Everything looks cool, but no sex yet.

[starmonkey]

I would love to hear other members' takes on my situation.

I'm fairly new to polyamory. I've been trying it for about a year. Last week I met a girl on OKCupid, and we hit it off really well. She is easy to talk to, there is good communication, etc.

We both have very high libidos. We love sex.

We have talked very openly, and we are both in a situation where we are interested in each other as potential new primaries. (I'm not a huge fan of the heretical terms, but I don't have anything better.)

We hung out several day the last week. Things have been great, but we still haven't had sex with each other.

Both of us are sexually active with other people. I want to have sex with her, but she is hesitant. We talked about it, and she let me know she is still stinging from her last potential primary relationship, and the reason she is hesitant with me is because she views me as potentially more serious. I think I can understand where she is coming from, but at the same time, I feel a little left out that she is able to have sex with other people, but not me.

I read something posted here in another thread: http://markmanson.net/fuck-yes This made a lot of sense to me. If I am going to start a relationship, I want my partner to be as enthusiastic as I am, to be basically, "Fuck, yes. Let's go for it!"

I am still pretty new at this, so I can still feel little twinges of insecurity around the situation, but I've been able to manage it.

The thing is, I'm not sure how much of my insecurity is just normal new-to-poly variety - or is it being inflamed but the lack of sexual intimacy?

She likes to share details of our encounters with each other as a turn-on, and I'm game to give it a try. It is a turn-on, but the thing is, when I hear her sexual exploits, I want to head over to her place and fuck her. Right now, it is a little frustrating to not have a sexual outlet with her.

I really do like her, and I think there is long-term potential with her, so I'm willing to experience some frustration with her. At the same time, we are both sluts and love sex (historically, for both of us, the time in a relationship before having sex is in hours, not days), so I want to build a sexual bond with her. But I think I want to build it with someone with the same "fuck, yeah" attitude.

There is one other factor I think worth mentioning: she has a three-year old son I am meeting tonight. I am pretty floored that she is comfortable enough after a week to be game for that, and in a very real sense, this means more to me then delaying sex. They are obviously a package deal, and I wouldn't be surprised if we will end up moving forward once I meet her son.

Anyway, what do you guys think?

 

[Marcus]

We are interested in each other as potential new primaries. I'm not a huge fan of the heretical terms, but I don't have anything better.

Partner, lover, girlfriend, roommate, life partner, buddy, friend, interest, romance, or squeeze.

We hung out several day out of the last week. Things have been great, but we still haven't had sex with each other... I feel a little left out that she is able to have sex with other people but not me.

It doesn't matter what your sex drives are like, there is no formula for when people should have sex with each other.

There is also no relation, none whatsoever, between how she behaves with other people versus how she behaves with you. For your own sake, I highly suggest you drop that train of thought entirely; it will only cause you harm and drive a wedge between you and the person you are hoping to build intimacy with.

I want my partner to be as enthusiastic as I am, to be basically, "Fuck, yes. Let's go for it!"

So this article told you that she needs to jump in the sack with you immediately?

Pump the breaks, take a deep breath, realize that this is not a problem. What you are describing is a person you just met and are hitting it off with. How is the fact that she hasn't gobbled your knob yet a real issue? What's the rush?

 

[opalescent]

Dude, it's been a week. Relax. Sounds like things have been going well for a week, in the direction you want. So let things come to you.

 

[IndieSolo]

I think the biggest problem is that you both have already set yourself up with the expectation that this be a primary relationship right off the bat, while you don't even really know each other. A primary, serious relationship takes time to develop, so why would you even give yourselves that designation now, when you are practically strangers? You already referred to her as your partner. Really? That's a lot of pressure to heap on top of just getting to know whether or not you are compatible with a person! Think about it. Wouldn't it seem ridiculous for a person to go up to someone and say, "You will be my serious boyfriend," or "You will be my serious girlfriend," before even having much quality time together? By doing this, you've both also taken away the excitement of discovery!

Why don't you both just relax and approach it as, "Let's date and see if we enjoy each other's company; let's get to know each other and see what happens"? And if sex and/or a serious commitment seems appropriate, do it. If not, don't.

 

[starmonkey]

Partner, lover, girlfriend, roommate, life partner, buddy, friend, interest, romance, or squeeze.

OK, main squeeze, then. It is a term she used, and it fits what I'm looking for.

There is also no relation, none whatsoever, between how she behaves with other people versus how she behaves with you. I highly suggest you drop that train of thought entirely; it will only cause you harm and drive a wedge between you and the person you are hoping to build intimacy with.

Yea - that make sense, I can see how drawing a comparison like that is counter-productive. My goal isn't to drive a wedge. When I look for a relationship between how I behave with my other romances and how I behave with her, there isn't one at all. It makes sense that there isn't one the other way around. I don't know what it is that drives me to view it like that, as a comparison.

So this article told you that she needs to jump in the sack with you immediately?

No, nothing about her at all, no "she should" do anything, sack-wise or otherwise. That is the opposite of what I want. I'm just asking what she is comfortable with. It told me something about myself-- two things, actually. The first is that I want to go into relationships with "fuck, yeah" passion; the other is that I want that feeling to be reciprocal. I want a "fuck, yeah" squeeze, not in the sense that I think someone should change where that are at, but I should be selective in what I choose to pursue.

How is the fact that she hasn't gobbled your knob yet a real issue? What's the rush?

I'm not sure that is the issue with me. I think I just like that beginning part of a relationship, where you have this crazy desire to fuck each other constantly. I think it has more to do with me seeking someone on the same page as me. She has been hesitant around intimacy with me, which I'm not used to. It feels strange. It makes me feel a little uneasy, wondering if she really is on the same page I am.

As far as why the rush sex-wise, some of it is just rutty horniness. I get the sense we would have really great sex, and I'm eager, but there is another part that I cannot quite articulate. The best thing I can come up with is that I want her to want me without wanting to make her want me, or make her anything at all.

I get the sense that she both wants me badly, and is holding back sexually, which might be a good thing. But it feels a bit unsettling and confusing to me.

On an intellectual level, I can recognize her willingness to have me meet her son this quickly mean a hell of a lot more than wanting to jump on my junk on the intimacy scale. I was surprised but really pleased when she agreed to it.

Dude, it's been a week. Relax. Sounds like things have been going well for a week, and in the direction you want. So let things come to you.

Yeah, I know. It is going in the direction I want. I know it has only been a week. Honestly, I'm a little surprised I'm feeling this way after a week. That is not typically my MO. I know this will probably be a shocker, but relaxing is something that does not always come easy to me. The funny thing is that I am incredibly laid back with just about everything else in my life.

I think the biggest problem is that you both have already set yourself up with the expectation that this be a primary relationship right off the bat, while you don't even really know each other. A primary, serious relationship takes time to develop, so why would you even give yourselves that designation now when you are practically strangers? You already referred to her as your partner. Really? That's a lot of pressure to heap on top of just getting to know whether or not you are compatible with a person! Think about it. Wouldn't it seem ridiculous for a person to go up to someone and say, "You will be my serious boyfriend," or "You will be my serious girlfriend," before even having much quality time together? By doing this, you've both taken away the excitement of discovery.

I've had the same thought, and it is kind of crazy. I think on some level we are both moving fast emotionally because we do like each other, and have chemistry, even though we are still getting to know each other. The intent isn't to create pressure, but it might be creating it despite intention.

I see my other dating partners something like once every week or two. I am giving her a larger chunk of my time to give it more room to go where I would like to see it go. I may have developed an expectation due to this. I will have to give that some thought.

Why don't you both just relax and approach it as, "Let's date and see if we enjoy each other's company; let's get to know each other and see what happens"?

That's a pretty good question. It makes perfect rational sense to keep it more casual, and I would give the same advice to a friend. For me, it is more difficult to actually implement in this case. I don't know why.

 

[bookbug]

Dude, the thing of it is, no matter how compatible, how similar you are, the fact remains that because of the gender difference, she is going to process things differently from you. I think having you meet her son speaks volumes. She is sharing with you something far more important to her than her body.

And frankly, I think you should take her at her word when she says she is holding back because she sees in you the potential to become her main squeeze. I know that *seems* counter-intuitive, yet it means she wants to see how the other elements fall into place. Why? Because if they fall as you both would like them to, then sex is going to have a different significance to her than it does with other people.

Sex is communication. Sometimes it says, this is just fucking fun! And sometimes it says sacred bond. She may be feeling that sex with you is going to say something more along the lines of sacred bond, and wants to be sure that is the case before engaging.

 

[GalaGirl]

I think I can understand where she is coming from. But at the same time, I feel a little left out that she is able to have sex with other people but not me.

So she chooses to participate sex with other people at this time. She has not yet chosen to participate in sex with you. She's given you a reason.

You could accept this is what it is at this time. No, you aren't going to get "throw caution to the winds!" sex with a woman you have known for one week.

You might get passionate sex with a woman when you've known her two weeks, two months, or two years. Who knows? You might even have it more than once with her.

Let it unfold as it will. Stop comparing how her relationships with others have unfolded, or how your previous relationships unfolded. You and she are not you and others, or her and others.

You could masturbate and take edge off while you wait for it to unfold. How fast you have sex is not a litmus test for this being a long-haul runner.

I see that you are anxious to have something here and secure the relationship, but pushing too hard for too much too fast is off-putting for some people.

BREATHE. Literally. Your brain needs air to function. Listen to calming music, if that helps relax your brain. Maybe stretch your muscles out and check you aren't holding anything in tension.

When you tell your muscles to relax that sends a message to brain to relax. Your brain doesn't have to be on high alert, poised for the flight or fight response. Take a walk. Ride a bike. Do do whatever your chill-out activities are, and... well... chill out. You will be okay.

 

[starmonkey]

No matter how compatible, how similar you are, the fact remains that because of the gender difference, she is going to process things differently from you.

This keeps coming up and I keep forgetting this. For about 15 years, I had exclusively dated men, whom I have an easier time understanding emotionally. Dating woman is a fairly recent thing. The funny thing is, the way woman process does confuse me. And it also is something I find powerfully alluring.

I think having you meet her son speaks volumes. She is sharing with you something far more important to her than her body.

Yeah, I get that. I really was floored she wants me to. Her son is everything to her, as he should be.

I think you should take her at her word when she says she is holding back because she sees in you the potential to become her main squeeze. I know that *seems* counter-intuitive. Yet it means she wants to see how the other elements fall into place. Why? Because if they fall as you both would like them to, then sex is going to have a different significance to her than it does with other guys.

Sex is communication. Some times it says, this is just fucking fun! And sometimes it says sacred bond. She may be feeling that sex with you is going to say something more along the lines of sacred bond - and wants to be sure that is the case before engaging.

I am taking her at her word. It is the seeming counter-intuitive part that confuses my male brain. This is going to sound strange, but it is flattering in a way I have difficulty articulating, while at the same time it also seems sort of backward. It is this kind of though-conflict that sometimes makes me feel like I'm in the spin cycle.

So she chooses to participate sex with other people at this time. She has not yet chosen to participate in sex with you. She's given you a reason.

A very good reason, one that shows me without ambiguity how much she cares about me.

You could accept this is what it is at this time.

I don't really have a choice. I need to accept that. The only option I have to change it is leave the relationship, which is the last thing I want to do. I will not and do not want to control her in any way.

Let if unfold as it will. Stop comparing how her relationships with others have unfolded.

Marcus said the same thing earlier in the thread, and I know he is right. I'm trying. I can see pretty damn clearly that the compulsion to compare has no value. If I come up short, it fuels my insecurities, which is worthless. And if I come out ahead it falsely panders to my insecurities-- equally worthless. I don't know what is driving the comparison... perhaps it is my insecurities themselves. BTW, I'm pretty damn tired of these f***ing petty BS insecurities.

I see that you are anxious to have something here and secure the relationship. But pushing too hard for too much too fast is off putting to some people.

I do feel a compulsion to push, but I am not going to. There is no obligation with her, and I don't want one. Given an effectively infinite variety of people she could be with, she is spending time with me because she likes me. Being an obligation is the last thing I want.

Yeah, I am anxious to have something here and secure the relationship, which is not her job. That something is my sense of security, which I need to provide.

I'm not in nearly the full-blown meltdown I was in the first time I posted here. I feel strange and slightly uneasy, but so far, I don't think I have put any of this on her. It is my shit to deal with, and I really would rather not screw this up.

When you tell your muscles to relax that sends a message to your brain to relax. Your brain doesn't have to be poised for the flight or fight response. Take a walk. Ride a bike.

That's in the works. I could have worked from home today, but I came into the office just because I needed a good bike ride. I have a nice engaging welding project in my shop I'm going to tackle. Somehow I find welding relaxing. I might head there tonight after my visit.

 

[GalaGirl]

I can see pretty damn clearly that the compulsion to compare has no value. If I come up short, it fuels my insecurities, which is worthless. And if I some out ahead, it falsely panders to my insecurities-- equally worthless. I don't know what is driving the comparison... perhaps it is my insecurities themselves. I'm pretty damn tired of these f***ing petty BS insecurities.

Compare and contrast does have some value at times. It's when you add the element of compete that it gets wacky. If you can't stop the compete part of it, then just don't start to compare and contrast to begin with. Give it a rest and just let it be. Stop cranking your own self up.

If you want to feel secure, you could think about doing more self-respecting, constructive behavior. Then when the inner voice is trying to tear you down, you have something to pull up from memory and argue back with, and quiet the inner judge.

Example:

• You are worthless! (No, I am not worthless. I can do X (eg., welding) and a whole host of other things. You, inner voice, are worthless, just bringing me headaches and angst.)
• Who are you kidding? You suck! (No, I will not talk to myself in crap ways. I will think about something else. I will not spend time here. I choose to think about my welding project.)

I am sure you could think of better examples of your inner monologue and how you could "change the channel" when you weld tonight.

It is you in charge there, isn't it? You are not your thoughts. You are the being behind the thoughts that is doing the thinking. Thinking is a behavior. You could choose to engage in different behaviors, even a different thinking behavior.

Thinking habits and patterns are only that-- habits and patterns. If you are in the habit of thinking along poor lines, destructive lines, in self-disrespectful ways, etc., you could consider changing that habit. Maybe something like recovery intl. could help you.

 

[bookbug]

I can see why you are confused if you are more accustomed to dating men.

Let me see if I can better explain. It sounds as if you both want the same thing. However, while I will never say "all" women, many women are going to be more cautious about things that really matter to them-- situations that could prove to absolutely glorious, or prove to be emotionally devastating if they are wrong. So when faced with such a scenario, there is a lot of analysis, even including getting accustomed to the fact that this potentially wonderful gift walked into her life.

I know she has a history of engaging in sex quickly, but she describes none of these sexual partners as her "main squeeze," right? That is a place she is holding for someone special. Someone who may get deep into her emotions; not just a fuck-buddy. Sounds like that somebody may be you.

 

[LovingRadiance]

I have two long-term lovers and we have sex regularly. If I met someone new I wouldn't be having sex with them a week in either, even if my mind and body were screaming with joy and the anticipation of it. Too many emotional and physical risks. In fact, I would make them wait a year.
I doubt you will have as long a wait. Just giving you a perspective to consider.

Having been raped, assaulted, abused and mistreated by men, I am very cautious. If dating and partnership are on the table, knowing they are safe for my kids comes before I do any of the kinky, sexy things I like to do.

But I too love the anticipation and heat that is driven by lots of sexually-explicit conversations.

 

[london]

Sex positivity is very important to me. People who want to wait because they feel that they give a bit of their soul to everyone they sleep with wouldn't be compatible with me. Someone who thinks that having sex "too early" will harm the intimacy we share wouldn't be compatible with me. I want partners who enjoy sex for what it is, a fun act, not something that has to be shared exclusively with those who you are in a long term relationship with. Also, using terms such as primary is absolutely fine, despite what others will have you believe. Especially when you use it to refer to levels of entanglement (ie primary relationship is the person you live with) rather than prioritising people.

 

[starmonkey]

When I use the terms primary or secondary on this forum, I'm not referring to some heretical order - it is unfortunate there is an inherent ordering for numerical terms. I use those terms more to easily convey how much time I spend with lovers. If I see someone during the week (sexual or not), once every week or 2 - and occasionally a day or half day during a weekend, then I would call them a secondary. If I am seeing someone 2, 3 or more weekdays a week, and usually at least one day on the weekend, that is what I would call a primary - but I sort of like the term main squeeze.

I have one lover who lives on the other coast, about 3000 miles away. We chat, we message each other, but realistically I only get to see her a few times a year, and it isn't always sexual, we collaborate on a burning man art project - we may only have sex once or twice a year, but I have also been seeing her for about a year - my longest current relationship. So is she a tertiary, implying she is the least important to me? She definitely isn't - she was the one who originally inspired me to look at poly as a viable option. In any case, when I use these terms it isn't to disparage anyone I am with - it is just a way I can convey how much time I spend with them - in the spirit of brevity.

I don't really have a reason to use these terms outside the forum, as I've already talked to everyone about how much time we spend together - if the situation changes, we will talk about it then.

Anyway - the night went really well. All people should be as easy to get along with as a 3 year old. Her son is pretty fun to play with - although he was a bit overstimulated and fought tooth and nail going to bed.

We talked a bit once he was finally down. bookbug pretty much had it right - she doesn't look at me like a potential fuck-buddy or casual romp, and is holding a place for me and is somewhat scared at the prospect. She is just enjoying casual, fun sex like she normally does - her feelings for me are deeper - these are both good things. I feel better about the whole situation. I feel like I can learn a lot from this woman.

Its funny how insecure emotions can drive you to a conclusion opposite from reality.