Back peddling

Apgreen

New member
Hi everyone! I'm new here and I'm looking for some advice. I have been in a poly relationship for the last 3 months. . I was approached multiple times before agreeing to this relationship and only upon my bestfriends repeated blessing. In the beginning everything was fantastic, everyone got along no issues at all. Then things started to change it was:
I don't like that you have feelings, I don't like how you kiss her, I don't like how much you text and talk, I I don't want her here as often, I don't want you to do things when I'm not included.
It has went from a relationship that was supposed to have three equal partners to a relationship that has a primary couple and then I am secondary. I am struggling with this because I feel that little by little the relationship has been chipped away.
Mind you my best friend has never been left out of anything and we have always been upfront and honest with her. However, she will ask me questions about circumstances or events then separately go ask her longtime partner. There has been restrictions and rules continuously forming throughout these last 3 or 4 months. I am at a point where I'm beginning to feel like maybe I should eliminate this relationship. Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.
 
We see this thing quite a lot here. It sounds like your best friend (girlfriend?) is feeling a bit insecure and jealous. Ironically, having 'rules' never seems to help - they will continue to get ever more restrictive until there's no freedom left. She needs to address the issues head on rather than to continue to curtail your involvement. It might be that she cannot deal with those feelings whilst maintaining an open relationship - not nice for you and her spouse if you are enjoying what you have, but it would perhaps be more honest and less painful for everyone in the long-run if she could be straight up and just ask for that. She probably knows in her rational mind that it is unfair of her to ask for you all to just stop and go back a few steps while she gets a handle on things. She might even know rationally that her fears and jealousy are also unfounded. However, she cannot help how she feels, and often it's impossible to know how we will react to a new situation like this without trying.

In your position, rather than let this thing drag itself out into ever more messy conclusions, I would opt to be the one who ends it. If the couple can resolve their issues (and they are their issues, not directly yours) then perhaps you can revisit the idea a few months down the line. I don't think you'd find many people on here that would judge you if you just decided that you weren't prepared to have anything more than friendship with them again in future though. It can be hard to recover trust when you've perceived yourself as being treated as less-than.

I have sympathy for all of you, because I've been in the shoes of someone really struggling with my partner's interactions with others. I've also been the person who has been relegated to secondary status for another's comfort. Both positions suck, completely and totally. It might be that there has been a basic pervasive miscommunication about what this three way relationship is about, which may or may not be solvable. It also might just be that there is a strong natural disparity in how you all feel about each other. It's normal for there to be differences in the levels of attraction, or emotional closeness, between each person. It can be hard to deal with if you start off with the expectations of it all being equal, but perhaps with time the situation can resolve itself by taking a more natural shape. Maybe this is better off as a V type relationship than a triad. Maybe she would feel more comfortable having a lover all of her own, so she can see and experience first hand how that doesn't diminish her relationship with her husband. Sometimes you need to experience it to truly believe it, and if you and she are not as close as you and her spouse are, it's perhaps not possible for her to truly understand that having loving and/or sexual feelings towards multiple people can be sustainable.

Of course, it might also be that their marriage has cracks and flaws of its own, independently of you. Those need to be fixed if they want to save their marriage, or they need to figure out the best way to part ways from each other. I'm not sure you want to be dragged into that at all, so for me, that would be another reason to leave (in addition to being treated poorly). Rest assured that you cannot 'fix' her, and agreeing to more and more restrictions is also not helping her deal with the underlying problems. As doctors say, don't treat the symptoms, treat the disease. If you let the disease remain, you will be forever treating symptoms. If the disease is eradicated though (and only she can do that, perhaps with support, but not with enabling type behaviours) then you can truly move onwards and upwards.
 
Reply

Thank you for the unbiased honesty. I've done a lot of reading and we've had several discussions but it does seem to me that she no interest in dealing with the issues other than rules and restrictions. And yes it is choking the life out of everything that was good.
Will take the advice into great consideration.
Thanks again.
 
More Explanation

Okay! So I was just able to actually sit down and read my original post. I realized that there was quite a bit of info left out as a result of being in a hurry. So I'd like to correct that. In this case I believe that the more info there is the better equipped others will be in helping point me in the right direction.
Here are the cast of characters:
Sally (myself)
Karen (the best friend)
Bert (Karen's longtime partner)

Okay so here it goes....

Karen and Sally became friends about 4yrs ago. Overtime they have became very close, even going on a vacation together. Sally was married to an addict for 10yrs and finally divorced because she was left with no other choice. Sally is now a single parent. Karen and Bert take Sally under their wing and encourage her thru the tough times of said divorce. Sally and Karen being best friends discuss current and past relationships during many of their conversations. Sally tries to emotionally support Karen thru a rough patch in her relationship with Bert. Rough patch is smoothed and time goes on.
One day Bert approaches Sally with the idea of a Polyamory relationship. Sally having no idea what it is looks it up and immediately says no. Because that's not how Sally was raised. She was raised with the belief of one man, one woman.
Time goes by and Bert reapproaches the Polyamory relationship. Again Sally politely says no. However, Bert encourages Sally to discuss this with Karen because Karen is supposed to be on board. So one afternoon Sally does talk to Karen about this Poly. Karen, much to Sally's surprise, gives her blessing. Not once but several times during the conversation. Then in a later discussion Sally asks about ground rules. Karen response was simple and agreeable. 1) The kids cannot know 2)Don't lie to her

So the forward we move.
At first I was very nervous. I had NEVER had anything to do with an attached person or a woman. I was curious, but the whole belief system kicked in so I had never followed thru.
Things progressed and seemed to be going swimmingly. Sally and Bert had always been surface level friends until this point. However, now they found that they really clicked. Sally would stop by and have coffee, spend quality time together, great conversations, etc. Karen and Bert would invite Sally over often. Sally experienced her first intimate encounter with a woman and was pleasantly surprised at how natural it was.
Then Bert professed his feelings for Sally. Now at first Sally thought nothing of it. Figured the feelings were on a friendship level, well convinced herself of that anyway.
By this time Sally was being asked by Bert to stay over constantly, and Sally would.
In the mean time Sally started noticing changes in Karen's behavior. She noticed the eye rolling, small comments, etc. By now (when time permitted) Sally has started helping with things around the house like dishes, getting the kids off to school, doing laundry, cleaning, cooking, etc. Things to make Karen's day a little easier, so she could rest/relax when she got home.
Sally noticed Karen's lack of appreciation in anything that was done for her. Never even so much as a thank you.
Next Karen stated her uneasiness about Bert's affection toward Sally, passionate kisses. So almost immediately Bert ceased passionate kisses around Karen.
Next Karen stated that Sally didn't need to visit as often. So Sally went home and stated that she would feel better if the invitation came from Karen at that point. It was at this point that Sally realized that she had feelings for Bert. OH CRAP!!!!
Bert had been texting Sally and Sally admitted her feelings and that she did not anticipate having those feelings. Then Karen took Bert's phone while he was away and started secretly texting Sally as if she were Bert. Asking if Sally wanted to be #1. Sally's response was "no, I just want to be equal".
After this Karen and Sally went and had a one on one meeting where Sally directly asked Karen if she wanted to do. Karen's initial response was "I just want it to stop" Sally complied and did inform Karen that she understood but that she would need to keep her distance for a while. At least until her feeling were under control. At some point in the conversation Karen claims that she did not say that she wanted the poly to stop. They talk, cry, and hug it out.
It was around this time that Karen states that the emotional involvement bothers her and that it has always been a rule in their swing life to not fall in love. We discussed that this rule was never revealed to me and talk it out. Or so I thought.
Next Karen brings up the texting and conversation frequency between Bert and Sally, and that Bert cuddles with Sally at bedtime. So naturally both become less frequent. It is at this time that Bert and Sally start discussing ways in which to make Karen feel more secure and confident not only in her relationship with Bert but in the relationship in general. Bert starts sleeping in the middle of the bed to accommodate. But in his sleep he would cuddle up to me because of his natural sleeping position. So then Karen changes which side of the bed she sleeps on, she even tries the middle but doesn't like it.
It was at this point that Sally believes that Karen may be experiencing jealousy/insecurity issues. So she starts doing some reading and finds several articles that she feels are encouraging in how to deal with this issue in a poly relationship. She then forwards them to Bert who in turn suggest that Sally be the one to present it to Karen. Karen never read any or the articles, claims she doesn't have time.
But she does seem to have another issue.... Now it's the frequency of Sally and Bert's intimate moments, several of which Karen is involved in.
By now there have been several discussions and Karen keeps saying that she had no idea that this was going to be a Poly relationship. That she thought of it as a FWB type of thing, honestly can't get much out of her other than that, she clams up.
Karen has also started double checking stories. She will asks Sally some questions then later go asks Bert the same questions to see if the answers are the same. She also starts checking Bert's messages and phone calls. And starts posting out of the norm stuff on FB.
Sally no longer gets invites from Karen unless it's at Bert's request.
Then one night Sally sets down with Bert and Karen and explains to Karen in front of Bert the different types of Poly relationships and how the work. She also asks Karen which relationship does she feel is better suited for her. Karen chooses the triad. Sally feels like maybe there has just been some misunderstandings and now there can be progress. Sally also expresses her love for Karen as more than just a mere friendship, that while it's not at the in love stage it could be if Karen wanted it to be. Karen doesn't say too much about it.
Now, Sally and Bert continue to discuss ways to help Karen and make this transition easier for everyone. In the midst of this there is a rare day when Bert and Sally are off. So Sally goes to run errands with Bert. After Karen finds out that the two are together she texts and calls more than normal. This time alone is the first that Sally and Bert have had in over a month, and it seems to bother Karen that Bert is doing something with Sally.
Afterwards Karen starts showing more affection, desire for intimacy with Bert, and general interest in Bert than was done previously. Sally no longer gets request to go out and only goes to stay the night once a week because she's needed to get the kids to school the next day.
Next is the big big big issue....
Bert and Sally have another rare day off and decide to have morning coffee. Upon one of many subjects is what could be making Karen feel the way she does. Could it be her age? Could she feel threatened? Could it be the "change"? Could it be her getting sick? Could it be a combination of all those things? So Bert and Sally go out run a few errands and discuss in depth a plan to get Karen to feel better about herself, hoping that in turn she'd feel more positive about everything. We spend most of the day coming up with activities to help stimulate a positive attitude and outlook. We know that if Karen figures out what's going on she'll be reluctant to do anything, so we decide not to tell her about out the plan. We head back to the house and eventually have a quick session before anyone gets home. When asked id we were together that day we lied, yes we lied. Well long story short, she didn't believe it and decided to record a conversation between Sally and Bert. She lets Sally and Bert carry the lie for a day or so then pulls Sally to the side and shows her the proof of the lie. Then asks Sally not to disclose this information to Bert, she wants to see how long before Bert tells her the truth. Well Bert does tell Karen the truth and now she has new rules.
Now she wants Karen and Bert to be the Primary couple and Sally to be secondary. Now Karen knows how Sally feels about being secondary (3rd wheel). She also states that on holiday's Sally can have the day before or the day after but not the day of. Sally has also been completely excluded from Bert's birthday plans. I know that a lie is a lie is a lie. However, it wasn't intended to be a bad lie. But it sure felt like it when the truth came out.
And I feel like this was a way for Karen to get what she truly wants, me out of the picture. When I look at everything that's just what it feels like, and I don't know if there's any help for it.
At this point would you opt out??????
 
I am sorry you struggle. I hope you feel better for the vent.

And I feel like this was a way for Karen to get what she truly wants, me out of the picture. When I look at everything that's just what it feels like, and I don't know if there's any help for it. At this point would you opt out??????

I would let it go. FWIW, I think you guys could have left it broken up at this point and not gone for more spins on the merry-go-round:

After this Karen and Sally went and had a one on one meeting where Sally directly asked Karen if she wanted to do. Karen's initial response was "I just want it to stop" Sally complied and did inform Karen that she understood but that she would need to keep her distance for a while. At least until her feeling were under control.

They had rules that affect you that they did not tell you about -- that whole "no feelings" thing.

Lots of people made other mistakes along the way.

  • Bert getting obsessed with you asking you over all the time.
  • You accepting the invite and then being over there constantly. Rather than having him over at your place sometimes so Karen's home is not always hosting home.
  • You seem cranky nobody thanked you for doing chores -- but did you OFFER or just "take over?" Unwanted gifts of service are not actually gifts.
  • You and Bert contrive how to make Karen do things. That's not good.
  • Karen does the phone snooping/pretending to be Bert, lies, recording things... not looking good there either. :(

I don't know if poly hell could help you three overcome these problems or if it is best left alone. Only you know how much more energy you want to be giving this or if you are done. I would be done. There are communication and trust issues along with not really knowing what model you are even trying to practice together -- it sounds like it was supposed to be a swing thing not a poly thing -- at least on Karen's end.

I wouldn't spend too much time on who did what in the recent past though. It's long and confusing and stirring up cloudy waters doesn't help move it forward.

If the bottom line AT THIS point in time is that Karen doesn't really want to be in it, but offers a "meh" sounding primary-secondary model to appease Bert and you don't like that model because "secondary" feels "third wheel" to you? It's not a match on any level. Not compatible.

Best to let it go, heal and be friends (if that is still possible) than keep forcing a thing to fly that just won't. :(

Galagirl
 
Last edited:
Reply to galagirl

It does feel better to vent, yes. And to put the whole truth out there without judgement.
And I do agree with your assessment of the situation. I have had the feeling for quite a while that Karen has wanted out but is apeasing Bert.
I'm not sure if the friendship is salvageable at this point, but I know that I will need some time and space before we can figure that out.
I guess I am a little cranky about the lack of appreciation. There was appreciation there before but then when things got serious it stopped like a brick wall. So yes, it did hurt my feelings after a while.
And I never thought that even though we was trying to do something good the fact that it was still conspiring was wrong. That does shed a lot of light for me. So thanks for that.

Your a wise last, thank you for your assistance
 
feeling anxious and irritated!!!

After days of thinking about my current situation and how I feel about these new rules and restrictions I have decided to end my triad relationship. It hold no longer is of benefit to me. If i cant date, text, call or have an intimate connection with someone then that's not a relationship no matter how you look at it.
So I group texted Karen and Bert (because that's how I'm supposed to communicate now, Bert's idea) and requested a lunch meeting for us three. It took hours for a reply and then I was asked if I could meet with only Karen. Because Bert's daughter (23yr old) is still visiting. I said no.
Then an hour goes by and Bert calls. Wanting to know if I can just come over and visit instead. I don't feel like being ignored and certainly know that this conversation can't be had when attention isn't at the 100% level. I'm then asked again if I can't just meet with Karen. I say no again and explain that i'd like to discuss some things jointly not singularly. That they could compromise and offer a better time today for a meeting. Because it's hard to have a discussion during the week because of work schedules. Bert then acts as if I'm making this complicated and passes me off to Karen to whom I explain the exact same thing. Her response is "well, I'm just not sure how she will be here". I proceed to say that Karen and Bert could decide on a time for us to meet and inform Bert's daughter that they have plans at that time. She's gives essentially no feedback. So I say y'all talk about it and let me know in a timely manner so that I can make arrangements to accomodate this. That was 3hours ago. Not a peep. I'm very irritated about this. I'm not asking for a damn date or for anyone to do anything out of the ordinary. I simply want to get this done so that I can move on. This really shows me that I need to do this and the sooner the better. And I'm trying to do this the adult way, face to face, not over the phone or text or by avoiding them. So why Do I feel like they're avoiding me?
 
I simply want to get this done so that I can move on.

I'm trying to do this the adult way, face to face, not over the phone or text or by avoiding them

Since you aren't willing to wait so you can break up in person? And you seem to want it over with today?

Could give up on your first choice of trying to break up in person today. Go second best choice. Break up in an adult way over phone or text.

Then you get to move on.

Galagirl
 
Last edited:
Greetings Sally,

Do Bert and Karen check their email? If so, you could send a group email to them explaining that you are breaking up with them. If they don't check their email, you could send them a group text explaining that you are breaking up with them. They are being difficult about letting you talk to both of them in person, and they could keep doing that indefinitely. If I was in your position, I don't think I'd want to wait around any longer. You tried your best to meet with both of them in person. They made it impossible.

Sorry things haven't worked out there. :(
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
Back
Top