Clean break, discovered manipulation.

A

Astirarose

New member
My husband, although he was, and so was I still thinking there was a possibility of a possible future for him and GF, have decided to make a clean break from them.

It was a choice my husband made after what conspired last night.

In chatting with GF and her husband both, we realized something we had suspected but really kind of ignore as just possibly jealousy on my part, was in fact going on.

She was manipulating myself, her husband, and my husband to get what she wanted (Which was my husband). My husband knows me better than anyone else, and she tried to lie about something she says I did.

She had told her husband, that I was the one having her push him towards me, and asking her to esentially make moves on me.

My husband knows me, he knows I dont need a go between, that if I like someone and I want something and I have the go-ahead, I will just go for it.

So she was trying to convince her husband that my lack of interest was basically because I was shy? I am not.

That coupled with we discovered last night, that she is esentially threatening to leave her husband if he doesn't just get over it, and go poly.

These were the last straws for my husband, and he pulled the plug today.

And to me one of the most telling comments I read from him, was How much SHE was sacrificing for him, to be with him.

She has never had an interest in poly in 10 years with him, she has said so. She has also stated she is not interested in poly with anyone else but my husband.

So she is pushing her husband into something to be with my husband.

While I can understand the desperation on her part, the manipulations she went through, its something My husband and I cant deal with. We cant ever trust that if she says her and her husband are in a good place, that they are.

My husband and I spent hours and hours each day since we came back talking.. They have spent an hour or two here.

My husband and I have a very strong bond, and we still felt we needed that much time to talk.

Anyhow.. update.. My husband obviously is worried about handling it wrong, because he doesn't want to cause more issues between her husband and GF.

Any suggestions on the best way to handle this, without throwing resentment towards the husband?

My husband told them both, he needs space and wont be around for a while. That he is not ok with how things turned.

He is in "repair mode" hoping to minimize the impact on their marriage right now.

Its obvious to us now, that she was absolutly not forthright on the state of their marriage.
 
I am having difficulty understanding all that. Let me repeat back what I understand in my own words. You correct me if I am wrong ok?

  • You guys had the trip to visit GF and her husband, which was hard for many reasons.
  • At the end of trip, Other Husband asked to stop dating and return to friends for now. You were disappointed, but seemed to accept that this is where he was at. You had hopes of it eventually working out.
  • But then GF started threatening to dump her husband if he doesn't just "get over it" and go poly.
  • Turns out during the trip, she was was lying and manipulating everyone. GF wanted your husband.
    • So to get her own husband out of her way... GF told her husband that you asked her to get him to make moves on you. (You did not ask for this.)
    • When you weren't interested or responsive, GF told her husband that it was because you were "shy." (You and your husband know you are not shy.)
    • GF was also telling your husband how much she was "sacrificing" to be with him.

Her poor behaviors have caused you and your husband to no longer trust in her Word. Her poor behaviors have also caused your husband to break up with her. Even if the other husband came around to them dating again... now YOUR husband doesn't want to go there any more.

Is that it? :confused:

If so... I don't blame either of you for not trusting her any more. She seems to want to stream roll right over people. I know she was supposed to be your friend before... but I don't see how "friendly" these behaviors are.

My husband obviously is worried about handling it wrong, because he doesn't want to cause more issues between her husband and GF.
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There is nothing to handle. If he chose to break up with her because she's been behaving in untrustworthy ways? He can do that.

What happens (between her and husband) is (between her and husband.) It's nothing you or your husband did.

Any suggestions on the best way to handle this, without throwing resentment towards the husband?
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WHO is throwing resentment at him? Neither you nor your husband seem mad at him. If you are worried GF is going to act out at her husband? You cannot control her behavior. She controls her behavior.

The best you and your husband could do is tell Other Husband that neither of you hold nothing against him, but cannot get involved with them because you can no longer trust in his wife's Word.

My husband told them both, he needs space and wont be around for a while. That he is not ok with how things turned.
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He has the right to choose what he will and will not participate in. He can bow out of things if he wants to.

He is in "repair mode" hoping to minimize the impact on their marriage right now.
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He doesn't need to do any "repairs" in that marriage.

The health of that marriage is not his job. That shared responsibility belongs to the married couple – GF and her husband. They will either work on their issues or eventually disband. It is not any of you or your husband's work to be doing.

Galagirl
 
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Thank you Gala,

Yes you understood everything correctly.
And thanks for the advice.

My husband feels responsible and wants to try to minimize GF feeling resentment towards husband for not "polying up" essentially.

I will show my husband this thread, because I think it will help him realize that he is not responsible for anything that happens in their marriage going forward.

My husband feels responsible (I do not feel my husband is responsible for what is going on in the other marriage) and Im trying to help him through that notion that he "needs to help repair the other marriage".

There was obviously something already broken that we were not clued in on. Had we known, we would have never gotten close to the situation at all, except perhaps as friends.
 
My husband feels responsible and wants to try to minimize GF feeling resentment towards husband for not "polying up" essentially.
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If her husband does not want to poly with her any more because she behaves crazy... how is that your husband's doing? :confused:

She wanted her way in getting your husband. Treated you poorly (telling lies about you) and treated her husband poorly (misleading him with stories about you and later pulling an ultimatum to bully him into doing what she wants.)

If I were the other husband I would say "Ok. Divorce then. Because I don't want to poly with you when you behave all crazy. And I don't want to be married to a person who treats me bad like this."

If she wants her own way regardless of who it damages or hurts? She's selfish. Your husband did not make her be that way. He wasn't holding gun to her head to behave like that.

He may feel REGRETS that this all happened this way. But that doesn't mean he is GUILTY of doing anything wrong.

What did he actually do? He saw her behavior was poor -- treating you badly, treating her husband badly, and telling him drama stuff. (how much she "sacrificed" when he did not ask her to make any sacrifices for him.)

He decided to get away from all this wacky. I would say that was a good thing to do.

Galagirl
 
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I agree fully. Ive told my husband, I don't feel he needs to feel responsible or guilty, she's the one who lied and withheld, and created this situation. But I think seeing this from someone else, and more experienced will help him(my husband) realize this.

He ( my husband) feels like he potentially broke up a marriage, I feel it was already broken and this situation only brought it to light.
 
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Hopefully your husband agrees when you show him the thread.

I'd be on guard for a Hoover.

Where she tries to suck your husband back into the drama now that he's leaving the situation. Maybe playing on his misplaced "guilty feelings" like he "owes" her this now because this is all his fault (when it is NOT.)

He ( my husband) feels like he potentially broke up a marriage, I feel it was already broken and this situation only brought it to light.
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He didn't break it up. She had a covert agenda and misrepresented herself and her intentions to her husband, to your husband, and to you.

If being caught in these behaviors leads to people distancing themselves from her (you, your husband, even her husband)? Those are the consequences.

People usually don't like being lied to/used/messed with. If they decide they no longer want to play with you if you do that stuff to them? They are allowed. They can choose what they will and will not participate in. They can pick who they will and will not play with. If you alienate people with bad behavior? You have nobody to blame but your own self.

She's free to choose how she behaves. She can choose to tell lies and bully people and alienate them. She is not free from the consequences of her choices though. The people could decide to get away from her and her wacky.

She's also the one threatening to leave if she doesn't get her way. Be kinder to just go ahead and leave the other husband. And chalk it up to "we have grown apart and want different things now." That's at least respectful to the other husband.

Rather than threaten to leave in order to bully him into doing stuff he doesn't want. How's that loving behavior? That's behaving like a jerk.

Galagirl
 
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Thats actually a big concern of mine, and I have told him. She managed to manipulate fairly well up to this point, so I dont expect her to try and stop.
 
Gala Girl pretty much said everything worth saying.

What occurs to me is that perhaps you had a good reason for your paranoid behavior during the trip. I am poly and poly friendly, but when Spexy fell for a mono woman who was basically pretending to be okay with poly but seemed to be interested in a mono relationship with her, everything in me was screaming that it was wrong. I went with my gut, did everything you classically go "no no" in poly - I put my foot down and pretty much told him to end it - without that many words, but suggesting extremely strongly that it wasn't working and was creating trouble all around and had wreaked havoc in our relationship.

Controlling? Damn right. But here's the thing, it was in resistance to the manipulations already happening. Would I do it again? If this situation happened again? Like a shot. Later she created a hell of a lot of extremely unethical and legally dubious drama including threats and blackmail trying to manipulate him back. When I told Spexy that the relationship was not going in a good direction, she was actually on best behavior, but Spexy was changing in ways fundamentally not him after every time he met her.

And yet, if Spexy genuinely fell for someone again, I'd still be happy. He is so horrified and frankly terrified by some of the threats and by what the woman turned out to be, he doesn't ever want to experiment with poly again. It is me explaining that people are all different, and he could have tangled with a bitch even in monogamy.

Perhaps, even if you didn't have the knowledge of the manipulation that you have now, you sensed it as dishonesty and and freaked out?
 
Ana, yeah I had had red flags along the way, but kept rationalizing them as jealousy.

I think one of the largest red flags we ignored, is when he explained to her that (he and I) fully planned to date other people. She got jealous. A woman who says she never gets jealous, but she reasonably made us feel comfortable about it ( gave us explanations and said she would get over it). At the time, I was still dealing with processing through jealousy over him and her, so it kind of felt like a slap to the face.

But we ignored it.

I had those feelings that she might be manipulating her husband And I into a relationship, but never had anything concrete until last night.

I was reading your post again and had a couple other comments. Because my Husband was suprised that I seemed fine with him finding someone and dating here, when I seemed to be having so many issues with his "online" relationship. And I was, I actually wanted him to find someone to date here. Why? I'm not sure.. Perhaps it was, what you have said, I sensed the manipulations and knew something wasnt right? Maybe something else.

I do know, We've gone to meetups, and Ive seen him flirt, and I tease him about it after, even suggested he should message one of the girls he was interested in. We both waited and hoped for a reply. Him flirting with her and other women did not phase me at all, and he and I splitting up and talking with other people felt so natural.

WE were talking this morning (He is on his midnight shift right now, so sleeping), but this morning, he isn't saying things like, I never want to do Poly, maybe POly isnt for us. He is saying, we make sure we are ready when we date, make sure we have researched and asked questions. This has not turned him off to the thought of Poly at all. I think its just made us more aware that we need to make sure were are ready when we do start opening ourselves up again to another partner.
 
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Hi Astirarose,

It sounds to me like your husband made the right decision in breaking up with his (now ex?) girlfriend. It is hard to keep dating someone when you can't trust them. Not sure how to break it to her, I just know I would try to keep it short and simple. Don't water it down with fancy words.

Sorry you've had to go through all that.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
I would frankly be concerned that your husband hasn't closed the door full stop yet. See lots of people on here who talk about how their partner is trying to disengage from their OSO in the most considerate way possible and the breakup just doesn't happen.

Does your husband need to be a dick? No, but a swift, clean break needs to be made. A person can manipulate you only if you let them.
 
I can still see him trying to rationalize, but he hasn't contacted her, yet he has asked me a few times today if she has contacted me.
 
I hope she doesn't decide to contact you.

While you can't demand that your husband stop seeing her and/or stop being in communication with her, you don't need to be pulled into any back/forth, will they/won't they nonsense. Just remember YOUR boundaries. Don't let the drama she is creating make you crazy.
 
This morning he told me he plans to talk to her this weekend.

Of course I told him I am not comfortable with it and think its a bad idea, and I got a guilt trip because of it.

I am angry, because he doesn't seem to be angry enough, upset enough that I was manipulated and used.
He wants to call her and see how she is, make sure she is ok.
He is se-sawing and I can see him trying to rationalize what she did. If Im talking to him and even give the slightest indication that Im upset that I lost a friend too, he clings to it and starts to rationalize everything.

Maybe she had a bad marriage, and shes going to great lengths to get out of it, or find happiness... He says things like that.

Im hurt that his concern feels like it is more for her right now, rather than me, and what happened.

I know if I flat out tell him NO, I don't want to you calling her, he will resent me and be able to put it all on me for a while.

If I do the opposite and say sure go ahead, I will resent him for feeling guilted into pretending Im ok with it.

Anyone here can help me rationalize this? Im not jealous, not feeling a bit of that, I'm just disappointed mostly.

I told him, I'm not comfortable with him calling or contacting her, and that I think its a bad idea, but I wasn't going to stop him.

Ideas, am I way off on being disappointed about this?

I can tell she is pretty much constantly on his mind right now, which I understand. He pretends he is fine, tells me he is fine, but the fact that he asked me in the middle of a particularly vulnerable conversation for me yesterday (Have you heard from her?) indicates he is not.
 
I told him, I'm not comfortable with him calling or contacting her, and that I think its a bad idea, but I wasn't going to stop him.
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That's all you can do. Tell him you prefer he not call her. And then let him own his choices. Give him space to arrive on his own that "no contact" is probably best here when dealing with a manipulative person.

Including space to find out that going back for more crazy is gonna ding him again and that's WHY it's best to do "no contact."

He is see-sawing and I can see him trying to rationalize what she did
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You can see he is struggling with acceptance. This JUST happened. He pulled the plug yesterday. Give him time to digest it in his own way.

You might not like hearing it, but he might need space to think/talk about what he misses. Even if it was under false pretenses or "love bombing" him -- being the recipient of a lot of her attention and then having that go away... there's going to be feelings of withdrawal and missing the attention.


Maybe she had a bad marriage, and shes going to great lengths to get out of it, or find happiness... He says things like that.
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Would it kill you to say "Maybe. Doesn't make it ok to manipulate and lie. But yeah, maybe she had crap going on" if it helps him move ON and let this GO?

I am angry, because he doesn't seem to be angry enough, upset enough that I was manipulated and used.
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Stop taking things personally. I know she hurt you, but he cannot even see his OWN hurt well enough yet. You can see him see-sawing. You can see he is not fine. Do you expect normal/rational behavior out of him when he's wonky right now? :confused:

He's just not going to be able to see your hurt yet when he's struggling to deal with his own load of hurt.

You can be disappointed that he's not as fast on the uptake after a ding as you are. You have learned something new about him that you didn't know before.

Galagirl
 
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So I guess I misunderstood my husband and he never had intentions of breaking things off completely. He was just standing back for a few days, and had plans to contact her after he felt She had enough time to calm down. So That her marriage was not at risk.

He completely dismisses what she did to me, her husband. His concern was giving her enough time that she didn't risk her marriage over this.
 
You can't stop him from dating her, but you can decide whether you're willing to stay with someone who would continue to date someone that acted that way.

You can also set your own boundaries to refuse to associate with her at all and not want her in your life.

For what it's worth, that sucks that your husband is so willing to overlook her manipulative behavior. And for what? Someone who is 800 miles away?! I honestly just don't get that, but then again, long distance relationships were just never my thing.
 
I should clarify, I dont know if he intends to "date" her, but still be friends with her, play games, chat.

I told him that if he decides to continue with her in whatever respect, that I will not be friends with her regardless.

I admit I'm hurt, that he would even consider it, but I'm trying to understand it. Is he really an asshole, or is this really NRE? Will he have a couple days to think about it and change his mind? I don't know.

I don't know If I can respect him the same way if he chooses to continue with her considering what she has done.
 
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Sorry things have taken such a downturn. :mad:
 
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