How do I have this conversation?

S

Sandy2u

New member
So far, our triad has worked amazingly well. I have never felt happier or safer in my life. There has been very little jealousy and lots of compersion. We are all happy.

My female partner started off with several boundaries for her husband and me. She quickly dropped all but one. He and I are not allowed to have actual intercourse. She has said from the beginning that this will change eventually; she just isn't there yet.

He and I are having our first romantic weekend away next week, and I worry that we might go there. I don't want to break her trust, but I don't want to deny what I feel for him. So clearly we need to renegotiate this boundary. Well, not renegotiate it. Drop it all together.

I don't even know how to broach the conversation. Do we all have it together? Do they have it? Do she and I have it? This is hard, because they have only ever had intercourse with each other. This seems unfathomable to me, but it was a big thing to them.

I feel like I am in high school again, and am doing the technical virgin thing. We do absolutely everything else. Our beds and sleeping situation are all very fluid. We function wonderfully, except for this.

Maybe I should just let it be for a while longer? It's only been a couple of months.
 
I think this is a conversation you need to have before you and he go way for the weekend, otherwise you may find yourself in very difficult circumstances. Breaking her trust on this break will set back the relationship by many months.

Perhaps it would be best if you sat down to discuss it, as three individuals. Ask your female partner how she is feeling about it, what her thoughts are behind the "no intercourse" rule.

Also, ask your male partner for his thoughts on it. Is he going along with the ban because she wants it? Is it something he also wants?

If she says she would like that rule to continue, ask her to set a time limit for when it can be reviewed. Ask what she would like to help her feel more comfortable in dropping this rule.
 
I was that woman for a while. It was a very hard decision to let them have sex without me. But I did. And it was hard. Lots of panic attacks. I found out that the only way I was ever going to be okay with it was to let them do it.

That doesn't help you, but I just wanted to share that. I think you should have a conversation between all three of you before you go away. If you have the mentality "It's better to ask forgiveness than permission," in these cases, you could royally mess up everything.

Good luck!
 
I agree with Orangesmartie. Have a talk amongst the three of you, to avoid triangulation. Say it just like you did there (or print the post), that you have honored this boundary, but want to renegotiate to lower the boundary in time, because it no longer fits, and the relationship is deepening. You do not want to break it and cheat, but you need to make people aware your needs are changing.
 
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Why did you go along with that foolishness? She is dictating how you can be in a relationship with this man. She may be his wife, but she's not his owner, nor yours. The only person who should have a say about what you do with your body is YOU.
 
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I went along with it because she is my best friend and we are new at this. None of us even knew the term polyamory. We just fell in love. It wasn't until we started reading and researching that we realized those sorts of boundaries didn't have to exist, and they don't necessarily help their relationship, and they sure as heck don't help mine.

He attempted to have the conversation without me, and it didn't go well, apparently. He and I just had a conversation about whether we were a triad or a V, because they shouldn't be having conversations about my sex life with no input from me. The three of us are going to sit down once the babies go to sleep tonight. I am fine waiting for her to get more comfortable, but I am not okay feeling secondary and less than. I don't get to dictate their sex life, and they shouldn't get to dictate mine. Again, I can wait, but I want to know if I am waiting three months or three years.
 
You have a say here. Tell them what your requirements are. Put a time limit on how long you're willing to work through this before you choose to walk away. The way things are going at the moment, you are not being treated as a full, living, breathing human being with real feelings. Her feelings do not trump yours, unless you let them. You teach people how to treat you by what you will accept.
 
So we talked, and it went fairly well. She understands how I feel, even my concerns about feeling second best when that is not the relationship we signed up for. She gets how inherently unfair it is and feels a lot of guilt about it. That said, she isn't ready, and I don't want to push her, so I set a date to revisit it in a few months.
 
Wow, a few months is quite generous on your part. Very, very generous! I could not allow a third party to manage a relationship of mine for any length of time. She says she feels guilty but is imposing her fear-based restrictions on you anyway. IMHO, she should only be responsible for her relationship with her husband, and for her relationship with you - but she is interfering with her husband's relationship with you and that is rather domineering. It sounds like she sees marriage as ownership -- rather than full partnership -- and because of that belief, is simply not ready for the realities of what having an open marriage entails.

Personally, getting involved with someone whose spouse is not completely on board and respectful of everyone's autonomy is something I would back away from, no matter how much I wanted to be with the guy. Reasonable time management/scheduling issues are the only restrictions I would allow. No one who isn't part of my relationship has any right to dictate what I can feel, say, or physically do with any partner of mine.
 
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Where are his needs and feelings in all of this? Why are his wife and his girlfriend making agreements about what he does with his penis, with him as an idle bystander?

She's free to make requests of him. He's free to agree or disagree to those requests. If he agrees, then respecting his autonomy entails accepting agreements he makes with other people.

It's understandable that he would agree to delay sexual intercourse until his wife is comfortable with it. I don't blame him for wanting to wait until there won't be a huge fallout from having sex outside his marriage. We're free to make choices; we're not free from the consequences of our choices. You don't need penis-in-vagina sex to have a good time, so why would he risk the happiness of his marriage over something that will be just as much fun in a few months?
 
Very well balanced, Schrodingers.

I'm wondering how the wife is going to get over the compunction at all. "Needing time" is pretty amorphous. Yes, time heals most wounds, but aren't there concrete steps like discussions or counseling that would actively move her acceptance forward?

On one hand, putting off sex for a few months seems innocuous when balanced against the health of a long-standing marriage. On the other hand, that seems very, VERY monogamous to impose. Why is it valid for the husband to shelve his love for someone at all, as long as he's been open and honest about things?

Hell, there are some on here that would say it's none of the wife's business if they've agreed to be poly.

It's not hard to imagine having an amazing romantic getaway with someone and have it be agonizing to force yourself to stop right at the most inopportune time. Sure, we're all rational adults. We stop ourselves from our carnal desires every day. But what is going to mystically happen to make the wife "ok" with things?

I can see both sides of this issue.
 
Sandy2u said:
So far our triad has worked amazingly well. I have never felt happier or safer in my life. There had been very little jealousy and lots of compersion, we are all happy. My female partner started off with several boundaries for her husband and I, and quickly dropped all but one. He and I are not allowed to have actual intercourse. She has said from the beginning that this will change eventually, she just isn't there yet. He and I are having our first romantic weekend away next week, and I worry that we might go there. I don't want to break her trust, and I don't want to deny what I feel for him. So clearly we need to renegotiate this boundary. Well not renegotiate it- drop it all together.

I don't even know how to broach the conversation. Do we all have it together, do they have it, do her and I have it?? This is hard because they have only ever had intercourse with each other. This seems unfathomable to me, but it was a big thing to them. I feel like I am in high school again and am doing the technical virgin thing. We do absolutely everything else, our beds and sleeping situation are all very fluid and we function wonderfully except for this. Maybe I should just let it be for awhile longer. It's only been a couple of months.
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At first she made him wear condoms because she didn't want us pregnant and for some reason they never get each other pregnant. That was a couple years ago and now since my GF has become more confident with herself, she has let him not use a condom (which is awesome) and all three of us are prepared to have a baby if that happens. Such a good relationship we all have I am so glad I am not just with a man.
 
So we talked, and it went fairly well. She understands how I feel, even my concerns about feeling second best when that is not the relationship we signed up for. She gets how inherently unfair it is and feels a lot of guilt about it. That said, she isn't ready and I don't want to push her so I set a date to revisit it in a few months.
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Where is hinge's voice in this? What IS the open model relationship you all signed up to practice? Are all the players on the same page with that? Understand the "how we agree to be together in this relationship?" Or are those agreements still in development? Sounds like the boundaries around sex share are. Maybe some of these helps articulate those activities/boundaries:

http://openingup.net/resources/free-downloads-from-opening-up/

That's good that you all want to work it out and set terms you all can live with in the meanwhile. Hopefully hinge's voice is in accord.

Hopefully when the check in date rolls around, all of you can move it along further.

Galagirl
 
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And it's gone. This led to a huge crisis of faith for her, wondering if this is what she even wanted at all or if she was only doing it to make us happy. After soul searching and meeting with our fantastic counselor she decided that it is and she can let go of that. Her fears weren't actually related to sex at all, sex being such a huge thing for her was just symbolic of the bigger fears. So once she worked through them the rest fell into place quickly.
 
Galagirl- thank you so much for those links. I wish we'd had them when we started this but they will still be a good way to open dialogue.
 
Just wanted to say I was in the exact same situation when myself and my partner became involved, and his long term gf did not want us having intercourse. It was hard, and I resented her at first. However, I found that once I stopped seeing her as a threat and someone to be angry at, but instead started talked to her and trying to understand her side of things that everything started running smoother. Once we started talking about how the relationship effects both of us she stopped feeling so threatened and started to be able to trust me. Things are much better now, and there are no rules on his and my relationship, but I also make sure if anything new were to happen that she knows about it so she isn't shocked if it does come up later.
 
Good point. Empathy always goes a lot further than competition.
 
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