Hello,
I've been lurking on the threads for a few weeks and I've finally decided to get a bit of advice about my own situation.
I'm a 23-year old bisexual woman who is in a 5-year relationship with a 36-year old straight man. We're involved in our city's BDSM scene and are sort of evolving from a semi-monogamish relationship into... well, I'm not really sure where this is going.
For years we had been having semi-regular threesomes with great women and had relationships with them, but eventually things would fizzle out or circumstances would sort of end our relationships.
Then we came into the BDSM scene and I was quite popular with the pretty young girls. Unfortunately, my partner wasn't as popular, because he would shut down and wouldn't engage in flirting, etc. I continually tried to help him and advised him on how his approach wasn't working. This situation continued for months.
He wasn't entirely unsuccessful. We have now several partners together and continue to see them. After a while, I succumbed to the desire of having lots of lady sex, asked permission for it, and we evolved the relationship a bit. I encouraged him to do the same, but he continually told me it wasn't possible. I forced him to negotiate with me and to create an agreement for us so that I would know what was ok, what was not, and how I could avoid hurting him.
But then, for the 5 or 6 months I had tons of lady love (and also planned tons of regular fun with our shared partners for both of us), he continually made comments about 'how much fun' I was having, and how he was having no fun, completely ignoring the two partners we shared together, and the several women we had had great scenes with. When told he was being mean and passive aggressive, he refused to acknowledge any problems, and told me that I couldn't expect him to not comment on my doings. But then continually told me he was ok with what I was doing.
Not only that, at parties and events I always tried to plan scenes with him, gave him first dibs on my dance card, etc. But he NEVER seemed interested, and the few times I forced him to play with me and set up dates with others for us both, he completely sabotaged them, or worse, made it seem like it was a chore for him.
Finally, after a melodramatic crisis (where he threatened to leave the BDSM scene he brought us to, and tried to convince me I didn't need to stop), I managed to convince him to try for himself, and explained EXACTLY and brutally what he was doing wrong and how it was hurting him, and me. Eventually, he listened to what I had been telling him for months, and started looking, but refused to negotiate the new terms of our relationship. For another month and a half he continued to refuse to negotiate the new terms of our relationship and the new boundaries, etc.
Two Saturdays ago, we woke up in the morning. We were about to do some work in the basement. I again tried to get him to negotiate with me and at least have a conversation about him getting his own play partners, which he told me he was pursuing. He then told me it was totally irrational to say that it was likely he would get a play partner easily, and he would discuss it when it seemed likely to happen. I told him that I didn't like surprises, that I wouldn't appreciate being surprised by something, that I would rather discuss before it was likely. He refused to discuss it again. I let it go.
That evening, we went to a party, and we played a bit together. He was in a good mood and we played with another friend of ours. Then I went out for a cigarette.
When I came back in 5 minutes later he was tying up, fondling and beating another girl. No warning, no notice, not even a glance while he was doing it. I stayed calm. It was a small apartment, so I had a drink, stayed a bit, then quietly went to the rest room to have a mini-freak out. I came back out. They were still going, so I quietly sucked it up and chatted nervously with friends. When they were done, I waited a bit, chatted quietly, then went out for another cigarette. My partner came out looking at me nervously. By then I was livid and a bit tipsy. I quietly and privately told him that I didn't appreciate being surprised, brought up the morning's discussion, and told him that I had stepped out for only a moment. He couldn't have let me know about what he was about to do?!
He apologized, acknowledged that he was wrong, and we went home a short while later. It was late, and I was a bit drunk, so we didn't negotiate then, but I had a bit of angry sex with him.
The next evening we had an already planned date with a partner who was quite skittish and busy. We went ahead with the date and she ended up leaving early anyway. So, after some dinner, I brought up the situation the night before and told him I still wasn't happy with him and the way he had gotten his play situation, but that I was okay with him having play partners. He got angry at me, saying how I didn't have a right to be angry because of all the partners I had. I reminded him that I always had a conversation with him beforehand and sought permission. He told me it wouldn't have been possible to get permission. I asked him how it was that he couldn't have said, "Just one moment, let me go to the bathroom, get my supplies, go talk to my partner, etc." Would she have immediately run away or something?
Anyway, we were both pissed at each other and the negotiation went badly. I ended up capitulating and he got the right to do whatever he wanted, without permission, or even talking to me, including going out on dates alone. And when I brought up the possibility of me doing the same, he became vengeful and asked me if it was so I could be out 6 nights a week on dates. Then told me I was trying to keep score.
That last part really hurt my feelings and it still hurts a week later.
I have previous permission to go out on dates with shared partners when he is out of town, to do relationship upkeep, and because I get lonely (and he's often out of town for a few weeks at a time). I rarely do anything with our other partners than cuddle a bit and then we talk about him, or her other partners. I don't get to be particularly intimate with any of my play partners. I avoid it, because he has always said that he doesn't want to share my affections. But now he wants to go out on dates alone and get play partners, but won't concede that a date is generally more of a connection builder than sex, and that it's emotionally threatening to me.
How can I approach fixing this situation? How can I make him believe that I value him and our relationship, even though he assumes I don't? How can I make him understand that he needs to be open and honest about his desires and needs?
I don't know what to do with this situation. It hurts because I feel like not only does he assume I don't value him, he doesn't value my opinions or my feelings.
I've been lurking on the threads for a few weeks and I've finally decided to get a bit of advice about my own situation.
I'm a 23-year old bisexual woman who is in a 5-year relationship with a 36-year old straight man. We're involved in our city's BDSM scene and are sort of evolving from a semi-monogamish relationship into... well, I'm not really sure where this is going.
For years we had been having semi-regular threesomes with great women and had relationships with them, but eventually things would fizzle out or circumstances would sort of end our relationships.
Then we came into the BDSM scene and I was quite popular with the pretty young girls. Unfortunately, my partner wasn't as popular, because he would shut down and wouldn't engage in flirting, etc. I continually tried to help him and advised him on how his approach wasn't working. This situation continued for months.
He wasn't entirely unsuccessful. We have now several partners together and continue to see them. After a while, I succumbed to the desire of having lots of lady sex, asked permission for it, and we evolved the relationship a bit. I encouraged him to do the same, but he continually told me it wasn't possible. I forced him to negotiate with me and to create an agreement for us so that I would know what was ok, what was not, and how I could avoid hurting him.
But then, for the 5 or 6 months I had tons of lady love (and also planned tons of regular fun with our shared partners for both of us), he continually made comments about 'how much fun' I was having, and how he was having no fun, completely ignoring the two partners we shared together, and the several women we had had great scenes with. When told he was being mean and passive aggressive, he refused to acknowledge any problems, and told me that I couldn't expect him to not comment on my doings. But then continually told me he was ok with what I was doing.
Not only that, at parties and events I always tried to plan scenes with him, gave him first dibs on my dance card, etc. But he NEVER seemed interested, and the few times I forced him to play with me and set up dates with others for us both, he completely sabotaged them, or worse, made it seem like it was a chore for him.
Finally, after a melodramatic crisis (where he threatened to leave the BDSM scene he brought us to, and tried to convince me I didn't need to stop), I managed to convince him to try for himself, and explained EXACTLY and brutally what he was doing wrong and how it was hurting him, and me. Eventually, he listened to what I had been telling him for months, and started looking, but refused to negotiate the new terms of our relationship. For another month and a half he continued to refuse to negotiate the new terms of our relationship and the new boundaries, etc.
Two Saturdays ago, we woke up in the morning. We were about to do some work in the basement. I again tried to get him to negotiate with me and at least have a conversation about him getting his own play partners, which he told me he was pursuing. He then told me it was totally irrational to say that it was likely he would get a play partner easily, and he would discuss it when it seemed likely to happen. I told him that I didn't like surprises, that I wouldn't appreciate being surprised by something, that I would rather discuss before it was likely. He refused to discuss it again. I let it go.
That evening, we went to a party, and we played a bit together. He was in a good mood and we played with another friend of ours. Then I went out for a cigarette.
When I came back in 5 minutes later he was tying up, fondling and beating another girl. No warning, no notice, not even a glance while he was doing it. I stayed calm. It was a small apartment, so I had a drink, stayed a bit, then quietly went to the rest room to have a mini-freak out. I came back out. They were still going, so I quietly sucked it up and chatted nervously with friends. When they were done, I waited a bit, chatted quietly, then went out for another cigarette. My partner came out looking at me nervously. By then I was livid and a bit tipsy. I quietly and privately told him that I didn't appreciate being surprised, brought up the morning's discussion, and told him that I had stepped out for only a moment. He couldn't have let me know about what he was about to do?!
He apologized, acknowledged that he was wrong, and we went home a short while later. It was late, and I was a bit drunk, so we didn't negotiate then, but I had a bit of angry sex with him.
The next evening we had an already planned date with a partner who was quite skittish and busy. We went ahead with the date and she ended up leaving early anyway. So, after some dinner, I brought up the situation the night before and told him I still wasn't happy with him and the way he had gotten his play situation, but that I was okay with him having play partners. He got angry at me, saying how I didn't have a right to be angry because of all the partners I had. I reminded him that I always had a conversation with him beforehand and sought permission. He told me it wouldn't have been possible to get permission. I asked him how it was that he couldn't have said, "Just one moment, let me go to the bathroom, get my supplies, go talk to my partner, etc." Would she have immediately run away or something?
Anyway, we were both pissed at each other and the negotiation went badly. I ended up capitulating and he got the right to do whatever he wanted, without permission, or even talking to me, including going out on dates alone. And when I brought up the possibility of me doing the same, he became vengeful and asked me if it was so I could be out 6 nights a week on dates. Then told me I was trying to keep score.
That last part really hurt my feelings and it still hurts a week later.
I have previous permission to go out on dates with shared partners when he is out of town, to do relationship upkeep, and because I get lonely (and he's often out of town for a few weeks at a time). I rarely do anything with our other partners than cuddle a bit and then we talk about him, or her other partners. I don't get to be particularly intimate with any of my play partners. I avoid it, because he has always said that he doesn't want to share my affections. But now he wants to go out on dates alone and get play partners, but won't concede that a date is generally more of a connection builder than sex, and that it's emotionally threatening to me.
How can I approach fixing this situation? How can I make him believe that I value him and our relationship, even though he assumes I don't? How can I make him understand that he needs to be open and honest about his desires and needs?
I don't know what to do with this situation. It hurts because I feel like not only does he assume I don't value him, he doesn't value my opinions or my feelings.
