Advice needed, please...

fawlynanjel

New member
I'm currently a part of a poly/BDSM relationship. I don't want to get into too much detail here, but there are four of us total, not counting the kids. Recently, some stuff came to light that has my head spinning and I honestly don't know how I feel anymore.

I'm open to talking with anyone that has experience with three or more partners, and more specifically, some of the challenges you have faced as a family. Also hoping to possibly get some advice on my specific current situation. TIA.
 
Are you only wanting to DM with people, or would you like to ask more specific questions on here, to get a variety of feedback? We are an anonymous board. Use nicknames for your partners.
 
i was more thinking in a private conversation, but i can give the basics here and still welcome advice from everyone.

My Hubby/Master and i got together about 5 years ago. About 2 years into our relationship we both developed feelings for a couple of girls. A little over a year ago, we moved one of those girls in with us (I will call her Wife), and everything was great. The other girl (call her Dior) lives in another state, so we visit each other as often as we can.

We are getting ready to move again, and Dior and her kids were supposed to finally join us. But about 10 days ago, we had a family video call about the move, and somehow (it's kind of a blur) it came out that Dior was never sexually attracted to me. This was very hurtful and triggering because of my past. Her argument was that she needed to spend more time with me and she thought she *could* develop those feelings towards me. So, for the last three years, i've had a completely false image of what my relationship with Dior really was.

This caused us to make the decision to let her go. Well, being the person i am, with a huge heart, i fought for her. I wanted to save my family, so i convinced Hubby and Wife to give her another chance. Dior claimed our family was her #1 priority, but then a couple days ago stated that for the moment she decided she wasn't going to be exclusive with us, because she had a sexual bucket list and wanted to check some of those things off before rejoining the family, and not being able to do those things anymore.

This didn't sit right with me, for a couple reasons. The first is that her actions speak louder than her words and she definitely wasn't acting like we were the priority. Second, we went through that whole ordeal about her not being sexually attracted to me, and therefore, basically having gotten nothing out of any of the intimate contact we've had for the last three years. But she's fine going out and having sex with people she barely knows, if at all. That part really fucked with me.

Dior is incapable of seeing things from my side and see how she has hurt me a couple times now, and maintains she doesn't see where she has done anything wrong.

Finally, yesterday she said that if we were that against her doing the things she planned to do, then she would not do them. But by that point, it really made no difference to me if she went through with it or not. The damage was done.

i really don't know if it can be repaired, or if i want to invest that much energy again, and hope it all works out. As of now, i feel like i'm done with her. The other two members of my poly family would like to give it some time, and see where things go. i'm ok with that, as long as they maintain their relationship with her separate from me.

i guess i want to know from people who have been in similar situations... am i being an asshole? Are my feelings justified? i don't know how to feel about it all anymore. 🤷🏼‍♀️
 
Hello fawlynanjel,

I have been in an MFM V since 2006, we had a few rough years in the beginning, but we made it through that together, and we are going strong now. There is a saying, "First year forming, second year storming, third year norming." It's not a mathematical certainty, but it does point out that every relationship has a difficult stage -- the "storming" stage. If you can get through that stage, things will start to get better.

There's no right or wrong way to feel in your specific situation, you don't have to defend your feelings. You have a valid grievance. Dior should have been honest with you over the last three years. I think it's gracious of you to be okay with your poly family members continuing to see her. All you've asked is that they not involve you with that. That is a reasonable request. It's your right to decide whom you'll be in a relationship with.

If it'll help, I don't mind if you want to converse with me privately. That would be okay too.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
Thank you for the kind words. Earlier today, i decided to officially remove Dior from my life. In return, she basically decided it was over with Hubby and Wife as well. It saddens me that she did not want to continue to explore the relationships she had with them just because she and i didn't work out.

In the end, she spun everything to make me feel like it was all on me. i never said or did the right things. And she clearly felt like she was the only one who had the right to feel upset or hurt. 🤷🏼‍♀️ This only reaffirmed to me that i'd made the right decision.

It does hurt, but i think we will get through it as the strong family of three that we are. At least for now, we've decided not to try and grow the family anymore. All three of us may eventually play with/date other people, but individually, and not with a plan to make them part of our family unit. Someday that could change, but i am going to need time to heal from all this before i can open my heart to someone else.
 
It's next to impossible to have a relationship where everyone is involved with everyone. You were right to be okay with not seeing her but being okay with partners seeing her. I'm not sure why she was so hurt by that when she wasn't into you in the first place.
 
I edited your posts to give a name to your now ex-gf. Just for clarity's sake, we ask members to give nicknames to their partners and metamours.

I think you and Hubby and Wife are lucky to have a solid triad. (At least, you sound solid.) I guess all three women are/were submissives to Hubby? It's a given that not every member of a group of more than two will have equal and lasting romantic feelings or sexual attraction to every other member. Most triads and quads don't make it past the NRE (new relationship energy) stage. That goes for vanilla groups, as well as Ds-type groups.

I get that you're angry, hurt, etc., that Dior faked being into you when you four engaged in your sexual or kink activities. I also get why she did that. It happens a lot in group sex situations that one person will fake being into one or more of a group just to get to be with the one they really do want to be with. There are a lot of conflicting feelings.

It even happened to me when I was brand new to poly. My ex h and I decided to form a triad with a woman. She said she was into both of us, but really she was only into him. She and I never actually got in bed together, either with him or one-on-one. I was naive, I admit. It sent me into a depression because my ex h and she were all infatuated and I was left out. I learned my lesson.

But knowing what I do now about the crazy complicated dynamics of triads and quads, your story is extremely common. Also, trying to get three or four people to agree to a CLOSED poly family unit can be hard to make work.

Try not to take it personally. Dior just wanted something different. She seemed to have some feelings left for your Hubby and Wife, but she decided she'd actually rather explore with others, and try some new things.

Take your time to heal. You've got two partners. You're lucky even to have two! Dating is hard and it's tricky to find even one good match. You're wise to have decided that, if one of you three wants yet another partner, to date individually. Most successful poly people do that. It is way way less complicated. Polyamory does not mean group sex.
 
Thank you for the advice/kind words. The idea was the Hubby, Wife, Dior and i were going to live as a married quad. For three years we've been dating her, but each of us at one point or another have had parallel relationships outside of the marriage (so to speak). To answer your question, yes, we are all submissives/slaves to Hubby.

The problem was that once we broke up for a few days and decided to get back together, she came back saying she wanted to basically take advantage of the split and do all these sexual things with random people before she would recommit to our family. Had we gotten back together, had she chosen her family over her sexual desires, we would have been good. She even probably would have able to do some of the things on her list. (There were one or two that Hubby would not allow.)

Anyway, after i officially ended things with her, Dior sent me a FB message. I was curious why she would want to do that after our previous chat, so we spoke for a while. She claimed to want to be friends, but all she wanted to do was talk about the breakup and point fingers as to who was to blame (me). However, i do believe in the end she probably did really only (or at least mostly) want Master/Hubby and just kind of accepted me and Wife as part of the *package deal.* We are both at fault, as neither of us took the time to nurture our relationship or bond while we were apart. (She lives about nine hours away and we only saw her once every other month or so.)

In the end, i just didn't see a way forward with her. i could not trust her to be honest about her feelings towards me, and i have no reason to believe that she would be going forward. Three years invested into a lie was enough for me.

Hubby and Wife do still have contact with her and they are friends. Sadly, it just did not work out that way for Dior and me, but life goes on, and i look forward to growing and nurturing the relationships i have with Hubby and Wife. We are not looking to expand our family anymore. We are great together! 🙂
 
It's next to impossible to have a relationship where everyone is involved with everyone. You were right to be okay with not seeing her but being okay with partners seeing her. I'm not sure why she was so hurt by that when she wasn't into you in the first place.
We had had a long-distance relationship with Dior for three years. Wife lived only a couple hours away until we all moved in together about 15 months ago, but the three of us have always had a connection from the beginning and i feel like we are strong together.

i think she's hurt because she didn't only lose me, she lost both my partners too. However, they've both agreed to remain friends with her, which i am fine with. 🙂
 
Thank you for the advice/kind words. The idea was the Hubby, Wife, Dior and i were going to live as a married quad. For three years we've been dating her, but each of us at one point or another have had parallel relationships outside of the marriage (so to speak). To answer your question, yes, we are all submissives/slaves to Hubby.

The problem was that once we broke up for a few days and decided to get back together, she came back saying she wanted to basically take advantage of the split and do all these sexual things with random people before she would recommit to our family. Had we gotten back together, had she chosen her family over her sexual desires, we would have been good. She even probably would have able to do some of the things on her list. (There were one or two that Hubby would not allow.)

Anyway, after i officially ended things with her, Dior sent me a FB message. I was curious why she would want to do that after our previous chat, so we spoke for a while. She claimed to want to be friends, but all she wanted to do was talk about the breakup and point fingers as to who was to blame (me). However, i do believe in the end she probably did really only (or at least mostly) want Master/Hubby and just kind of accepted Wife and me as a *package deal*. We are both at fault, as neither of us took the time to nurture our relationship or bond while we were apart. (She lives about nine hours away and we only saw here once every other month or so.)

In the end, i just didn't see a way forward with her. i could not trust her to be honest about her feelings towards me and i have no reason to believe that she would be going forward. Three years invested into a lie was enough for me.

Hubby and Wife do still have contact with her and they are friends. Sadly, it just did not work our that way for Dior and me, but life goes on, and i look forward to growing and nurturing the relationships i have with Hubby and Wife. We are not looking to expand our family anymore. We are great together! 🙂

I think the practical issue is that your husband is one aging man with a single penis. She isn't sexually attracted to you, so you wouldn't be a fulfilling source of sex.

He gets sexual access to three people he's into. You get sexual access to at least two and so does Wife (one or two). Maybe she has a higher sex drive and different tastes.

Why was it so important that she was sexually attracted to all of you, rather than just him? Couldn't she just have been your metamour and his partner?

I'm all for kinky relationships with power exchange. I've owned and been owned. However, when you take that inordinate control of someone's sexuality and wider life, you have to be prepared to meet their every need. Honestly, I've never met anyone who can have that level of dynamic with three people simultaneously and all be truly content, especially where those people are restricted from autonomous relationships of their own.
 
I think the practical issue is that your husband is one aging man with a single penis.
I guess we're all aging... But there is no indication he is/was incapable of satisfying his partners. And we all know rock hard penises aren't necessary for fun sex, and especially kink play.
She isn't sexually attracted to you, so you wouldn't be a fulfilling source of sex.

He gets sexual access to three people he's into. You get sexual access to at least two and so does Wife (one or two). Maybe she has a higher sex drive and different tastes.

Why was it so important that she was sexually attracted to all of you, rather than just him? Couldn't she just have been your metamour and his partner?
Yeah, I am sorry this wasn't negotiated. But if she's feeling stifled and wanted to play with others and be more solo, like a poly anarchist, for now, we could see what happens. Maybe she's got some growing to do. There's nothing innately wrong with leaving one kink family to go do some other stuff. Sure, she could have negotiated all this in a different way, but Master was saying no to a couple things on her sexual bucket list, so...

She's staying friends with him and Wife though, so who knows what the future will bring?

Anyway, nine hours away is FAR. Maybe she's got some other prospects closer to home, where she won't be Wife #3.
I'm all for kinky relationships with power exchange. I've owned and been owned. However, when you take that inordinate control of someone's sexuality and wider life, you have to be prepared to meet their every need. Honestly, I've never met anyone who can have that level of dynamic with three people simultaneously and all be truly content, especially where those people are restricted from autonomous relationships of their own.
 
I guess we're all aging... But there is no indication he is/was incapable of satisfying his partners. And we all know rock hard penises aren't necessary for fun sex, and especially kink play.

Yeah, I am sorry this wasn't negotiated. But if she's feeling stifled and wanted to play with others and be more solo, like a poly anarchist, for now, we could see what happens. Maybe she's got some growing to do. There's nothing innately wrong with leaving one kink family to go do some other stuff. Sure, she could have negotiated all this in a different way, but Master was saying no to a couple things on her sexual bucket list, so...

She's staying friends with him and Wife though, so who knows what the future will bring?

Anyway, nine hours away is FAR. Maybe she's got some other prospects closer to home, where she won't be Wife #3.

I think it's pretty clear that wife is sexually unfulfilled and believe it or not, a lot of people do want the option of an erection when sex is going on. Plus a lot of men experience a decline in sexual energy as well as erections.

I have a good few friends from about 40 up who are now saying a working penis is pretty compulsory for new sex partners. They're over impotency, especially when it's because the man refuses to keep in shape.
 
I think it's pretty clear that wife is sexually unfulfilled

Which wife? The OP, or the one she called Wife, or Dior? Or are you assuming all three women are/were sexually unsatisfied by Hubby? We don't know how old Hubby is. I reread the thread. There is no mention of his age, or sexual potency.

Complete ED is extremely rare at 40, only 5%. Even at age 70 it's only 15%! (Anecdote: My ex husband and I broke up when he was 55 and we were having daily sex at that time.)


and believe it or not, a lot of people do want the option of an erection when sex is going on.
We've had threads here on that for years. Most men do not want to give up on sex as their testosterone decreases, and they may take medications such as Viagra, or learn how to be really good with their mouth and hands. Plus there are toys. And in kink, sometimes ordinary PiV sex doesn't happen; it's just not a priority. Maybe the focus is on impact play, dressing in latex, acts of service, oral sex, role play, or a hundred other things.

There is really no evidence of a lack of sexual/sensual satisfaction anywhere in this thread. Why add to the issues without confirmation from the OP?
Plus a lot of men experience a decline in sexual energy as well as erections.

I have a good few friends from about 40 up who are now saying a working penis is pretty compulsory for new sex partners. They're over impotency, especially when it's because the man refuses to keep in shape.
 
Okay, so I mixed up Dior and wife.

I think everything the OP reported says that Dior couldn't find enough sexual fulfilment within the poly family, even with the guy alone. I think it's a pretty big ask for any guy to fulfil the sexual needs of multiple women. That's why she wanted to fulfil a sexual bucket list which excluded the family (seemingly she saw it was pointless to try to include them for whatever reason). So whether it be through his lack of ability libido-wise or restrictive boundaries, she was sexually unfulfilled within what the "family" were able to offer.
 
Okay. so I mixed up Dior and wife.

I think everything the OP reported says that Dior couldn't find enough sexual fulfilment within the poly family, even with the guy alone. I think it's a pretty big ask for any guy to fulfil the sexual needs of multiple women.
If he had a strong libido and the women had lower libidos, this wouldn't be a problem at all.
That's why she wanted to fulfil a sexual bucket list which excluded the family (seemingly she saw it was pointless to try to include them for whatever reason). So whether it be through his lack of ability libido-wise or restrictive boundaries, she was sexually unfulfilled within what the "family" were able to offer.
It's so odd that you're insisting the man is unable to satisfy any of the women sexually, when it is stated that the women also have sex with each other. I can't see why the blame has to be put at the feet of Hubby. Dior was attracted to Wife, so it sounds like she had the opportunity to be satisfied by both whenever she visited, and vice versa!

Dior isn't attracted to the OP, but seemed compelled to fake it. That's on Dior, of course. Maybe there were too many negative associations around that problem, which tainted the whole thing for her.

To me, the nine-hour travel time (driving, I assume) and that she has kids to either bring along or arrange care for, may have been the biggest obstacle. Also, the OP admitted that she and Wife didn't communicate well with Dior between her somewhat infrequent dates, which probably made her feel less than special.

So, imo, Dior would be much better off dating other kinksters locally, where she can hire a sitter and go out and play for a night, either to a kink club or with appropriate doms of her choice.
 
If he had a strong libido and the women had lower libidos, this wouldn't be a problem at all.

The reality is that most people have an average libido though, so that's why it rarely works.
when it is stated that the women also have sex with each other.

But Dior isn't sexually attracted to the OP. You don't need to tell me that women can have great sex together. It's just clear that Dior isn't having great sex which is fulfilling enough for her not to seek sex elsewhere.

I'm sure the distance made sure of that too. But I also think that if it was more fulfilling, and there wasn't demand for all her needs to be met by the "family," then it would have worked much better
 
The reality is that most people have an average libido though, so that's why it rarely works.
There are variations in libido (we see that here all the time), and we don't know the situation, so I think it's edging on rude, and isn't helpful, to make assumptions.
But Dior isn't sexually attracted to the OP.
Again, Dior was/is attracted to Wife and had sex/kink with her! But the OP said they didn't communicate between dates, so the relationship was weak.
You don't need to tell me that women can have great sex together. It's just clear that Dior isn't having great sex which is fulfilling enough for her not to seek sex elsewhere.
I don't assume the sex itself was "bad." It sounds more like the social expectations and dealings were weak and unexamined. Submissives can often do things they don't really want to. It's a hazard. They may even get off on being "coerced" in a sexy way, but then finally decide to stand up for themselves, which is what it sounds like to me here.
I'm sure the distance made sure of that too. But I also think that if it was more fulfilling, and there wasn't demand for all her needs to be met by the "family," then it would have worked much better.
Obviously some needs weren't being met. I don't disagree with that. I just don't assume a lack of enough PiV when she was actually visiting was the reason. That is my main point.
 
There are variations in libido (we see that here all the time), and we don't know the situation, so I think it's edging on rude, and isn't helpful, to make assumptions.

Again, Dior was/is attracted to Wife and had sex/kink with her! But the OP said they didn't communicate between dates, so the relationship was weak.

I don't assume the sex itself was "bad." It sounds more like the social expectations and dealings were weak and unexamined. Submissives can often do things they don't really want to. It's a hazard. They may even get off on being "coerced" in a sexy way, but then finally decide to stand up for themselves, which is what it sounds like to me here.

Obviously some needs weren't being met. I don't disagree with that. I just don't assume a lack of enough PiV when she was actually visiting was the reason. That is my main point.
OP said that her master and her got together with 2 women. I can't see where it says Wife is/was a partner of Dior other than OP reiterating her hunch is that she saw her and Wife as a package deal. I didn't say it was a lack of PIV, I said it was a lack of fulfilling sex from the "family".
 
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