Struggling with time and honesty...

O

Overthinker

New member
I am looking for some advice with the current situation that we are struggling with. My husband and I have been in a quad for a year now and, of course, we’ve all had our ups and downs. We’ll call my husband Matt, husband’s girlfriend Nora, and her husband/my boyfriend Heath.

I recently had a breakdown after I had been struggling for a while with some inequality in the two extra relationships (which I know I should not expect to be totally equal, because we are all different people).

For the past few months, I have felt like I have been just watching the relationship between Matt and Nora from the sidelines, while I have got close to nothing from Heath. Matt and Nora have regular lunch and drinks dates, talk on the phone constantly, and at times he will text her for hours while I just sit there on the couch watching him. He sneaks out of the house to call her, or waits for me to leave to jump on the phone.

On the other hand, I never know when I will hear from Heath. I will go weeks without seeing him. It has been months since we’ve had a lunch date. Heath has a totally different personality than Matt. I am learning how to handle it, but most of the time I feel very alone in all of this.

To top it off, there have been a couple of times that Matt has not been completely honest with me when I have asked him about very minor things. About a month ago, both of the men were out of town, so Nora and I had a girl’s night out. While we were out, she answered a phone call from Matt, and went into another room to talk to him.

This made me feel a little uncomfortable, mainly because a few days earlier, she was out with friends, so I decided to hang out with Heath for awhile, because I hadn’t seen him in weeks. Well, when she found out I was there, she begged me to come out with her. She kept saying “just forget the men," etc. So since I thought she was trying to make an effort in our friendship, I dropped what I was doing with Heath, and went out with her.

I felt like her taking that phone call was kind of hypocritical. If Heath would have called me while I was out with her, I would have ignored it in a heartbeat. But all in all, it wasn’t that big of a deal and wasn’t worth me bringing it up with her at the time.

Well, it caused more problems a few days later, when I was in a conversation about his out-of-town trip, and I asked Matt if he had called Nora while she and I were out that night. He told me no, even though I knew he had. I stewed on it for a day or so, then told him that I knew the truth, and he said, “Well, maybe you are right. I don’t remember what time I called Nora, because I was drunk." He then said that he told me he hadn’t called her because I put him on the spot. I told him that I didn’t care if he called her, even though at the time it made me feel a little awkward, but I would expect him to just tell me the truth-- “Hey, I did call her, but I was drunk and have no idea when I did.” That would have been just fine.

There was another recent incident where he disappeared to his man cave while we had family over. I knew that he went out to call Nora. Well, when he got back in the house, I asked him what he had been up to. He made up some excuse of what he was doing. I don’t know why he didn’t just say what he was doing. It’s not like he doesn’t already have permission.

So, back to my breakdown. It came to a head the other night when I had made a dinner for Matt that he had requested, and he ended up being late without letting me know in advance, because he was "having drinks with another friend." Well, after he came home, and dinner was cold, he told me that he had been at Nora’s house having a drink, as well. I wasn’t upset that he was there, but that he totally disregarded me and the family. We ended up having a heated discussion, where I told him exactly how I felt about all the time he spends with her, and how I felt second. By the end of the night, I told him that I didn’t think I could do this anymore, and I wanted to call things off with the quad. We all have the agreement that if one person wants out, then we all are done.

After doing a lot of talking with Matt into the wee hours of the morning, he totally understood where I was coming from and agreed to call everything off. I then decided that I had been too harsh, and that we all needed some time to talk and let everyone know how I felt, and that it didn’t have to end right now. Heath wasn’t even in town when all this happened, and I felt like I had to talk to him as well about how I was feeling.

Well, I talked to Heath about everything in detail, and told him that I needed more from our relationship if I could continue to be able to handle Matt and Nora’s relationship. I guess it is easier to overlook the time that Matt spends focused on Nora, if I am somewhat preoccupied with Heath. Heath is struggling with being able to focus on me more, because he doesn’t feel like Nora cares to be around him, or work on the relationship they have. I totally understood that. I mentioned that maybe we should back off of things until their marriage is in a better place. So I really don’t know what is going to happen there.

But in the meantime, Matt is upset and he says he can’t even talk to or text Nora, because he is scared of what I will think. I have not asked him to totally stop everything with her. I have asked that he be honest if I do ask him things, which I don’t do very often.

I feel like he has taken everything that I shared with him about how I have been feeling to another level that it doesn’t need to be. He told me that he was very frustrated with everything, and that he was actually somewhat relieved when he was going to tell Nora that things were over. Nora does have a tendency to cause some drama and not be very honest, herself.

So, I guess, after my long novel, I really don’t know what to do with Matt now. I don’t want him to feel like he has to worry about his every move, but I want to be able to be honest with him if I am struggling with something.

So, go ahead and shoot. I’m ready… lol.
 
A very short reply to a very long post-- I would search the forum for posts on NRE. It just sounds like Matt and Nora are in the midst of new relationship energy and are having trouble maintaining balance with their current relationships. Maybe reading a bit about it might help you (and him) to see what's going on.

The fact is, NRE can feel great, but it needs to be something he (and she) are aware of, so that they do the things they need to do to maintain their already established relationships. It might take conscious effort to do that, but it needs to be done. They have to realize that they can't just do whatever they want to do, or everything they feel like at every particular moment, because there are other people involved.

It seems that Heath is in the same boat as you, so my guess is both of them need to rein it in a bit. Not give it up, and not NOT enjoy it, but be caring of the other people they are involved with.

I'd also tell Matt directly that he needs to not take what you told him about how you're feeling and turn it into something it's not. If he has questions about what you're feeling and thinking, he needs to ask you, not make a wild stab in the dark. :)
 
Thanks Minxxa. Boy, I have read almost everything there is. I had actually thought that a lot of the NRE had been over with them, or at least diminished.
 
A few pieces of advice.

- Insist that Matt take his relationship with you seriously, not disrespect you, and be 100% honest. Tell him that if he can't do that it will badly impact your marriage, plain and simple, just as it would if anything else in his life were causing him to treat you poorly. Make it clear to him that none of those things involve not seeing Nora. Maybe show him this thread to try to help him understand that. Promise him that if he lives up to the commitment to do those three things, you will not guilt him or pressure him or in any way give him grief about his relationship with Nora.

- To help Matt keep the commitment to treat you right, ask him to read up on NRE, because that is, in fact, what's going on. Maybe even ask to sit down with Matt and Nora together, the three of you, so you can explain what actions have hurt you and why, and can make it clear that you support their relationship, just not those inconsiderate behaviors.

- Treat your relationship with Heath as its own entity. If you're not getting what you want/need from it, then there's no reason this has to be a quad rather than a vee. You could go out on dates, and maybe meet a new poly or poly-friendly guy who will give you more time/energy.
 
Overthinker said:
I had actually thought that a lot of the NRE had been over with them, or at least diminished.
Click to expand...

It can last for differing amounts of time (from what I hear), but generally I think in 12-18 months it starts to fade.

I know you say you've read everything, but has Matt? One issue I've had with my hubs is that I am the one that has researched, read and gotten other people's perspectives on poly and issues with poly, here and there over the past 15 years. He's hardly read anything, so everything comes "through me", and is sometimes seen and brushed aside as my own personal opinion and viewpoint, and not as information I've garnered from a lot of people's own experiences and advice.

I would suggest that HE be the one to read about NRE, maybe some info on how experienced poly people handle it respectfully, so that he can see it's not just YOU freaking out about something, but it's a common poly issue that he seems to be unaware of, or is ignoring in the heat of all of the chemicals flowing through his system.

The nice thing about seeing other people's experiences is that you don't need to reinvent the wheel yourself.
 
The way I see it, the big problem here is the current poor quality of Heath's relationship with Nora. Backing off sounds like a good idea, or at least cutting way back. Hopefully Matt can see the wisdom of that, since the quad will likely implode if Nora and Heath's relationship doesn't stabilize.

I feel for you. No one in a quad likes to be held captive by another's pace.
 
I have to agree with Jade, based on a very messy and ugly quad relationship my husband and I were in. If the other couple does not seem to have a good solid marriage, I would definitely back off and see if they can work on their problems and issues. If all care about each other, and understand what is going on and needed, no one of the quad should feel badly about taking a temporary break. If drama occurs because of this suggestion, especially from the other woman involved... Run!

LOL

Sorry, it just sounds all too familiar to me.
 
You don't need to force things with Heath just because it's clear your spouses are falling in love.

Your husband just needs to be a bit more honest with you about how things are going with his new girlfriend, and needs to keep paying enough attention to you so that you still feel important. He can manage that even when in the throes of new love.
 
MichelleZed said:
You don't need to force things with Heath just because it's clear your spouses are falling in love.

Your husband just needs to be a bit more honest with you about how things are going with his new girlfriend, and needs to keep paying enough attention to you so that you still feel important. He can manage that even when in the throws of new love.
Click to expand...

I don't feel like I'm forcing things with Heath, but I have told him what I do want out of a relationship with him. It's not that Heath doesn't want to give me more, it's the fact that he feels like he's just a roommate, and someone to help with the kids, to Nora, and not a husband. She is not very affectionate with him, but of course she is with Matt. So his mind is always wandering, wondering if she would rather be spending time with Matt instead of him, mainly because she does spend so much time focused on Matt. Heath can't get that out of his head to relax enough to actually be himself with me.

Now, when he has been able to totally relax, our time together is awesome, and I love it. I just wish I had more of him when he is like that.
 
Well then, it's clear that Heath and Nora need to reconnect and get back to loving and romancing each other. They should be having hot dates together, just as you should be having hot dates with Matt..

I think it can only help the entire quad if the pre-existing couples step back from their OSOs, strengthen what they have together, and find the good stuff again, before going back into "swapping" positions. Then, take that slowly! Don't let NRE swallow anyone up to the point of ignoring someone else. Make an agreement that all of you speak up when you see that happening. Perhaps you should also all go out and socialize together as a foursome on a regular basis, as well.
 
Hmm

I'm new to this poly thing, but to me it sounds like Nora and Heath need to figure out what is going on in their marriage, and either reconnect, or decide what each wants. It also sounds like there needs to be more communication about feelings. Perhaps when you communicated, Matt took it as jealousy. Or possibly he and Nora are feeling guilty.

Sometimes body language can cause words to get lost in translation.

It also maybe seems like Nora is confused and not sure what she wants, perhaps jealous of your relationship with Heath.

Some ideas to throw out...
 
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