lets try this again... Red flag?

S

Swellgal

New member
I'm very new to this. We haven't really defined a term or clear set of rules. In fact the man I am committed to doesn't want rules. I am trying to learn as much as possible right now. I feel I have a lot to learn and so please, be gentle.
I have been dating the man I love for almost 18 months and from the start we spoke of having an open relationship. I have had life experiences that make me question traditional relationships. I don't think it's reasonable to demand one person to be fulfilled by a single relationship for their entire lives.
At first we were in an open relationship but we planned on being together and having a family ( we both have kids from past relationships) and we wanted to get legally married. I am attracted to women more so than men but because of my familial connections I have never felt safe enough to pursue a same sex relationship. So we agreed that we could both have secondary relationships with women only. We are still finding what's right for us. But it's always been something he doubted I could do since I was "too jealous". I admit I felt threatened even though the idea makes sense to me. I've been doing a lot of work on myself and I am making progress in becoming more secure. I realize now that I am not lacking that it's just who he is and that's not wrong. Because of this fear of jealousy he has kept a lot away from me and I understand why. This is our first time pursuing a relationship on our terms. He was married before briefly when he was very young and says it was the longest two years of his life. He has beaten himself up for not being content with a conventional relationship. Right now I'm feeling pretty good about what I've been learning and I want to open up the dialog about our relationship and any secondary relations. I'm told be him that he wants his freedom. I respect his need for privacy and want to honor that. I've read him blogs post by those identify as poly and he identifies with what they experience. I want my partner to pursue relationships outside ours because I believe in it and I realize now it doesn't mean he loves me any less. But should I be concerned that he doesn't want to talk about where he is what he's doing and he wants his space. I know relationships should be allowed to grow at their own pace but he doesn't want to tell me what he's doing whether he's at work, alone at home, going out for a meal, with friends or what have you. He seems to think this will provide him with the privacy needed to pursue secondary relationships without hurting me. I can honestly say that so long as I have my needs met he doesn't need worry. It's the point where he doesn't even want to make concrete plans at night with me and our children
 
I see you say you are committed to him. Is he committed to you? To me he sounds like he doesn't want commitments. To me it sounds like he wants no agreements between you that he has to maintain or be accountable for. (He calls it "no rules.") He wants no questions asked.

Well, ok. That's his preference/style for doing it.

But if what YOU need to feel safe and secure in Open relationships is some agreements, some accountability, and some communication, then I don't think he sounds like the best fit for you.

You each can like your own way of going. But if they don't match in style, I don't see it being a runner between you. The gap is too big.

Like if super independent personality is a 1. And do everything together personality is a 10?

And he's a 1, and you are a 7? That is a much bigger personality gap than say between a 6 and a 7.

To be honest? All this stuff:

  • I'm told be him that he wants his freedom.
  • he has kept a lot away from me
  • he doesn't want to talk about where he is what he's doing
  • he wants his space.
  • he doesn't even want to make concrete plans at night with me and our children

To me it does not sound like he wants a non-primary open model. (#3 on that article). I could be wrong, but to me it sounds more like he wants to break up but hasn't put it out there clearly yet. Like he is slowly checking out, detaching.

Galagirl
 
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Galagirl

thank you, I appreciate it. Is there a way to bridge this gap? I feel like I'm open to learning a new way. I'm not concrete or clear on what my style is. Neither of us have done this. It just seems like everyone has such open dialogue with the person they are with and I wonder is that the goal, should I be worried we aren't like that?
 
Well, if it is about a "bridge the gap thing" I am not sure. Him contorting himself to fit your style is bad for him. You contorting yourself to fit his is bad for you. This is not like a 6 and a 7 compromising a bit so they can flow together.

Big gaps requiring twisting up to a pretzel to even make it get off the ground? Seems easier to accept it won't fly naturally, or in way that is healthy and happy for both.

I could be wrong. If it is that you guys really are closer in style/personalities than that, you could read this together and figure out if the models you want to practice match any of the ones he wants to practice.

You don't have to have a lot of "rules" or "agreements" but you could talk it out. If you have concurrent lovers at bare minimum I think you could have safer sex agreements for how to deal with birth control, accidental pregnancy, and STDs. Hygiene is hygiene.

Some of these might help.

http://openingup.net/resources/free-downloads-from-opening-up/

If you are wondering if it is a "he wants to break up but is not saying it yet" situation here? Then have that conversation honestly and up front. You could ASK him to clarify his position so you can know.

"Would you rather we break up? So you can be more free that way?"

It's not FUN conversation to have. But taking a side trip into poly to avoid having it? That's not a good way to go either. Dragging it out and making a half hearted attempt at poly with a "meh" partner only to make a mess later? That would be worse to me.

It just seems like everyone has such open dialogue with the person they are with and I wonder is that the goal, should I be worried we aren't like that?
Click to expand...

If you guys do not communicate all that much or even all that well to begin with? How do you know you are compatible?

I don't see why you would want to add 2 more people to the mix at this time rather than improve your skills first. How is going from weak 2 people communication to weak 4 people communication better? The potential for misunderstandings seems to go up. How is that entering polyamory from strong foundations with strong skills? :confused:

I am not hearing he's joyous about embarking about polyamory with you. I would get more certain on that first. (willingness) Without it, everything else is moot.

I am not hearing that you guys have good communication skills. (ability)

I am not hearing that you guys agree on the HOW of it -- what model do we practice together? What agreements do we have? A few basics for sex health hygiene? Medium? Lots? Do we both understand the agreements in the same way?

If the willingness is there, I would focus on improving interpersonal and interpersonal skills next. Then sort out the HOW stuff.

If the willingness is just not there... do not poly together.

If he doesn't want to be with you at all... do not be together at all.

I'm sorry. I cannot think of anything else. :/

Tread with caution. Even you call it a red flag in your post title. I would not jump into poly right now. I would definitely get clear on what's going on here and where each one of you stands.

Poly is not a bandaid for existing problems. :(

Galagirl
 
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First of all: you have indeed already two rules, and these are not lightweight ones
a) other relationships have to be secondary
b) relationships have to be with women only

Not wanting to hurt you is only an excuse for not wanting to get accounted for his actions. This poor sharing of him is no basis for a family. It might be ok for a relationship where you date once or twice a week.
 
Hello Swellgal,

Re (from OP):
"Should I be concerned that he doesn't want to talk about where he is what he's doing and he wants his space?"
Click to expand...

Only if his rule ("You must not ask me where I am or what I am doing") causes one or more of your own needs to go unmet.

Re:
"I know relationships should be allowed to grow at their own pace but he doesn't want to tell me what he's doing whether he's at work, alone at home, going out for a meal, with friends or what have you."
Click to expand...

Sounds like his rule extends beyond polyamory. He doesn't want you to know where he is or what he's doing no matter what he's doing and no matter where he is.

Re:
"It's [to] the point where he doesn't even want to make concrete plans at night with me and our children."
Click to expand...

I am thinking that concrete plans at night with you and your children ... is one of your needs, and his rule is causing it to go unmet. So then his rule goes too far, for you at least.

You have to figure out what you can and can't stand. Then talk to him about the "can't stand" stuff and see if he is willing to compromise. And if he's not willing to compromise, well ... I know you don't want to hear "Break up" but.

I hope this helps a little.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.

....

To cut to the chase, you have to figure out what *you* can and can't stand ... and find out if he will compromise.
 
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It is not acceptable to refuse to make any sort of plans, especially if he is on the search for lovers night outside the house most nights while the kids want time with their dad. This is beyond immature and bordering stupid and offensive towards the family he claims to want.
 
finding our way

thank you for the input you've given me a lot to consider as I said before I'm not sure were poly. That having been said I don't know if we have styles so to speak. I think at this point we're still trying to figure out what works for us we had a really good talk today and so I'm hopeful I think that when somebody starts out exploring something about themselves they don't quite understand and something society really doesn't understand there's a high level of trepidation. It's tempting to think that love should go a certain way but if I've learned anything from what I've read about Poly it is so important to not interfere or make too many demands on how a relationship evolves. We're evolving that's for sure.
 
So ... things have improved a little bit?
 
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