Mono/Non-Mono - Struggling to Accept

[gnc0758]

New here, and I hope that I am in the right place.

I had sexual fantasies of seeing my wife sleep with another man for some time. I told my wife about it, and she was not interested in the subject. She agreed to role playing for many months, but did not get anything out of it. She then reluctantly agreed to actually have sex with another man, and we found one on a swinger site. The other man was 20 years younger and in much better shape than me.

Upon watching them together, I began to feel jealous and inadequate and was not sexually excited like I was during the role playing. She wanted to continue and I did not. I agreed to allow her to continue because I felt so bad for coaxing her for so long. The 2 of them attempted to connect again over the next month, but it became evident that he used her for a one-night stand. I still do not get sexually excited by the thought of her sleeping with another man.

She wants to continue having recurring sex with another man. It has awakened some feelings in her, and she wants to explore them. I have agreed to allow her to continue, as I still feel bad about coaxing her for so long. I am sure that she would feel betrayal and resentment if I did not agree to allow her to continue. She is communicating with a few single men on the same swinger site that we used to find the first man.

However, I am stuck in the jealous feelings still. After 30 years of marriage, I fully trust her to not leave me and our marriage is otherwise very solid. I understand that this may not be forever, and she me lose interest after a while.

 

[LoveBunny]

So your wife sleeping with another man is only ok if she does so for YOUR gratification, but it's not ok if she does so for her own?

 

[gnc0758]

So your wife sleeping with another man is only ok if she does so for YOUR gratification, but it's not ok if she does so for her own?

I realize how selfish I was, and I feel very ashamed that I asked her to do that for my gratification in the fist place. I now realize how she must have felt when she was in participating in my fantasy and reality. I can understand if she has feelings of resentment or betrayal because of that.

I am willing to allow her to do it for her gratification, and I am having a hard time dealing with the jealous feelings that come up. My goal is to conquer those feelings, and not ask her to not sleep with other men.

 

[IndieSolo]

BWhen you consent to an open or poly situation, you are not "allowing" your wife to do anything -- she is not your property, after all. What you consent to is to accept the choices she makes and to handle your own reactions about them. She is an autonomous individual whether she is married or not, and only she is the boss of her body, sexuality, and mind.

You fooled yourself into believing that it was up to you to tell her what to do sexually to satisfy a fantasy of yours, and are now having second thoughts ("buyer's remorse") because you never considered the possibility that she might like it and you might not. Is what bothers you more about realizing you're not in charge of what she does with her body? In reality, you never were, but perhaps her claiming and owning her own desires scares you.

Personally, I think that perhaps you may want to discuss with your wife precautions about where and how she seeks out other partners, personal safety, safer sex methods, how to handle things if romance/emotional connections develop, and whether or not you want to be with other people sexually, too. But yeah, you opened Pandora's box so I think you owe it to both of you to look beyond your original selfishness and deal with the reality of your current situation. This is what you wanted - you just never thought it t hrough. There are lots of threads here about how to handle jealousy, envy, difficult issues, and how to have the tough talks necessary to flourish in these kinds of arrangements. Please take some time to read around these forums and feel free to ask whatever questions you have.

You are very welcome here. I commend you for for not becoming a dictator about it and realizing that you need to deal with the ramifications of what you created rather than just pulling the plug. Keep asking questions here, but be aware that you may get answers you won't like (being the internet and all).

 

[gnc0758]

BWhen you consent to an open or poly situation, you are not "allowing" your wife to do anything -- she is not your property, after all. What you consent to is to accept the choices she makes and to handle your own reactions about them. She is an autonomous individual whether she is married or not, and only she is the boss of her body, sexuality, and mind.

Thanks for clarifying that. My choice of words obviously state how I view my wife. A good first step for me to take in changing my mindset.

Personally, I think that perhaps you may want to discuss with your wife precautions about where and how she seeks out other partners, personal safety, safer sex methods, how to handle things if romance/emotional connections develop, and whether or not you want to be with other people sexually, too.

We have been talking about safety concerns, but not if romance/emotional connections develop. She feels that it will be more casual than that. As far as I am concerned, I have no sexual interests outside of our marriage.

You are very welcome here. I commend you for for not becoming a dictator about it and realizing that you need to deal with the ramifications of what you created rather than just pulling the plug.

Thanks for the compliment. I came here looking for support, and I feel quite welcome here.

 

[reflections]

I also recommend that you start considering the possibility of her falling in love with one of her partners. Neither Roger nor I went into our relationship with others with love on our radar, and yet both of us fell in love. You can't always prepare for it.

You might want to do some reading on the subject of non-monogamy, as you're learning. "Opening Up" is a great book that many people have recommended here.

 

[gnc0758]

I also recommend that you start considering the possibility of her falling in love with one of her partners. Neither Roger nor I went into our relationship with others with love on our radar, and yet both of us fell in love. You can't always prepare for it.

You might want to do some reading on the subject of non-monogamy, as you're learning. "Opening Up" is a great book that many people have recommended here.

I had not thought of that, thanks for the insight about potentially falling in love. How did that change the dynamics for you, given that you were not prepared for it? Given that we plan for me to stay mono, do you think that will cause more issues?

I purchased "Opening Up" about 2 weeks ago and have read half of the book so far. Very helpful.

 

[graviton]

I had not thought of that, thanks for the insight about potentially falling in love. How did that change the dynamics for you, given that you were not prepared for it? Given that we plan for me to stay mono, do you think that will cause more issues?

I purchased "Opening Up" about 2 weeks ago and have read half of the book so far. Very helpful.

You say that "we plan" for you to stay mono. That's fine if its what YOU decide. However issues can arise if you change your mind and decide you would like to see other women. A double standard is rarely healthy unless its entered into willingly and thoughtfully with the possibility of changing your mind. The resentment can build and destroy everything.

 

[reflections]

I had not thought of that, thanks for the insight about potentially falling in love. How did that change the dynamics for you, given that you were not prepared for it? Given that we plan for me to stay mono, do you think that will cause more issues?

I purchased "Opening Up" about 2 weeks ago and have read half of the book so far. Very helpful.

At the time that I fell in love with Jack, Roger was also mono. Open to meeting someone else, but didn't for at least 2 more years. Roger was amazing at being supportive - to be honest, I don't know how he did it. He knew I was in love with Jaxk before I even told him, and when I did, he was completely there for me. Perhaps he's had more poly beliefs than I had until I actually fell in love with two people at the same time. I have much more jealousy that I'm working through with him and Taylor than he ever had with me and Jack, though it helped that he and Jack were already friends. And I am completely willing to sit in uncomfortable emotions and deal with them, in order to support him in being the best of himself.

He started his relationship with Taylor saying it's just sex (not romantic). He said it to her, he said it to me. But his history of not having sex without an emotional connection cued me into the possibility of love. And by the second date, after being friends for a while, he told me he was in love with her. I knew before he even told me.

You are certainly able to choose to be mono. There are lots of members on here who have mono partners. In fact, my OSO, Jack, identifies as mono right now. I think that if I wanted another male partner, it could be difficult for him to understand why I would want that, when I have him and Roger. But I am open to that changing in the future, and if I decide to see other men, then we'll talk about how that doesn't change my love for him. I think he's more understanding of me having a female partner, since I only recently starting identifying as bi and would like to explore that part of myself. But I'm feeling quite happy with having my two guys in my life.

Glad to hear the book helps. I will say from my own experience, it gets better with time. Please feel free to keep asking questions, as you go through this transition and grieving peiod.

 

[gnc0758]

You say that "we plan" for you to stay mono. That's fine if its what YOU decide. However issues can arise if you change your mind and decide you would like to see other women. A double standard is rarely healthy unless its entered into willingly and thoughtfully with the possibility of changing your mind. The resentment can build and destroy everything.

We have discussed the idea of me not staying mono, and she has been the one to bring the subject up by asking me if I want to sleep with other women. It is usually in the context of how it would only be fair since she wants to explore sleeping with other men. I have always replied that I do not want to sleep with other women, primarily because I prefer that we both return to being mono with each other someday and don't want to add complexity to the situation. I can see where discussing the possibility of me changing my mind in the future is a good idea.

Aside from the increased chance of resentment, what other things should we consider as I agree to enter into this type of arrangement with her (where I am mono and she is not)?

To add a bit more of clarity, she has told me that she feels this might be a mid-life crisis, and she is seems to be drawn to men who are 20 years younger than us.

 

[Nadya]

To add a bit more of clarity, she has told me that she feels this might be a mid-life crisis, and she is seems to be drawn to men who are 20 years younger than us.

This of course very well could be a mid-life crisis for her, but... The "mid-life crisis" could also be just a term she has found to make sense of all of it for herself. I mean, she originally agreed to do this under pressure by you. It must have been a huge shock for her that she actually found it pleasurable!

The fact that she is drawn to younger men is no indicator of a mid-life crisis. It is fairly common that women aged 40+ (or 50+ or 60+) find young men attractive. The sex drive of a bit older women and 20-30 something men can be similar.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[gnc0758]

The fact that she is drawn to younger men is no indicator of a mid-life crisis. It is fairly common that women aged 40+ (or 50+ or 60+) find young men attractive. The sex drive of a bit older women and 20-30 something men can be similar.

I can see where her being drawn to younger men is not an indicator. I was surprised to hear her use the term "mid-life crisis" and it wasn't in the context of the age of men she is attracted to.

She has told me, and I can understand why, that she gets a huge ego boost when a younger man finds her attractive and desires her.

I feel that she is focusing less on the emotional connection aspect of it and more on the attention and sex aspects. That seems to be consistent with her taking steps to seek out younger men mostly. It's almost as if she is looking for a boy-toy to play with for a while until she has gotten it out of her system. She tells me that she is not looking for another long-term, emotional relationship.

Having said that, she has jokingly said several times over the past few years (even before I disclosed the fantasy of watching her have sex with another man) that she thinks it would be nice for me to have a "brother husband", a thought driven from her interest in the TV show, "Sister Wives". I have asked her to explain to me what she means, and she has told me that he and I would be good friends, share in the household chores and financial responsibilities, and she would have a relationship with both of us. There was a recent example of where she was feeling a bit down about something while I was at work, and she said that this would have been a great time for my brother husband to comfort her. Perhaps the 2 of us combined would make the perfect husband for her! She talks about in a way that makes me think that she would never even remotely consider acting on it. Similar to how I would like to wake up tomorrow 50 pounds lighter, or a million dollars richer.

 

[Invi]

You might ask her specifically about that. Find out if it's really just a joke she likes to bring up with you, or if there's a grain of truth behind it and perhaps she fantasizes about such a situation on occasion.

 

[reflections]

I also wonder that if she DID want an emotional connection, she may not feel safe sharing that with you. Not to say that you two don't have a great relationship or that she is "lying" to you, but more so that it's hard for her to even consider that as a possibility, as you're struggling with her even sharing sex with other people.

I say this from my own experience of Roger insisting that he wanted to only share sex with Taylor, not date her, initially. It was me who brought up the possibility of them falling in love, given how close they were as friends and how I also didn't plan to fall in love with Jack. In that conversation, Roger told me that he wasn't able to even think about that, given how hard it was for me to think about him sharing sex with someone else, much less having loving feelings for someone else. It was through my reassurances that I would adjust to any kind of relationship he and Taylor developed into that he realized he was already falling in love with her.

 

[gnc0758]

I also wonder that if she DID want an emotional connection, she may not feel safe sharing that with you.

Being married for 28 years, I can say that I have learned that a woman's mind never stops thinking! Many thoughts in there are never shared with anyone else.

 

[kdt26417]

Hi gnc0758,

The Struggling Mono Thread may be helpful to you, check it out. Also, here are some jealousy-related links:

Let us discuss the greeneye monster shall we?
How to slay the greeneyed beastie.

How To Contain The Green Monster
Jealousy, Envy, Insecurity, Etc.
How do you achieve compersion?

The Theory of Jealousy Management
The Practice of Jealousy Management

Jealousy and the Poly Family
Kathy Labriola: Unmasking the Green-Eyed Monster
Brené Brown: the Power of Vulnerability

When it comes to jealousy, what are you most afraid of, and why? Analyze your feelings, and see if you can tell where they're coming from.

Regards,
Kevin T.

 

[gnc0758]

she has jokingly said several times over the past few years (even before I disclosed the fantasy of watching her have sex with another man) that she thinks it would be nice for me to have a "brother husband", a thought driven from her interest in the TV show, "Sister Wives". I have asked her to explain to me what she means, and she has told me that he and I would be good friends, share in the household chores and financial responsibilities, and she would have a relationship with both of us. There was a recent example of where she was feeling a bit down about something while I was at work, and she said that this would have been a great time for my brother husband to comfort her. Perhaps the 2 of us combined would make the perfect husband for her! She talks about in a way that makes me think that she would never even remotely consider acting on it. Similar to how I would like to wake up tomorrow 50 pounds lighter, or a million dollars richer.

I brought the subject up to her yesterday, and she explained her realistic expectations further. She described it more as a friend with benefits. Someone who she can hang out with and talk to (similar to a girlfriend), but also have sex with.

 

[gnc0758]

When it comes to jealousy, what are you most afraid of, and why?

Thanks for the links to information about jealousy. There is a wealth of information on here, and it would take me a long time to find it all!

I have identified that my feelings of jealousy arise from fear that I will be deprived of her time and attention and fear that what makes our relationship special will be shared with or surpassed by another relationship that she has. I read an article "Are You in Poly Hell?" and several things resonated with how I am feeling.

Demotion: The primary partner has previously had you all to him or herself, and has not had to share your time, affection, attention, and loyalty with another lover.
• the partner who is feeling “demoted” often reports experiencing sadness, betrayal, distrust, a sense of loss and grieving, fears of abandonment
• they have lost the primacy of being the one and only lover, and they need to grieve that loss

 

[kdt26417]

Sounds like you are mostly concerned about losing time, attention, and specialness. These are reasonable concerns. Time and attention are limited resources, and you will no longer be "her one and only" if she is involved with another man.

You will have to go through a grieving process, with stages such as denial, anger, depression, bargaining, and acceptance. Some stages you may have to endure more than once. You also should think about what you can accept and live with in the long run. If something is a deal breaker for you, you should inform your wife of that fact.

Don't make any hasty decisions, do some more reading and thinking first. Hopefully the forum here can help you with some of the reading and thinking.

Regards,
Kevin T.

 

[gnc0758]

An update and request for more advice.

My wife stopped pursuing other men for several months at my request. About 3 months ago, I told her that I was feeling as if I could accept it better now. She has started pursuing other relationships, and I am struggling again.

The first post in this thread has the details, but I basically opened the door by revealing a fantasy that I had of seeing her have sex with another man. We tried it, I didn't like it, I wanted to stop, and she didn't. She said that I took her to Disneyland but wouldn't let her ride the rides.

So, now we are at a place where she believes in non-monogamy and I believe in monogamy. I am working to accept it, but I struggle daily, and I am worried that I will want out of our almost 30-year marriage because of this.

My main concerns are around losing time, attention, and specialness. I have told her when I feel excluded, and she has struggled to not react defensively in those conversations. She often is not as proactive as I would like to make me feel special, despite the fact that I have told her that I need that from her.

I keep finding myself asking the question, "What's in it for me?" Marriage is a give and take, and I feel as if I am giving so much and not receiving much from her in return.