Hello!

I'm meeting up with John tomorrow after work so in preparation I've been writing in my journal, trying to organize my thoughts as best as I can. Describing my emotions to myself, trying to filter through jealousy to find the source. Getting overly emotional on my own so I don't mess it up tomorrow. I was talking with my best friend yesterday, and she helped me a lot with giving me advice about allowing myself to be vulnerable in love and realizing that this all felt easier before we said "I love you."

A lot of my discomfort has come from his relationship with Jess, who he has always referred to as he ex until the other night I specifically asked and he said that yes he sleeps with her. I knew it, could sense it the few times I've met her. I thought it would make me feel better hearing it stated as a fact. And for a little while it did because I was able to look at it logically.

But I've just realized that this means that John lied to me over the summer.

I briefly mentioned this conversation in an earlier post of mine, but around June-ish we had the "what are we" talk, where we talked about how we feel in relationships and how neither of us wanted to be trapped so it was better to keep it casual. Jess was mentioned and I confusingly had said "Wait I thought she was your ex?" He emphatically responded with "Yes she *is* my ex, but we are close friends, better as friends than in an actual relationship." I understand that fully. Some of my very best friends are people I've been in previous relationships with. I support that, even told him about those people in my life. The lie comes in when he told me that he wasn't sleeping with anyone else. That he didn't care as much about casual sex with people as he did when he was younger, that he prefers to have a genuine connection with someone like he does with me. But he specifically said "I'm not sleeping with anyone else," and I told him the same was true for me. And it was, still is.

But clearly, that's not the truth, and I think it's the source of my discomfort. I didn't meet Jess until July, but even then I picked up on it, on that energy. I'm an empath and he knows it, claims to be one himself. I've only hung out with her maybe a total of three times and it's always been uncomfortable for me. I've been identifying it as jealousy and insecurity but I'm starting to think that's not at all what it is. That this discomfort and pain I've been feeling is the knowledge that he didn't tell me the truth. And it's been in front of my face for months.

I'm angry and hurt. These are not emotions that I'm good at expressing. It's not that I'm the type to lash out or get violent or loud or anything. I don't even know if bottling it up is the right way to describe it. I just get sad and feel the need to walk away. I'll be seeing him tomorrow, less than 24 hours from now, and I HAVE to bring this up. I cannot hold this back but I know that it is likely that this means it will be our first argument/disagreement. Which I know, logically, is normal and fine in healthy relationships, and that the health of the relationship is determined by how he will respond and how we work through this.

But now I'm really honestly more sad than anything, as well as pissed off at myself. My last relationship was with an narcissist who was emotionally abusive and I've spent the last nine months in this bliss of rose-colored glasses I fear. I've looked hard at it, but kept saying how it seemed weird that there were no red flags to be seen. But I've been encouraged by friends, family, my therapist, that in healthy relationships there are no red flags. But then what the fuck is this? I'm not trying to say that he is abusive or mean or anything, but this is blatantly withholding the truth, therefore, a lie. My heart hurts. I've been worried about continuing the conversation tomorrow, mostly fears of coming across as too insecure, too anxious, too worried, that he would want to back away due to all my feelings. But I've been able to look back at other conversations where I've gotten real with him and when that hasn't happened. But this is different. This feels major. This IS major. Yes, it was early on in the relationship, but he should have been forthcoming then. He should have told me the truth. And I keep thinking about how the night he said he loves me, he said "Now I don't know if I should do the polyamory thing - which if you're not comfortable with it's fine -" and I stopped him because I am okay with it. He didn't mention his "love" for Jess until a few days later when I asked him about it.

I'm a complete mess right now. I'm going to take my anxiety meds and go to sleep and hope that I can get through the work day tomorrow and be focused when I see him in the evening. I feel stupid and blindsided.
 
It sucks when things all of a sudden don't add up. I've been through that, and I am ashamed to admit I may have also accidentally perpetuated it a few times as while I won't lie, I may keep some details close to the chest at first.

I can see one situation where you weren't lied to: if he didn't start sleeping with anyone else until after he told you he wasn't, but if that was the case and you guys were as serious as you seemed to agree he definitely still should have mentioned it when it happened and that in no way lets him off the hook.

Tread carefully, however, because you don't want to let anxiety lead you to end something that might be just a fixable communication hurdle. Don't outright accuse him of lying, just ask "when did you start sleeping with these people again?" And if the dates don't match up or he seems weaselly about it, THEN point out the dishonesty and gauge whether or not he's worth keeping around.
 
Thank you. I've been running it through my head over and over what I will say and how I will begin speaking. He already knows about the vulnerability I've been feeling since saying I love you, and he's been supportive of that. He knows about my past shitty relationships and connections with people. I will try my best to ask it like you posed to avoid outright saying "this means you've lied to me." But, the thing is, from what he said the other night I know that that's what he did by saying he wasn't sleeping with anyone else. I keep thinking to myself that maybe I'm just naive because he said casual and non restrictive, because he said there is love between them while being friends because they are better friends than in a relationship with each other, because I should have found a way to voice my questions better and earlier in the relationship with John. I should have brought up my concerns after the first time I felt that energy between them. In my "defense" my best friend is someone I have dated and been in involved with over the years and we have great love between us but truly are better friends than lovers/girlfriends. When he explained Jess in that way I interpreted that as being the same, telling him about Catherine and how I understand that and how when we are together people think we are in an official relationship but that's not how our love grew. He agreed to that statement during the conversation. I should have asked over the summer during that conversation, but when someone says that they are not sleeping with anyone else I should be able to believe them. I know she's on birth control, it's actually something we talked about during one of the first times we met because she has the implant. I'm not on any birth control because of side effects and John knows that. There have been times where we have had unprotected sex using the pull out method successfully. But that means that while we talked about us both being clean, I was put at risk. Jess could have had a risky situation where a partner of hers was careless with another partner and passed something to her which could have in turn been passed to me on those occasions, plus we don't use protection with oral sex. By not telling me the truth he took away my ability to make informed decisions about boundaries with my body, our relationship, and my heart. I've been feeling like this discomfort I've been feeling is all on me. Unpacking jealousy to find anxiety and fear, trying to describe it to myself rationally to be able to work through it. I'm really going to try to start with a question like you suggested but I'm feeling pain and im feeling defensive.

I absolutely don't want this to end. I do want this to be just a hurdle to pass over together because I believe in my love for him and his for me. I believe in the connection we have. But now I have all these questions because I've been relishing in the open communication we have, how easy it is to talk about feelings and lofe problems and anxieties. Does this mean that's all not true? I don't know at this moment. It snowed more here last night, and will likely get icy tonight, but that can't stop me from going to his house and discussing this with him.
 
yogiskeleton said:
Thank you. I've been running it through my head over and over, what I will say, and how I will begin speaking.

He already knows about the vulnerability I've been feeling since saying I love you, and he's been supportive of that. He knows about my past shitty relationships and connections with people. I will try my best to ask it like you posed, to avoid outright saying, "this means you've lied to me."

But, the thing is, from what he said the other night, I know that that's what he did, by saying he wasn't sleeping with anyone else. I keep thinking to myself that maybe I'm just naive, because he said casual and non restrictive, because he said there is love between them while being friends, because they are better friends than in a relationship with each other. I should have found a way to voice my questions better and earlier in the relationship with John. I should have brought up my concerns after the first time I felt that energy between them.
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That's a lot of "shoulds."

In my "defense," my best friend is someone I have dated and been involved with over the years, and we have great love between us, but truly are better friends than lovers/girlfriends.

When he explained Jess in that way, I interpreted that as being the same, telling him about Catherine, and how I understand that, and how when we are together people think we are in an official relationship, but that's not how our love grew. He agreed to that statement during the conversation.

I should have asked over the summer, during that conversation, but when someone says that they are not sleeping with anyone else I should be able to believe them.
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More shoulds. I see you're rethinking everything now. What a blow. He really misled you.

I know she's on birth control (it's actually something we talked about during one of the first times we met). She has the implant. I'm not on any birth control because of side effects, and John knows that. There have been times where we have had unprotected sex using the pull out method successfully.
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It's never a great idea to go bareback in polyamory, until you know you can really trust someone. Certainly you can use condoms even if hormonal bc is out? Especially now that you found out he's been lying about who he is fucking. If he's fucking his so-called ex, maybe there are others... Who knows?

But that means that while we talked about us both being clean, I was put at risk. Jess could have had a risky situation, where a partner of hers was careless with another partner, and passed something to her, which could have in turn been passed to me on those occasions. Plus we don't use protection with oral sex.

By not telling me the truth, he took away my ability to make informed decisions about boundaries with my body, our relationship, and my heart.
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That's terrible. So much for "loving" this guy. You were loving a persona, not a real person.

I've been thinking this discomfort I've been feeling is all on me, unpacking jealousy to find anxiety and fear, trying to describe it to myself rationally, to be able to work through it. I'm really going to try to start with a question like you suggested, but I'm feeling pain and I'm feeling defensive.

I absolutely don't want this to end. I do want this to be just a hurdle to pass over together, because I believe in my love for him, and his for me. I believe in the connection we have.

But now I have all these questions. I've been relishing the open communication we have, how easy it is to talk about feelings and life problems and anxieties.

Does this mean that's all not true? I don't know at this moment. It snowed more here last night, and will likely get icy tonight, but that can't stop me from going to his house and discussing this with him.
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Yes, it sounds to me like it's all not true. I don't know where people draw the line about being lovers, friends, in a relationship or not in a relationship, having sex, not having sex...

If he was her bf, but now he's still seeing her regularly and having sex with her, what's the freeking difference? In my strong opinion, he is still in a relationship with her.

That you met her, and hung out with her 3 times, and the two of them had this little dirty secret of knowing they were fucking (maybe had even fucked that very day you were with them all together!), ugh... That's just sickening.

What he has been doing is cheating on you. He hasn't been practicing polyamory at all. Practicing poly means, with the full knowledge and joyful consent of all involved. You were kept out of the loop. You didn't know he was fucking someone else, and bareback to boot! You have every right to feel upset. He betrayed your trust.

I am sorry you were taken in by a narcissist before. I have had that horrible experience too. It can be very hard to tell you're with one. They are great at mirroring your feelings and actions to please you. I know after I was with my narc, I mistrusted all new dating partners. I don't think I ever got over it.

Even if a new narc knows you've been hurt by a narc, they will use that to their advantage. They will think, he too her in, I can take her in too.

I'm not saying John is definitely a narc. But he did lie. And it was a whopper. Maybe he was just stupid, or afraid to lose you, or didn't trust you to still "love" him if he was still fucking his "ex." Or maybe she isn't he "ex" and he can't admit it to himself, but he's still carrying on with you.

What a mess. I'm really sorry this happened to you.
 
I didn't see this earlier post before I commented on your most recent one. Sorry.

yogiskeleton said:
I talked to John last night about the things that have been on my mind. He was open and receptive to the conversation, which I am very thankful for.

I let him know about some of my struggles, how my anxiety has been affected, and what I've been feeling. I asked to have things more on the table, to help me feel more comfortable, and he agreed to try and be more forthcoming with sharing information, such as saying, "I'm going on a date with x," rather than [just] saying he is "going to spend time with a friend."

I also asked him to tell me how many other people he is sleeping with, saying that I felt that was a fair request for me to make, because it's good information to have, especially with regards to safety.

He sleeps with Jess (his "ex," who has been practicing poly longer than he has), as well as with some friends that he hooks up with just for sex. [He said] that the romantic connections he has are just with me and Jess, but that he views our relationship as "basically a primary one."

I told him that I consider our relationship to be primary. I [admitted] that my struggles with actually scheduling dates/hook ups with other people come from my slight discomfort of this being a new situation for me. [I said] I will gain a lot of comfort and security with sharing information.

I told him that I've been acting on the assumption that he sleeps with Jess and other people, but my anxiety has been stemming from that not really being stated as fact. He understands that, and also understands the sort of heaviness I've been feeling and struggling to process, because he felt that too, when he first started practicing poly.

I feel so vulnerable in stating my needs, but I suppose that's more of a general relationship roadblock that I need to work and grow through. I was trembling with anxiety before I started talking out loud. I spent more than five minutes giving myself a pep talk in my head. "You can do this yogiskeleton, just say, 'Can I ask your advice about something?' 'I need help with something I'm struggling with.' "

We're going to keep talking about it all.

For those of you that also struggle with anxiety issues, are there any key sort of phrases that you use to help open up a conversation when you have things to need to talk about?
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So you've been dating this guy for 9 months and weren't sure whether he was having sex with his so-called ex, but you suspected it. You also knew he was fucking others "casually," but you don't know their names or how often he has sex sessions with them.

It seems that, despite thinking you and he have open and raw conversations, it's more about you sharing information about yourself, and maybe him sharing information about his early life, and maybe about his tastes in music or hobbies or whatever?

But he's not been open about his current sex life with others. At all. So you've been occasionally having unprotected sex with him without knowing for 100% sure if he's using condoms with any number of other people. You don't know names other than Jess, and you weren't even sure whether they were having sex or not. You don't know his other fuckbuddies' names, or the frequency of him seeing these people.

Yet, you both declared "love" back in October.

I understand your anxiety has been holding you back. But how can love and "polyamory" exist if you don't know how he conducts relationships?

So far, this has not been "polyamory," since you didn't have all the necessary information to consent to his shenanigans.
 
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Mags,

In your opinion can John and I move through this? Maybe he didn't see it as "cheating"?
I do love him, but I feel blindsided.
Just over 5 hours to go until I'll be seeing him. I'm no longer sure what I'm going to say.
 
yogiskeleton said:
Mags,
In your opinion, can John and I move through this? Maybe he didn't see it as "cheating"? I do love him, but I feel blindsided. Just over 5 hours to go until I'll be seeing him. I'm no longer sure what I'm going to say.
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Honey, I have no idea. It sounds like the jury is still out on whether you're truly compatible with this guy you are infatuated with. I think declaring love made you rethink, "Who really is this guy I feel good feelings about? I also have areas around him that feel dark and heavy. Is it just me, or is something sketchy going on?"

Something sketchy was going on! You can trust your gut. It's not just you and generalized anxiety and spiraling thoughts and catastrophizing. He really was withholding important information.

But you let it go on, riding on your soft feelings, your NRE. Now you're finally addressing some deep issues, and are facing a rift. It might be possible to cross it, it may not. Time will tell. Actions need to be addressed. Boundaries asserted. Promises made, and promises kept, and verified.

They say the first year of a relationship is "forming." The second year is "storming." The third year is "norming."

So, you're entering the 2nd phase. Keep speaking your truth. Your confidence will grow as you practice speaking out. Even if the relationship doesn't work out because he keeps lying, or he IS a narc, or things are too complicated with Jess, etc., etc., at least you will have learned and grown for the next dating prospects.
 
It was hard, but our talk went extremely well last night.

I put it all out there. My feelings of jealousy, insecurity, and pain. How I felt betrayed by the information he withheld. The discomfort I've been feeling. The things I need moving forward to keep this working as well as it has felt it has been. I cried freely and softly as I let it all out. I made an effort to be clear and non-defensive.

He admitted to the unprotected sex with Jess, saying it has only happened a few times and that it was wrong and unfair even though he has talked with her openly about sexual health, and I let him have it with how unfair it was that he didn't have that conversation with Me. He also said that while he doesn't remember when they started sleeping together again that when he said he wasn't sleeping with anyone else that was true. He understands that by not telling me about it when it happened that he took away my ability to feel secure and set boundaries when it began.

Things didn't work out well with Jess due to what he was comfortable with at the time and how much she had wanted to share with him and know and how it didn't match. He apologized for generally bringing up that experience because he doesn't want it to seem like he is consistently comparing or trying to make it the same. He is looking at our relationship with fresh eyes and genuinely wants it to be different. This is also one of the healthiest relationships he has experienced.

We talked about how we feel about being each other's primary, the security he feels with it being like home, and the strength he feels with our connection. We also talked about guidelines and what we each want to know and what will make us feel comfortable and secure, and how we want to grow together. I let him know that his relationships with others does not bother me, cause me pain, or turn me off and make me want to run. I just don't want to be left in the dark to make assumptions and have fears about it all. He promised to work on keeping out communication open and healthy.

He felt terrible, as he should. He hurt me. He thought I was going to break up with him last night. That wasn't my intention at all, but I was going to take some space to evaluate it all if he responded poorly, and maybe that would have been the outcome. He told me that he doesnt want to screw this up and how he was fearful that he had. Promises were made on both our parts. I'm feeling a lot more secure with John now. Of course I will continue to be cautious.

Thank you all sincerely for your inputs.
 
You did a great job! I'm glad to hear about how it went.

One more thing that should happen is to get tested for STDs, both of you. Maybe you could go to a clinic together. This is serious business.

And plan to use condoms always, with John. You can request he always use condoms, with Jess and his fuckbuddies too, but it's his choice on what to do with his body. Boundaries are personal choices, not imposing rules on others.

It's a personal choice on what to do about oral sex. The risk of getting an infection in the throat is very low, and there are definite signs of infection if you do get one. You can read up on that.

I hope John continues to be more and more transparent with you. It sounds like Jess struggled a lot with his polyamory, having jealousy and throwing fits. So he "broke up with her" to pursue his freedom to date. Now their agreement has changed and he is seeing others. (And so is she?) But he assumed you'd also lack compersion and so kept you in the dark. I'm glad now it's all out in the open, as far as it's possible to know. Keep your radar active.
 
Thank you.

We are both going to get tested but I'm not sure if our schedules will allow us to go together. I did request that he used protection with her and he agreed that is the best choice for everyone.

It was actually John that struggled with jealousy issues. Sorry for not making that clear. Jess is in other relationships as well now. He said that with regards to not telling me, it was because he was still kind of operating on how things were with Jess which was that he felt "strange" sharing things because sh kept pressing him hard for details when he wasn't ready.
 
yogiskeleton said:
Thank you.

We are both going to get tested but I'm not sure if our schedules will allow us to go together. I did request that he used protection with her and he agreed that is the best choice for everyone.

It was actually John that struggled with jealousy issues. Sorry for not making that clear. Jess is in other relationships as well now. He said that with regards to not telling me, it was because he was still kind of operating on how things were with Jess which was that he felt "strange" sharing things because she kept pressing him hard for details when he wasn't ready.
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OK. "Sharing things:" sharing something like, "I am going to see X tonight from 8-11:00. We may go out, we may Netflix and chill," is a good bare minimum to share.

Oversharing is quite another topic. No one should be pressuring anyone to share sexual details, other than, "We used condoms, practiced safer sex." No one should be asking prying questions about their metamour's personal intimate emotional life either. Every new partner should be asked about how much they are comfortable having shared with other partners or friends.

Pressing a partner hard for details about their dates with others shows insecurity. There are better ways to reassure one's partner without disclosing intimate details about one's other partners.
 
Absolutely agreed. What we plan on sharing are things like "Jess is coming out on Saturday and will be spending the night." Its actually info I just got. Also sharing things like "hey I've been talking to this cool person and we will be going on a date." Little things to ease minds like that. Neither of us want the dirty details, just to know that the other is being safe, that the person they are dating/with is caring and kind, and that they are happy and feeling fulfilled. So yes, bare minimum to ease anxiety, especially on my part since that is a general struggle. He told me Jess would want to share everything, have him meet the other people after just meeting them, wanted him to share all the details too. They were living together for a little while and he said that after a while it mostly just felt like they were roommates and he would be glad when she would go on her many dates so he could be alone and not be pressured by anything.

His love for us is different, and I really appreciate that he shares that with me. All love is special and unique, at least that's what I think. No two loves or relationships or people are the same and that's what makes this journey wonderful.
 
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Sounds like you and John are getting things worked out; that is good to hear.
 
Thank you. I'm very happy that the conversation went as it did. It felt good to be listened to, have him really take in what I was saying, and respond with honesty both with regards to the facts of what's outside of us and with what is in his heart. Of course I plan on being cautious, with continuing to make sure we are checking in with each other to ensure our happiness together and how we are doing.
 
I'm glad it had a happy ending. Here's hoping subsequent episodes in the series follow suit.:D
 
yogiskeleton said:
Hi all!

I'm 31F and fairly new to polyamory and have been finding that my situation is somewhat unique as a newbie than others due to the fact that my boyfriend and I entered in to our relationship together as two relatively single people who have polyamorous intentions. I say this is unique because the types of posts that I've seen here and around the internet regarding those who are new to poly seem to be from people who have been in monogamous relationships and have come together to explore new ways of love and relationships. Maybe I'm just not looking hard enough, but I'm having trouble finding others with my same perspective.

When John and I started dating in March we started off with a very strong connection however agreeing that we wanted to keep things casual as neither of us wanted to feel "trapped" in a monogamous relationship which was something we both had experienced in the past. We have had a lot of great conversations about how we look at life that have helped us to grow closer together as we both keep learning about how similar we are and how well we really mesh together on many different levels. It's been a wonderful 8.5 months.

In early October we sat down and had another conversation about us and shared that we love each other and had a beautiful night together. Polyamory was briefly mentioned but not exactly expanded on. A few days later I brought it up and we talked a little bit but we haven't really talked much about it since.

We have great, open, and healthy communication and I'm well aware that above anyone else in the world he is the most important person for me to be talking to about my feelings about everything, but I'm human and my anxiety makes it hard sometimes.

He's told me that he loves two people, me and his ex with whom he is still incredibly close with. To be fully transparent I don't actually know the full "extent" of their relationship at this moment. I did ask him during that second time bringing up poly if he would be willing to have our relationship be one where we share a little bit of information about people we are involved with outside of us, and he seemed really hesitant. I haven't brought it up again. I know that I should because it's been bothering me over the past few weeks. It's also important to note that he does talk to other girls and has gone on dates, but I know literally nothing about those events.

To go back to the beginning of this post, I'm struggling to find resources and help and advice on how to navigate my relationship with him and how to focus my life and work through my emotions. I'm finding it so complicated to try and describe coherently which is why I have been struggling with talking to him about it. Sometimes the closest way I can describe what I'm feeling is an insecurity or jealousy but it doesn't really make sense in my head because I shouldn't feel those ways because I'm also on dating sites and talk to men and women and have been getting myself to the point where I am setting up dates with others.

There just seems to be so much information and assistance for people who have transitioned from monogamous relationships to poly in some form or another but nothing for someone like me. I keep reading things about people who were first established as a couple that expanded into a V or a triad, etc. I've read things about people who become a third in a couple. I've read accounts of people who are solo-poly who don't want any defined sort of relationship. I keep finding myself feeling uncomfortable and it is absolutely not because I'm trying to do something that I don't actually want to do. It's more that I just don't know what I'm doing.

Thank you for reading.

yogiskeleton
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Hi,
what kind of yogi or yogini you are ? I am also a yogi... a Tantra practice yogi...
 
Hi Yogiskeleton,

Just noticed this thread, and wanted to say that I also began my poly journey in a similar way (being single and wanting to be poly) and found it frustrating that there was so much info on opening monogamous relationships, but nothing on just being poly to start with. When I first joined this forum (in 2010!) I felt very lost and alone.

I think you're doing fine! I'm not seeing red flags here. I think John's lack of honesty about his relationship with Jess wasn't malicious or deliberately deceitful. I think he was struggling with how to define his relationship with Jess and how to communicate about it to you. Plus, his relationship with you was new and maybe still in the sort-of-casual phase. He needs to do better in the future, but it's forgivable (in my opinion).

Poly resources emphasize communication a lot, but in my opinion, most resources don't consider what it's truly like to begin a relationship by being "single and dating around." Most poly resources are aimed at people who are already in a long-term mono relationship, have strong intimacy and communication with their partner already, and just have to learn how to transition that into multiple relationships.

It's totally different when you're single & dating! Especially if you start a relationship very casually and later realize you're falling in love (and you didn't plan on it, as happened with me and my partner of 8 years!). Intimacy and honesty develops slowly.

I came to poly because I was having a blast being single and dating around in my mid-twenties (after a very unhappy young adulthood). I felt like I'd found myself, didn't want to be monogamous, and was enjoying casual dating. At first I thought I had to avoid falling in love so that I could keep having casual partners, but I was getting frustrated with the lack of emotional closeness and long-term potential in casual encounters. I didn't want to get trapped in a monogamous relationship...but when I read about polyamory, it seemed very focused on people having essentially two spouses, or opening up a marriage and getting another very serious partner. That seemed totally irrelevant to my life at the time.

When I met my partner 8 years ago, we were both very happy being single and were on the same page for not wanting to be monogamous. We started out quite casually, and slowly transitioned to love and "seriousness." (I am solo poly, which just means I want live separately from any partners; I consider Elijah my life partner and he is very involved in my life). We allowed each other space to figure all that out without any strict rules.

So, for your situation: the big thing, I find, about coming to poly from "single and dating" is that you learn to communicate with your partner slowly. Total honesty and intimacy doesn't need to happen right away. When people are single and casual, they tend to try to be discreet about they other partners. This definitely can come across as vague and evasive! (It can even be deliberately deceitful, too). It's not sustainable long-term to be vague about who else you are seeing, but it is a normal impulse if you are casual dating as a single person. It's not immediately clear what you are supposed to share!

When I first met Elijah, the main thing he and I did for each other was respect each other's privacy and autonomy. (Well, that and use condoms 100% of the time. As you would do when single vs. in a relationship, maybe). We didn't immediately share much about other people we were seeing. Over time, we became friends, then deeply emotionally intimate friends (before we fell "in love"). We started talking about our other relationships in the context of our friendship and wanting advice from each other as friends. It naturally evolved as we communicated more frequently and settled into a more "defined" relationship.

In your case, I think it would help if you started thinking of Jess as your metamour, as John's other partner. I think he can be forgiven for not describing her as his partner right away--he was trying to figure that out himself. She was his ex that he was still kinda involved with in an unclear way. Okay. Single people are allowed to have that kind of undefined thing!

He's in a relationship with you now, and he wants to be poly, so he has to do better about being clear with you about what his relationship with Jess is like. At least, he can't be vague about whether she's his sex partner. But, this is doable.

Since Jess is poly herself, I think this will be fine. I think you'll be able to learn to do poly with John. It will be okay!
 
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