Well it's over

[Natja]

Ah, now I get you. Well no, I don't think it is right, but I understand it, especially considering the near hysterical tone in the OP. I think she (the OP) is probably a lot more oppressive than she thinks she is. I am sorry, but she is a bit delusional. I don't agree with the (stupid) mind reading form of communication that some women engage in, and it is clear the girlfriend is doing that. However, even the OP realises the girlfriend does not want her, and yet decided to continue with it, not because the girlfriend persuaded her, but because her husband wants a triad. And the OP realised she wants the girlfriend instead of any other woman. In other words, despite the mind-reading form of communication having been vaguely effective, the OP has chosen to ignore it to indulge her desires. Of course that is crap-worthy! Can't you see?

 

[Vinccenzo]

I don't think it is right, but I understand it, especially considering the near hysterical tone in the OP. I think she (the OP) is probably a lot more oppressive than she thinks she is. She is a bit delusional. I don't agree with the (stupid) mind-reading form of communication that some women engage in. It is clear the girlfriend is doing that. However, the OP realises the girlfriend does not want her, and yet decided to continue with it, not because the girlfriend persuaded her, but because her husband wants a triad. And the OP realised she wants the girlfriend instead of any other woman... the OP has chosen to ignore it to indulge her desires. Of course that is crap worthy!

No. I don't see how its worth crapping on the OP. If it is, it sure isn't for me to do on the behalf of a person I don't know, who won't speak up for themselves. Here is why:

If this weren't a triad, but instead someone the husband met and began seeing on his own, the behavior of this girl, being unforthcoming, avoiding any communication, wishing to avoid anything having to do with his wife, would sniff shady. And I don't believe metas need to be anything but aware of each other. I only see where it can all get messy, and zero communication never seems to make that get better. So this girl isn't even conducting herself in a productive or respectful manner for a V.

All this "it's torture to expect someone to talk when you need to" is way overblown. Someone doesn't know what torture is. And isn't it just as cruel to dangle someone along till they have to read your mind and slink away?

I just get a little tired of reading about how quick everyone is to assume the unicorn person is the victim. All these excuses for why they have don't have any responsibility or accountability, when these are grown-ass adults in the mix. Might it be uncomfortable, scary, dramatic? Sure. But what's new about that in the land of interpersonal relationships?

 

[Natja]

I don't see how it's worth crapping on the OP. If it is, it sure isn't for me to do on the behalf of a person I don't know, who won't speak up for themselves.

Well, that is your first mistake. I am not doing this on the girlfriend's behalf. I am saying it because it's common sense, because I want the OP to realise that her behaviour also needs checking, and also because I would hope other people would not come on here and believe that all poly people support the entitled attitude present in the OP.

The gf is just by the by, really.

Wishing to avoid anything having to do with his wife would sniff shady.

I think you'd find a few people are not all that involved with metamours without it being shady. Also, the OP goes out on a lunch date weekly with the gf. The problem here appears to be the enforced intimacy, not the friendship, or even the casual flirting. The girlfriend is happy with that. But the OP is unhappy that she does not get romance from the gf. I assert that you can't force that! This communication that is lacking is over something that can't be fixed. I.e., she is just not into her.

I just get a little tired of reading about how quick everyone is to assume the unicorn person is a victim.

I don't think she is. But she isn't here, and we can't excuse the OP because the gf does something wrong too.

 

[Dagferi]

I an in a V relationship as the hinge. My boyfriend wants nothing to do with my husband and that is his right. He is respectful when he comes and stays at my family home. He will make idle chat. There is no sharing of feelings or discussing of relationship issues between my guys. Murf is not comfortable with it. Period. There is nothing shady going on. He prefers privacy in our relationship, and so do I. Just like what goes on between Butch and me is between us.

 

[peabean]

I think you'd find a few people are not all that involved with metamours without it being shady. Also the OP goes out on a lunch date weekly with the gf. The problem here appears to be the enforced intimacy, not the friendship, or even the casual flirting, the girlfriend is happy with that. But the OP is unhappy that she does not get romance from the gf. I assert that you can't force that! This communication that is lacking is over something that can't be fixed. I.e., she is just not into her.

This is completely true, if they were metamours. Clearly the OP entered the relationship thinking they were lovers, not metamours.

So how is this 'enforced intimacy'? That is total BS. The woman agreed to a triad. The OP goes around thinking they are in a relationship; therefore the intimacy is real, in her mind!

Also, if the gf refuses to communicate the fact that she just isn't into the OP, how is that the OP's fault? It seems the OP has had her heart broken by a woman who would like to just exclusively date her husband, was dishonest about her intentions, and is now refusing to be an adult and break up with her.

But never mind. Let's just have a merry time slaying unicorn hunters some more.

People on here think they have some wealth of anecdata that shows that triads don't work. You wonder why you don't hear from those of us that are successful? Speaking for myself and my partners, we are tired of reading this crap!

 

[Emm]

I don't think anyone in this thread has said that triads don't work. What they've been saying is that forcing a triad doesn't work. If you're unclear on the reason that the OP is being dogpiled, reread her first post. It couldn't have fit better into the entitled unicorn hunter category if it had tried.

 

[Natja]

This is completely true, if they were metamours. Clearly the OP entered the relationship thinking they are lovers, not metamours...

So how is this 'enforced intimacy'? That is total BS. The woman agreed to a triad.

You say that, but how do we know? The OP's first post on the subject was, 'Husband met woman, they really dug each other, she wanted him, and so now we are a triad.'

Go and check for yourself. Frankly, we have no idea what sort of free agency this other woman was given.

Also, if the gf refuses to communicate the fact that she just isn't into the OP, how is that the OP's fault?

I have already stated that I don't agree with that, but two wrongs do not make a right. The OP is wrong for what she is wrong about. Simple.

But never mind. Let's just have a merry time slaying unicorn hunters some more.

Going back to my first point, we don't have any evidence that they started out as unicorn hunters. We simply do not know how this woman was approached to enter into a triad. But what we do know is that the woman met and attached to the husband.

People on here think they have some wealth of anecdata that shows that triads don't work. You wonder why you don't hear from those of us that are successful? Speaking for myself and my partners, we are tired of reading this crap!

You don't have to read it. Perhaps post about ways you make your triad work instead? That is what I used to do. Besides, as already pointed out, no one actually said that on this thread. However you couldn't get a more classic example of forced triad hell if you tried. If you are not a unicorn hunter, if you are not acting in ways similar to the OP, this thread does not concern you.

When I was in a triad, I never took such fuck-ups as ^this^ one personally, because I knew mine did not originate out of a unicorn-hunting scenario. Nor were there any examples of behaviour exhibited by the OP.

So perhaps you need to step back and think about it.

 

[northhome]

I don't think anyone in this thread has said that triads don't work.

No, I don't believe they have. But what I do see is overly emotional responses to anything that has to do with a situation that might look like a 'triad.' It seems like a lot of people have issues with that particular configuration.

I was starting to think it was just a few people on this particular forum that have had bad experiences that they are generalising. I'm the author of a book on non-traditional relationships. I have worked with (and the book is co-authored by) poly-friendly counsellors, and I have a lot of information on different poly configurations and experiences.

I'd never run across the level of hostility to triads that I encountered here during the research for the book, however. Odd. Maybe it's a cultural thing, as I've most info about the Netherlands and Germany.

Recently I did ran across this, though. The article seems to confirm that there is a certain prejudice in some poly circles against 'triad' configurations.

It does seem that the unicorn-hunter situation is common and leads to difficulty. But from my vantage, it appears that the biggest problem is simply when people are not acting as adults, but instead playing out roles (and all three can do this!), instead of committing to the hard work it takes to make any poly configuration work.

As an aside, I did notice in my research that there were (very broadly speaking) two groups of people interested in poly. The first were ones that just wanted to carry on with dating/falling in love/having sex with more than one person, with no interest in changing their underlying behaviour patterns.

The second group embrace poly as a part of a fundamental re-examination of who they are in a quest to have more conscious relationships.

I may be wrong, but it seems like the first group often get really angry with the second group when discussions about triads happen. The second group find the first haven't a clue what they are talking about. Talk about miscommunication.

 

[Marcus]

You don't have to read it. Perhaps post about ways you make your triad work instead. That is what I used to do. Besides, as already pointed out, no one actually said that on this thread. However, you couldn't get a more classic example of triad hell if you tried. If you are not a unicorn hunter, if you are not acting in ways similar to the OP, this thread does not concern you.

When I was in a triad I never took such fuck-ups as ^this^ one personally, because I knew mine did not originate out of a unicorn hunting scenario. Nor were there any examples of behaviour exhibited by the OP.

While polyamory would be the correct way to classify my relationship set-up, it would be incorrect to suggest that my relationship is the way "most" poly relationships seem to be set up. My views on independence, sacrifice, compromise, and selfishness are drastically different from what appears to be mainstream. (If I get the "Hey, don't tell me how to have a relationship," I'm just going to ignore you.)

So, when I read these threads, I need to apply my critical thinking skills and realize, "That doesn't really apply to me, because they are doing XYZ, which I don't do."

When I'm talking to someone who doesn't really understand that poly isn't a single thing, but that it's a very general classification of approach to romantic relationships, I need to remember not to take their opinions personally. I have heard a number of things from uninformed people about how poly relationships work, and while they might apply to a majority of the threads I've seen on here, they in no way are related to how I do things.

So it doesn't offend me. Why would it? I know what my principles are; I know how I am similar and how I am distinct in ideology from the wider poly approach. If it doesn't apply to me, it doesn't apply to me. If I want to add rational information to the discussion to help people understand the difference, then I can do so.

 

[Emm]

But what I do see is overly emotional responses to anything that has to do with a situation that might look like a 'triad'. It seems like a lot of people have issues with that particular configuration.

If you look a little closer, I don't think you'll find anyone who says—in general terms—that a triad won't work. They might say that a specific triad won't work, such as the one in the OP, but that is because of the way the specific people in that specific set of relationships is going about it, not because of the shape of the relationship itself.

 

[northhome]

If you look a little closer, I don't think you'll find anyone who says—in general terms—that a triad won't work. They might say that a specific triad won't work, such as the one in the OP, but that is because of the way the specific people in that specific set of relationships is going about it, not because of the shape of the relationship itself.

Well, actually, quite a few people on this board have said that triads rarely work. Most have been referring to existing couples bring a third person into the relationship rather than three single people getting together.

I'm happy to pm you the posts if you like as I have no need to bring them in to the public conversation without their consent.

 

[Emm]

Most have been referring to existing couples bring a third person into the relationship rather than three single people getting together..

Which is exactly what I said. It's because of the way they're going about it, not because of the shape of the relationship.

 

[YouAreHere]

In this particular case, what I'm seeing (and again, this is speculation on my part, given that the GF isn't posting) is that

- the GF is in love with the husband
- the OP wants more romantic attention from the GF
- GF is getting avoidy with the OP

This leads me to believe that the GF is not as into the OP as she is into the husband. Should she tell the OP? Certainly. But what are the "rules" of this configuration?

If the GF is going to lose the relationship with the man she DOES love if she doesn't love someone else in the same way, I can see where this would hold her back. It doesn't make it the honest, upstanding thing to do, but I can understand why she'd be reluctant.

I haven't seen it spelled out whether or not the GF would, in fact, lose the relationship with the husband if she told the OP that she's not really feeling the romantic connection with her.

This is the part of (forced) triads that I think has many people upset - that if one dyad fails to work on a romantic level, then the other dyad with that person must also be broken. You can say that these folks aren't innocent - that they knew what they were getting into, but emotions are never that simple and it seems to turn into a major CF all around.

I know some of the posts here seem like attacks, but to me they sound like warnings - warnings that get louder and more urgent the further you wade into danger. Here there be dragons - if your GF just isn't that into you, forcing the issue is going to lead to some major malfunctions down the road. If the GF isn't discussing it, then maybe the OP should step back, take a look at what's going on, and talk with both the GF and her husband and figure out what to do next. Someone needs to take the reins.

Hell, I'm in a vee, and I've just recently gone through issues with my metamour where she wanted us to have a closer (sisterly) relationship than I was comfortable with. We have finally ironed all that out, but wow, did it take a while, with discomfort on all sides. I can't imagine the amount of emotional hell this particular situation must be on everyone involved, and I wish the OP, her GF, and the husband luck through all this.

 

[Natja]

Omg, not this again. You have my consent, Northome. I said that triads rarely work and I stick by it. I am unsure why Northome feels the need to bring it up every time they post though, as if they are still distressed by it. Nothing is going to change, Northome, move on...!

And btw, it's not really relevant to this thread.

 

[kkxvlv]

the reason we broke up is because she has a lot of emotional things going on. instead of communication with us that this is whats going on she shut down and ultimately broke things off. there was some stuff going on the past couple days and instead of telling us hey I need some space she wouldn't talk to us. that's not ok to me.

There isn't even any need to speculate about whether or not the gf is/was "into" the OP or whether this is a problem with triads or unicorn hunters in general. It isn't particularly useful either since most often posters just rebel against these terms. There is enough information in her own posts to show she just isn't considering the gf's needs in addition to her own.

The gf was dealing with other stuff and needed space so she took it. That was not ok with the OP because the gf didn't communicate it. The OP needed communication but the gf needed to not be dealing with the OP or her husband right then.

Let me make this clear. she did not break things off because I was pressuring her. there was other things going on. she needed some time to herself. not just from me but from both of us. and she didn't tell us that.

im torturing her? I don't think I am. she is not the kind of person that would let that happen. she is not someone that lets people walk on her and treat her bad. she is a very strong woman. so if I was "torturing her" she wouldn't let that happen.

When they continued pushing her to communicate when she was trying to get space, she tried again to get space by breaking up with them.

The valuable lesson here for the OP is when someone in a relationship with you isn't willing to meet your needs (whether those needs are for more communication, more one on one time, or in the gf's case, space to deal with her own stuff) you break up with them!

OP - This girlfriend was not willing or able to give you the time and communication you felt you needed, so let her go. If you do try to continue with her, it would be far more helpful for you to try to consider what she needs and why she is behaving the way she is, rather than ask a bunch of outsiders to confirm that you are right and she is wrong. Even if every single one of us had agreed she was wrong, it wouldn't change anything for your relationship.

 

[northhome]

And btw, it's not really relevant to this thread.

No distress. Just curiosity (and amusement at your responses!). As for relevancy, I would beg to differ.

The OP has posted about her problems and I notice that some people seem to be slotting her into a role or model and discounting her because of that. That seems unfortunate and gets in the way of providing assistance. Unless of course providing assistance is not the purpose of some peoples posts...

If a third party joins an existing couple then they must have their reasons for doing so, and clearing there is some sort of benefit for them. Why else would they do it?

The issue is what the agreements and expectations are, and how clearly these are communicated, negotiated and lived up to. Where there is unclarity there is often confusion and pain, as the OP clearly is experiencing. To simply put it all on her plate seems somewhat unfair however as the GF has had a part to play.

I do agree however that there is not a good set of communications protocols in place in the OP's relationship, and that could well be the underlying cause of the trainwreck.

 

[BoringGuy]

Well, actually, quite a few people on this board have said that triads rarely work. Most have been referring to existing couples bring a third person into the relationship rather than three single people getting together.

I'm happy to pm you the posts if you like as I have no need to bring them in to the public conversation without their consent.

These posts you refer to are public posts already, aren't they? What does that mean, "without their consent"? Anything posted here already has "consent" to be quoted and linked to from anywhere on this site or anywhere else on the internet. Unless of course you are talking about private messages. Then i guess it would be proper, if not necessary, to get the author's permission.

 

[northhome]

These posts you refer to are public posts already, aren't they? What does that mean, "without their consent"?

That was shorthand for 'not wanting to start an off-topic conversation that might occur if I bring other people's posts into my response'.

I was trying to stay on topic. Not always an easy task

Thanks for the request for clarification.

 

[Natja]

No distress. Just curiosity (and amusement at your responses!). .

Glad someone is amused by your flogging this 'triads rarely work' horse to death.

 

[BoringGuy]

Someone said up there that we should try to provide assistance. Here is some: whenever a relationship takes a turn for the worse, or doesn't go the way i would have liked (it's been a long time since i've had one of these but i've had my share), i think of what i was like, where i was, and what i had going for me BEFORE that relationship became "serious" (whatever that means to any person). If you were basically happy with your life and your self BEFORE embarking on a given relationship, you can get back to your baseline even though you might feel bummed out for a while. If you got into a relationship because there was "something missing" or because of some other co-dependent reason, then yes, you are going to have a much rougher time letting go.

That's REAL advice you can USE because it only refers to things YOU can control.

Many, if not most, of these posts seeking "advice" or "support" - what they REALLY want to hear is what they can do to cause other people to behave in a certain way. In this case, the OP wants US (the forum membership) to tell her how to get the girlfriend to "communicate". OP says she TAKES the advice, but the girlfriend STILL won't talk to her. So we're like, "hey, looks like this isn't what you thought it was after all..." But..but, we all AGREED to this! "yeah but it ain't happening. Haven't you ever heard of people who agree to somethingthen change their mind, or don't follow through for one reason or another?"

tl;dr. Grant me the serenity to accept what i cannot change, the courage to change what i can, the wisdom to know the difference, and if it ain't broken, don't fix it.