What is considered Poly

maxnsue

maxnsue

Inactive
For some reason, despite a 38 year relationship with my wife's best friend in our marriage, we never visited sex related websites. We felt no need to. We did what we did and it worked out very well for us. Our triad even survived the marriage of our girlfriend to another man who she had an arrangement with. In fact it thrived after her marriage as she had someone other than me to support her and a built in babysitter for her son. We socialized with her husband and he was a nice guy who never mentioned the fact that my wife and me were having sex with his wife a few times a week and twice on Sundays. :) Heck, the guy even flew our g/f out to be with us on vacation and then went off on his own, leaving his wife in our capable hands.

Then I found this website last week. I am confused as to what poly means to people these days. Much of what I read seems to be either an open relationship or serial polygamy. I do not read of many long term poly relationships that are not just sex based.

I am not saying that I am the judge of what anything is, but rather find what I am reading very interesting and it is an eye opener as we had no idea of what others did outside of what we learned from other couples we knew in real life. Now I am reading some very complicated stuff with husband, boyfriends, wives and lovers, all in various relationships with each other with jealousy and insecurities abounding with one or more of the group.

We lived like a husband and two wives. We did not date anyone or would have liked to have anyone date anyone outside of our group. Even our girlfriend sought our approval before she got married and introduced us to her husband to be for his and our approval. Then we moved on with our lives and she split her time between her own home and ours. She had a say in what we did and when she stayed with us she did all the boring stuff that goes into having a life together. She went shopping for food, participated in decisions that affected our lives and in general was functioning like a wife.

So, what does poly mean to you? It is just having sex with others or forming an extended family? Do you find that it works if one of you takes on a lover and then tries to incorporate that lover into your marriage? I guess I am not used to the concept that you have to date someone before you can bring them into your marriage. We did not have to do that so we avoided all of the pitfalls associated with it. I would also like to know if your poly relationships lasted and if not, why not? We have yet to met a couple that has had a third involved in their marriage, as long as we did. Maybe old fashioned values are not so bad after all. :) Let me hear what the 411 is these days.
 
Kind of impossible to say "what is considered poly". Just form my reading here there are so many different styles and configurations it would make my head spin. Me personally I'm involved in a V type of relationship where my girlfriend is married to someone else. I consider myself mono meaning I have no desire to date or have sexual relations with anybody else. I'm not sure what her husband considers himself but that doesn't affect me so I don't care. I consider us a couple and don't concern myself with the other leg of the V.
 
WhatToDo said:
Kind of impossible to say "what is considered poly". Just form my reading here there are so many different styles and configurations it would make my head spin. Me personally I'm involved in a V type of relationship where my girlfriend is married to someone else. I consider myself mono meaning I have no desire to date or have sexual relations with anybody else. I'm not sure what her husband considers himself but that doesn't affect me so I don't care. I consider us a couple and don't concern myself with the other leg of the V.
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When I dated married women, I was considered what is now called a "bull" and the husband a Cuckold. I, in fact, did cuckold my girlfriend's husband for those 38 years. She used to call him every night after we had sex. I never knew what she said but it was the only rule he had so we respected his wishes.

There was a brief period when I was into married women. I did not chase them, they chased me. :) Both got caught with me but each has been cheating on their husbands for about 10 years with other guys. I was just new at it and did not know how to go about having an affair secretly. I felt sorry for their husbands and no longer went out with married women after that. It never ends well, even if they lie and tell you that they have an open relationship. :)
 
There's a few things to keep in mind.
The LARGE majority of people posting here are posting issues and asking advice, the majority of people who are happily ensconced in any type of relationship, are too busy living their lives to bother posting.

(not to say there aren't any people here posting who are happy-just saying majority).

So it's REALLY hard to get a feel for "what is typical" because what is here isn't representative at all.

that said; I define poly as loving more than one.
I don't make it any more structured than that.

MY "poly" is different from my husbands and is different from my boyfriends and is different from my sisters or her boyfriends or his wife or any of my poly friends.

We each have our own comfort zones.

Much like, people's monogamous marriages are all different too. We lump them under the word "mono" but the truth is that they are all different. Some people are ok with their spouses having opposite sex friends, some aren't ok with their spouses having friends at all, some are only ok with friends who are also couples, etc.
 
To me "Poly" is "more than one". Simple.

I also think it's best thought of as the Trapezoid/Rectangle/Square situation: All Polys are "Poly", but some might not be the same as others... and there's nothing wrong with that, because "not the same" does NOT equal "less than".
 
maxnsue said:
... I felt sorry for their husbands and no longer went out with married women after that. It never ends well, even if they lie and tell you that they have an open relationship. :)
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Interesting. My boyfriend came to the exact opposite conclusion...he says that he is ONLY going to go out with (happily) married women from now on - they have proven they know how to maintain healthy relationships. I guess it all depends on what your experience is. Which may be because NONE of us are comfortable seeing cheaters - not a "rule", just a damn good idea! (Likewise, "Don't fuck fragile." or, my husband's personal rule, "I don't stick my dick in crazy.")

As to "what constitutes poly" - you'll get as many answers as you find people who consider themselves poly (or who find themselves in "poly relationships"...as you have seen). For years my version of poly looked one way, now it looks another way - was one way more "poly" than the other? Who cares?

(Am I only poly if I have more that one "serious" relationship? What if I am only "open to the possibility"? Am I only Bisexual if I currently have at least one partner of each gender? What if my partner doesn't gender-identify? What if I am celibate?)
 
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Re (thread title):
"What is considered Poly?"
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In most cases I think it could be said that:

  • Polyamory = "the state of being, or the ability and/or inclination to be, part of a romantically-connected group of more than two adults, with the full knowledge and consent of all the adults in the group."
  • Polyamorous = "practicing, inclined toward, or having to do with, polyamory."
  • Polyamorist = "one who is practicing, or who is inclined toward, polyamory."
  • Poly = "polyamory, polyamorous, or polyamorist."
I base the above on 6+ years of poly forum (internet) participation, as well as at least a year's live local poly group (meatspace) participation. Personally I am comfortable with the above definitions, and am willing to "own" them, while still being willing to listen to new discussions about what poly means.

Living together isn't a necessary component of the definition of poly, but have no fear, many polyamorists (my little V included) do cohabitate and many of those (my V again) are committed for life in a marriage-like arrangement.

In most cases, people don't mean poly to describe arrangements that are "just sex." Polyamory implies a romantic/emotional component, usually some kind of commitment, and sometimes doesn't involve sex itself at all. On the other hand, some people's relationships are more casual than others, and there is variance in how people define poly and in just how much romance and/or emotion they believe it must entail.

In my case, one of us (us three) could start dating someone new, and who knows, the new someone could eventually be adopted into our family (turning our V into a Z). But it's not like we're looking for people to date.

At this time, Snowbunny (the hinge of our V) has a sister who's in the process of divorcing. This sister knows all three of us and technically it's possible she could come and be adopted into our family. Snowbunny would feel pretty good about that arrangement because she knows and trusts her sister, and both the guys in our home rather have the hots for this sister as well. Probably something that would never happen in real life, but I throw it out there as another example of how things *could* go in our arrangement. We wouldn't *have* to date someone before we adopted them, is what I'm saying.

And the way we do it is just one model of poly. There are many possible models. Some polyamorists are swingers on the side; some even identify as relationship anarchists (it's all about the autonomy, man). You'd be surprised at some of the relationship models that can succeed -- and succeed often. (My V has been together for over eight years, and there's no indication that we'll ever split up.)

When a poly relationship fails, it can be due to any number of reasons. Jealousy, sure, though it's usually more complicated than that. Growing incompatibility can be a reason. Dwindling communication and distancing. Burying little resentments until they become big resentments.

I think one of the biggest reasons is if someone isn't sincere about the role they claim to be playing in the arrangement. Honesty is really really important (in monogamy too, but especially in polyamory).
 
LovingRadiance said:
There's a few things to keep in mind.
The LARGE majority of people posting here are posting issues and asking advice, the majority of people who are happily ensconced in any type of relationship, are too busy living their lives to bother posting.

(not to say there aren't any people here posting who are happy-just saying majority).

So it's REALLY hard to get a feel for "what is typical" because what is here isn't representative at all.

that said; I define poly as loving more than one.
I don't make it any more structured than that.

MY "poly" is different from my husbands and is different from my boyfriends and is different from my sisters or her boyfriends or his wife or any of my poly friends.

We each have our own comfort zones.

Much like, people's monogamous marriages are all different too. We lump them under the word "mono" but the truth is that they are all different. Some people are ok with their spouses having opposite sex friends, some aren't ok with their spouses having friends at all, some are only ok with friends who are also couples, etc.
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I understand what you say about posting. I did not want to say it but we knew a lot of kinky couples and it is true that those with no problems, did not post or visit forums. We had no problems and were seeking no answers. I fully understand how special interest forums can present a false view of their subject matter. I run into that in other non sex related forums where you get a distorted view of things because the forum is filled with people with a certain viewpoint or take on things.

I only signed up here about a week ago so this is all new to me. The only other forums I had joined were chastity forums but they really were not so much about chastity itself but chastity as part of something larger like feminization, cuckolding, D/s, etc. I guess we are more into teasing and denial without D/s aspects, or as little as you can have in such a relationship. In my family, everyone is an equal and we always have been able to reach a compromise on any major issue in which there was disagreement. I hate to sound sappy but we are really in deep love and we consider each others needs and wants as much as we consider our own, in everything we do. We often find ourselves making decisions in favor of the other and neither of us wanting that. :) Anyway, I am not used to this posting stuff so I tend to repeat myself a lot because I treat each post as if people are reading about me for the first time. I keep forgetting that many read all the posts in all the different forum sections so I must sound like a broken record at times.

I am even concerned that my happiness with our life comes off the wrong way to those who struggle with real issues that I just never considered. When things go your way you do not look at what could have gone wrong. This has been a big eye opener for me and I hope that I can help others. I think that experience, especially when proven to work, is valuable and as I get even older I feel a need to give back to people but so many of the younger generation think they have it figured out but yet cannot understand why they never seem to be able to get it to work for them. I do not purport to have all the answers but at least I can show that what does work for me and they can ignore me or not. Does not matter to me as I do not let what others do affect me.

I do not think it a coincidence that all of our friends are still on their first marriage. We like people who are like us and are attracted to them. We value faithfulness and loyalty that is not confined to just two people. We have moved 13 times and have friends all over the USA. Some live very interesting lives, have multiple life partners, are gay/lesbian couples, into BDSM or cross dressing but what they all have in common is being faithful to their partners and being fiercely loyal. Those are the two things I value the most above all else. I have only had three girlfriends in my live starting at the age of 14. All three are bisexual so I have a different view of relationships and woman than most males. I have no idea of what it is like to live with a straight woman or have just one sexual partner. Heck, my second girlfriend was into gang bangs for gosh sake. She is the only one that I never got engaged too. She was my post Vietnam, need to make up for a year of no sex, girlfriend. :)

If you have not notice already, I tend to be very wordy which does not seem well suited to todays texting, web surfing individual. I co-authored a 4 volume technical reference book and wrote magazine articles that had to be so many words in length and that has affected the way I say things. Excuse my excessive words. :)
 
Excessive words, eh. :) My personal record here is a five-part post (had to be broken up into five parts due to the forum's post size limit). So if you do a six-part post sometime, I might have to get another apology. I'm pretty sure you're in the safe zone though for the time being. ;)

One thing you may find that's different is that some polyamorists don't measure the longevity of their relationships to determine how successful said relationships were; they just look at the quality of each relationship for however long it lasted and what each person got out of it. Did someone get together with someone else and then break up after a year? They might still say that was a successful relationship if it was a happy and/or productive one and ended on a good and/or amicable note. Heck even a two-week or a one-night relationship might be considered successful if measured in that way. Doesn't always have to be "til death do us part."
 
To me, what's considered "poly" is whatever is being done by someone who considers themselves polyamorous.

To use a random tangent from my life, my 16-year-old went through a stage last year (until her dad, a/k/a my ex-husband, told her to mind her own business) where she constantly told me that I wasn't dressing or acting like a "real mom." To which my reply--and Hubby's reply, and her dad's reply--was always, "I *am* a mom, and I *am* real, therefore however I dress and act is like a real mom."

I *am* polyamorous. Therefore, however I choose to live my polyamory is considered poly.

I'm still pretty new to this. Hubby and I opened our marriage in March 2013, but that wasn't polyamory, nor did we consider it such. It was a way to address some sexual disparity between the two of us. One of our agreed-upon rules was that if either of us felt something stronger than friendship for another partner, we had to immediately cut ties with that person.

It wasn't until September 2013 that I went to him and said I had fallen in love with Guy, that monogamy had never made sense to me, and that I didn't want to lose him OR Guy, I wanted both of them. I braced myself to be told I had to stop communicating with Guy, as per the agreement between Hubby and me.

Instead, Hubby, bless him, said, "You loving Guy isn't going to take away from how much you love me. You're bringing more love into the world, and I can't have a problem with that." Likewise, earlier this month when I told him I was afraid I was also falling for S2, Hubby said, "You have a lot more love in your heart than I do, and I'm okay with this."

I live with and am legally married to Hubby. He's my husband. (Hence the nickname on here, because I am completely unoriginal.)

Guy is my boyfriend, for want of a better term. He and I have a long-distance relationship that consists primarily of marathon phone calls (this morning's was over two hours), and occasional texts or Facebook messages. I've only seen him twice since July 2013, though he's going to be in my area on business for a month starting in September, so we'll get a bit of time together.

S2 and I are just beginning whatever we have; our first date was July 12. But so far, our relationship is occasional emails on the site through which we met, and seeing each other once or twice a week. Hubby and Guy already consider S2 my boyfriend; I've chosen not to consider him anything yet, and I don't know his opinion because I haven't asked.

But regardless of what terminology is used, the basic fact is that I am in love with Hubby and Guy, and I love S2 though I don't know if I'm *in love* with him yet. And that's what makes it polyamory.
 
maxnsue said:
So, what does poly mean to you? It is just having sex with others or forming an extended family?
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Neither of those. For me it is simply the desire, ability, or practice of having multiple loving relationships, openly and honestly. It is definitely not focused on sex, nor is it about creating some kind of "family." I enjoy living alone and having several lovers with whom I feel emotionally, intellectually, and physically connected. I have no desire to cohabit with anyone, nor to be part of some big poly tribe. Always been childfree by choice, so no parenting/family issues to manage.

maxnsue said:
Do you find that it works if one of you takes on a lover and then tries to incorporate that lover into your marriage?
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Not all polyfolk are married with a couple-centric perspective. I am solo, as are many other members here. My lovers and I are free to live our lives, manage our own relationships, take more lovers or not, as we see fit, and I have no need for any of the men I am involved with to meet and/or know each other.
 
nycindie said:
Neither of those. For me it is simply the desire, ability, or practice of having multiple loving relationships, openly and honestly. It is definitely not focused on sex, nor is it about creating some kind of "family." I enjoy living alone and having several lovers with whom I feel emotionally, intellectually, and physically connected. I have no desire to cohabit with anyone, nor to be part of some big poly tribe. Always been childfree by choice, so no parenting/family issues to manage.

Not all polyfolk are married with a couple-centric perspective. I am solo, as are many other members here. My lovers and I are free to live our lives, manage our own relationships, take more lovers or not, as we see fit, and I have no need for any of the men I am involved with to meet and/or know each other.
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Sounds just like my regular life before marriage but giving it a fancy name makes it seem so much nicer. :).
 
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maxnsue said:
Sounds just like my regular life before marriage but giving it a fancy name makes it seem so much nicer. :).
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So, you were practicing a form of polyamory even before your marriage, then. Obviously you did not think of it that way, but - solo poly is a valid way to live a poly life.

For you it was temporary, and from your posts I get that you very much preferred the poly-fi arrangement with marriage and all. Or would you say you were dating around *with* the thought of finally finding The One, getting married and settling down? Some people do not want that. For them, being solo poly may mean "dating around", but without the intent of settling down with someone / some ones.

Somehow I got offended by your remark here, since it made me feel that you disrespect the choice of being solo poly by saying it is a "fancy name" for something that only can be temporary and "The True Poly Life" is in a committed, life-long (poly-fi) arrangement. Okay, I might have read too much into your one single line.

My own practical poly life is much closer to yours than NYCindie's but I truly enjoy having a variety of views present on these forums. It gives me food for thought and a wider understanding of life.
 
maxnsue said:
nycindie said:
Neither of those. For me it is simply the desire, ability, or practice of having multiple loving relationships, openly and honestly. It is definitely not focused on sex, nor is it about creating some kind of "family." I enjoy living alone and having several lovers with whom I feel emotionally, intellectually, and physically connected. I have no desire to cohabit with anyone, nor to be part of some big poly tribe. Always been childfree by choice, so no parenting/family issues to manage.

Not all polyfolk are married with a couple-centric perspective. I am solo, as are many other members here. My lovers and I are free to live our lives, manage our own relationships, take more lovers or not, as we see fit, and I have no need for any of the men I am involved with to meet and/or know each other.
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Sounds just like my regular life before marriage but giving it a fancy name makes it seem so much nicer. :).
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Nadya said:
So, you were practicing a form of polyamory even before your marriage, then. Obviously you did not think of it that way, but - solo poly is a valid way to live a poly life.

. . . Somehow I got offended by your remark here, since it made me feel that you disrespect the choice of being solo poly by saying it is a "fancy name" for something that only can be temporary and "The True Poly Life" is in a committed, life-long (poly-fi) arrangement. Okay, I might have read too much into your one single line.
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Glad you posted this, Nadya, because I was just going to ignore the response I got. I don't think you read too much into it. Personally, I did not take offense, but I did get the sense that maxnsue's comment was a bit of a "polier than thou" put-down, despite the little smiley face. It seemed to say that what I had described was really just fucking around and calling it poly is just something I do to whitewash it.

Polyamory is simply the act of having multiple loving relationships openly and honestly. It is not an approach to relationships that only counts if a couple does it. Solo practitioners of polyamory are plentiful and the ways in which we maintain our lifestyles while in polyamorous arrangements are no less valid than married couples who "open up" their relationships. There is no requirement that poly arrangements resemble monogamous marriages in any way, so the level of practical investment in any given one is really a moot point in defining poly.

For me, I don't want any live-in partners entwined in my life, but that doesn't mean my relationships are not or cannot be emotionally deep - and even if they aren't that deep, if I'm having more than one, hell, I'm practicing polyamory and, thankfully, I don't have to prove that to anyone.
 
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Fucking around is fucking around. Love doesn't necessarily enter the equation.

Polyamory =/= fucking around.

Polyamory is loving more than one person, with complete openness and honesty among the participants. At least, that's my definition. Whether one is single, married, or otherwise committed doesn't have anything to do with whether it's polyamory. And sex isn't necessarily part of the equation. We have several members on this forum who identify as asexual, but still consider themselves polyamorous.

In my situation, Hubby is completely mono. He tried having sex with another woman and quickly decided it wasn't for him. And as for love... He says he isn't capable of *romantically* loving more than one person. Right now, I'm that one.

Does that mean our situation isn't polyamorous, because he chooses to have only one romantic relationship while I have more than one?

Guy is single. (Divorced.) He has sex with other women, because he's not the type who can go through long stretches of celibacy and we don't get to see each other often. He has said that if circumstances were different and he was able to see me regularly, he likely wouldn't be seeking sex with others. He has also said that when he sees other women it is *only* for sex, as he isn't interested in *loving* anyone other than me.

Does that mean it isn't polyamorous, because I love both him and Hubby while each of them only loves me?

Polyamory somewhat literally means "loving more than one." Nothing is included in the definition about whether someone has to be married for it to be polyamory, or about whether two people have to be involved with the same third person, or any of that.

It simply means loving more than one.

And if you're doing that, and are open and honest about it, it's polyamory.
 
Re (from nycindie):
"There is no requirement that poly arrangements resemble monogamous marriages in any way ..."
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I totally agree.

I think the word for "marriage-like poly" is usually polyfidelity. A specific kind of subset.

I think the key thing that distinguishes polyamory from "just sleeping around" is that in poly, words like "romance," "love," "in love," "in a relationship," and/or "emotionally involved" are part/s of what's going on.

Re (from KC43):
"Does that mean it isn't polyamorous, because I love both him and Hubby while each of them only loves me?"
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Not at all. The chain of loving links leading like a path from a first to a third person suffices to make it a poly situation in my dictionary. In my own (hetero MFM) V, neither of the men has any involvement with any (men or) women besides the one woman (the hinge of the V). And that's still a perfectly poly V.
 
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