When Dynamics Change

Hi all!
This is my very first post. I am hoping to your collective infinite wisdom will help out with my current confusion. :)

Alright, I am a 26 year old bi woman. I have always been open to polyamory or openness, but have no experience with actually loving more than one person at a time.

The man I am currently in love with and I have a somewhat unique history. He and I met online just before he had to move quite far away for a job. We are very sexually compatible, so we stayed in touch. He told me at our very first date that he has a gf, they had been open from the start. That was a very new concept for me, but I was open. Him and I started a long distance thing, with me visiting him only, since his gf lived in the same city as me and when he was in town, hanging out with her was his priority. Over time my feelings became stronger, like they do when you get closer, get to know each other more etc. He tried quite hard to keep the two relationships seperate. Never really talked much about her and their relationship. What he and I had was somewhat in a gray area, since they had never put down any rules and didn't want to restrict the other's experience. But they had also never delt with something so long ongoing. 1 1/2 years in I was visiting him and she had somewhat of a breakdown and told him she couldn't deal with theh situation anymore. Me and him had some great talks and I was really sad obviously, but understanding. I didn't want her to be in pain.
a month later he proposed an affair. He said he loved his gf but wasn't ready to do without the sexual experimentation and growth he was experiencing with me. I had to think about it. I had never met her, but in the end I decided against it. I felt it would change everything. Also the relationship him and I had.
Some time later the two of them revisited the whole thing. She was quite happily dating someone and was happy to move from 'open' towards 'poly' so he took the chance and brought up his relationship with me.

So that's how we continued our relationship ( I am calling it a relationship simply because I don't know what to call it exactly and because in the end, what isn't a relationship?)

Now we've been spending more time together and have become more intimate on an emotional level. He had made me more of a priority, wants to see me more and we started going on small vecations together instead of me visiting him. Everything seemd fine, but now over christmas we all were in the same city together and her and I had talked about meeting up for coffee for the very first time. After 2 years of this strange situation I thought we were moving in the right direction, dealing with jealousy and the great unknown of this stranger. But then it all turned out differently. He stayed over at my place a view times, which is unheard off when he's in the city, and then left the city on a whim for new years to spend it with some friends. The things I overheard and that added up to them having issues or breaking up. But we didn't talk about it. I figured if they were right in the middle of it all I wasn't really the right person to talk to. But it opened up a whole load of questions in my mind. Since then we've been talking a lot, but not about this. He is eager to make plans for trips and visits.

Now this is a confusing place to be in. I am aware that I have to talk to him about it. If he doesn't bring it up I will have to. But that convo comes with a lot of fear and insecurity on my end.
If they did break up, what does this mean for us? Do we have to establish new rules? I am his primary now? He definitely seems to have extra time to go on trips and talk to me.
I also experienced new jealousy. I had somewhat gotten used to the old situation but now I am thinking of him going on new dates, seeking ou new sex parteners and I get sad.
On the other hand I am loving the freedom this relationship has given me and wouldn't want anything else. I love knowing that he's in my life while beeing free to explore anything with whoever I want.

I would love some advice and maybe some of you have had similar experiences regarding breakups in poly relationships.

Love, H
 
Greetings ExploringTheGrapeLife,
Welcome to our forum. Please feel free to lurk, browse, etc.

I think you need to have an honest conversation with the man you're in love with. First you need to confirm, is he breaking up with his primary? and if he is, does that mean you will now be his primary? How do you feel about that? Will he go on new dates, and seek new partners? Are you okay with that? I assume you will want to keep seeing him, but how will you deal with the jealousy? I have links for that, let me know if you're interested. Just in general, have a heart-to-heart with him, get everything out on the table. Keep us posted here on how that all turns out. We'll try to help.

Sincerely,
Kevin T., "official greeter" :)

Notes:

There's a *lot* of good info in Golden Nuggets. Have a look!

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Note: You needn't read every reply to your posts, especially if someone posts in a disagreeable way. Given the size and scope of the site it's hard not to run into the occasional disagreeable person. Please contact the mods if you do (or if you see any spam), and you can block the person if you want.

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Welcome aboard!
 
Hi all!
This is my very first post. I am hoping to your collective infinite wisdom will help out with my current confusion. :)

Welcome to the Forums! There are a lot of opinions here - and hopefully some "collective wisdom" as well. :rolleyes:

Alright, I am a 26 year old bi woman. I have always been open to polyamory or openness, but have no experience with actually loving more than one person at a time.

There are a number of us bi-women on this site (and most of us were 26 at least once :rolleyes:). You say that you have "always" been open to poly or open - just curious if you have "always" known that it was an option? (Many posters here, not me, discover the "poly-option" later in life.)

You say that you have no experience loving MORE than one person at a time - how much relationship experience to you have even loving JUST one person at a time? (I ID'd as poly before I had even been in ANY relationship.)

The man I am currently in love with ... He told me at our very first date that he has a gf, they had been open from the start.

So far, so good - although it sounds (later) that they may not have fully hashed out what "open" meant for each of them...

That was a very new concept for me, but I was open. Him and I started a long distance thing, with me visiting him only, since his gf lived in the same city as me and when he was in town, hanging out with her was his priority. Over time my feelings became stronger, like they do when you get closer, get to know each other more etc. He tried quite hard to keep the two relationships seperate. Never really talked much about her and their relationship.

OK, "parallel poly" (as opposed to "kitchen-table poly") and hierarchical (i.e. when he is in town he prioritizes time with her) - not everyone's cup of tea, but it's a thing. Here it sounds like he is being a "good hinge" and not over-sharing about things on the "other side" of the Vee.

What he and I had was somewhat in a gray area, since they had never put down any rules and didn't want to restrict the other's experience. But they had also never delt with something so long ongoing. 1 1/2 years in I was visiting him and she had somewhat of a breakdown and told him she couldn't deal with theh situation anymore. Me and him had some great talks and I was really sad obviously, but understanding.

So...he was "not talking" about her and their relationship - but you know all of the above paragraph? (and lots more, I would wager?) - But then, this stands out to me:

I didn't want her to be in pain.

So, in a general humanitarian sense, I don't want anyone to be in pain. But, in all actual fact, I cannot be responsible for all of the pain that results from the human condition. And YOU are not the immediate cause of her pain - it is HIS decision whether to engage in a situation that causes her pain and YOUR decision whether to engage with him under whatever terms he offers.

...a month later he proposed an affair. He said he loved his gf but wasn't ready to do without the sexual experimentation and growth he was experiencing with me. I had to think about it. I had never met her, but in the end I decided against it. I felt it would change everything. Also the relationship him and I had.

Good for you! ...and I think you made the right call, but for YOURSELF, not because of some moral obligation to a person you don't even know. He offered you a shitty deal - "cheating affair partner" and you declined. (FWIW, at one point in my life I would have accepted - but I was looking for lovers and not partners...today I want partners, and partner-quality people don't cheat!)

Some time later the two of them revisited the whole thing. She was quite happily dating someone and was happy to move from 'open' towards 'poly' so he took the chance and brought up his relationship with me.

Meh. So she is "poly" when she has a toy but disgruntled when she doesn't? Not my favorite metamour ...

So that's how we continued our relationship ( I am calling it a relationship simply because I don't know what to call it exactly and because in the end, what isn't a relationship?)

TOTALLY agree with you there - we need more words! I have some sort of "relationship" with every person I have ever interacted with!!! Familial relationship, friendship, romantic relationship, sexual relationship, doctor-patient relationship, etc. "Relationship anarchists" view relationships differently than people who like to have roles defined. (I would be an RA except their non-existent rules are too rigid for me!:D

Now we've been spending more time together and have become more intimate on an emotional level. He had made me more of a priority, wants to see me more and we started going on small vecations together instead of me visiting him. Everything seemd fine, but now over christmas we all were in the same city together and her and I had talked about meeting up for coffee for the very first time. After 2 years of this strange situation I thought we were moving in the right direction, dealing with jealousy and the great unknown of this stranger. But then it all turned out differently. He stayed over at my place a view times, which is unheard off when he's in the city, and then left the city on a whim for new years to spend it with some friends...

So, your relationship with him is progressing in a way that is satisfactory to you, he stayed over with you a few times, and then went off to spend time with friends. (Is this a problem for you?)

The things I overheard and that added up to them having issues or breaking up. But we didn't talk about it. I figured if they were right in the middle of it all I wasn't really the right person to talk to. But it opened up a whole load of questions in my mind. Since then we've been talking a lot, but not about this. He is eager to make plans for trips and visits.

Er, um, WTF?! Overheard from WHO? And WHY, if it opened up questions in your mind, have you NOT been talking about it? If they are broken up - fine, not your problem. If they are NOT broken up, then is he revisiting the cheating thing again but not including you in the the decision-making?

Now this is a confusing place to be in. I am aware that I have to talk to him about it. If he doesn't bring it up I will have to. But that convo comes with a lot of fear and insecurity on my end.

If you are confused - then it is on you to clarify the points that are of importance to you - regardless of fear and insecurity (not easy, just necessary).

If they did break up, what does this mean for us? Do we have to establish new rules? I am his primary now? He definitely seems to have extra time to go on trips and talk to me.
I also experienced new jealousy. I had somewhat gotten used to the old situation but now I am thinking of him going on new dates, seeking ou new sex parteners and I get sad.
On the other hand I am loving the freedom this relationship has given me and wouldn't want anything else. I love knowing that he's in my life while beeing free to explore anything with whoever I want.

Here, I think, is the crux of the matter. And these are questions that I think you have to answer for yourself before you discuss them with him - what are your personal answers to these question?

My answers will be different than yours.

If they did break up, what does this mean for us?
*I don't know that this would mean very much for ME - I am not in a relationship with someone because they are, or are-not, in a relationship with someone else - if THEY expect our relationship to change, then I many, or may NOT, be agreeable.

Do we have to establish new rules?
IDK, what "rules" do you have now? What "rules" do you want? What "rules" do you NOT want? (P.S. I HATE rules so my answers will reflect that :eek:)

I am his primary now?
What does that mean to you? To him? You do not need to consider yourself to be his "primary" even if he wants you to be! But he might consider you that anyway...Not. Your. Problem You can ask him what expectations he has for a "primary" and then decide whether or not you are willing to accede to those expectations! (Dude, my boyfriend, one got bent out of shape because he asked if he could rest his head in my lap, and I said "NO" - Dude, if I can't say "No" then it isn't actually a question!!!)

I also experienced new jealousy. I had somewhat gotten used to the old situation but now I am thinking of him going on new dates, seeking ou new sex parteners and I get sad.

Just because the "new normal" is uncomfortable doesn't mean it is not a good idea. The familiar is always less scary...but that doesn't mean it is better. If YOU like the freedom to explore, then it is reasonable that he would as well!

On the other hand I am loving the freedom this relationship has given me and wouldn't want anything else. I love knowing that he's in my life while beeing free to explore anything with whoever I want.

Personally? This seems to me a situation to lean INTO the change, try it out, and if it doesn't work for you then you will KNOW...
 
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? I have links for that, let me know if you're interested. Just in general, have a heart-to-heart with him, get everything out on the table. Keep us posted here on how that all turns out. We'll try to help.

Hi! And thanks for the warm welcome!

I think the questions you posed here are very fitting. I know I need to work on my communication. And have honest answers to those questions for myself first.
I'd love some links, yes!

:)
 
@JaneQSmythe

Welcome to the Forums! There are a lot of opinions here - and hopefully some "collective wisdom" as well. :rolleyes:
:D GREAT!


You say that you have "always" been open to poly or open - just curious if you have "always" known that it was an option? (Many posters here, not me, discover the "poly-option" later in life.)

I actually have known about poly for quite some time. I think I first heard about it on a podcast when I was about 16. And so far I've experimented with openess and shared experiences with my previous two partners, but not in any real poly way.

So...he was "not talking" about her and their relationship - but you know all of the above paragraph? (and lots more, I would wager?) -

I guess we did talk about their relationship from time to time, but only when something had come up. It's quite difficult since we are long distance and when we do have time together we wanna enjoy our quality time and don't want to spend it all talking about his other partner.
When we first had to end it last year, which is what I was refering to, we had long converstaions. It was the first time both of us truely opened up. Kind of this 'nothing left to loose' feeling, since we thought it was over anyways.




So, in a general humanitarian sense, I don't want anyone to be in pain. But, in all actual fact, I cannot be responsible for all of the pain that results from the human condition. And YOU are not the immediate cause of her pain - it is HIS decision whether to engage in a situation that causes her pain and YOUR decision whether to engage with him under whatever terms he offers.

Yes, I totally agree with that. But at the time I had a idealized version of their relationship in my mind. I thought I could never become a threat to her. That I was the only one struggeling from time to time, the only one who was ever jealous. Silly, I know. It was such a weird surprise to find out she was struggeling with my visits.
I think they fell in love hard and thought, like many of us do when we are in that state, that their love was indestructible and special. That they could open things up and not put any rules down for the other person, because they were to secure in the primacy of their love. I believe me, slowly becoming a stronger and stronger presence in his life and therefor in their relationship was something they both didn't predict.


Meh. So she is "poly" when she has a toy but disgruntled when she doesn't? Not my favorite metamour ...

I think it's something you slowly have to learn. IT's obviously much easier to be chill and deal well with jealousy when you have an active love life on the side. Might not be ideal.


So, your relationship with him is progressing in a way that is satisfactory to you, he stayed over with you a few times, and then went off to spend time with friends. (Is this a problem for you?)

No, not at all. Just a sign that he wasn't spending this rare time when he doesn't have to work with his girlfriend liek he usually does and how he himself had told me he would.


Er, um, WTF?! Overheard from WHO? And WHY, if it opened up questions in your mind, have you NOT been talking about it? If they are broken up - fine, not your problem. If they are NOT broken up, then is he revisiting the cheating thing again but not including you in the the decision-making?

Haha:D That was poorly worded on my end. He was at my place just before he had to head off to the airport and was talking on the phone to his father while sitting right next to me. I could clearly hear his father, and he asked how it had gone with his gf the das before...
It was pretty clear that they had had a talk before he had come over.


IDK, what "rules" do you have now? What "rules" do you want? What "rules" do you NOT want? (P.S. I HATE rules so my answers will reflect that :eek:)


What does that mean to you? To him?

Good questions...:confused::D I will have to think about the rules part. Hard to say. I feel like I am so conditioned to want and fear certain things, I don't even know waht I really want.


Just because the "new normal" is uncomfortable doesn't mean it is not a good idea. The familiar is always less scary...but that doesn't mean it is better. If YOU like the freedom to explore, then it is reasonable that he would as well!

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Totally!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Personally? This seems to me a situation to lean INTO the change, try it out, and if it doesn't work for you then you will KNOW...

:eek:Yes I couldn't agree more

Thank you!
 
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Update

Thanks for the links!

Update: We talked on the phone and he told me they in fact did break up!

We talked about it a little but not in regards to us. It doesn't change much for us I guess. And I just don't love talking on the phone about things that matter. But I'll see him in 3 weeks and I'll make sure to investigate what I want and what I wanna talk to him about until then.
 
You have the right idea. Just do your best to prepare for the conversation you will have with him in three weeks. Good luck!
 
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