partners marriage trouble

Smiles said:
What I find interesting is that all my love interests are totally different from my wife, physically as well as personality-wise. The reason is that 22 years ago, I was a totally different man. Back then, I had very little confidence. My wife was the friend I needed at the time. My needs are different now.
It may be the same for your bf. He may not want to let go of what he feels is his best friend. Now that your provide for his physical needs, all is fine.
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Very true, Smiles. He is much the same as what you are describing. There has just been a lot of hurt involved. It's hard to watch him trying for a friendship when he's still grieving the marriage.
 
What I struggle with now is I want to advise him to not try to be friends. I've been there. You can't just jump to friends when a relationship crumbles. But as his new primary, is it my place? I can comment on secondaries plenty, but in this case, she is still his wife and had 23 years with him before me.
 
I would advise you to stay out of his relationship with his wife, whatever form it might take. It's not your place, even if you are co-primaries. Treat them as separate relationships. Only comment on events or behaviors that affect your relationship with him. Ask him to refrain from talking about her to you, if that bothers you. But really, it's none of your business if he want to try being friends with her or not, and it's not worth you getting upset when he ignores your advice and tries it anyway.
 
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BrigidsDaughter said:
I would advise you to stay out of his relationship with his wife. It's not your place, even if you are co-primaries. Treat them as separate relationships. Only comment on events or behaviors that effect your relationship with him. Ask him to refrain from talking about her to you, if that bothers you. But really, it's none of your business if he want to try being friends with her.
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I totally see your points. What's awkward is, we aren't co-primaries. She isn't a primary to him. Only I am. Yet she's married to him. Any other secondary person in either of my primaries' lives I could totally comment on, or even ask for some boundaries to make me comfortable. But here, I can't say much of anything. Its a fucked-up dynamic, at this point.
 
polybynature said:
What I find curious or hard to handle in my situation is that their marriage is falling apart while they are poly. He had the opportunity to turn to me, and I didn't mind being there, as I love him dearly. Our relationship has surpassed theirs in a romance sense, because they aren't a couple anymore, though sharing a home and some time. But I cant help but think, what if they rekindle, rebuild? What does that do to change what he and I have built? It's a little selfish, but I think we are all a little selfish in protecting our own desires.
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Turn it around. What if they end their marriage and he moves on? Your relationship with him might turn into the one he has with her, and you'll be the miserable one.

Look at what people create in their lives. He has what he wants, on some level, otherwise he would leave her. My guess is that his relationship with you would not be as good as it is if he did not have a shitty relationship with her. It's a way of punishing himself, or reinforcing old negative beliefs about himself (all subconscious choices), so he can feel deserving of good things. If suddenly, his fucked-up marriage were gone, he wouldn't know what to do, and things would start to slide downhill with you, to recreate the misery. We all live out patterns over and over again, unless we gain some self-awareness.
 
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nycindie said:
Turn it around. What if they end their marriage and he moves on? Your relationship with him might turn into the one he has with her, and you'll be the miserable one.
Look at what people create in their lives. He has what he wants, on some level. We all live out patterns over and over again, unless we gain some self-awareness.
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This is a very interesting point to ponder, NYCindie. I can totally see how his crappy marriage is his subconscious desire to punish himself, and in me he gets the reward of what is good and kind, etc. I hope he will find the self-realization that he does not NEED to punish or neglect himself for some unseeable slight he has committed in life. I hope he realizes he is good and whole for who he is, regardless of either of us. I feel like his continued desire to spend time with her reinforces this negative he craves and is stunting any personal growth.

They have some plans coming up that, to me, would be awkward and uncomfortable with someone you are no longer involved with. He admits to not even liking her anymore despite still loving her.

It's hard to relate to my own life, because I have kids, and they do not. In hard times, I have my children to think of and strengthen the fact that I am with their father. For them, I suppose that basis is years and years of memories.

I want to tell him to stop spending time with her, to set himself free. I know I can not. I am trying to just enjoy what we have, because it's wonderful. But I fear her returning, and then having to share, or give up, being primary.
 
What would be some of the consequences of having to share being primary? How would you feel about those consequences?
 
kdt26417 said:
What would be some of the consequences of having to share being primary? How would you feel about those consequences?
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If she and I were to be co-primaries? I feel like that takes a lot of work and friendship between the two people. Like my spouse and boyfriend talk, hang out, are close enough that it makes it easier to say "Hubs, I want a weekend away with BF" or "BF, lets give hubs some time off without the kids". It's the consideration, trust, and respect. I don't see his wife and me ever being able to be like that.

I tried very hard to be friends early on, was rebuffed, and now it seems she wants no part of either of us. We have a weeknight at the house that begins when they are still there around dinnertime (wife and her BF). My BF said we could just come and start preparing our dinner, even if they were there. That wasn't acceptable.
 
Questions, questions ... (Just answer the ones that are helpful and aren't too nosy.)

Sounds like there is some friction between you and your boyfriend's wife. Perhaps she is insecure about things in general because of the problems in her marriage? Was that marriage in trouble at the time when you tried to be friends with her? What is she like as a person? What are some of the things she says and does? Is she a good wife or bad?

So, what's his main reason for not divorcing her? Is it because he's afraid she can't take care of herself?

What's the main/biggest problem in that marriage? and, how does your spouse feel about all this?

What boundaries would you need to make you comfortable?
 
I'm sorry, why do you consider yourselves co-primaries? See, for me, you are in a primary relationship with your husband, whom you live with, and a secondary relationship with this guy. If he splits with his wife, he had no primary relationship, but does have his relationship with you. The reason why I'm saying this is because unless you can have those sorts of entanglements with him, such as sharing a home, finances, kids, joint purchases such as cars, that stuff, you have secondary entanglements. It sounds like you want to be this guy's wife, but you don't have room for anther primary relationship. You need to let him sort out who, if anyone, he wants in that role.

Step back, be his girlfriend and let him lead his life.
 
london said:
I'm sorry, why do you consider yourselves co-primaries? For me, you are in a primary relationship with your husband, and a secondary relationship with this guy. If he splits with his wife, he had no primary relationship, but does have his relationship with you. The reason why I'm saying this is because unless you can have those sorts of entanglements with him, such as sharing a home, finances, kids, joint purchases, you have secondary entanglements. It sounds like you want to be this guy's wife, but you don't have room for anther primary relationship. You need to let him sort out who, if anyone, he wants in that role.

Step back, be his girlfriend and let him lead his life.
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For me, being primary isn't just those things you listed. In that way, my husband I are one-and-only primaries. Where I consider it "co," is that I have the same level of emotional devotion to them, and they get equal say/priority in my time and attention. If he were truly secondary, my spouse would have say in how and whom my time is spent with, and my bf would not. From bf's side of it, I'm the only one loving and supporting him, having sex with him, taking trips, working out problems. I'm the one he turns to. I really don't like hierarchy at all, but they used to be very hierarchal. He could barely breathe without her permission. Now he does what he wants, when he wants, with me.
 
kdt26417 said:
Sounds like there is some friction between you and your boyfriend's wife. Perhaps she is insecure about things in general because of the problems in her marriage? Was that marriage in trouble at the time when you tried to be friends with her? What is she like as a person? What are some of the things she says and does? Is she a good wife or bad? What's his main reason for not divorcing her? Is it because he's afraid she can't take care of herself?

What's the main/biggest problem in that marriage? How does your spouse feel about all this? What boundaries would you need to make you comfortable?
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Friction is an understatement. I dislike her intensely. She either feels the same, or is ambivalent towards me. As a person, she is very selfish, and blames everyone else for her problems. She seeks attention and affirmation from everywhere, but is never happy.

These are things I know about her. I don't know her that well, as she's never wanted to get close.

In my eyes, she is not a good wife. She belittles him, calls him names, holds grudges from years ago, and blames him for everything that goes wrong. (I don't want to be too specific on a public forum.)

He stays because he isn't ready to let go.

Boundaries, if we were co-primaries? I'm not sure I could do it. I feel it works so well with him and my spouse because they are good friends, and the three of us. If I went to a friend's function they know I could bring both of them. I wouldn't have to pick and choose, or give someone priority. The three of us could work it out, or we could all go together. None of that could ever happen with the wife. With what I know of her, she'd demand it was her or no one.

This may be all moot. I don't think she's coming back, anyway. But he does.
 
polybynature said:
For me, being primary isn't just those things you listed. I have the same level of emotional devotion to them, and they get equal say/priority in my time and attention. From bf's side of it, I'm the only one loving, supporting, having sex with him, taking trips, working out problems. I really don't like hierarchy at all, but they used to be very hierarchal. He could barely breathe without her permission. Now he does what he wants, when he wants, with me.
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This may be actually related to why you are where you are: many people, if prompted to use labels to describe their relationships, don't use them in a way that determines hierarchy. They use them in a way that describes level of practical entanglement. Acknowledging that you cannot have a primary level of entanglement doesn't mean you love less, or their needs are less important. It might help you tolerate the fact you have even less room to say how and whom he does have that with.
 
Agreed. I much prefer the terms as levels of practical entanglements. I love hubby and boyfriend, and am committed to them both. But boyfriend has his own wife and kid, and hubby's girlfriend has her own husband. We are secondaries to the responsibilities that come with having shared households and children, and all of us accept that. We don't see it as a limit to the level of love or commitment we feel.

Co-primaries are possible, but I generally see that as sharing a household with both, either alternating days at different homes or sharing a home together as a group.
 
BrigidsDaughter said:
I much prefer the terms as levels of practical entanglements. Boyfriend has his own wife and kid and hubby's girlfriend has her own husband. We are secondaries in the responsibilities that come with having shared households and children. We don't see it as a limit to the level of love or commitment we feel to the relationships.

Co-primaries are possible, but I generally see that as sharing a household with both.
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I would have that if I could. Both guys know that. In a fantasy world I would cohabitate, or at least live in close proximity and share more with both.
 
Many porn stars are fluid bonded too.
 
My point is that fluid bonding, and your feelings about it, are irrelevant to the fact that you can't be the person your boyfriend lives with and that kind of stuff, not for the foreseeable future, anyway. That means you have zero say over how he meets his needs in that respect.

There isn't any doubt about how much you love and trust each other. Just sort of accept the limitations that are a consequence of finite resources and clashing circumstances
 
It sounds like about the only thing you can do about your boyfriend's marital problems is to wait until he is ready to free himself from that marriage. Are you of the firm opinion that he should leave his wife? (I'm guessing yes, but I always hesitate to assume.)
 
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