Exes, Boundaries, Transitions

mewster

mewster

New member
Hi, and thanks for reading and providing your feedback

My concerns/questions are concerning my current girlfriend's ex. They were together for 17 years before I arrived on the scene. They do not live together, nor are they legally domestic partners, though health insurance and some other financial stuff lists them as partners.

They had some very rocky years before I even knew them. Then I arrived and her ex became irate and overly emotional at my girlfriend. The ex claimed that they never had an open or non-mono/poly arrangement. My girlfriend was confused, as both she and the ex had had other lovers over the years. My girlfriend had some relationships that never went anywhere. My girlfriend offered couples counseling over the years, and again during the 9 months of turbulence. The ex said no way. So the ex unceremoniously and abruptly ended their relationship 3 months ago.

Now it's the holidays, and the ex is back sniffing around looking for connection, seeking "to talk" with my girlfriend. Girlfriend is saying she won't get back together unless they go to couples counseling, and that she doesn't think it's possible to become lovers again. She does want to try and transition the ex-lovership into friendship.

I come from a different way of doing non-monogamy, wherein everyone knows and meets each other. They had a "don't ask, don't tell" set-up (which failed quite wretchedly). Girlfriend doesn't want me to meet her ex, saying that that the ex will be jealous of me and cause further emotional wrinkles.

I'm out here wondering "What the heck?" I'm working on finding out where my boundaries are, what is reasonable to ask for, what isn't. What and how can a transition happen here when it seems there are so many closed doors and secrets and walking on eggshells?

My ideas for boundaries are:
- Please let me know if there's contact. I don't need specifics, etc., but would like to know about dates or big emotional email bursts.
- When and if there is some resolution, and what the dimensions of that resolution looks like.
- Sexual reconnection or reuniting-- I would like to know about this so I can make decisions for myself around the situation.

I'd like input on the following:
- Stories of transitioning old loverships into friendships (good, bad, okay, totally screwed up).
- What you might consider bad boundaries or emotional blackmail. If you were in this situation, what would you be willing to make an agreement on, if you were my girlfriend?
- Any sage wisdom for my girlfriend, who is faced with transitioning a person who has been part of her life for such a long time.

Anything else you can add (that is useful, not flaming) would be appreciated. I am not new to polyamory. I know how to have conversations with grace and dignity. I know how to behave if I am a secondary or a primary or something else. I'm just murky in my thinking around this situation.
 
I just know that in that particular situation, I would more or less insist on meeting the ex (if there is any chance of my gf rekindling their relationship), just a coffee or a passing "hi." That would likely be good (or at least, telling) for each of you. And as this isn't a new relationship, but an old one, putting a face to all the emotional feelings, and seeing that you're just a nice person, is the only thing that could make me feel optimistic that this was going to be doable.
 
If my partner insisted on meeting my other partners when he knew that was something they didn't want to do, I would think that they had problems respecting boundaries, and end the relationship.

It also sounds as if you're threatening to punish her if she dares reunite with this guy. What you need to realise is that the boundaries you request need to be about you and her, not her and him. As long as they have safe sex, their relationship and how it doesn't work is their business, not yours. If their shitty relationship does start to affect yours, then make sure he stays away from you, and she doesn't discuss him. But other than that, it isn't your concern.
 
mewster said:
Girlfriend is saying she won't get back together unless they go to couples counseling, and doesn't think it is possible to become lovers with her again. She does want to try and transition the ex-lovership into friendship.
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It sounds like she's managing her relationship.

Have you taken an honest look at what you are afraid of, exactly? My shot in the dark guess is that you're afraid he'll come back in her life and force you out. Or is it the potential drama associated with having a toxic metamour?

In either case, if she were waffling, and of weak moral character, then it might be reasonable to assume there will be trouble. At this point it might be a good idea to plan your exit strategy. If she's a grown woman entirely capable of managing her own relationships, then you might just be letting your insecurity fog up your vision and prompt you to take action on something that is not your business.
 
Thanks for the opinions and feedback.

First, we're all women. No men in this situation, thankfully. (No offense, guys.)

Mostly I'm concerned about about the co-dependency that's been operating for a long time here. I am wary, not jealous, because of what I've witnessed going on between the two of them, albeit from a safe distance.

But yes, my boundaries are about keeping myself safe, which I guess is a backwards way of controlling that thing over there. I know I don't want to be a passive-aggressive-controller person, so I've got to to think about what I can ask for that isn't sideways or backwards. Watching my girlfriend get steamrolled, not stick up for herself and become re-enmeshed in a former relationship that wasn't meeting any of her needs (her words, not my viewpoint) is not something I want to put myself through.

The question I think I need to be asking myself is that if the reunion happens, how much co-dependency will I put up with? Where is my threshold? I've got to dig a little deeper here.

Thanks again for the perspective.
 
But the co-dependency is between your partner and this other woman, right? Not your partner and you?
 
Yep, the co-dependency is between them. But it has impacted me when the other one cried wolf, went into freak-out mode, and my girlfriend went running. Wary of bad behavior.
 
We are not isolated from the thoughts and feelings of our partners, even if those thoughts and feelings are directed at another person, their job, their family, or hurricanes in Malaysia.

Sure, our partners might have issues in another relationship, and those issues aren't about us and our relationship with our partners. But few people are able to completely isolate their feelings in one relationship from their other relationships. It's a perfectly reasonable question to pose: "Given that I cannot control whom she associates with, how much carry-over pain and angst am I willing to put up with? At what point do I say enough is enough, and move on?"

Allowing someone to continually bring negative energy home and into our own relationship is not healthy for ourselves, or for our relationship to that person. It sucks our energy, as that person continually requires our support. As much as it's unhealthy to control other people, it's unhealthy to tolerate our own lives being dominated by the actions of people we have no direct contact with.
 
If their shitty relationship does start to affect yours, then make sure he stays away from you and she doesn't discuss him.
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Wrong pronouns, right premise. I think it was Marcus who once said that if his partner were to stay in an obviously unhealthy relationship, he'd have to evaluate why he thought she was a good partner for him to begin with. She wouldn't be the person he thought.
 
london said:
If his partner were to stay in an obviously unhealthy relationship, he'd have to evaluate why he thought she was a good partner for him to begin with. She wouldn't be the person he thought.
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Yes, this.

Thanks, folks, for the feedback, witnessing & reminders. Much obliged.
 
london said:
If my partner insisted on meeting my other partners when he knew that was something they didn't want, I would think that they had problems respecting boundaries, and end the relationship.
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In some cases that makes sense to me (casual friends or relationships, long-distance relationships, and that does include if the OP considers their relationship such), but I find it much more dysfunctional feeling to be in a relationship that I want to last far into the future, and have a metamour or friend of a partner that's been around for 17 years, and might want to be around for 17 more, avoiding me for the rest of my life. And in this case, it seems like more than not wanting to meet me, it'd also be refusing to go to events, birthday and holiday parties if I might be there, so they don't have to meet me. If I moved in with this partner some day, the other party would refuse to come to our shared home unless I was out. I'd be unable to come home if the other person were over and my plans out fall through. So... yeah. If DADT doesn't work for one party short term, trying to deal with it long term isn't too appealing.

If you start dating somebody who is DADT, it is inappropriate to insist that the other partner meet you. However, as her partner had broken up with the other partner, and this wasn't the case, I don't find it unreasonable to ask "for relationships we start/rekindle from this point on, it's important to me that I have the option to meet them."

Yes, that might end a relationship for me, but since I don't see there is any healthy motivation for them not to meet, just fear and jealousy and anger, that would likely be the preferred outcome over being compartmentalized for those reasons. Nevertheless, in this case, asking to meet is not a boundary-pushing behavior, because her gf is not dating her ex, so there's no DADT agreement in effect, and it's perfectly reasonable, IMO, to try to sort this out with the gf. *shrug*
 
mewster said:
If the reunion happens, how much co-dependency will I put up with? Where is my threshold? I've got to dig a little deeper here.
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I like this. It keeps your energy focused on your actions and feelings, while at the same time, being vigilant in keeping an eye out for a potentially deteriorating situation.
 
Just because someone doesn't want to meet their metamours, it doesn't make it a DADT. Not wanting to meet your metamours doesn't mean you won't be civil to them when they come to your paramours b'day party either. Some people just have no interest or need to formally meet their metamour, or spend time with them.

ETA: I got confused about this thread. I just wouldn't be comfortable with anyone insisting on meeting a reluctant partner. Meeting metamours isn't something that has to happen, and the insistence that they meet insinuates that meeting is the right thing, rather than something some people do.
 
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london said:
Just because someone doesn't want to meet their metamours, it doesn't make it a DADT. Not wanting to meet your metamours doesn't mean you won't be civil to them when they come to your paramours b'day party, either. Some people just have no interest or need to formally meet their metamour, or spend time with them.
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Yes, that's true, but I was getting wordy and using it in a nice loose way, as in this case, the gf and ex had one, and I've seen people have DADT that range from no mention of other partners at all, and lying about where you are going to be that night, to minimalizing mention of, and avoiding addressing that other parties are romantic or sexual partners, and refusing to meet them.

I'm not clear whether, in this case, the ex is willing to meet in a social setting. I consider a brief introduction of 15 seconds at a social situation to be meeting however, and that would tick my box. Having been ignored "civilly" at a couple of social situations by the partner of a friend and a metamour in the last few years, it's just clarified how important it is to me that people are willing to be say hi or nod in greeting if they are 5 feet from me, and not pretend I'm not there if they are uncomfortable. I had no idea how fucking awkward that would be until it actually happened. I never expected it. And I know, for me at least, it isn't workable in the future.

It sounds quite feasible that not meeting the ex could be tolerable if the gf didn't vent or tell the OP about the issues she has with the ex, though. I can do compartmentalized if its actually compartmentalized, but not if things are bleeding over into my relationship like that.
 
I really appreciate this continued conversation. Thanks for giving voice to some of my concerns in a way I wasn't able to. Reading other's words, so succinct, coherent and clean, helps me tremendously in sorting out my feelings.


My gf has always done DADT, and is scared but willing to give our unfolding without it a chance. We thankfully do not share many social circles, so chance run-ins and accidental bumping into problems are greatly reduced. That being said, there have been 2 - 3 events where we've almost had run-ins with the ex (since they broke up) and it did impact my gf. She got nervous and developed an escape route plan. This impacts me, because I would have potentially been left on my own. That sucks.

The ex does not want to meet, refused to meet while they were together, and likely will not want to meet me moving forward.

As far as meeting partners or not, this is just how I do my non-monogamy. I am not forcing anyone to comply with this standard, but I have found it significantly reduced anxiety and amplified calmness to see and chat with the person. Doesn't have to be a huge big deal, just a simple meeting. I did have one situation where I was the primary, and the secondary who'd been on the scene longer than me requested the meet. She wanted to make agreements specifically with me so there wouldn't be triangulation in communication with the person we shared. I felt incredibly reassured by this. A simple gesture of kindness and respect goes a long to dismantling the panic button. Not every situation will work out that way, but I like striving for this in my relations.
 
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