I don't agree with/like the woman my husband wants to date

[Raccoon]

Okay, my husband dropped that he wanted to be poly on me, but after he already decided who he wanted to start dating. We are swingers and she is a half of a couple that we were swingers with. Going in to swinging he made it clear that he didn't want any romantic relationships and no one-on-one dating. I have been struggling for months to decide if I could live with him dating other people. The fact that she is already in the picture and the one he wants to do this with has really complicated things for me. In fact it has made things much worse and I have been seriously struggling with my marriage over it.
Anyway, this would make poly relationships new for my husband and for her as well. Her husband became open to the idea and now has a woman he dates. I have been very frustrated with both of them over the whole thing. They have claimed to remain just platonic friends this whole time until I am ready. The problem is they've always made it "when" and not "if" I am ready. I don't know if I'll ever be ready or want my husband to be in that type of relationship.
I asked her if she would still want to date my husband even if she knew I wasn't okay with it. She said yes. She also said that she can't and doesn't have to justify who she is in love with. My husband has stated that he can't date her until I am on board. He does continue to have phone conversations with her everyday and they text a lot or communicate frequently through other forms of social media. I'm just bothered by the fact that she doesn't seem to have any regard for me. She seems like a very selfish person. I feel that her conduct has been very immature. My husband defends her actions at every turn. I understand caring about your own needs, but it doesn't seem like you should have to step all over someone else to get what you want.
My husband has agreed to take a 2 month break from her with no contact. I just hope that this can be a time for me to breathe. I have felt so much pressure to agree to their relationship. I just wish that he would have gone in to this whole idea from a better place.
Any advice?

 

[GalaGirl]

I'm sorry you struggle.

I have been very frustrated with both of them over the whole thing. They have claimed to remain just platonic friends this whole time until I am ready. The problem is they've always made it "when" and not "if" I am ready. I don't know if I'll ever be ready or want my husband to be in that type of relationship.

Focus more on that part. Where YOU stand.

If you just don't want this type of relationship? SAY SO rather than agonize and drag it out.

I asked her if she would still want to date my husband even if she knew I wasn't okay with it. She said yes. She also said that she can't and doesn't have to justify who she is in love with.

Well, she's honest, I guess. She still wants to date him even if it means you and him break up first. Not sure what the point is in asking her though. Presumably just because she wants stuff doesn't mean husband is gonna do it. He is in charge of his own choices.

I mean, I can want your hubby to give me a million bucks. Alright. I'm here wanting. That doesn't mean he's just gonna give it to me, right?

Detach yourself from this woman and whatever it is she is doing. And focus on what YOU want to be doing and if you are up for this or not.

My husband has stated that he can't date her until I am on board. He does continue to have phone conversations with her everyday and they text a lot or communicate frequently through other forms of social media.

Well, what was their swinging relationship like? Did they usually chat every day/text a lot then?

Or is this a change in behavior like he's jumping the gun and courting her already?

I'm just bothered by the fact that she doesn't seem to have any regard for me. She seems like a very selfish person. I feel that her conduct has been very immature. My husband defends her actions at every turn. I understand caring about your own needs, but it doesn't seem like you should have to step all over someone else to get what you want.

If you decide to open the marriage to poly?

You cannot pick who your husband picks to date. Who he dates is HIS choice.

You get to see how he handles himself. Then decide whether or not you can deal with that and if you still want to keep picking HIM out to be with. Who YOU hang around with is YOUR choice.

If those things line up? You and him still want to hang around each other? Then you can be together. If one wants and one doesn't? It's not happening.

If he goes around picking selfish people who don't have any regard for others? Not like a mistake from inexperience, but he chronically picks out really off putting people? That may change your own opinion of him over time. It may cause you to bow out. Because you don't want to be around him any more if he's choosing that kind of company.

Maybe hard to think about, but there it is.

I have been struggling for months to decide if I could live with him dating other people.

My husband has agreed to take a 2 month break from her with no contact. I just hope that this can be a time for me to breathe. I have felt so much pressure to agree to their relationship. I just wish that he would have gone in to this whole idea from a better place.
Any advice?

Who is pressuring you? Him? Her? Yourself?

Sounds like it has been months already. Doesn't sound great to you. Maybe you are a person who wants marriage and swinging, and that's it. No poly. If you are not up for poly at ALL? Say so.

If you are up for it, just not with THIS woman? And/or THESE behaviors from husband? Just say so.

Be clear in communicating where YOU stand and let the chips fall where they may.

Could say "No, thanks. I am not good with it like this. I don't like being pressured to consent. I really dislike her. I need to be away from all that. I cannot stop you from dating her, but I don't want to be in your poly network if you do. So if you choose to pursue, I prefer to bow out first so you are free TO poly date her and I can be free FROM being around poly stuff I do not want."

Let it be HIS choice rather than you being some sort of "gatekeeper" to their relationship starting or not starting.

Galagirl

 

[Raccoon]

You are so right, I need to focus on where I stand.

She said that she would still want to date him even if I wasn't okay with it, but with the two of us still being married, not us broken up. He said he didn't want to try if I wasn't okay with it.

The swinging relationship was much more casual at first. The chatting has become more and more frequent. It does feel as if they are courting already.

They both have been pressuring me. I suppose I have also been doing that to myself.

This is all amazing advice! I do need to stand up for what I want to. Thank you!

 

[kdt26417]

Hi Raccoon,

This sounds like a continuation of your first thread, Is my husband really poly? If it is, then your husband is Dave, the woman he wants to date is Betty, and her husband is Jim. Let me know if I have misread that. Anyway, it seems to me that Dave would act, even feel, better if Betty wasn't around. Betty is a super negative influence on him. The worst warning bell, for me, was when Betty said she would still want to date Dave even if she knew you weren't okay with it. That is not poly. Poly is done with the knowledge and consent of all the participants. Always. By definition. At least Dave is adhering to that part of the definition, but it seems that Betty has convinced him to pressure you into consenting. And she is pressuring you too, in fact you are even pressuring yourself. And honestly, consent under pressure is not really consent, so that part is not poly either.

I think my advice would be to tell Dave, "I might be able to consent to you being poly ... maybe. But not with Betty. Definitely not with Betty. I don't trust her." Honestly, poly is already hard for you to accept, and he wants you to accept Betty as well? That's asking too much of you. You can keep trying to accept her, of course, but it doesn't sound like you'll be able to do it. Why not rip the band-aid off now, and get it over with? You want to support your husband, I get that, I really do. I just think that asking you to accept poly and Betty all in the same package, is asking the impossible of you. You can keep trying for awhile, of course, but I think at some point you'll realize this is a limitation for you. And there is nothing wrong with having that limitation, especially when Betty has acted so selfish and immature. Heck, you may not be compatible with poly at all, but at least with Betty out the picture you could have more clarity about that.

Sympathetically,
Kevin T.

 

[GalaGirl]

Glad it helped you some.

Deal with your own stuff. Not other people's. My suggestions don't really change much from your old thread.

You have to keep YOUR personal boundaries. Nobody else is gonna keep them for you.

She said that she would still want to date him even if I wasn't okay with it, but with the two of us still being married, not us broken up. He said he didn't want to try if I wasn't okay with it.

I find that weird. To me that is a conversation between (her and him.) How do you even know this was said? Who is bringing their stuff into your lap?

If BETTY is now pestering you to consent so she can get access to Dave / get her way? Then you can tell Betty "No, thank you. Not into it. Suicide healing is priority one." And let her deal with her disappointment.

If she keeps ON pestering you? You don't have to keep explaining your stance to her. You can just cut off all access she has to you -- email, phone, FB, whatever. You stop swinging with that couple. Cuz she's turning into a weirdo.

You tell Dave you want no part of her. If he brings you more Betty stuff? You say "No. I do not talk about Betty. I am not friends with her. You can talk to your therapist about your Betty problems." And you hold the line and YOU respect your personal boundaries.

Because it's a pretty tall order as it is from your old post here.

• Dave had a cheating affair with X. You found out, you and Dave tried to make repairs.
• Dave started out with swinging agreements with you. It went ok.
  • Eventually you guys met Betty and Jim and these 4 made swinging agreements together.
  • Dave and Betty then cheated on the swinging agreements between Dave, You, Betty, Jim.
• Dave then tried to kill himself.
  • His therapist wanted him to do his suicide healing stuff and not work right now.
  • You have to support you and Dave financially because his disability was denied.
• Betty and Dave want to do poly now when he's in the middle of doing suicide therapy care.
  • Jim is ok with it. He's moved on to poly dating a woman.
  • You are not ok with it.
    • You haven't had time/space enough to deal with Betty and Dave cheating on swinging agreements
    • You haven't had time and space enough to deal with all the suicide stuff going down.
    • Betty, Dave, or both of them are now pressuring you to consent to polyamory. You haven't had time and space enough to process that either.
• Dave and Betty ALSO want to fluid bond.
  • Jim is not ok with that.
  • You are not ok with that.
• Dave doesn't want to use condoms any more. Betty says she always wanted a baby.
  • Betty is/is not taking BCP responsibly at this time.
  • Jim knows/does not know that Betty wants a baby. He is/is not willing to consider reversing his vasectomy. He is/is not ok with Betty having a baby by Dave.
  • Dave is/is not planning a vasectomy. He does/does not want a kid by Betty. This is/is not the best time to be TTC when one of the potential Dads (Dave) is under suicide care (??)
  • You do/do not want to have a family in this way. You do/do not to be paying to support a baby of Dave's by Betty since you support Dave right now (??)

I don't know where your personal limit lies, but this would be WAY too much stuff at one time for me.

If it is BETTY pestering you to agree to poly? That's easy to answer. You say "No, thanks. Suicide healing is priority one." Then disconnect all facebook, email, phone, stop swinging with them, and tell Dave not to bug you with his Betty problems. She's his pal. Not yours. And he has a therapist to talk about his problems. Disconnect. Any babies are deal breakers to you.

You can also call the therapist if you are next of kin. I know, cuz I've had to do it for my Alzheimer dad. I cannot have info about what he and the therapist talk about. That is private patient stuff. But as next of kin I CAN give the therapist background information so they have the full picture. Like if dad is taking his meds or not at home, how he is behaving, if he's had a recent UTI making him extra irritable, thing happened in the family to upset him like a death, etc. The therapist knows full well my dad will LIE and will sometimes paints a rosy picture that is not always true.

I don't know what your "next of kin" patient arrangements are in your particular situation if your husband is on suicide care, but maybe you want to look into that. Does the therapist REALLY know what's going on with Betty?

If DAVE is the one pestering you to consent to poly? So he can then move on to date Betty with a clear conscience? Well, Dave cajoling/pressuring/pestering you into giving consent is not really you giving consent from free will, is it? How "clear conscience" is that really if he's being a bully to get HIS way?

Dave can make a request. You can consider it. Then you give your honest answer. If you say "No poly at this time. Suicide healing is priority one. We have enough going on" and it isn't the answer he hoped for?

He gets to make a choice like an adult.

• He chooses to keep seeing you.
• Or chooses to see Betty instead.

No drama required. He keeps bringing the drama to your lap? YOU get a choice.

• You can keep on with the drama.
• Or you can STOP participating in it and bow out in order to uphold your own personal boundaries and your desire to be more drama free.

If it needs to be that you and Dave separate because you are tired? If this is all TOO MUCH for you? Be ok with hitting your OWN personal limit.

You don't have to BREAK you for other people.

You can choose to bow out.

Heck, you may not be compatible with poly at all, but at least with Betty out the picture you could have more clarity about that.

Or it could go the other way. Who knows? You might discover you are totally fine doing poly with another group of people who DO NOT behave like this.

So I encourage you to detach from all this "other people noise" and do your OWN soul searching. Listen to YOUR inner voice. You decide what YOU want from your life. What YOU are and are not up for at this time.

Then state it clearly to Dave and Betty. And let the chips fall where they may. Up to and including you deciding to just get off the bus.

Just because people invite you to go along with them to Chaos Town doesn't mean you HAVE to accept the ride and go along with them. You can decide to pull the cord and get off the bus.

Galagirl

 

[Raccoon]

Thank you all so much for your great advice.

In regards to her wanting a baby, there was never at any point that they were planning on having a baby together. My husband isn't interested in that at all. I just wanted to clear up any confusion there.

It's really nice to hear from such positive and uplifting people. If I were to really give poly a try that's the kind of people I would want around me for the experience. I think things could go much better for my husband and I if we surrounded ourselves with people just like that. I may come to the conclusion that poly isn't for me, but to be surrounded by people like you on that journey to discovery would be such a refreshing change. Thank you again for your words of encouragement, they have really lifted my spirits.

 

[GalaGirl]

Glad it helps some to lift your spirits.

You almost sound like you are losing yourself in all this "noise."

In regards to her wanting a baby, there was never at any point that they were planning on having a baby together. My husband isn't interested in that at all. I just wanted to clear up any confusion there.

I'm not confused.

To me it just sounds like another load of weird to an already really weird situation.

If your husband doesn't want more children? And he doesn't want to wear condoms with Betty? Schedule his vasectomy then. Be responsible. And stop bugging you about it all. You have enough going on without also having to mind where he puts his sperm. C'mon! Sheesh.

If your husband overloads you with Betty stuff when he has a therapist right there? I think you have to say NO to listening to any more Betty stuff. You cannot be like his "free therapist" on the side. You have your OWN problems in this situation to attend to.

It's really nice to hear from such positive and uplifting people. If I were to really give poly a try that's the kind of people I would want around me for the experience. I think things could go much better for my husband and I if we surrounded ourselves with people just like that.

So why aren't you surrounding yourself with better company? What kind of people are you hanging around with?

Do you need to reassess your personal standards for the company you keep? Raise the bar? Stop hanging around people who are meh? Start making more time with people whose company you DO enjoy?

I may come to the conclusion that poly isn't for me, but to be surrounded by people like you on that journey to discovery would be such a refreshing change.

Whether poly is for you or not in the end?

Consider raising the bar and being more picky about the company you keep if your current company is dragging you down.

You can make your OWN refreshing changes.

Galagirl

 

[vinsanity0]

I think you need to see things from a better perspective. Hopefully this will help.you sort out your thoughts.

Her saying she would still want to date him is not selfish. It's honest. She can't help her feelings. That doesn't mean she would act on them. He is not interested unless you approve.

What happened is natural. Being sexually intimate with someone on a regular basis is most likely going to cause feelings. Don't look at it as something done behind your back.

What is it you don't like about the thought of being poly? You're fine with him having sex, but not a relationship. What are a it about a relationship that scares you?