SO's first date... sort of...

Squixy

Squixy

New member
*sorry this is so long!!*
I have been with my partner for five years this August. When we met, he was married and I become his secondary and was good friends with his wife. About 8 months into the relationship, his wife decided she wanted something else, and they decided to dissolve their relationship and ended up in divorce. Since then it has been difficult for us to find people to add to our relationship. We are introverts, and don't really know how to get out there and meet people.
Three years ago, give or take, we met this really cute girl that we worked with (we'll call her Cindy.) I pointed Cindy out to my SO, and they started talking. He informed me after chatting with her for about a week that Cindy stated that there's "no way she could be poly because she could never share." That to me was a no-go. She was off the table. My SO and I discussed this, and he agreed. However, he continued to have a friendship with her, chatted with her nearly non-stop for three years and every time we started to pursue a relationship with someone else it failed due to his feelings for Cindy. In five years, this girl is just about the only thing we have ever fought about... numerous times.

During the last five years, we have branched out, gone on dates, picked up new friends, learned a lot about polyamory in our efforts to find partners, and after a while he decided that he wanted to try to date on his own for a while, which is different than normal. We like being a triad, but you can't really fit people and/or relationships into a box. So, I supported him and gave him lots of room and even suggestions on how to go about meeting new people... eventually -- through a very honest miscommunication -- he asked this original girl out on a date. Because he was obviously honest about it, i decided to let him go out with her. That was a year ago. They went on a couple dates, and we all hung out as a giant family with all of us and our five kids... She's fine. She's not crazy... but she still reiterates that she ultimately wants a monogamous relationship, and that she further could never tell her kids or their fathers about our poly dynamics because she's afraid of what they might do.

After much discussion, i vetoed Cindy... for a second time.

Another year has gone by, and some circumstances have changed. All this time, we have been unable to start new relationships because of his continued feelings for this girl. They're practically internet dating they chat so often. He's shown time and time again that he can't let go. I decided that he can try to date her again, but he better be really careful and he needs to determine if it's really okay. He has been receptive of my needs and my concerns and we have had several discussion regarding why I am nervous. She already has three ex husbands and she's only 30. I fear that we're just another stop on her serial monogamy path. She also comes from a christian culture that condemns bi/homo/pan-sexuality and equivocates sex-positive culture with sex addiction. We are queer, bisexual pagans. that doesn't match our cultural beliefs at all.

Now their second first date is tomorrow.
I can't help but be nervous.

I feel that they need to work through this and figure it out. Deep down i'm hoping that they'll see that this is unwise. I feel guilty about it. And scared about it. What if he really can't let go, and she's a bad culture fit?

I guess my question is... am i just having control issues here?
do people really "convert" from monogamy to polyamory? I mean, we all had to start somewhere, right?
Am I just being paranoid because of past relationship drama?
Is it wrong to ask a person up front if they "plan" to move on to a monogamous relationship? (I'm an INTJ so i know i can be way too fact-based...)
What experiences have you had moving from a triad to a V type relationship?
 
Hi Squixy,

I don't blame you for being nervous about Cindy, but it sounds like your partner is dead set on continuing a relationship with her, and maybe there's not much you can do about that. Does she want to convert to polyamory? Maybe she's just limited by her upbringing.

I'm sure you've discussed this with your partner many times, so I won't suggest doing that. Just prepare yourself in case she lassoes him away.

With regards,
Kevin T.
 
kdt26417 said:
Hi Squixy,

I don't blame you for being nervous about Cindy, but it sounds like your partner is dead set on continuing a relationship with her, and maybe there's not much you can do about that. Does she want to convert to polyamory? Maybe she's just limited by her upbringing.

I'm sure you've discussed this with your partner many times, so I won't suggest doing that. Just prepare yourself in case she lassoes him away.

With regards,
Kevin T.
Click to expand...

Thanks Kevin.
I have definitely been talking to him about it over the last year, and he seems to understand the concerns... finally... which is why i'm willing to let him try again. But Cindy's wishy-washy about "converting," and can never really give a straight answer... It's always "i don't know... i'll have to play it by ear when another person comes along."
Last year she expressed the possibility of dating us (we were exploring a triad at the time) and then potentially breaking it off if she finds a monogamous partner... but maybe not. To me, this doesn't really seem any different than the same serial monogamy stuff.. just with more benefits, so to speak. Is that...well... normal? (lol. that's a dumb way to word that. I know things depend on each specific situation... but do people really do that?)
i'm such a long-term minded person, i guess... I don't think i could imagine being in a relationship with the caveat of "but if i find someone else, we have to break up." that seems silly to me. I've been a secondary before. I understand the concept of wanting to call a moratorium (or at the very least spend less time) with my other mates to spend more time on a new primary relationship, but I dont break up with them... it just seems to me like she just likes my SO and wants to date him as if it was a monogamous relationship... She's also concerned about him seeing other people, because in the past she's been jealous. That's not promising. Needless to say, this time we're not exploring a triad because i'm not comfortable with the probably whole being dumped idea.. but now i have to adjust to the possibility of a V... which is fine, i guess... its just an adjustment going from a triad, to monogamy, to dating as a triad, to a V.
 
So she doesn't mind you being in the picture? or she does mind, but she'll tolerate it until something monogamous comes along?
 
Some thoughts...

He's obsessed with her, & has been so for years. He's willing to foster the fantasy at risk of pushing you away.

She's not into it.
She's shopping for Husband #4.
She knows he's involved with you.

Conclusion: he's available, because you don't matter.

She could've reached that conclusion from the way your s/o treats you. Or, she's predatory & doesn't care.

My impression is that your s/o wants to be married, with "something on the side." That'd be you. So long as you're cool with that, it should work out fine.
 
Ravenscroft may be right. This long almost daily contact with a romantic other who has been vetoed twice and is now being semi-unvetoed sounds unhealthy for your relationship and for your mental well being.

What has Cindy been doing with herself all this time? Has she been in a committed monogamous relationship with someone else during these last few years? Or has she steadfastedly been unable to give up her feelings for your boyfriend the same way he can't date others because of some combination of his feelings for Cindy and her jealousy surrounding his new partners?

If
1) Your boyfriend and Cindy are unable to escalate their relationship,
2) the feelings are not subsiding to a mutual friendship that does not involve romance,
3) and this is causing problems (you state this is the only issue you fight about)

Then maybe no contact for a period of time to help clear the mind may be an unpopular but healthy option. My main issue is that I can't see their relationship progressing and their relationship is currently proving problematic to all 3 parties involved. You may feel mentally healthier if you step back a little as Ravenscroft suggested or move towards a (perhaps temporary) no contact model which may be unpopular. I just wonder if Cindy will be as well matched for your boyfriend as his feelings lead him to believe, given her conservative religious views and his rather liberal ones (what will he do when the NRE with Cindy wears off). I wonder if he has fantasies about changing Cindy and leading a pseudo-monogamous life with her with the fantasies reflective of limerence rather than reality. If so, Limerence.net forums may be able to help with that, technique wise, even if you feel this isn't actually limerence. Or maybe it is. I dunno.

In summary, continuing as you have done for the last 3 years seems untenable. Progressing their relationship seems untenable because Cindy doesn't want polyamory. The long 'limbo time' you've spent in this awkward state of semi-internet-dating lead me to suggest either Ravenscroft approach or a (possibly temporary) no contact approach in order to break from the unhappy cycle you find yourself in. I'm also curious as to what Cindy has been doing all this time and her views on how she wants this to play out.

Best wishes towards a better future for you, your boyfriend and also for Cindy. -Shaya
 
Hmm... wow. yeah... no.

Something I feel was missed here.

1) he and I are hand fasted. She is the side relationship there is NO worries about them having a relationship ship without me other than a V. That's suuuper clear.
2) We tried monogamy for a while together. We absolutely don't want that. He's made that clear to her. In fact, his last marriage dissolved because he didn't want to give up poly.
3) we already had a separation. They were separated for a whole year, albeit the feelings never went away because of my veto. They need to date and figure it out without me, obviously.

my main question here is the following:

What are some tips for adjusting to a V when all you've had is triads? Particularly if the new potential partner is a jealous, monogamous person that you don't like/trust much?
 
Hey Squixy,

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I'm hearing you say that you would like advice on moving to accept the relationship structure of a polyamorous V when you started the relationship feeling that the deal was triads. I'm also hearing a second, more important question which is about dealing with a strongly monogamous metamour.

It sounds like you wish to proceed with polyamory. If you don't respect Cindy's approach to relationships (and just to be clear, I don't think she sounds like the healthiest metamour either), I think you might have to take a step back from their relationship. His NRE is going to make him think Cindy is wonderful. Your jealousy is going to make you feel Cindy is a monster. The truth may be somewhere in between but if you and your boyfriend are anything like my wife and I, there will be no agreement on this issue. Ever. NRE and jealousy may start to pull the two of you apart in opposite directions. Cindy may become the biggest issue of argument between the two of you. My advice would be to step out of it and let him handle his own relationship with. She seems conservative compared to your husband and seems to burn through husbands faster than an arsonist. They may find they're not that well suited in the long run, but hopefully that won't impact you.

It has been mentioned on this forum numerous times that males seem to make poor hinges or perhaps females seem to make poor arms of the V. The issue was explored here if you're interested.

All the best,
Shaya.
 
She is still sounding like a cowgirl to me.

What can you do about it? Not a lot. I'm not saying that monos can't be involved in poly relationships successfully, because they can. However, this woman SAYS she wants a mono relationship. Why your SO isn't just leaving her be is completely the result of his lust. He's not thinking this through.

Just have a Plan B in case the worst happens. We had a poster here a few months ago, who was in a poly relationship. He found a mono woman whom he believed suited him far, far better than the woman he was in a poly relationship with. You won't believe what happens next. . . the mono woman wanted to break up with him because she couldn't "handle" being in a poly relationship anymore (rolls eyes). By then he was really sucked into their relationship (I believe the term "soul mate" may have been bandied about) and he was contemplating leaving his long-term poly relationship for this mono woman because he couldn't stand to be without the mono girlfriend. He quit posting, so we never knew what happened.

You can get angry, and say that this CAN'T happen to you, but it can. You can never control the actions or feelings of another person. What you do with this is up to you.
 
Re (from Squixy):
"What are some tips for adjusting to a V when all you've had is triads? particularly if the new potential partner is a jealous, monogamous person that you don't like/trust much?"
Click to expand...

For now at least, my advice would be to ask the hinge (your partner) to not talk to you about the new potential partner (your metamour). Also avoid running into your metamour. In a V, the two legs don't have to be friends. They don't have to have anything to do with each other. This would be my advice in this case.
 
Ravenscroft said:
My impression is that your s/o wants to be married, with "something on the side." That'd be you. So long as you're cool with that, it should work out fine.
Click to expand...

Ravenscroft didn't misunderstand your original post, he actually understands it perhaps better than you do, Squixy.

Cindy, in however flawed a fashion, is squarely monogamous and your BF, hand fasting or no, veto or no, is captivated by her and from the sounds of it, on his way to doing whatever it takes to have her in his life. No woman can wrangle a man away who doesn't want to be roped and from all you've told us so far, your BF is dying to be roped by her. Yes, he has all of his sex-positive, pagan, poly cultural values, but his desire for her is enduring and, at very least, equal to all of that. Men give up kingdoms for less. She is who she is and she's not budging, so all of the mental contortions to make her OK with poly aren't going do anything. His desire for her seems so strong that he's not giving her up any time soon. You've tried to work with him on this for a few years and the only place you've all gotten is that they became closer. Your BF is clearly not prioritizing your desires - which is certainly his choice, but one you need to clearly see. You already are in a "V" - with your BF as a lousy hinge. Sure, he and Cindy will likely run into the same trouble as he was in with his ex and with you: monogamy vs. poly (I'm sensing a pattern here...) but for now, he is laser focused on having her in his life any which way he can. You can't orchestrate your way out of this, you can either accept it or reject it.

That was the meaning of Ravenscroft's comment.
 
Squixy said:
What are some tips for adjusting to a V when all you've had is triads? Particularly if the new potential partner is a jealous, monogamous person that you don't like/trust much?
Click to expand...
I'm in a V where the metamour relationship can be strained (because we are both monogam-ish), although some basic good will is present, so I'm gonna suggest a few things I find most important.
  • If you don't like her very much, just don't hang out with her. Ask your partner NOT to schedule "together" things and give you a heads up if she's going to the same social gathering as you. If you both happen to be at the same social gathering, I find it best to be clear about who's his "date" for the evening - so that the other person can come along for a hello kiss just fine but doesn't expect to hang out with the hinge for the whole evening.
  • Ask him NOT to carry over conflicts. If she's jealous, they can sort it out. You don't have to know.
  • Focus on the relationship between you and your partner, and leave her out of your thoughts as much as possible. Ask for what YOU need in terms of time and attention to be happy, don't keep score. Schedule dates for you two.
  • Likewise, only evaluate your relationship based on what you're getting or not. Don't blame the other partner.
  • For your own inner peace, if this is how it's gonna be longterm, you still need to wish her well in some basic fashion. Be polite. Do the occasional nice practical thing for one another, if possible.
  • If for whatever reason 3-people negotiations are necessary, don't be as conflict-avoidant as me, and face it ;)
 
Go read my blog! Mono co-worker who was "Willing to date my Husband until someone 'better' came along!" Spoiler alert: It didn't end well.
 
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