Conflicted-- affair or poly?

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secretposter

New member
Hi, I'm new here. I know I'm going to get a lot of flak for what I'm about to type. Honestly, I'm not sure why I'm typing this here. Right now, I'm feeling okay, but I know as things progress not being open with my wife is going to drive me utterly bananas.

Anyway, here goes. Married for a long time to a woman I love to bits. (Call her Ellie.) Our relationship has been through some bloody difficult times, a lot of which is down to me. Problems because of my repressed sexuality in childhood jumped out at me like a lightning strike after marriage. I now accept that I'm bisexual and have poly tendencies. It's taken me a very very long time to accept this. Years of refusing to accept this caused depression and all sorts of crap in my marriage.

Anyway, we have discussed this a lot. After a lot of war between us, and more counselling than I'd care to admit, we are together and happy. Elli is bi too, but monoamorous, and as far as I can see, she's not for turning.

The thing is, I've met another woman, Zoey, who is in an open relationship, and is happy to remain so. We get on like a house on fire. What drives me nuts is the fact that I cannot tell Elli about this wonderful person in my life. It's frankly cracking me up. (I'm okay now.) I know as my relationship with Zoey progresses, it's going to become more difficult. It has reached the stage that losing either would break me.

Yes, I'm breaking all the rules, yes, I'm playing with fire, yes. I'm in a situation where I'm lying to my "primary" (god, I hate titles like that).

I hope that as the counselling progresses, Ellie will become more comfortable. I don't know. I do know that, as things stand, if I tell her about the other woman in my life it will crush her.
 
First, welcome to the forum. Many of us here, myself included, are relatively new to all this. In that sense, you're in good company.

secretposter said:
I know I'm going to get a lot of flak for what I'm about to type.
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Flak isn't likely, given what I've learned of people on the forum. Stern advice, tough love, the occasional good talkin' to, yes, but rarely flak, especially for people who 1) are in a vulnerable position, and 2) are up front about the fact that they are conflicted. as you are, in the very title of your post.

secretposter said:
We have discussed this a lot. After a lot of war between us, more counselling than I'd care to admit, we are together and happy. Ellie is bi too, but mono, and as far as I can see she's not for turning.

The thing is, I've met another woman, Zoey, who is in an open relationship and is happy to remain so. We get on like a house on fire. What drives me nuts is the fact that I cannot tell Ellie about this wonderful person in my life. It's frankly cracking me up.
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Okay, here's a stern bit of advice, from one newbie to another: you have to talk to your wife about this, right now, before things go any further. Be as judicious as you please in setting it up, maybe do it in the context of counseling, but tell her.

As for what to tell her, that you have developed strong feelings for another person is an important fact about you. It's not something you or she can wish away. It's not something you can ignore.

Does Ellie already know you lean poly? Have you discussed that aspect of yourself? Does she know what it means, i.e., that you are able to develop strong feelings for someone else without detracting from your feelings for and commitment to her? If she already knows that, telling her that you currently have strong feelings for someone else shouldn't come as that much of a surprise to her.

It's what you do on the basis of those feelings that matters. Once you've told her that you have feelings for this Zoey, you pretty much have to tell her what, if anything, you've done on the basis of those feelings. Again, past actions are now a matter of fact.

Once all that's out in the open, then have to figure out what to do next. That is not a matter of fact, but a matter of choice. Since it seems you've been doing the hard work of keeping your marriage going, it seems Ellie should be involved in whatever choices follow from all this.

secretposter said:
(I'm okay now.) I know as my relationship with Zoey progresses, it's going to become more difficult. It has reached the stage that losing either would break me.
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Here's another stern bit of advice. Put on the brakes, for now. If you allow the relationship with Zoey to "progress" without coming clean with Ellie, you will very quickly find yourself just plain cheating on her, if you aren't already doing so by withholding important information from her.

Just don't go there.

Besides, it's important to keep your feelings in perspective. It may feel as though losing Zoey would "break" you, but that may just be "NRE" talking.

(NRE = "new relationship energy", the giddy rush of emotion and urgency and near-obsession at the beginning of a new relationship, which can blow out of all proportion the importance of the relationship and your own feelings. If not acknowledged and treated with some caution, NRE can do serious harm to existing relationships that seem less immediately urgent. There are many, many posts on these forums about NRE. Check the glossary, and do a search for NRE.)

secretposter said:
I do know that as things stand, if I tell Ellie about the other woman in my life it will crush her.
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I won't presume to know about your relationship and its history, but imagine how much more crushing it would be when Ellie learns, and she will learn, sooner or later, of your deception.

("Deception" may be too strong a word for what you're doing now, which may be just withholding information to which Ellie is entitled by moral right. But, as things "develop," deception is almost bound to follow. Again, don't go there.)

Others may be able to advise you more fully on how to talk to Ellie about all this, and what, precisely, you should say. This is one of those situations in which your very choice of words is a matter for serious ethical reflection.

I wish you all the courage and strength you need for what's ahead.
 
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Well, good on you for coming here and posting, at least. Since you know the sort of reaction you're going to get, I see that as a desire to change.

No secret in life is completely safe. Do you really think Ellie might not find out?

If/when she does find out on her own, what do you think her reaction will be? Worse or better than if you told her yourself? Do you think you'd ever be able to fully gain back the trust you'd lose? How much of the progress you've made in therapy would be blown out of the water by her finding out?

That doesn't even touch the questions of what happens if you get an STD, what happens if Zoey gets pregnant. These things do happen.

You can either passively wait for this to explode in your face, or you can deal with it proactively and hopefully have a lesser explosion on your hands. Which would you prefer?

My advice is to tell Zoey that you plan to tell Ellie, and that you need a little time to work things out at home, you don't know how much. Then cut things off. THEN tell Ellie, and explain the step that you took. Tell her that you know this must be very hard to accept, and that you're so sorry, but that you love Zoey, and you want to try to find a way to move forward. No one can guarantee Ellie's response, but others have made this sort of thing work. A show of good faith can only help your chances, plus give you back a little of your self-respect.
 
"Once you've told Ellie that you have feelings for Zoey, you pretty much have to tell her what, if anything, you've done on the basis of those feelings. Again, past actions are now a matter of fact."

YES. This is a *very* important point. We've seen many times here when a person finds out about a partner's indiscretions, begins to heal and regain trust, and THEN find out that there are more things that were still being hidden, and all that positive progress is completely lost and then some. When you come clean, come clean 100% if you care about trying to make it work.
 
Thank you all for the responses, advice I would give myself were I in another's shoes.

What drives me crazy is that Zoey came into my life unexpectedly.

Yes, this may simply be NRE still filtering. Yes I'm a newbie. Yes, I have a lot to learn.

More than a little overwhelmed at times. The secrecy is cutting me. I look into Ellie's eyes and I see the trust for the first time in years. I think of the journey we're on, the hurdles crossed, the time spent, the re-learning of each other. It is all in jeopardy. My other partner literally has my life in her hands, and that scares me sometimes.

The coldly logical side of me shouts "End it now!" The side that enjoys her company shouts that I have never been in a position like this before. I can just be me, talk, and not be condemned for being me. I am at a point in my life where there is someone in my life that I connect with in a different way.

I feel like such a child at times, grappling with constructs that fascinate me, whilst not fully understanding them entirely. It feels like a new journey, one which I would dearly like to take, incorporating into my life as best I can. I think I'm babbling now, but I really am caught between two stools.
 
secretposter said:
More than a little overwhelmed at times, the secrecy is cutting me. I look into Ellie's eyes and I see the trust for the first time in years. I think of the journey we're on, the hurdles crossed, the time spent, the re-learning of each other. It is all in jeopardy.
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secretposter said:
The coldly logical side of me shouts, "End it now!" The side that enjoys her company shouts that I have never been in a position like this before. I can just be me, talk, and not be condemned for being me.
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I'm sorry, but there's still only stern advice for you. You seem to need a good talkin'-to.

[Commence talkin'-to.]

You HAVE to stop now . . . but what you have to stop is the secrecy.

Do it now.

Just do it.

There is no other way.

Seriously.

Whether anything else stops as a consequence of that is up to you, your wife, and Zoey.

secretposter said:
My other partner literally has my life in her hands, and that scares me sometimes.
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This sounds more than a little like a cop-out. You have your life in your hands. You have to choose.

Also, might it not be a bit soon to refer to the other woman as a "partner", as though your relationship with her is already a "primary" relationship, co-equal with your marriage. It takes time to develop that kind of relationship and, it seems to me, it's not the sort of relationship that can thrive in secret.

secretposter said:
I really am caught between two stools.
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Then let yourself drop to the ground, take your bruises, and see what happens when you try to stand up.

The only way out of your predicament is through.

End the secrecy.

Do it now.

[End of talkin'-to.]

Sorry about that. It's strong medicine, but it's the only medicine that will help.

P.S. One picky little point: It's much easier for people to read and respond to posts that have paragraph breaks. Could you edit your last post to include them?
 
Lying to your wife, hiding your relationship, and maintaining secrecy is NOT polyamory. It's cheating. You can call it whatever you want. However, if you are not being honest with your wife, you are cheating.

Do with that what you want. However, continuing down the path you are going can easily destroy your marriage.

Personally, I've lived through both consensual openness and cheating in my marriage. The consensual openness, and now the polyamory, have NEVER been an issue in my marriage. The cheating nearly destroyed us. It destroys 2/3 of marriages where it occurs, actually. Anyone who has survived cheating can tell you it's not the SEX that is the deep, devastating blow to the relationship; it's the lying that destroys it.
 
secretposter said:
I know this. I know that all the rules are being broken on this one. This I know.
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Then what are you going to do?

If the answer is that you're just going to drift along on your current course, continuing to cheat on your wife, then why did you post to this forum?

There is no point asking for advice unless you know you have a choice to make.

And, really, you have no choice but to choose. Not choosing is also a choice.

So, I ask again, what are you going to do?
 
secretposter said:
I know this. I know that all the rules are being broken on this one. This I know.
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I'll phrase it slightly differently than Hyperskeptic. I'll encourage you to stop thinking about "rules" and instead just ask you this:
what do you possibly hope will be the outcome if you continue in your current course? What positive end goal are your actions striving for?
 
secretposter said:
I know this. I know that all the rules are being broken on this one. This I know.
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Fine, then no flak, not condemnation or anything like that.

But as the husband of mennodaughter let me make the options clear:

You can either:

1) Come clean, NOW, before the next time you even think about Zoey. It will hurt Ellie, it will hurt you, and it may destroy your marriage. It may be too late.

OR

2) You can wait, hedge, lie, wait for Ellie to find out. That will destroy her, destroy you, and almost undoubtedly destroy your marriage.

I trust you didn't chose to be where you are; but here you and it is time to make a decision. Which will you pick?
 
I thought it all a bit vague, too. Thanks for asking what I was wondering, NYCindie.

I agree that this has to stop right now. Even if you haven't had sex, or touched each other in a way that is sexual, stop, right now. You say you know this stuff, so listen to yourself. It sounds like you will end up with nothing if this goes any further.

I am hoping you haven't done anything stupid yet, but one thing seems for sure; you haven't got to the stage where that pain you feel and guilt has solidified and become normal to the point of ignoring it, rationalizing it and turning it into something that rots the very core of your being until you are no longer the person you know and love. You seem to be grasping at trusting yourself.

Now is the time to act. In the company of your therapist, tell Ellie what is going on. I have a mono partner. It's possible to get through this with some compromise, some slow movement and trying to understand that the two of you speak two different languages. Zoey will wait if she is meant to be. There is no rushing into this stuff, anyway, especially if you are looking for a long-term thing. So take your time. Slow down and let Ellie catch up for a bit.

Try looking at some "cheating" threads by doing a search for "cheating" in the search engine. There are a lot of stories here of what happens when you cheat, what can be done and what kind of process can be gone through.
 
Please forgive my vagueness. I am not about to go into detail on a public forum. Suffice to say that we have been intimate.

I did not expect this relationship to develop. It was an out-of-the blue sort of thing. We met, hit it off, and have been seeing each other for a while now.
 
secretposter said:
Please forgive my vagueness. Suffice to say that we have been intimate. I did not expect this relationship to develop, it was an out-of-the blue sort of thing. We met, hit it off, and have been seeing each other for a while now.
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Sorry if it seems like I'm harping on this. I really just want to be helpful, if I can be.

One thing you keep saying stands out for me, and raises a question you should probably be asking yourself. You keep saying this relationship arose unexpectedly; you weren't looking for it; it just sort of happened, on its own, in spite of you. You may not mean that the way I'm hearing it, but too often I've heard people use that kind of language to try to avoid taking responsibility for the circumstances in which they find themselves. I've had students try to weasel out of responsibility for obvious acts of wholesale academic dishonesty by crying: "But I didn't mean to do any harm!" That doesn't wash, whether the cheating is academic or sexual. The harm is done anyway, and if you just kind of drifted into the current circumstance, just sort of let it happen, then you are responsible for letting yourself drift, for just letting things happen.

You are also responsible for what you do next.

As I tried to say before, that you are drawn to Zoey is a psychological fact about you; it's a neurochemical addiction. What you do about that attraction is not a matter of fact, but a matter of choice, and not choosing is also a choice.

(To give this some context, I have for some time been powerfully attracted to a younger woman with whom it would, for professional reasons, be inappropriate to have any relationship with other than a somewhat formal friendship. That I am madly in love with her is really no one's fault. It just happened. Had I pursued an intimate relationship with her, I would rightly have been held responsible for wrongdoing. By the way, my wife knows about my crush and sympathizes with my frustration over it. That helps immensely.)

So, I'll sound the refrain again. You are where you are. What do you do next?

Oh, and wallowing in guilt, repeating that you've broken the rules (which implies they cannot be repaired or restored?), may be just another way of evading responsibility. "In for a dime, in for a dollar" is not a viable principle in this case.

I guess what most of us who have replied are trying to say, in part, is that there is no way for you to avoid responsibility. You face a difficult choice. There will be damage and pain any way you go, though perhaps less pain and more hope of recovery in one direction than another.

Own up to your situation. Embrace your responsibilities. Find the path that will allow you save as much as possible of your self worth and your relationships with the people who care for you.

Maybe I could be more positive about this: find the path that gives you the best hope of living and loving without deception (including self-deception) and go that way, even if it's the hardest thing you've ever done.
 
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Good morning, secretposter. What's your biggest fear in coming clean to Ellie? Are you worried that she is going to leave you when she finds out that you've been seeing someone else? Are you worried that she is going to forbid you from seeing Zoey? In either case, the chances of this happening are much less likely if the truth comes from you, rather than her finding out from another source. Also, Ellie deserves to make an informed decision for herself about what structure HER relationship takes.

If this really is a dealbreaker for her, and under no circumstances does she want to be involved in an open relationship, then all that is happening is that you are putting off the inevitable. If, though, there is a chance that she will be open to you having other loves in your life, then the work has to be done on both your parts eventually, and it might as well start now.

There is no easy way out of this, and no guarantees. You're not going to know what her reaction will be until you tell her about what has been going on. This isn't going to be easy at all, but it does have to be done so you can move into the next phase of your life, whatever that is going to look like.
 
It is possible to suddenly fall in love with someone. Sometimes that isn't a choice. What is a choice is what you do with it. Unfortunately, you decided to create a situation where you didn't compound the love in your life, but jeopardized what you had by cheating. Now your new love is soiled and your old love is false in the eyes of your wife. Love has become scarce and impure, where you could have made it abundant and beautiful, and all because of the path you chose. At least, that's what I learned in cheating myself. It's possible to turn it around, but you've made a lot of work for yourself and have likely damaged someone who is innocent. I would have less respect for someone who chose to cheat with me.

So what will you do? We have given you a lot of advice and directed you many places. Have you decided? It sounds like the time is now to decide to keep lying and cheating, or getting about coming clean and having integrity.
 
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You might want to read this thread http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?p=114580#post114580 at around page 8 and 9 and any other threads tagged "pacing."

I realize this is really hard for you. I can completely empathize, as can many people here. Many of us are saying it like it is because we have been in the place of any of you in this dynamic. Please realize that the push to come clean comes from compassion. It is almost always the best solution. To me, it's the best solution in your scenario. I feel for you. I know how crippling it can be to realize what you've done and having to now come clean about it.
 
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