The Struggling Mono Thread

sage

New member
Hey Lady I

I am very impressed with you. For one so new you really seem to have come to grips with poly/mono in a very measured and healthy way.:)

I don't quite understand what you mean when you say that your personal boundaries are welded together? Perhaps you could explain that a bit further?

I am in a big learning phase around co-dependence so I apologise to anyone if I have things out of whack.

Like anyone Z has some quite distinct ....I can't find a word for it. It's more than moods, it's the way his energy is. His energy ranges from beautiful and very loving to sad and emotionally withdrawn.
I've noticed that I've been invested in keeping him in the "beautiful loving" space. What's wrong with that? It prevents him from dealing with his stuff. Sometimes he needs to go into his dark and lonely cave to work through things.

His relationship with J is one of those issues. It is unbalanced (he's far more invested in it than she is). A lot of it is fantasy in his mind but I've been supporting it because it makes him so happy (i.e in his loving energy space).
Now that I've realised this I'm going to start very gently speaking my truth (when the opportunity presents itself), even though I know I risk losing him to his big black cave.

We can be all set for a wonderful weekend together and if I touch a nerve it can be wiped out, he can be emotionally withdrawn and sad for days. So I've learnt to stay away from those nerves. But this isn't healthy for either of us and now I'm learning to create my own lovely energy so that I can allow him his cave and hopefully help him deal with the nasties that lurk there.

hugs right back at you

Sage
 

nycindie

Active member
I've noticed that I've been invested in keeping him in the "beautiful loving" space. What's wrong with that? It prevents him from dealing with his stuff. Sometimes he needs to go into his dark and lonely cave to work through things.

. . .

We can be all set for a wonderful weekend together and if I touch a nerve it can be wiped out, he can be emotionally withdrawn and sad for days. So I've learnt to stay away from those nerves. But this isn't healthy for either of us and now I'm learning to create my own lovely energy so that I can allow him his cave and hopefully help him deal with the nasties that lurk there.

Ah, Sage, this is a key realization.

I remember one occasion, early on in my marriage, when my husband was quite upset and angry about something. I don't recall the particulars, but I know his upset wasn't from an outside source, like something that had happened to him that day, but an issue he had with us or our relationship. He wanted to argue his point, I think. Anyway, my response to him was something like, "Well, you have every right to feel what you're feeling and there's nothing I can do to change that. But I'm not going to argue with you about it. When you're ready to have a conversation, let's talk about it."

He told me afterward (when he was ready to talk) that the fact I didn't try to change or prevent him from processing whatever he needed to process instantly melted him. He said he realized at that moment that I was willing to let him be who he was, and that the stuff he had going on was his stuff and not my responsibility. He told me that when I said he had every right to feel whatever he was feeling that he felt like he had a true partner.

I don't think you were talking about J. being angry about something, but I think you see why your post reminded me of this. There is so much value in letting people be, as well as being available to prod, comfort, or shake them, etc., when they need it. This is why I often do not immediately touch or hold someone who is crying -- because making contact physically could dissipate the release of energy they are experiencing. People get so uncomfortable with others' discomfort, we don't realize how much we are invested in comforting others or making them happy largely so that we ourselves don't have to see them going through that pain.
 
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ladyintricate

New member
I don't quite understand what you mean when you say that your personal boundaries are welded together? Perhaps you could explain that a bit further?

The short version of what I mean is it can be hard at times to know where my needs end and his begin, or vice versa.

Long answer: My husband and I are so in tune with each other that when we are happy or sad, in pain, angry, etc. the other one is very much aware of it as well and often feeling it. I don't think that is a bad thing, but the next part that often happens is not great: when it is him who is in pain then I want to help him or heal that pain, I don't let him heal himself at times. I tend to do this with the "negative" emotions like pain and anger. I feel pain too so I want it to be immediately over, or I feel the anger and I don't like it so I try to calm him down right away. Sometimes this means that the actual issue is not worked out, but just a band-aid is put on.

I am learning a similar lesson to yours with Z (it sounds like): I need to let him deal with things his own way and not interfere sometimes.

Thanks as always for the emotional support! And NYCindie I wish that I had learned the lesson apparently you already knew, year ago! :eek:
 

nycindie

Active member
And NYCindie I wish that I had learned the lesson apparently you already knew, year ago! :eek:
Oh hey, thanks, but it could be that I just hate to get into arguments, and it worked out in my favor and made me look really enlightened when I just wanted peace and quiet! Hahaha!
 

LovingRadiance

Active member
Not that this is a cure-all at all, but has Macha ever been to counseling? Do you think he might be willing to go? It is helping our communication skills to talk to someone who has seen other people with similar communication issues to ours. She is able to somewhat untangle our communications in front of us and applying that has helped when we are alone as well.

He's in counseling. We've gone off and on over the years. But, not for long enough for anything to stick. The hardest part is that you have to actually put the steps into practice. ;) Go figure.

I know he loves me.
I know I love him.
I know we can work it out.
I also know-we can't get to the working it out step if we're caught up in the drama.

Sage-that was an AWESOME realization. I struggle with that. In fact, that's part of what got us where we are right now. I figured out that I can't just "say what makes him feel better" I have to say what is TRUE.
Sometimes the truth hurts-a lot. :(

But-honestly, I am already seeing so many benefits of being real with myself, being real with everyone else. It's hard work-but I think it's worth it.
 

Morningglory629

New member
Ladies- Just wanted to step-in here and say I am reading along. I may not post much but I follow the posts. Honesty IS the great equalizer, and communication (listening and talking) its vehicle. Without it, there is nothing. Had a long talk with 2Rings on this matter on several fronts. But, as LR said being real with yourself is key. Being afraid to hurt someone is not a good enough bandaid for the damage misleading or dishonesty can cause in the longterm. All you can do at this point is move forward with that attitude and resolve in mind.
Hi Sage! "Codependence" is a tough word. I am so unsure about the line between codependence and interdependence. Obviously a lover needs to depend on his/her lover. But how much is too much? I want to be a safe-haven, touchstone, lovey place for 2Rings- and the hubs, but when is it creating a false sense of healthy and happy? Know what I mean? It is a bit of a slippery slope. Keep posting on this- I am, as always, learning.
 

sage

New member
HI MG, great to hear from you.

I think the difference between co-dependence and interdependence is that one is healthy and one is not healthy. Over the past few months I've scaled back my support of Z's relationship with J from encouraging to neutral. I started out with the best of intentions supporting Z in his relationship but if I'm honest I think that to continue actively supporting it would be co-dependent. It stops him having to deal with his stuff and makes him more loving to me. He needs to deal with that stuff and in the process he isn't probably going to be very nice to be around.

Initially he used me as the excuse for their relationship not progressing, hence my encouragement and hard work to befriend J. But after many months it's now clear to me that she is not going to progress beyond where she is and she is not going share any more of herself with him beyond her best behaviour self. They each share only he best of themselves with each other and I don't see how that is love, that to me is something else, maybe a kind of crush, or crutch?
 

redpepper

New member
I think the difference between co-dependence and interdependence is that one is healthy and one is not healthy. Over the past few months I've scaled back my support of Z's relationship with J from encouraging to neutral. I started out with the best of intentions supporting Z in his relationship but if I'm honest I think that to continue actively supporting it would be co-dependent. It stops him having to deal with his stuff and makes him more loving to me. He needs to deal with that stuff and in the process he isn't probably going to be very nice to be around.

Initially he used me as the excuse for their relationship not progressing, hence my encouragement and hard work to befriend J. But after many months it's now clear to me that she is not going to progress beyond where she is and she is not going share any more of herself with him beyond her best behaviour self. They each share only he best of themselves with each other and I don't see how that is love, that to me is something else, maybe a kind of crush, or crutch?
Interesting point Sage, I would agree with your first statement about co and inter-dependence. Co is when one can't make a move without the other being right there along with them. Every decision made, every plan, every breath taken is with ones partner. New love tends to be like this. I think it is healthy, in time, once people know each other, to make plans for doing ones own thing, making decisions without the other with boundaries about what is okay and what needs discussing. That would mean inter-dependence to me.

What can happen, and we see it all the time here on the forum, is that people in couples decide they want someone new to come into their lives. That can often be finding a unicorn for them in their co-dependence or one decides they want to break away and find their own love, challenging the co-dependence of their monogamous relationships. When I say co-dependent here it is in a matter of degree mind you. There is complete co-dependence and that which monogamy is based on. A level of trust and understanding that the couple are exclusive. The latter is common in our culture and completely valid. The latter is destructive to ones autonomy and dependence. At least in terms of going on the theory that we are our own primary, which is what I go on.

When a new love comes in it is really easy to either be jealous and complain and fight for it not to happen, or it can go the other way. It can go the way of making it all comfy and cosy for the new couple so that they are at their best and no one is the wiser about either of their true natures.

I know someone who did that at the beginning of their husbands relationship as far as prompting him to write emails to her while he was away because he isn't good at keeping in touch... I pointed out that it is HIS relationship and this new woman would have to deal with his inability to keep in touch. They would have to develop their own method of relating and asking for their needs to be met. Besides, maybe it isn't something she is all that concerned about anyway... it is so easy to project onto someone else what is important to us. It's easy to project on to someone else's relationship in terms of what we value also.

Good for you backing away and letting them sort themselves out. I can imagine it would take a huge load off of yourself and what you think you "should" be doing. You can concentrate on your own plans now instead of investing in theirs. Be more inter-dependent perhaps :)

Maybe it is all surface and good times, but really, if that is all they both want then Meh, it means you likely will be around for the long haul and she won't. I have found that a balance of good times and rough times is what makes a relationship rich and worth holding on to. If they don't have any struggle or plans for the future, then I would wonder if they will dwindle out at some point.
 

sage

New member
Thanks for such an indepth reply Rp. I always appreciate the generosity of your comments :)

I disagree about co-dependence being as totally encompassing as you say however. My ex and I were very co-dependent even at the worst of our relationship, when in many ways we lived separate lives. I wasn't happy but didn't have the courage to get out and I hated our financial situation, but he kept me happy by trying to give me and more stuff, bigger houses and better cars, which I accepted. That to me was co-dependence.

It will be interesting to see if J and Z's relationship fizzles out. It's been going for years like this but in many ways it is a fantasy for him and I've been supporting that fantasy. Having only recently realised this it would be co-dependent of me to continue buying into his fantasy because of the benefits it brings me.

I do agree with your point about unicorns. We did that briefly ourselves. I thought a unicorn might give him what J didn't. I believe the depth for our relationship will come from me having the confidence and fortitude to ride out his periods of gloom without filling the void and instead looking to the root courses.
 

redpepper

New member
I disagree about co-dependence being as totally encompassing as you say however. My ex and I were very co-dependent even at the worst of our relationship, when in many ways we lived separate lives. I wasn't happy but didn't have the courage to get out and I hated our financial situation, but he kept me happy by trying to give me and more stuff, bigger houses and better cars, which I accepted. That to me was co-dependence.

It will be interesting to see if J and Z's relationship fizzles out. It's been going for years like this but in many ways it is a fantasy for him and I've been supporting that fantasy. Having only recently realised this it would be co-dependent of me to continue buying into his fantasy because of the benefits it brings me.
Oh no, I think we are fully in agreement. You describe a part of co-dependency that is completely valid. Finances are all a part of it usually; from what I have known anyway.

I was completely co-dependent with my ex-wife. She continued the trend with other partners and I managed to end it with her. Thankfully. We were wrapped up in a tight little knot of being unable to move in any direction due to our dependence on each other emotionally (my half of it) and financially (her half of it). I gave her emotional support where by she never had to stand on her own two feet and be confident for herself and she paid for stuff... had the car, the clothes that I shared with her and provided food. I found it hard to get out from under that and stand on my own two feet.

I find it interesting that you "buying into his fantasy." I wonder if this buying into is similar to what was going on with your last relationship whereby your partner bought stuff... is participating in creating a situation where the two of them are not completely being themselves the same thing as what he gave you? Does that make sense? I am not sure that my question is clear... but will try it on to see if you understand what I mean. ;)
 

Morningglory629

New member
I believe the depth for our relationship will come from me having the confidence and fortitude to ride out his periods of gloom without filling the void and instead looking to the root courses.

This is encouraging. You are very inspirational here Sage. It is amazing how the "stuff" gets in the way of really examining the real happiness/unhappiness of our relationships.
 

ladyintricate

New member
Besides, maybe it isn't something she is all that concerned about anyway... it is so easy to project onto someone else what is important to us. It's easy to project on to someone else's relationship in terms of what we value also.

Good for you backing away and letting them sort themselves out. I can imagine it would take a huge load off of yourself and what you think you "should" be doing. You can concentrate on your own plans now instead of investing in theirs. Be more inter-dependent perhaps :)

RP, what you said here really "clicked" for me in my own relationship! I have a tendency to project onto my husband my worries and expectations. I am not doing this currently with a metamour and my hubby, but I have done this in other aspects of our relationship. I am learning that I need to let him "sink or swim." This was something that I just recently realized I was not allowing to happen and it has been such a big eye opener. I always learn so much from your posts! :)

Sage, I hope that backing off and letting Z and J's relationship progress as it will is a freeing experience for you. For myself I have found doing this extremely freeing and it has taken a lot of stress off of me that I did not even realize I was harboring. I have had to pick up the emotional pieces with him and a work endeavor that went wrong (I did not remind him to call people and about appointments as I have in the past, instead i told him that he needed to keep track of things in his planner and that I cannot do that for him any longer with my own job and responsibilities) recently. This was hard for me to watch to an extent, but at the same time it was good for him I think. He is starting to really see that his stuff is his stuff and mine is mine. I have too much going on with my own stuff (work and a master's program) as well as "our " stuff (kids and home) to be able to fill the void for him as well. I am finding this empowering and although he isn't liking it, per se, he now gets the full glory when things go well. :cool:
 

sage

New member
Phew, I've worked through this last struggle and I think I am very like you Lady I. I take on responsibility for everyone else. Now that I've realised it I see it everywhere. I feel so much lighter already. I think I also have made life harder for myself than it has needed to be. You sound like you have a very full life at the moment, full credit for being able to cope with poly/mono at the same time.
 

ryanwer

New member
mono in a poly world

hello everyone im new to all of this im a mono with a poly and need help desperately.

K and i have now been together for just over 3 years its had its up and downs just like any realtionship but all in all its pretty amazing, however a few months ago she opens up to me and tells me shes poly and always has been, i was rather confused and didnt know what to do, a little while later she had found a secondary (as it seems to be called) and naturally theres tons of NRE but heres my problem hes a long haul trucker and i see her maybe twice a week if im lucky now honestlly when she first told me i said forget it how could share her to me it just didnt seem right im a mono i love a single person. so i did some research alot of research on poly and learned alot after a few fights and alot of talking i decided to try it for her and agreed for her to have a secondary, me i couldnt do it sure i may look at other women but i could never love another as much as i love her its just not in me, i guess what im really asking for from everyone is how can i be truly supportive im doing what i can think of from what ive read but i need help it feels as if ive been put on the back burner and im only here just to bridge the gap between the days she doesnt see him. but at the same time when we are together its usually pretty good, and shes even said that despite her even being poly that if it came down to it that i would be the only one, though i have a hard time with it cause shes never here so really all i want is some help so i can show her that though its not easy for me im here for her 100% and hopefully i'll see her more often...

thanks in advance for anyone who reads
 

sage

New member
Hi Ryan and welcome

Check out my blog www.polyamorouspeople.com. There are lots of things on there that have helped monos figure out life with a poly partner.

The first thing I would do if I was you would be to work out whether your partner will still be able to be the partner you want if she has another relationship. This is probably something you will have to work out together. Work out where your bottom lines are.

For me it was that I always want Z to live with me full-time (no house hopping like some poly people do). He has a fantasy that one day his OSO will live with us. While that isn't very likely to happen, I like her and would be prepared to give it a try but my bottom line is that he sleeps with me most of the time. My other bottom line is that if he stays with her (she lives in another country) for any longer than a couple of days, we go together. If anyone else came into his life we would have to look at my bottom line again.

Some people call this setting boundaries but for me 'bottom line' works better because it's very important to me that Z is able to experience himself as he really is and not as he thinks he should be. So I will always give him as much freedom as I possibly can while still being able to have the kind of relationship that is important to me.

Hope that helps for a start.

Take care and remember to nurture yourself. Polymono relationships aren't easy but they can be wonderful.

PS: You also will probably need to have a discussion about why, if she always knew she was poly, she didn't tell you at the outset. I see this as a significant dishonesty which I would want to be addressed.
 

ryanwer

New member
thank you sage for showing me your blog site and i do plan on buying your book hopefully theres information in there that will be helpful to me as im sure there will be. as mentioned one of my biggest issues is all the NRE its difficult to sit back and watch her be happy in someone elses arms as you said "im mono through and though" and i always will be and i can get really jelous ive been trying to keep it in check but it shows out from time to time, ive never met the guy and don't really have any desire to atm. its been almost 2 months now and theres still so much NRE lots of ppl on this forum say i will calm down after awhile and mellow out i just need to be patient and im trying to be i really its just i wish that i had some of that energy when shes with me shes usually tired and a little bogged down so it makes it hard for us to do anything
 

sage

New member
The work necessary to make your relationship successful is not all your responsibility. What is your partner doing to contribute? Yes you will need to work on jealousy but jealousy is also a symptom of things being out of order and it seems to me there are some fundamentals here that need addressing.
 

ryanwer

New member
i think our biggest issue right now is not spending all that much together i have brought this up with her and we are working on a schedule that will hopefully support all 3 people well as before poly was brought into our relationship most of our time was spent together and now its barely time for anything a quick visit for a couple days every odd week and im hoping we can change that
 

LostRane

New member
After Reading this thread

I have been reading this thread for two days now. Wondering if I am cut out for this. There are a few things that I know from the start.

1. I love my girlfriend more then anything in this world
2. I would do anything to make her happy as long as it doesn't compromise my values or my beliefs.
3. I am having jealousy over sharing her sometimes.
4. I forget that she is in a relationship with me and Draco. Not single relationships with both of us.
5. Draco spends allot of time with us and at times its hard to see him get kisses and love from Rane. ( I need to ask for what I want, I am working on this)
6. I don't think I could have a sexual relationship with anyone one else at this time. Maybe it will change in the future but here and now I have what I need.
7. Having Draco in our life's has made me and Rane's 4 year relationship stronger and we talk more, love more and are over all happier.

Here are my questions.

1. Does the jealousy of the New and Shinny ever go way? I am very jealous some days of Draco for he is getting all the attention and I am not. ( i know this is not what is happening for Rane is trying to find balance between the both of us but some days I feel selfish for asking for the things I need or want.)

2. Are there days when you still feel lost and alone? How do I deal with these feelings?

Lets start there..I have a lot of thoughts and feelings and am trying to work them out so they will make sense when you all read them..
 
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