Captain's Log

LoveBunny

Member
My relationship with Mel remains challenging as fuck. We have such an intense, almost psychic connection, I'm still absolutely dumbstruck by her physical beauty, and the sex is still the best I've ever had. But her bipolar disorder/ADHD is disruptive to say the least. After a really bad episode, she was hospitalized for a few weeks, but now she has a new doctor and a new medicine regime that seems to be helping a lot. I've had to really adjust my expectations for what I demand from a partner. I'm not convinced she'll ever be able to have a full time job and a "normal" life as I see it.

My solution is to create a LOT of space apart in the relationship so I don't get bogged down by her mental illness. She hates this, she would love to live together and do everything together, but I stand firm. Now, she's got her own apartment an hour's bus ride away, below the people she babysits for, so they keep an eye on her, and we just spend a few nights a week together. I've had to let go of the idea that she's ever going to be an easy partner, and just love her anyway as best as I can.

I haven't had much to report poly-wise, I've only had sex with Melinda for over a year now, though occasionally I'll meet someone on Tindr or OKC it's never gotten past a little making out. I went on a first date last night with a guy I liked, we fooled around a little, but I wasn't ready for sex with him. He's only 30 (where the hell are all the datable people my own age?) He admits he wants a wife and kids someday, so I guess I'll have to keep it casual with him, which I think will be fine. Melinda has formed a friendship/flirtation with a much-younger bi woman who has a boyfriend. Not sure where that's going, Mel is somewhat obsessed with her though. The girl is only 20, too young for me to even want to hang out with. But she's sweet, and a knockout, and she and Mel have a lot in common. My challenge is to not feel like an old ugly troll in comparison.
 

LoveBunny

Member
I love my much-younger lesbian lover passionately, but she's exhausting. I know I'm the mommy to her abused inner child, and sometimes I'm the child to her inner daddy. She demands so much of my energy and focus--she gives it back, of course, but things get so fucking intense between us. When it's good it's so good, when it's bad, it's hellish. Plus, beautiful young women are expensive! I just can't afford all the "I wants." Maybe someday, when she's less wild and has a real job, we can be real partners, but at this point I lose patience with her after a day or two together. I don't even know what to call her anymore. Girlfriend? Babygirl? Lover?

Hal and I seem to have started up again. I just went back and read all the awful things I said about him--his smug white male privilege, his lack of depth. But we hang out at the same places, we have great conversations, and he makes it clear he still loves and wants me every time I see him. He just broke up with the woman he's been seeing all year, and what with Melinda moved out of my house and about to get busy with school, the timing seems right to try again. I know some things have changed in my life since we were together. Melinda fulfills the side of me that wants a super-passionate connection. Plus I've worked hard to become more financially stable than I was when I was with Hal, and I feel more powerful and in control. Perhaps Hal has grown too. But even if he's still the same emotionally shallow guy, maybe that's ok, as long as I'm not expecting great depths out of him. We have fun together, he's financially stable, undemanding, and age-appropriate. I find him attractive as heck. None of the guys I've gone out with in this town have had even one-third of his staying-power in my life.

It will have to be a different relationship this time. For example, we always used to spend nights at Hal's place because his job starts earlier than mine, and his place is bigger with better A.C.. Also, I still felt like my place was mine and Arlo's and it felt disrespectful. But right now, I can't spend nights away from home, as I've got to wake up in the middle of the night to deal with pets. I've got an elderly, disabled rabbit who needs help eating and drinking. I'm raising two orphaned wild tree rats still little enough to require nightly feedings.

Melinda is fine with me seeing Hal again, though she did try to make a couple rules for me to follow. No vacations together. No sex in what she considers "our" bed if I ever want her back in it. I pointed out to her that this is actually the bed Arlo and I shared when we were married, but she doesn't see it that way. I flat out refused to agree to any rules, but I do need to weigh the fact that I would suffer unduly if I lost access to her body. Her budding romance with a superhotty seems to have fizzled for now, Melinda decided the girl is just too young and wild for her. :rolleyes:
 

LoveBunny

Member
Haven't been here a while. It's been a hell of a ride since summer.

Melinda now lives several hours away in a group home for mentally ill people recovering from substance abuse. She's been there 4 months or so after 90 days in rehab following a couple of weeks in the psyche ward. At moments, she seems more lucid and focused than I've ever seen her, but then she flips out again.

I have as much as a relationship with Melinda as I dare under the circumstances. As much as I love her, I've really had to put up strict boundaries so as not to get the life sucked out of me. I last saw her on Valentine's day, 2 1/2 months ago. If she's stable enough, we'll spend my birthday together at the end of this month.

I really miss having sex with Mel. Even her text messages turn me on.

The guys---well, I'm really struggling to "get it up" with the guys.

I last fucked Hal on Thanksgiving, so 4 months ago. If I'm being honest, I just wanted someone to spend the night with and he feels warm and safe. Plus, I hadn't had dick in 2 years--and that last dick, 2 years ago, happened to be Hal's. I enjoy spending time with Hal, and sometimes I find him dreamy and feel romantic about him--which makes me mess up and start hinting that we could get back together more seriously. I'm not being dishonest, I mean it at the moment, but then later, I wonder what I was thinking.

Joel is the new guy. I've known him casually for years, we have mutual friends, he actually used to date a good friend of mine. We fucked for the first time last night, and I slept over. He lives just a block and a half away from me. Easiest walk-of-shame ever! Joel is well-educated, funny, artistic, confident, and he makes a good living. He seems super easy-going.

He reminds me of Hal in some ways, both guys have "dad bods," both are inveterate bachelors who have never been married, never wanted kids. Joel is a bit of a man-slut, like Hal. Last weekend, he took home a woman he barely knew, then ended up throwing her out when she made anti-Semitic comments. I, personally, talk to someone enough to know they're a Nazi before fucking them, but that's just me. Joel has that same damned white guy arrogance I see in Hal. My ex husband Arlo, who is Asian never had that, and half-black lesbian Melinda is the flip side, totally marginalized.

I am not wildly physically attracted to Joel, the sex last night was, for me, 1) an attempt to test our chemistry, 2) I felt ready to show him my sexuality, since I've been strictly 'hands-off' up till now. Neither of us came. I had a brutal work week, and I ran out of energy fast. I wasn't really in the mood in this morning, gave him a bit of a bj but stopped in the middle. I was ready to go home, shower, and be alone.

I haven't been in a very sexual place lately, and I've been up front with Joel about that. My work season is in full swing, it's time for me to make money, and I need to stay focused.

Plus, watching Melinda descend into psychosis really sucked the wind out of my sails, you know? I've had to shut down my sex drive because the one person who really turns me on, I can't possibly have a healthy relationship with.

Right now, I want a lot of alone time, and I want to focus on myself, and I can't do that if my libido sucking me into toxic relationships. So I shut it down. It sucks feeling like I've lost my mojo, though.

I actually spent a few days visiting my exhusband Arlo in his new city where he lives now most of the time, though he still has an apartment here, too. I enjoyed spending time with him, definitely didn't feel like I wanted to rekindle, but I enjoyed catching up with him.

Now you're all caught up!
 

LoveBunny

Member
Wow my last entry was over 2 years ago! So much has changed. I just read all my entries dating back 6 years ago, crazy how much I'd forgotten. So many ways I was selfish, wrong, and also at times very brave.

So Arlo and I eventually divorced, he moved out out state and became a heroin addict. Watching him go through that was horrible, but he seems to have recovered finally. We remain friends, but we don't talk much nowadays. I feel a great deal of guilt for how I handled opening our marriage, and my ambivalence about him at the end. I was selfish, completely focused on MY growth. I like to think I would do things differently if I could go back.

Melinda's mental illness eventually drove me to cut ties, I just couldn't stay in it, even as friends. She left the state and went back to her family last I heard.

After that, I tried a monogamous relationship with a butch, black, dominant lesbian, someone I met through friends. I found I was surprisingly fine with monogamy in this case. I was happy with this woman and very fulfilled as her bottom. But she dumped me for another woman, and now I get to see them around town together. Fun!

There's a reason I'm back here reading about poly. 6 months ago, I started dating a poly man with great daddy dom energy who I developed deep feelings for. These days, I'm much more "monogam-ish" than poly-amorous, and definitely female-leaning in my sexual preference. But this guy has a lot of feminine energy, and I crave him like I do women, and we always have fun together, very rare we have any discord.

We met right before covid started, so we went through lockdown together and had all this time of not dating anyone else. We agreed a pandemic wasn't a good time for relationship negotiations, and took down our dating profiles, though we did decide we were boyfriend/girlfriend and primaries, and this month was our 6 month anniversary so we took a trip together to visit some state parks. I really started feeling like we are a couple, like this guy could be a suitable life partner.

A couple of days ago, he informed me that someone he'd met before me, but "the timing wasn't right," has resurfaced in his life, and they've been talking, it's getting serious. And I am shocked at the agony this is creating in me. Of course, I guessed we'd explore some form of non-monogamy eventually, but we had a miscommunication where I thought he was only interested casual sex outside of his relationship. He's since corrected me, no, he wants a secondary.

He's rather inexperienced at poly, and he made the same rookie mistake I made back at the beginning of this blog with exhubby. He basically just told me he's going to date this someone else, no negotiating, no discussion, because it's what he "needs." Like I can pretty much get on board or go.

I was really thriving under his consistent focus, his sunny optimism, and the way he handles my body. He's sane, competent, kind, and I just want to spend all my spare time with him and only be with him right now. To learn he wants to spend time with someone else while we're still really in the honeymoon phase is hard to swallow. The way he presented this with no asking me how I feel or what I want really stung. We've been talking for a couple of days now, and I just don't know if I want to do all the processing and emotional work involved in a poly relationship at this time. It's been a crazy enough year as it is with all going on in the world.

He's convinced, despite not having much poly experience except in casual relationships, that he'll be great at this, that I'll never notice his attention wavering because of another relationship. I think he's being naive and overconfident. I already have to share him with his other responsibilities and emotional ties: a business he owns, 2 kids and his 1st wife, their mom (the kids live with mom,) and his 2nd wife from whom he is not yet legally divorced. I'm not sure I can deal with a lover too.

I feel remorse for any way in which I might have mislead him. I told him I was open to poly when we first started dating. And I meant it, but now faced with the reality of sharing him, I'm melting down and struggling not to shut myself off from him completely. But I've been where he is, asking for what he's asking for. I get it. He's been fighting his way out of serial monogamy, exploring his sexuality, and learning to be independent, and doesn't want to hit pause or stop for my ass. He's where I was 6 years ago.

So now, I'm faced with decisions. Stay or go. Date or don't. Do I try to make rules to make me more comfortable? Like, no women in his bed, he can fuck them somewhere else. He must wear a condom to keep me safe from STDs (he's had a vasectomy.) Pick something that remains just between us--anal? Bondage? Ugh, I used to hate it when Arlo tried to put rules on my relationships. But now I totally get it. I do not want him doing those things with other women! Sunny says he's totally ok with me making some rules, but will he stick to them in the heat of NRE? We haven't built up years of trust for me to rely on. So I'm here again, reading and writing, trying to make sense of my intense feelings of shame, jealousy, and abandonment.
 

LoveBunny

Member
After 3 days of talking, I'm finally able to calm my nerves. Two nights ago Sunny and I had our most productive evening of conversation (which ended in deep lovemaking.) I see him giving serious time and thought to how to keep our relationship moving forward while he explores having a secondary. He says he wants to come up with fun things for us to experience together. He wants me to spend more time at his place. He's generally a fly-by-the-pants kind of guy, so I appreciate that he's reading, talking, and being intentional.

The good news: More than I'd realized, he seems to see us as partners. For the first time, we really talked about moving in together eventually. It'd have to be his place, mine's too small, plus he's paying mortgage and I rent. He lives outside the city, so I'd have to get a car, or he'll fix up one of the old trucks he has in his driveway for me. Of course, that's for later it's only been 6 months, and I am NOT giving up my sweet pad until I know it's right. I'll never find a place here at this price again.

He seemed ok with not having another woman in his (maybe someday our) bed, and that I get first dibs on holidays after his kids. He wants to keep bondage and anal as things only done to me. I hoped out loud that the daddy/babygirl dynamic would remain ours alone, but I'm not going to try to make a "rule" about it. I actually really liked how he approached agreements, making it more about a code of conduct, not so much regulations that supposedly merit punishment if broken.

The bad: Mostly, the bad is in me. I'm worried he'll agree with everything I say while he explores the new connection. I know from experience how easy it is to falls for someone and start wanting MORE and pushing those limits. can't entirely shake feeling hurt that he wants to spend time with another woman when he could be spending time with me. I resent the idea of him doing fun things with another love when he could be doing them with me. Unless she's totally in sports or something else I hate, and they do that together, I am going to get jeal-ouuusssss.

I'm bringing a lot of old wounds to this. Poly arrangements where I settled for being the secondary when I wanted to be the primary. My last love, who dumped me for another woman. Years of neglect from my parents, my ex husband. I have in the past used poly as a way to try to get more love and attention, and I don't want to have to do it again. I dream of a relationship that is ENOUGH, then anything we do outside of that is cake.

Sunny's reasons for wanting this seem to be about self-growth and exploration, and I get that. So far, he has been a man who keeps his promises to me, a guy who shows up, and if he continues to be consistent and attentive, I very well might be fine. I've done poly a dozen times, often with people less equipped than Sunny, plus I was less well-equipped. I'm wiser now, more independent.

I've started thinking about what I might want or be open to if I decide to start dating. I can't stomach it right this minute, I need to finish a new business project, plus I'm still a bit covid anti-social. But what might I look for in a secondary? Female. Maybe lives in a city on the mainland, I love to take little trips. That's all I've got so far.

I know I cannot remain long or happily ambivalent. Right before Sunny, I was trying to truly settle into my life. I adopted a tortoise, he's nearly as big as me and unruly and might outlive me an I adore him. Sunny's a reptile-lover, and attached a lot of meaning to the fact that a tortoise came along at the same time he did. In fact, Sunny was with me, it was like our 3rd date, the first night tortoise was dropped off. He saw me going through the joy and panic of letting such a creature into my life, lol. I also took all my toxic exes and fwb's and anyone not truly adding value to my life out of my phone. I felt like I was digging in, and Sunny felt like part of that.

Maybe that's why it's extra-painful to worry he might not love me with the same intensity I love him.
 
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LoveBunny

Member
Sunny and I have talked a lot about "commitment" and what it means to us. He says he's committed to treating me well. I'm committed to showing up, for sure.

He wanted to know if there was some other commitment I felt we should be making at this time, and I really couldn't think of anything appropriate. I toyed with the idea of having him collar me. It might be fun, though it doesn't seem to be something either of us NEED, or even necessarily something that would feel "serious," since we keep our D/s dynamic strictly in the bedroom.

I don't want to make rules about how many nights a week he spends with me, but we all know I'd prefer more than our average 3. Usually we stay at my place, since he works in this area and I don't have a car to drive up to him. We've been trying to think of ways that I can go to his place more. I'll be working fewer evenings starting next month, so that will help. There is a public bus system I could learn to use, or he is thinking of leaving me with his personal vehicle sometimes (he also has a work vehicle.) He wants to make more privacy at his place from his tenant/roommate, converting that part of the house into a separate apartment. None of this can happen right away, so for a while, 3 nights it is.

I haven't delved into anything about his potential secondary, who she is or what they're planning. I've just been concentrating on ME and US. If his relationship with her grows, or if I start dating someone else, we will inevitably keep certain things from each other, out of respect for each other and our other partners. For the last 6 months, we've told each other pretty much everything, and I'm bummed that will no longer be the case. I'm not expecting DADT, but at this point, for me, I don't want a lot of details.

I've felt ok about this for a couple of days now. Maybe not a 10, but a solid 7.5 or 8.
 

LoveBunny

Member
After 2 nights on my own (I went out with friends one night, worked one night) I spent last night with Sunny. He didn't bring up any poly stuff, I didn't really either. I was honest with him that I was still feeling a bit shy and anxious, and he reassured me it would all be ok, he wasn't going anywhere, and we left it at that. It was nice to ease up on the serious talks for a bit and enjoy being together. We had a fun afternoon and evening. Not as much sex as we usually have...only once instead of 3 times. Its it because someone else is satisfying his libido? I suppose it could have been many things, and really, do I need sex 3 times??

I haven't asked, and he hasn't volunteered, any more about what is going on with his secondary connection. I don't want to be avoiding the reality that Sunny is dating someone else, but also I really don't want to be giving time and space to that within OUR relationship. I'm unsure how much we ought to flesh out our agreements and expectations more, or where it might be best at this point to just let things flow and see what happens.

I'm considering looking for someone for me to date, not right away, maybe in a couple weeks after I sort out a couple of work things that are taking up a lot of my bandwidth. Maybe if I'm dating, I'll feel less...vigilant.... for signs of neglect. Maybe I'd feel more inclined to give Sunny space and encouragement instead of just acceptance. It still mystifies me that he can want to date someone else in the midst of all this NRE, which I think he stills feels as much as I do. I know it's possible to love more than one person at a time, but is it possible to handle that much NRE?? I don't personally know if I could hold it together!
 

LoveBunny

Member
God damn, I am in love with Sunny. I can't believe just 8 months ago, I really, really thought I could never feel so passionately for a man, was sure only a woman would suffice. That man just lights me up all over. He came over last night, I was on call for work so we just had to order in, watch t.v.. We made love last night and twice this morning. I was really surprised when I told him my next two nights off, and asked him which he'd like to spend together, he said "both." I keep worrying I'm not giving him enough space, but I want to be with him all the time, so....At least I'm not one of those people who need to text or call constantly when we're not together.

I think soon I will have to ask him about his secondary connection. I don't want him to think I've forgotten or am denying to myself that he wants to date other people. So far, to Sunny's credit, I have not felt at all neglected. Strangely, I have not felt her presence at all. I wonder if he (or she) may have put on the brakes in it, or if they are going really slow, which shows more restraint than I ever had when I was in his situation. Maybe he really is great at compartmentalizing.

He thinks his "polysaturation" level is 2 people. In my 20's, I stretched myself thin once by having 5 regular lovers. I can easily be saturated with one. I remember back when Arlo and I had just moved in together, this woman I'd been chasing for like a year finally offered herself to me, and I was like, "Nah." I just wasn't interested in something casual, and I knew casual was all I could handle outside of Arlo just then. I'm thinking I'll put up my dating profiles next month, gives me a couple more weeks to figure myself out and solidify this "primary" relationship with Sunny.
 

LoveBunny

Member
Hit a wall with relationship negotiations. Sunny and I had a really intense night/morning recently of discussions, sex, and even a little hurt feelings and some tears (his) all this made much worse by my period.

Triggers: 1) I learned that Sunny actually pursued his other lover for a year, which makes me feel jealous because he didn't/doesn't have to pursue me at all. 2) I learned she does not have other partners. I would've felt more comfortable with a married woman or something. I'm scared it's a perfect storm for a toxic love triangle with 2 woman "competing" for the singular attention of the same man. 3) My period came and I was hormonal/emotional.

I told him my intention to put up a couple dating profiles next month. I have fears about dating. Mostly, that I have, in the past, lost my marbles during NRE, especially with women. And as a queer woman, I seem to chafe at the idea of a female/female relationship being secondary. I feel like I could stomach this whole thing better with a female primary, male secondary, but who knows. That I'm struggling so much with this still comes as a shock. Am I just self-sabotaging this relationship? If so, why? Years ago, I was so sure that a poly life was absolutely what I wanted. Shouldn't I feel safe because finally, I am free?

Anyway, here's where we're at with the negotiations:

Surprisingly, he did a turnabout on condoms, agreeing they should be worn with partners outside our relationship until testing is done and metamours have been met. I'm surprised he'd consider us meeting. He had an experience where he introduced 2 women he was dating casually they ran off together and it was painful for him.

We agree I get dibs on holidays (after his kids of course.) I don't have family and holidays are lonely, painful times for me.

I don't want to see him and her together on social media when all my friends/family know we are a couple. He doesn't want me on major dating sites like Tinder and Facebook where his friends/family could see me.

The one I'm really struggling with: Other women in his bed, which we've talked about might someday in the next year or more become MY bed too. I understand where he's coming from, realistically not everyone lives in a situation conducive to dating (roommates, kids at home, etc.) He brought up designated bedding, maybe the other woman isn't allowed to keep things at his house? I'm thinking, what poor woman would agree to this, especially if you're her only lover?

I'm having cognitive dissonance about this. On the one hand, I see him doing things like rearranging his house the way I like it. Making sure the foods I like are in the fridge. I mentioned earlier he's turning part of his house into a separate apartment for his roommate/tenant. He told me this was to give "us" more privacy and room, which made me feel great, but then later he mentioned something about maybe after I moved in, it being a separate bedroom for dates. My heart sank. When I envision my ideal relationship, honestly, being left alone in bed while my partner sleeps with someone else just isn't in the picture, but of course that is the reality of most poly relationships. I think the fact that we have a daddy/babygirl dynamic makes this harder.

He came up with some rules that are very sex based. Sunny is very focused on sex. He pouts if he doesn't get it, attaches a lot of importance to it, wants a LOT of it and in many different ways. He feels he didn't get enough of it in his "prime" because his wife only wanted it once a week, and he only recently lost weight and started dressing and grooming in a way that attracts women more. He's envious of all the experiences I've had. So I decided maybe a way to make this a more positive experience is to approach some of it on a psychosexual level, come up with some babydoll/daddy agreements.

He wanted to come over tonight, but I said not yet, tomorrow night. I'm feeling drained. I really miss the days of this being fun, and feeling wholly at ease within this relationship.
 

LoveBunny

Member
It's been a month since Sunny informed me he was dating someone else, and so far, he has remained true to his word that he would not spend less time with me or be less attentive. It took three long, hard weeks for us to solidify our agreements. A couple of them are very much the training-wheel rules poly people get all indignant about, rules meant to preserve Sunny and I as the "primaries," but Sunny seems content with the arrangement, and I feel more relaxed.

This morning, for the first time, I asked a few questions about the woman he's dating, just her first name (If I get her last name, I'll cyberstalk and what if she's super hot???) I asked what she does for a living, and what he likes about her, how he met her, does she have kids? This was the first time I was able to discuss her without getting emotional. I think, for now, that's all I need or want to know about her, though I do have a couple questions I'll probably need to ask if they continue dating down the line, like how they define their relationship, and how deeply he thinks he means to bring her into his (our?) life. I'm ok with things right now, not sure how I"ll feel if/when they get more "serious."

In a couple ways, our relationship has grown this month. We leaned in to our DD/LG arrangement, we started saying "I love you" to each other. We're trying to figure out the when and how to introduce me to his kids.

I'm gearing up to put up a couple dating profiles, though I wonder where will my time and energy come from?

Truth is, it's a bit uncomfortable being one of two monogamous females to a male hinge. It feels icky and antifeminist. Sunny was the hinge in his last (casual) poly arrangement too, he's never actually had to deal with one of his partners dating another person. He thinks he'll feel compersion.

If I'm being honest, in all my experience I've rarely, only occasionally felt true compersion. I've felt neutral quite a bit. Then, there's been those times where I actively struggled with jealousy and envy.

Let me take a look at some situations which created compersion or neutrality or jealousy and why:

I felt compersion when my high school boyfriend shared a kiss with my female bestie because I trusted them both, loved them both. I felt compersion in my 20's when my boyfriend Matt hooked up repeatedly with my gay friend, because I knew Matt was more straight than gay so I trusted him not to leave me, plus I loved them both. I felt compersion 8 years ago when my monogamous husband made out with a woman at a party, because I knew he needed the ego boost it gave him and I felt it made it less awful that I was a hinge dating others. felt compersion a few years ago when Melinda made out with Jessica, because Melinda wanted more attention from me than I could give her and Jess had a serious boyfriend so I assumed she wouldn't take Mel away from me.

I felt neutral in my early 20's in my 3somes with Greg and Millie once they became a couple. I loved but wasn't in love with either of them, and had a rather "primary" relationship at that time with Jimmy and Sonya. I felt neutral during my MMF 3somes with David and Greg or Matt and Greg throughout my mid-20's. Maybe because I was the only female, or because I loved them all but wasn't "in love" with any of them. I felt neutral 8 years ago when my female secondary, Coco, dated 2 guys (One I considered a friend, one I never met) because I was her only female lover, plus I had a husband of my own. I felt neutral 5 years ago when my boyfriend Hal got a (female) FWB. I think I knew by then I wasn't going to stay with him long-term, I wanted to date women, and I was still emotionally involved with my ex-husband.

I felt jealous in my early 20's when Sonya and Jimmy fell in love and I became the secondary in what had been a previously more equal triad. I felt jealous when Sonya did just about anything with anyone, male or female, during the last year of that relationship. I wanted to be her primary, but I felt secondary, jealous of both her primary and any casual or tertiaries. I felt jealous last year when my monogamous girlfriend left me for another woman. I felt jealous last month when Sunny opened our relationship to start dating a woman I'd never met, while I want only him.

Definitely some patterns there. I'm more likely to get jealous about female metamours. Seems like I do better as a secondary if I have my own primary. I also see how much easier it is when I know, like and trust my partner's partners. I'm going to keep looking at and thinking about this......
 

LoveBunny

Member
This week's a mixed bag. BIDEN WON! Already seeing Trump less in the news cycle is bliss.

Sunny hurt his back and is been struggling with pain management. Twice he's tried to stay at my place, but left in the middle of the night because he can't get comfortable. His leaving jars me. Last night, I made him dinner and just tried to stay quiet when he fell asleep on my floor. But he still left.

I got to spend one night at his place a few days ago, during a tropical storm. He sweetly came to come get me (buses weren't running) so I wouldn't be alone. Poor guy slept on the floor because anything softer hurts. I cleaned his bathroom for him, vacuumed his floors, took care of his pets. I see how frustrated he is, how pain is making him withdraw into himself. I don't know what else to do, so I just try to stay quiet and undemanding.

I've been reading a well-written book called POLYSECURE about how attachment theory can be applied to non monogamous relationships. I had a very honest moment with Sunny recently and confessed I'm struggling with my commitment-phobia. I simultaneously want and yet panic at the idea of moving deeper into a relationship with him, because I do not want to commit to a long-term poly lifestyle. But I suspect I'd feel this way at this point in the relationship even if it were monogamous, and I'd blame monogamy. Going back to attachment theory, I have moments of being earned secure, but when stressed, I tend to flip between anxiously attached and fearfully avoidant. Now, because I can't complain about Sunny himself, who is kind and mature and consistent, I've gone ambivalent and commitment-phobic about polyamory vs. monogamy.

At this point, I feel largely neutral about Sunny's other lover, but then I have pangs of jealousy, even through he's meticulously kept her presence out of my life--or am I jealous BECAUSE he's doing that, compartmentalizing, if not basically hiding her? It occurs to me this is the first time I've ever not known my metamour--assuming I should acknowledge that's what she is, though they've only been dating a month and a half, they've known each other a year. I dislike that this stranger, someone I didn't choose, is now something to me (a metamour.) She's probably delightful, but right now I just see her as Sunny's baggage. I'd probably make everyone happier if I can get myself to a more welcoming attitude.

Oh and it's not just that Sunny has another female lover (causing the whole why aren't I enough thing to rear it's stupid head.) Equally jealousy-inducing is that he has a family here, and I don't. Sunny has kids and and a baby mama and 2nd ex wife he still has financial entanglements with and a brother and brother-in-law all right here in town. Yet, though we've been together almost 9 months now, I've only met the bro-in-law. I have a handful of close friends here, but it's not like what Sunny has. I keep wanting to make Sunny my family. Sunny says he sees me as a domestic partner, but the reality is he already HAS a full family I'm excluded from, (not intentionally I don't think.) I FEEL extraneous in his life, as much as he says it's not that way.

I told Sunny I'd put up my dating profiles this month. I think I'll do it this afternoon. I feel I need to do this to pull my focus off Sunny, and for both of us to grow, and to keep my options open. I need to define what I want, who I'm seeking. Something like,

"I currently have a boyfriend/anchor partner, we date separately. Polyamory, for me, is a choice I make with some partners rather than an orientation. I naturally lean monogam-ish or polyfidelous. I thrive with consistency and like a lot of attention."

Hmmm, that's actually not bad, honest. I need to decide "I have room in my life for (blank.)" One or two nights a week? Afternoon delights only? A lover? A girlfriend? Do I even want to date men?

Anyway y'all thanks for listening!!
 

icesong

Active member
I've been reading a well-written book called POLYSECURE about how attachment theory can be applied to non monogamous relationships.
I'm reading this one too, and it's wonderful, enough that I'm going to finish it and then start at the beginning and do all the questions, I think. There's a *lot* there for me, both in recognizing patterns from my family of origin and in trying to break those patterns with my own kid, let alone with my partners.
 

LoveBunny

Member
@icesong, I'm terrible about actually doing workbook type stuff, but I definitely think I will give POLYSECURE a second read. I did find myself wishing it went deeper into what each type can do to be better at poly. I really like that the book pointed out the strengths in each relationship style as well as the weaknesses.

I got miffed in the thread on this forum about "Is poly right for you?" when it implied that anxiously attached people were least-suited for poly, when I've experienced first hand how fearful and dismissive avoidant types can use poly as a way to keep partners at arm's length and an excuse for treating people insensitively. Of course, ideally, we'd all be secure, but I think as long as someone is doing the work on themselves, that's more important than what their upbringing left them struggling with, you know?

Sunny started doing a little reading on the topic, too, and has decided he's mostly secure, and that sounds right, but he occasionally swings fearful avoidant, too, with a strong fear of engulfment. He says he's "lost himself" in past relationships, stopped having a life outside. He's voiced fears that I might make him my "everything," as if I'd let go of my longstanding friendships, creative pursuits, etc.. I guess in his experience, that's what happens in a monogamous relationship. My experience with being married and monogamous was different, Arlo and I kept plenty (probably too much) separateness.

I was worried Thanksgiving might suck for me, but I had a great day! Last year was awful, at a Benihana's (yuk) with my bestie Victoria's family, feeling like a pity invite, while my ex boyfriend Hal blew up my phone trying to lure me into a booty call, then he got all mad when I refused. But this year, I had a great day!

Sunny spent the day with his ex wife and kids. I was technically invited, but Sunny didn't really want to introduce me to his ex, and they weren't making anything vegetarian, so I passed. I briefly met his kids earlier in the week. His teen boy was nice to me, preteen girl not so much. I didn't want to attend the couple of invites I got from casual friends doing turkey dinners, so I thought I'd just end up all alone that day, maybe decorate my tree Luckily, at the last minute a few of my besties decided we should all go out on a boat for the morning and I had the best time. Then, when Sunny finished with his family, we went to our favorite pizzaria for dinner. He got grouchy and snippy towards the end of it because his back was bothering him, but I still enjoyed my meal.

Sunny and I haven't talked about his other partner much. I learned in passing he sees her about one day ever other week, I'm thinking even less with his recent problems with his back which has kept him home laying flat a lot. He did admit he had "romantic feelings" for her, which I honestly didn't like hearing. But he tells me often he loves me, he sees us being together long term, and his lust for me seems undiminished, so I can't really complain. I put dating profiles up on HER and OKC, but nothing happening for me so far.

I was thinking today about a comment another poster said on a thread, that she had hoped poly would bring her and her husband closer. Sunny has said something similar, and I can't understand why anyone would expect that having relationships outside the couple would bring the couple closer. It perhaps fulfills one or more members of the couple more than monogamy, but how does it foster more togetherness within the couple and not the opposite? The only advantage to the couple I can think of is it might inspire them to be more intentional with their time together, make them spend more quality time/dates instead of just being in the house together but doing separate things.

This all comes up as I contemplate if Sunny is truly the right choice for me as someone looking/hoping for my next life partner(s.) Not that that needs to be decided after 9 months together, but I do feel a wee bit of panic of being single and nearly 50. Sunny says he never wants a legal marriage again. I can take marriage again or leave it, I think, but I do want a live-in partner. I've been spending more nights at Sunny's over the last few weeks, he lends me his nicest truck to get back and forth. He definitely takes care of me, physically and emotionally. He was so funny when he got all grouchy the other night, he got so upset that bugs were biting me, way more than I was, like he felt personally responsible for the mosquitos causing me discomfort.

Yep, love makes me anxious. My last serious relationship ended about 8 months before I met Sunny, she left me for another woman. Just two nights before she broke up with me, she'd rushed me home from the event we were at because she wanted to make love to me so bad. She told me she loved me, held me all night. The next night, I saw her with the other woman, we argued, and in the morning, she was done with me. I couldn't believe it. I find myself wondering if Sunny could possibly do something similar. I mean, he seems 100% like a man who loves me, but I've been fooled before.
 

icesong

Active member
It perhaps fulfills one or more members of the couple more than monogamy, but how does it foster more togetherness within the couple and not the opposite? The only advantage to the couple I can think of is it might inspire them to be more intentional with their time together, make them spend more quality time/dates instead of just being in the house together but doing separate things.
The intentionality is definitely a big part of it, but for me it goes a lot deeper than that. Because we do have relationships with other people, everything I share with a partner is an active choice - and at least for me that’s kind of brilliant in that I don’t feel like a default, I don’t feel like an obligation. (This actually is true of both Knight and Artist. )

Add to that, for me, all the requisite self-work - stuff like reading polysecure and a host of other relationship books and ... I hesitate to say self help but stuff like Brené Brown’s books or bell hooks’ all about love? Clearly that level of growth isn’t exclusively a polyamory thing, but polyamory is what set me down that path. And the better I am at being a person, the more able I am to have relationships that are between people and not just, like, culturally scripted.
 

LoveBunny

Member
Because we do have relationships with other people, everything I share with a partner is an active choice - and at least for me that’s kind of brilliant in that I don’t feel like a default, I don’t feel like an obligation. (This actually is true of both Knight and Artist. )
 

LoveBunny

Member
@icesong That's true, it definitely does make a relationship feel more like a choice than a default. Thank you for that.

Sunny got all weird on me last night, told me he feels he's "losing himself" in our relationship. This started because he feels like he's eating too much lately, and insists it's because I like 3 meals (instead of nibbling fruit and granola all day like him) and restaurant food, and he feels like he's been overeating/drinking for me (as if I asked him to.) He got a little insulting about my staple carbs and cheese, but you know what? Maybe I could lose 15 lbs, but I'm nowhere near obese, I burn more calories at my job than he does at his, and I have zero physical issues. I was pretty bummed out, figuring maybe his outburst was REALLY because I spent the last 3 nights at his place and apparently that's too much. Now he's saying it's just pain from his back and the pain meds making him feel "disconnected." I didn't get upset or argue, just listened and promised I'd think about ways to have big/restaurant meals more often without him. I asked if he wanted me to leave (he didn't) then got out of there first thing in the morning. I figure I will give him some space and let him suck bananas as much as he likes, lol. I guess I'm still a little salty.
 

LoveBunny

Member
Sunny and I just spent 3 nights in a row at his place, and he didn't seemed freaked out or like he was ready to be rid of me, so that's progress. We did a great deal of (TMI alert) fluid bonding. I keep wondering when I'll get to a place where I don't just want to fuck Sunny all the frigging time. Surely, we won't always be like this. He says I'm the first relationship he's ever been in where he gets enough sex. I wonder if it's sustainable, like once we move in together, or once I go through menopause, etc.. We're going on our 10th month of this relationship.

He let it slip he hasn't slept with his other lover lately. I didn't ask if it was because of his back pain and he'll pick her back up again at some point when he feels batter, or if it just fizzled out, or if it has anything to do with me and us growing closer. I prefer to just assume he's sleeping with others so I don't relax into thinking I'm his one and only.

I was talking to a woman who seemed kind of promising on OKC, a poly married woman who lives 4 hours away. But she seems to have ghosted last couple of days. I never even mentioned it to Sunny, I figure no need unless it's someone I'm definitely going to meet in person or date. I have now met Sunny's 2nd ex wife, he's taking care of her cat. Sunny gets so protective of me sometimes, he was all concerned it would be awkward for me and tried to keep her away from me, but it was fine. I loved how she dressed, and she texted him later how nice I am and how happy he seems with me.
 

icesong

Active member
Ha, I keep asking myself the same about me and Artist. Spoiler: 5.5 years later and... haven't found that place yet. 'Course, we haven't moved in either nor do we plan to, but... :🤷:
 

LoveBunny

Member
Ha, I keep asking myself the same about me and Artist. Spoiler: 5.5 years later and... haven't found that place yet. 'Course, we haven't moved in either nor do we plan to, but... :🤷:
Oh wow! We do think we'll probably move in together in the next year or two, I wonder if that will change our level of sexual interest in each other. I can't say I've never had this much sex, but I've never had it combined with what seems to be a long term serious relationship
 

icesong

Active member
I hadn't since I was 17/18, and even then that intensity didn't last more than 3ish years, if that.
 
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