Trust My Metamour?

L

LovelyLady

New member
I find myself once again needing advice. My hubby is about 3 months into a new relationship, they're still in NRE but have reached the "love" stage. I really don't have many boundaries, I let them do their thing in our house and I don't limit the number of days/hours/overnights they share. But I do have one thing that I just don't think I could handle and that is if he were to have a baby with her. We are in our early 40s and already have a child together while she is 25. She has shared that she does want children. I have told my husband that I don't think I could handle it and it might be the one thing that I just could not accept. He says he understands how I feel and has shared my feelings on children with his gf. Here's my issue:
1. He doesn't use a condom to avoid pregnancy. We've all been tested and she states she is on the pill, but I would prefer the extra precautionary measures. He has always hated condoms, which I guess every guy does, and says it makes the sex feel impersonal. From my perspective, he is basically saying, losing me is worth the risk so he can share his cum with her. Am I being irrational?
2. As I said, he has told his gf that a baby would be too much for me to handle. I am worried that she now has the "ammunition" to use against me. Both his gf and I are mono and I just have this gut instinct that she would like me out of the picture. Now she knows that all she has to do is get pregnant and I will most likely leave my husband. My husband has been very clear with her from the beginning that she would be secondary (his choice; not my requirement), but she has already told me she would do anything to spend more time with him. She and I have met a few times and are trying to build a friendship but it has been rocky to say the least. Should I trust her? Do I have any other options? He has already made comment that I am harping on the subject and he doesn't understand why I'm making it such a big deal.
 
Would he be willing to get a vasectomy to alleviate your worries? Even if she is on the pill accidents happen. This would double up the birth control. Nate doesn't want more kids either he got a vacectomy a couple years ago. Honestly if he hadn't I wouldn't feel comfortable with him going Barrier free. I don't want to be financially responsible for a child that isn't mine.
 
Yikes, she told you, the wife of your shared man, that she'd do "anything" to get to spend more time with him? And you suspect she'd even get pregnant to get her hooks more into him.

This is called a "cowgirl" in poly parlance. And a thing to be avoided.

I'd also be worried, and want my husband's help in avoiding knocking up his gf by using condoms. I am sorry, but his wish to go bareback with her would be unacceptable, if she's acting sketchy and cowgirlish!

BTW, my bf is 61, been poly all his life, been with his wife for nearly 40 years, and I am the first person he's ever gone barrier free with. It's been his price of admission to being able to be poly. His wife is still fertile (age 60, poor thing) and can't use hormone based contraception. All the other women he's been with, he didn't really trust them enough to go bareback. If a horny nearly oversexed man like my bf can use condoms for 45 years, without any problem, almost anyone can. :cool:
 
If she's mono and wants kids, and he's refusing to give her that, why is he wasting her time? Seems kind of unfair. I can imagine she's swept in NRE and thinks maybe she can change him, but I doubt that.
 
I'm thinking that a vasectomy would be worth talking about, but the conversation might be a stand-in for the real conversation: how serious they are allowed to be. I don't mean in the sense of cowgirl, I mean in the sense of what kind of shared life they might want. The problem is the gap between NRE and responsible conversation. I DON'T recommend a vasectomy, but I do recommend you guys talking about responsibility and shared choices. Condoms are the safe bet for a while, but he'll hate using them (because they haven't so far, and again, it's a stand-in for the sentence "I don't actually trust you.").

I guess my point is that this is not about what it's really about. Dedication, devotion, permanence, shared life, trust... those are serious issues. They're in NRE. Future rule: always use condoms until NRE wears off...?
 
Inyourendo said:
Would he be willing to get a vasectomy to alleviate your worries?
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This would be a solution I would be happy with, but I fear it might take some convincing.

Magdlyn said:
Yikes, she told you, the wife of your shared man, that she'd do "anything" to get to spend more time with him? And you suspect she'd even get pregnant to get her hooks more into him.
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Yes, she told me that. I think she was just being playful, but I don't know her that well, so I'm not certain. This is also why I'm not sure if my suspicions are warranted or I'm being paranoid.

PolyinPractice said:
If she's mono and wants kids, and he's refusing to give her that, why is he wasting her time? Seems kind of unfair. I can imagine she's swept in NRE and thinks maybe she can change him, but I doubt that.
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Well, he's been honest with her from the beginning and it's been her decision to continue with the relationship. They've only been dating a few months, so I really don't think he's leading her on. When he was sharing our preferences for no additional children, he did add that if an accident happened, he would do the right thing and support her and the child. I guess she could have taken this to mean there was an opening for her????

Ultimately, I fear I'm just going to have to take a leap of faith and trust her until she proves untrustworthy. I just hope if she is a "cowboy" that she shows her true colors before an accident can happen.
 
I wonder-have you considered what it is that makes you feel like any other partner of his isn't worthy of having his child?

I'm not saying you *should* change your mind.
But my experience is that when we have some specified thing that is a "deal breaker" for us-it's usually a good sign we need to do some hefty considering about that thing because;
while it could be a simple, healthy boundary,
there is a high risk that it's actually not.
That it is in fact a place where we are holding ourself back from fully opening up.

I don't want any more children. Neither do either of my partners.
BUT-we also don't allow ourselves to date anyone who does-because that is unfair. It is unfair for us to put ourselves into a relationship where we are holding someone else back.
That part isn't yours.

BUT the other piece of that is; if one of my partners did want to have a child with someone else, it's not my place to hold my partner back. Likewise if I wanted to have a child with someone else, it's not their place to hold me back.

There's a point in poly where we are forced to face ourselves in a mirror and consider just exactly how POLYAMOROUS we are willing to be. I use that word in the strictest sense of multiple-loves.
Because love, isn't limited.

If we aren't willing to allow full and complete loving relationships, are we *really* polyamorous or are we maybe something more like polykinky or polyaffectionate or something?
Not that we need to create new terminology-but that we need to dig deeper into our own selves and identify what it is that we really are accepting of.
Because if we aren't accepting of our partners earning the same privileges with other partners as they earned with us-then we are playing a favorites game and that isn't loving...
 
And just to be clear-I am NOT saying that you should or shouldn't be ok with this that or the other thing with this specific person.

only saying that what you wrote, while it does send up red flags about his behavior/choices and her behavior/choices ALSO suggests that there is some internal work YOU need to do in regards to your behavior/choices.
 
LovingRadiance said:
If we aren't willing to allow full and complete loving relationships, are we *really* polyamorous or are we maybe something more like polykinky or polyaffectionate or something?
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I've always wondered about that. But the minute I suggest something similar, someone invariably screams "poly police"!
 
Yeah but bringing a human into the world is a huge decision. There's a lot of reasons people don't have more and it truly affects every one involved. Does Nate have the time and resources to start another family? No he doesn't. He is a sahd and doesn't have the income to support a child with someone else. We don't even have room in our vehicle for another baby.
 
LovingRadiance said:
I wonder-have you considered what it is that makes you feel like any other partner of his isn't worthy of having his child?

BUT the other piece of that is; if one of my partners did want to have a child with someone else, it's not my place to hold my partner back. Likewise if I wanted to have a child with someone else, it's not their place to hold me back.

There's a point in poly where we are forced to face ourselves in a mirror and consider just exactly how POLYAMOROUS we are willing to be.
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It is not that either of us feel his gf is not worthy of having his child. I will give you both his reasons (as I understand them) and my own reasons:

HIS - He has 2 children from a prior marriage who are 23 and 17. He has one child with me who is 5. The expense of another child is not something we are wanting to take on. The other issue is that he is 42 and worries about being a good Dad at an "advanced" age. I think these are just things vanilla couples would consider as well when making the decision to have a baby.

MINE - I also have the same fears that I detailed above for him, however my biggest reason is that we are not "out". I am very much against our families knowing that he has other women and I would like for my daughter to be protected from societies judgments. I know this may seem cowardly for those who are brave enough to be champions for polyamory, but I will admit to being weak in this area. A new baby from another woman would require us to provide answers that I'm just not willing to share. He does not share this same fear and is more of the "I don't care what anyone thinks" mentality.
 
LovelyLady said:
The expense of another child is not something we are wanting to take on . . . he is 42 and worries about being a good Dad at an "advanced" age . . . I am very much against our families knowing that he has other women and I would like for my daughter to be protected from societies judgments . . . A new baby from another woman would require us to provide answers that I'm just not willing to share.
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Okay, that all makes sense.

LovelyLady said:
Inyourendo said:
Would he be willing to get a vasectomy to alleviate your worries?
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This would be a solution I would be happy with, but I fear it might take some convincing.
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This does not make sense.

Jeez, you've got good reasons, so why the hesitation in discussing a vasectomy with him? He's older, has kids already, doesn't want more, neither of you needs the extra expense of an additional child, you don't want a scandal - yet you "fear" it would take "some convincing" and now you're in a quandary about what to do?!??

I am having a hard time understand what the hell the problem is. He doesn't want kids, but would need to be convinced... huh? And so what if he needs convincing? If a guy doesn't want to become a father, he has as much responsibility to invest in that not happening as the woman does. Have either of you ever read up on vasectomies? Maybe you can stop at a doctor's office and get some pamphlets on it. It's a very common, simple, and quick procedure. Most of the men I know in their 40s and 50s have had one. My husband did it just before we got married, and it was such a relief not to worry about conceiving! Here is someone's take on it from a different thread:

MonoMale said:
I've had a vasectomy. There's no fuss with it and it's not painful at all. Doesn't even affect your sex drive whatsoever - hell, I've had more sex with my wife since than I did before! ;)

I know lots of guys won't consider it even if they don't want more kids. Something to do with thinking they're less of a man, libido going south, etc. Nonsense, I say!

I think it's sensible and even responsible. That's just me. :)
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LovelyLady said:
MINE - I also have the same fears that I detailed above for him, however my biggest reason is that we are not "out". I am very much against our families knowing that he has other women and I would like for my daughter to be protected from societies judgments. I know this may seem cowardly for those who are brave enough to be champions for polyamory, but I will admit to being weak in this area. A new baby from another woman would require us to provide answers that I'm just not willing to share. He does not share this same fear and is more of the "I don't care what anyone thinks" mentality.
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Here's the thing. As regards the children of the family, no explanations need to be given. Questions will be asked, absolutely. You are not required to answer them. If you feel obliged, there's the (hopefully) true yet uninformative answer that "This is my husband's child and I accept zie as part of my family". Or even "This child is part of my family." Full stop.

These days, children comes from a lot of places, not just the marital union. There's adoption. There's surrogacy, traditional and gestational. There's step-parenting. Undoubtedly other things I'm forgetting. Point is, no matter who it is -- even if grandparents/inlaws -- it's not their business unless you choose to make it so. Let them wonder and conjecture; it's what people do. You don't have to confirm or deny.
 
nycindie said:
Jeez, you've got good reasons, so why the hesitation in discussing a vasectomy with him? He's older, has kids already, doesn't want more, neither of you needs the extra expense of an additional child, you don't want a scandal - yet you "fear" it would take "some convincing" and now you're in a quandary about what to do?!??

I am having a hard time understand what the hell the problem is. He doesn't want kids, but would need to be convinced... huh? And so what if he needs convincing? If a guy doesn't want to become a father, he has as much responsibility to invest in that not happening as the woman does. Have either of you ever read up on vasectomies? Maybe you can stop at a doctor's office and get some pamphlets on it. It's a very common, simple, and quick procedure. Most of the men I know in their 40s and 50s have had one. My husband did it just before we got married, and it was such a relief not to worry about conceiving!:
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NYCindie, it all seems so simple, doesn't it? Here's a guy who doesn't like condoms, might be anti-vasectomy, is 42, has 3 kids, and doesn't want more.

Why is he being like this? Well, my ex-h was like this too. With him it was a self esteem thing. We only used a condom twice in 30 years. Otherwise I was using a diaphragm, was on hormonal bc (pills), and then I was past menopause, finally.

He had very low self esteem, not a very firm grip on his masculinity, and getting his bits snipped wasn't in the cards. He was also convinced it would f up his immune system to reabsorb sperm. The 2 times we tried condoms in the latter years of our relationship, just for the kink of it, he was fine once, turned on. The 2nd time he claimed to have no sensation, and wilted.

When we first opened our relationship, the first time he had intercourse with his new gf, he didn't use a condom. We hadn't discussed safer sex. I'd just assumed he knew the risks, since he is a very intelligent man. But no. He told me she used a diaphragm so what was the problem? Um, STDs? Grrrr! And she'd had sex with no condom with her previous casual lover who was a homeless Deadhead... Goodness knows what beasties he had in his semen. (I insisted he require her to get tested, and she was, and was negative, but I had a couple very nervous weeks.)

I used to beg him to get a vasectomy, but he refused. Reason #503 we are now divorced.
 
Magdlyn said:
Why is he being like this? Well, my ex-h was like this too.
He had very low self esteem, not a very firm grip on his masculinity, and getting his bits snipped wasn't in the cards. He was also convinced it would f up his immune system to reabsorb sperm. I used to beg him to get a vasectomy, but he refused. Reason #503 we are now divorced.
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Thanks for sharing your story. I did bring up the vasectomy option last night and this morning. It's going to take a lot of convincing, if I really want to push for it. His reasons are similar to your ex-h. We are not fanatics, but we try to maintain a natural balance. We rarely take medicine or seek any medical treatment considered optional. In addition, he is worried about impacts it could have on his drive, stamina, etc. He doesn't care that those side effects are rare, it's too big of a risk for him. Lastly, he does have a bit of an inferiority complex. I think the ability to make babies is tied to his masculinity. He constantly worries that his dick is not big enough. He asked me "do you want to make my already small cock weaker? "

Although his reasons are based in fear rather than fact, I have to respect that. Unless I see a sprout coming from the vasectomy seed I planted, I am not gong to bring it up again. Which leads me back to thinking I just need to make a leap of faith.
 
Both my ex and dh had a vacectomy and it was as simple as numbing the area, using a dermal punch, taking the tube out with a hook and cutting and sealing it. Took all of 5 minutes and dh didn't feel a thing. Just a little tenderness the next couple of days
 
[raises hand in support of vasectomies -- of which Brother-Husband and I both have one]

Where'd all the weird phobias about the procedure come from anyway? Damn, people need to get educated. Mine was the easiest thing in the world. The worst part by far was all the worrying I did. In reality, getting a minor cavity drilled is way worse. And zero pain afterwards.

Didn't hurt my libido one bit. Improved it if anything. Zero ED. I mean come on, sex without the added worry of conception? That was like getting fitted with a set of wings. I felt like Superman.

Maybe it's somehow related to men's phobia about sitting down to pee? Sigh, guys have hang-ups about some weird things. I'm just sayin'.
 
LovelyLady said:
Thanks for sharing your story. I did bring up the vasectomy option last night and this morning. It's going to take a lot of convincing, if I really want to push for it. His reasons are similar to your ex-h. We are not fanatics, but we try to maintain a natural balance. We rarely take medicine or seek any medical treatment considered optional. In addition, he is worried about impacts it could have on his drive, stamina, etc. He doesn't care that those side effects are rare, it's too big of a risk for him. Lastly, he does have a bit of an inferiority complex. I think the ability to make babies is tied to his masculinity. He constantly worries that his dick is not big enough. He asked me "do you want to make my already small cock weaker? "

Although his reasons are based in fear rather than fact, I have to respect that. Unless I see a sprout coming from the vasectomy seed I planted, I am not gong to bring it up again. Which leads me back to thinking I just need to make a leap of faith.
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Actually, you don't "have" to respect that. I lost respect for my h over it, and it was part of our deal breaker. And you don't "need" to make a leap of faith. Those are choices you are making. To be with a man who thinks he's small and will get "weaker" if he gets a couple tubes tied off. To be with a man who might knock up his cowgirl gf and wreak havoc on YOUR life.

There is such a thing as self-respect and dignity too. I chose that.
 
So, if you take that leap of faith, what kind of reassurances do you have for (A) STD protection, and (B) what happens if she does get pregnant (say she goes on antibiotics, which reduces the effectivity of the pill)?

These are what-ifs that should be discussed now, and not in an "OMG!" moment, when emotions are at their highest.
 
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