook on the next few steps). But agree with? No. I don't care what your realization is- gay, poly, atheist, whatever (and I've been through "awakenings" on all those topics), you don't have to rush into ANYTHING. If you suddenly realize you need to stop drinking, fine, stop drinking. But something that has the potential to drastically affect, even damage your relationships, particularly with your children? Slow down and take your time. Which the OP seems to be saying he IS doing. I think some of his more emotional posts gave the impression to some of us (me included) that he was rushing into drastic action. But if that isn't the case, good, and I wish them all the best in trying to work this whole thing out.Do you understand the premise of the reverse awakening as it applies here.?
This got addressed in another thread, I believe, when Jane brought up a good example. If they really truly didn't realize because they didn't know it was an option, then I will take back any accusation of lying and they can just be mistaken about what they wanted. Being mistaken is fine, we're human. If they were avoiding introspection out of fear or because they were trying to make someone else happy/not be alone, then they were at the very least lying to themselves, and possibly lying to their partner.#2 If a person was a serial monogamist, a cheater, etc for years (history) ...finally gets married ...commits to a traditional mono marriage.. is happy for several years ...has kids ....more years pass ... not so happy for a period of time and then he or she reads a book see's a tv show has a dream or whatever and boom it clicks I"M POLY ...I"M wiring for non monogamy.
Is that person a liar? Was he or she Lying to themselves and their spouse all that time ?
Good question. I would say that, like the compromise that gets discussed here so often, it has to do with finding a solution that BOTH/ALL parties are content with. If you aren't reasonably content with the result, then it's not the right/appropriate solution yet. And obviously, Matt was not content if resentment has been building up for this long (along with other issues, apparently, regarding how his wife manages her relationships).Where's the line in trying to assimilate trying to make things work for your wife/ marriage, the greater dynamic AND doing things "just" to make someone else happy.
First of all, to me that's a faulty premise and therefore not answerable since I don't agree with your concept of "awakening". Second of all, seriously?!? I'm not going to do your homework for you. You want to know where I've said it, or GalaGirl, or anyone who deals with poly and kids, you can go look it up. If you search for pregnancy that would probably be fastest. There have been several threads where people have recommended slowing down and not opening yet when you're already dealing with adding a baby. From everything I've read (here and elsewhere) the general consensus is that poly is not detrimental to children as long as people are respectful, considerate, and responsible in their move to/practice of poly. That includes slowing down/waiting if someone isn't ready yet. In this reverse case I would apply that as staying respectful and considerate of his wife, even though he no longer wants to be part of a poly relationship, and responsibly working towards either a new agreement or a separation, whichever way it ends up going.#1 Yes people should consider the spouse and kids, but thinking with in the strict confines of the reverse awaking concept when does it happen in regular awaking ? I've never seen anyone suggest they should carefully weigh the effects of changing the marital dynamic on children when considering taking up a poly lifestyle with a reluctant spouse. Ive read a lot of threads never seen that. Please list the ones you've said that on.
There tends to be greater support given for those going against the norm rather than those going back to the norm. That's human nature. And this is a POLYAMORY board. Yeah, there's going to be more support for those trying to work towards poly rather than away from it. So I guess I'm not sure of your point. If you're complaining because a poly board supports people trying to be poly more than people trying to not be poly, besides "No kidding" I don't know what else to tell you.#3 the word "celebrated" was used to describe how a new person is treated upon their personal awakening. The words of support to the new member. Following that internal wiring....not on the particulars of their executing their plans for their new lifestyle or the effects it had on others within their sphere.
No, his identity as such was not belittled. Just the way he seemed to rush in the complete opposite direction after so many years. If there's no rush, no drastic actions taken in the heat of anger and cold of hurt/revenge, then fine. It may still be a difficult, painful process for them to work out what they each actually want and whether or not they are compatible in a relationship, but that's life.Nothing wrong with the suggestion of taking his time and thinking it through. It seems he's being judged for his decision. He British so he's got cultural baggage surrounding repressed emotions. Why can't he have a mono identity? That seem to be belittled by those thing. Her identity must be honored ...and his can be compromised. the compromise is his ideal partnership and life for some time management. How would you do that with gay person ?
You don't slow down an identity. That's ludicrous (yes, I know that's your point). But you absolutely have a choice in how quickly you ACT on that identity. I went through the first 6 years of my dating life not realizing I was bi. Once I figured it out it was still another couple of years before I dated a girl. And it didn't kill me. I wasn't even particularly miserable. Same with poly. MC and I have taken baby steps for YEARS to get to this point. We've gone from "Flirting, dancing with and making out with someone else at a party is okay as long as the other isn't there" to me having a second committed sexual relationship that we're trying to turn into cohabitation. But that was over the course of 15 YEARS. No one is going to DIE if they keep their status quo for a little longer while they communicate and work out what the issues really are (unless, of course, it's an abusive situation. Then they absolutely need to Get Out Now).How do you slow down on an Identity ?
A person walks up and says "sorry honey I'm gay" .....how do you slow that down. How do you compromise.
Judgements and aggressive language seem counterintuitive to encouraging a forum member to find their voice and express their needs to a partner.
First let me ask if you think its possible for someone to have an awakening.? Do you understand the premise of the reverse awakening as it applies here.?
#2 If a person was a serial monogamist, a cheater, etc for years (history) ...finally gets married ...commits to a traditional mono marriage.. is happy for several years ...has kids ....more years pass ... not so happy for a period of time and then he or she reads a book see's a tv show has a dream or whatever and boom it clicks I"M POLY ...I"M wiring for non monogamy.
Is that person a liar? Was he or she Lying to themselves and their spouse all that time ?
Where's the line in trying to assimilate trying to make things work for your wife/ marriage, the greater dynamic AND doing things "just" to make someone else happy.
I've never seen anyone suggest they should carefully weigh the effects of changing the marital dynamic on children when considering taking up a poly lifestyle with a reluctant spouse. Ive read a lot of threads never seen that.
He British so he's got cultural baggage surrounding repressed emotions.
Why can't he have a mono identity?
That seem to be belittled by those thing. Her identity must be honored ...and his can be compromised.
How would you do that with gay person ?
Metamour. I hate that bloody word. I slept with her... It felt like cheating. Why continue doing something that makes you feel like shit?
My 180 is within reason.
I never lied to my wife or even to myself for that matter. I knew she was polyamorous. I knew that meant compromising, being understanding, being tolerant, and making sacrifices. I grew out of it. I grew tired of being so accommodating, always compromising, always making sacrifices, and always being understanding. In return, my concerns were ignored and my say was undermined.
I guess none of that matters.
For me, polyamory is not part of my vision anymore. I lived with it for years, and then over time, I questioned whether I wanted to live contently with occasional bursts of happiness for the rest of my life, or did I want pure and true happiness? It reeks of settling. At some point, you get tired of only getting a fraction of someone you married. It got old. Especially as she started getting complacent and putting her other relationship before our marriage. Then, her other relationship and our marriage became a hybrid creation. It wasn't that I wasn't saying it. It wasn't heard. My wife didn't want to hear it because well she probably assumed that I would demand that she end her relationship. Presumptuousness in essence. I was tuned out because I wasn't saying the right thing.
Initially, the good outweighed the bad, so I stuck it out. I had a wife and two children. I liked my life. It was good up until a certain point. Notice I didn't say loved. Was every moment of our lives filled with blissful joy, rainbows, and spinning around a campfire singing Kumbaya ? No. Come on now.
I've been dying to say this. This isn't in a hateful way, but I don't really give a damn if her girlfriend's life has to be restructured. That's her problem. I have enough to deal with in my marriage. Let alone an issue with her. She's a grown woman. She's not part of my family or any part of my future. The end.
I care about my kids well-being. I know if push came to shove, my wife would be alright. With or without me. She has someone else to fall back on, and well, she's an integral part of her life, so if I left, what difference would it make?
She wouldn't have to deal with a husband who doesn't want to be part of any of this. She could find one who has no problem with it.
You never want to do anything to hurt a loved one. I know that, and never would I ever do anything to intentionally hurt her or cause her pain.
Out of curiosity, why do you hate the word? It just means your partner's partner. It has nothing to do with sleeping with someone (I'd venture a guess that most metamours NEVER sleep together). I mean, it's not the greatest made-up word ever, but then neither is "polyamory". Mixing Greek and Latin roots!!Metamour. I hate that bloody word.
What would have happened if your spouse had not been accepting or on board with that idea? Would you have left, or would you have let them leave in order to pursuit your happiness?
Out of curiosity, why do you hate the word? It just means your partner's partner. It has nothing to do with sleeping with someone (I'd venture a guess that most metamours NEVER sleep together). I mean, it's not the greatest made-up word ever, but then neither is "polyamory". Mixing Greek and Latin roots!!
By the way, you do know what "metamour" means, right? It sounds like you might have it confused. It sounds like you think it means "mutual partner", like the "third" person in a triad where all are involved with each other. Is that what you think it means, or not?
Out of curiosity, why do you hate the word? It just means your partner's partner. It has nothing to do with sleeping with someone
From my own introspection (not to speak for Matt, but I tend to not use the word, either), I think it's partly because of the way it sounds... "Metamour" implies a relationship with my partner's other partner by virtue of THEIR relationship. It has no bearing on what MY relationship to that person is, and if I don't feel a personal relationship with that person, I'm very hesitant to use words that imply such. It's the difference between calling a person "My sister-in-law" or "X's sister". One term does a better job of keeping a person (emotionally) at arm's length if you don't feel a connection (or if you feel animosity).