Judge me, please

Sine

New member
Hey guys. Could you give me your raw honest impressions about these two people and their relationship? Sorry is a really long. But any help would be much appreciated. Thanks!

Context: A and B are in the middle of sexting and masturbating...

A: Honey, do you remember the day before I traveled for my vacation?

B: I do.

A: It was an unreal day, because I had to do so much regarding my work papers, getting my backpack ready and university stuff.

B: Yes...

A: I really forgot to tell you that I had sex with C that day. Sorry I'm telling you so late. I hope you understand. That day I had time for nothing and I didn't remember until today. Better to tell you late than never. Hehehe

B: mmm
That's fine
Thanks for telling me.

A: Yes, but that day was so unreal.

B: I kinda suspected it already, I know you don't think so, but you behave a little different when you have sex with other people.

A: I was so tense that day and at the end, I needed to relax.

B: When you called me that day I could see that. Was it good?

A: It was good. I think anything that would make me cum that day would have been good.

B: How many times did you have sex?

A: Just one, because it was in the middle of me packing my clothes. I didn't have time for more.

B: Tell me about the best moment of it.

A: We had anal.

B: Did you cum then?

A: Actually, we had a double penetration with a dildo, I think that helped C with anal.

B: Had you ever done that with C before?

A: No, it never happened before.

B: And how was it that you came to do double penetration that day?

A: I think because I was going on my vacation, it felt like doing something different.

B: Who proposed the idea?

A: It was kind of natural. We were doing anal and C wasn't enjoying it, so I asked if perhaps doing double penetration would help.

B: And C accepted right away?

A: Yes. It was a practical thing of the moment.

B: Which dildo did you use?

A: The big one. Your questions are getting really serious hehehe. Is everything all right?

B: Sorry if I seemed too blunt. But something strange happened, I don't know if everything is all right. I was interested until you said you guys did double penetration.

A: Your reaction was so predictable.

B: Why do you say that?

A: I knew I shouldn't have mentioned any details. Because I think you say that I can tell you things, that is all good, but really you get angry and uncomfortable.
I don't think you were interested at any point.

B: I think what you just said is so uncalled for. You never tell me these things, in fact, this is the very first time that you tell me you had sex with someone else without me asking first. I was interested, that's why I asked you to tell me about the best moment of it.

A: It's amazing how the energy of the conversation shifted, but this has to be a lesson for both of us.

B: But when you said you did double penetration I lost interest, it was an automatic response in my body. I just lost interest.

A: I don't think so. You were blunt, objective, direct, you wanted to know more, even before I mentioned the double penetration. I know you, but now you're gonna say that I'm wrong.

B: Well, you are wrong. I was masturbating. Then you started this subject out of the blue, so I lost a little bit of interest, but then you said the best moment was anal and I started masturbating again, but when you mentioned double penetration it went away. And you are criticizing me for asking too bluntly, but you don't create a good atmosphere when you tell me all this.

A: Ok, blame me as you always do.

B: Hey, stop that.

A: You're a joke.

B: I'm not blaming you for anything here, NOTHING at all. I thanked you for telling me. I feel you got a bit aggressive now. I'm not trying to fight here.

A: You're saying that I didn't create a good atmosphere, you should be more receptive, I don't know how you were feeling.

B: Try to chill, I'm not trying to start a discussion here.

A: You didn't say "that seems hot" or anything.

B: Really, try to calm down and let's talk calmly.

A: You always blame me. That irritates me.

B: Are you reading what I'm saying? I'm asking for us to talk calmly

A: You are always playing the fucking victim.

B: What blaming are you talking about??

A: I won't tell you a fucking thing starting from now.

B: Are you reading me?

A: Yes.

B: Then try to calm down. I am NOT trying to fight. And I am NOT blaming you for anything. I'm trying to talk to you with good intentions. Try to chill.

A: Ok. Just remember the way you react when I tell you things.

B: Let's talk. Could you tell me two things: what didn't you like about my reaction? And how would you prefer for me to react when you tell me these things? I'm really asking. I'm trying to understand.

A: You blame me because I didn't create an atmosphere. But you always look for an excuse so it doesn't work.

B: Can you get that out of your head? I'm not blaming you of anything, I swear.

A: I always have to tell you these things cautiously.

B: I know it's not an easy subject to talk about and truthfully we have never really talked about this upfront. I think is important we do. I'll tell you again...

A: You have to admit that you are not well equiped to hear these things.

B: I'm NOT blaming you here.

A: You are not ready to hear about these things. Bottomline. You get uncomfortable, it seems like you are asking to see if you get me lying or contradicting myself. It's so tense. You have to be able to admit that.

B: I think you are still a bit tense now. You can't tell me "You are not ready to hear about this things. Bottomline" that is very restrictive. Please try to calm down.

A: Ok B.

B: Let me try to understand you better.

A: Whatever.

B: Can I try to repeat what you told me to see if I got it?

B: Hello?

A: Go ahead. I'm falling asleep.

B: Can I call you?

A: No. I don't think talking about this is going to get us anywhere. I think you get uncomfortable and that's it.

B: I think this is an important conversation to have for us.

A: If I kiss someone or fuck someone, etc. So everytime we talk about it, I have to be very careful. If I hadn't said anything now, we would have continued masturbating and we wouldn't be here. I shouldn't have said anything.

B: Can you please hear me out?

A: That's my lesson and it doesn't matter what you say, I'm not gonna change my mind. I hope you understand.

B: I feel like you are... I don't know, fed up with me. I've felt that for a while and I feel like everything is coming out now. I feel you are very close minded now, you're not listening to me.

A: Stop making things complicated.

B: Then listen to me, ok?

A: Is obvious I shouldn't tell you certain things because you get uncomfortable. Is that simple.

B: Can you please hear me out? I'm asking here.

A: Ok. Talk.

B: You feel like when you tell me these things, I ask too many questions and I create tension, right?

A: Yes, you get uncomfortable.

B: You have to put things in context. Talking about this has always been an issue in our relationship, this is in fact the very first time you told me something without me asking. Before I used to ask, this time I decided to wait until you came forward. Trust is built both ways. I get uncomfortable yes, but you have to acknowledge that you have lied to me and kept affairs from me in the past. I think you should try to understand that. I'm trying here. I think is restrictive when you say "you're not ready, bottomline". You can't limit me like that. Is a process. The same way it has been a process for you and you're now telling me about this. When you say "I'm not gonna fucking tell you anything" I think is very destructive and even an overreaction... I really don't know what I said just now for you to be so defensive, like if criticized you or something. You asked me if everything was all right and I was honest when I told you I lost interest. I thought double penetration was a thing you only did with me, it has been our fantasy for months and now you told me casually, in the middle of us masturbating, that you did that with someone else. I think you should be more understanding and not get so agressive.

A: But you did criticize me. You said I was supposed to create an atmosphere, like saying that everything is my fault.

B: I never said that everything is your fault. You criticized me first. And I replied to that saying that you weren't helping to create a good atmosphere. I'm NOT blaming you. Thinks can't only depend on me, right?

A: Sorry, this is my last night in Berlin.

B: You didn't even answered my questions back there, about what kind of reaction would you like for me to have. Can you explain that? I really think is important to know what you feel about this.

A: I'm going out, ok? It's late and I want to go out.

B: mmm... I feel like you're running away, it's a weird feeling.

A: I swear I'm not. We can continue tomorrow.

B: Why do you leave like this? With all this awkwardness? I get really sad. I'm trying to understand everything you're saying. But I kinda feel you don't care.

A: Honey, I'm in Berlin. I'm not gonna spend my last night here fighting. Sorry. XO

B: Who's fighting? We're talking. I swear I don't understand. It's always something for you to not wanna talk. Now you're in Berlin, then is you're studying, tomorrow you'll be visiting another city and you won't be able to talk either.

B: Really? You just left? I feel like you don't care. I'm so sad now.
 
My general impression is that B should probably stop asking about details of what A does with A's intimate partners. I doubt A would be saying that this is a reoccurring problem unless it has happened before. The frustration about it is very clear. Maybe focusing on different fantasies while sexting would be a better idea, at least as an experiment.
 
Hi Sine,

My initial impression is that A overreacted. Maybe in part due to earlier conversations but now I am guessing and I don't want to do that. I don't know what to suggest, other than therapy/counseling. There is a lot of blaming language in the conversation posted. Obviously A is doing most of the blaming but I don't know how typical this sort of conversation is. I think Polyamory.com can help but, believe it or not I think we need more information first.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
dont miss it!

Sounds like an opportunity for both to grow... If such is the desired direction?
Have to learn to let go.. Both of you...Learn to except what was said... And find the good in it!
Sounds like what A wanted to say was said! At a bad time ( talk about open anything.. Wow)
A was open and having fun... For a change .. If true...And .. Dang... Got blued!
Be honest with each other about direction.. Be free to say what needs said.. In the right moment.
Toodles, keep us updated ;)
 
Both A and B need to work on how they communicate. They both jump to defensiveness almost immediately so nothing constructive was going to come of the discussion. There are clearly unsettled feelings over past behavior on both sides. I have been in discussions with a similar dynamic and it is a most uncomfortable place to be. Trust can take some time to rebuild and it requires both sides to see and understand how their own behavior contributed to the situation. Even if one person was more at fault often the aggrieved party forgets to apologize for striking back in some fashion.

Leetah
 
You know, while I get a slight flavor of martyrdom from B's language (and that I know is colored by the thread title of "Judge Me, Please" ...why would you assume we are here to judge anyone?...)

I saw an attempt to be understanding and even involved/engaged on the part of B.

I saw A uncomfortable all around. The feeling I get is that A confessed and expected to be in trouble. When the trouble did not materialize, A started a sort of fight in order to turn it from "I've done something that is wrong (sex with C without saying anything first, trust violation)" transforming into "Now we are fighting and it's all your fault!" I feel that A unconsciously engineered that whole thing. Turn from the wrongdoer to the victim. I see B saying a lot of "I feel" this and that (owning your own feelings, which is good communication behavior.) And A jumping straight to "I am being attacked!"

Kevin mentioned that maybe more information would be needed to have a clear picture of this relationship and how deep the underlying issues run. I would agree with that.

I also want to say that I have been in the position of telling a partner a fantasy of mine, and then not getting it with them but then they do it for another partner. In my situation the person meant no harm by it and they weren't even the one who set the whole thing in motion...it was not their fault. But because I had a desire that was unfulfilled and was there seeing my partner give that to another person...it hurt. I know she didn't mean to hurt me. I am not mad at her for it. It still hurt. It was not sexy to me. I think it was completely fair in this situation for B to feel the way that B felt and to express it in the manner it was expressed.

Also, my lover, who has an interest in Zen philosophy, sometimes says that what one criticizes in others, is what one hates in oneself. Something like that. A says that it is amazing how the energy of the conversation shifted, but A was the one specifically who shifted it, in saying "your reaction is so predictable." That ONE point was where it turned on a dime and got hostile. Right exactly there. Then the accusation that B started it.
 
The whole thing made my head hurt. Sounds like two people who both need to step back and think about what they say and why. It sounds like two people who both excel at playing off each other and escalating.
 
What I'm reading here is the beggining of quite a productive and honest conversation. My opinion is it should continue in person and less by text.
 
I don't think the minute details of the argument matter much and can in fact be a distraction from the bigger issue: breakdown in communication.

I see a lot of focus on blame, defensiveness, and a lot of lingering attachment to previous hurts/issues that aren't fully healed and so are leaking out here. You know, there doesn't have to be a villain and a victim.

Like others have suggested, counseling is a great idea.

I also noticed B being resistant to dropping the conversation while A was not wanting to talk about it while emotions were high. Perhaps B would have an easier time postponing if a set time and date were scheduled to revisit the subject? To be reassured that yes, this WILL be addressed. And maybe A would be more comfortable if a time limit was set on the discussion, like an hour at a time, to know it won't be one long, circular marathon of fighting?

Then both can pick a time that's more conducive?
 
Square Peg - Round Hole

Could you give me your raw honest impressions about these two people and their relationship?

My assessment? I think people should associate with people that they actually get along with. This business of insisting that two people must associate with each other and treat each other well, regardless of whether or not it comes naturally is hogwash. Go take classes, read volumes of books, get group therapy from trained professionals... what a bunch of effort for arranging deck chairs on the Titanic. This planet is replete with other humans, I suggest we let go of the ones we don't get along with and seek out ones that we do.

Easy peasy.
 
Thought several things. In almost this exact sequence:

1. (to A) Waitaminit, you're telling the person you're sexting and masturbating with about sex with someone else?

2. (to B) Wow. That sounded like he was wary of telling you, but you seem interested. Oookay.

3. (to A) Waiting for the other shoe to drop. By design, huh?

4. (to B) Walked right into that one, didn't you.

5. (to A) That went well. From confession to blaming her. No need for apologies or to be considerate or anything.

6. (to B) If you don't know what's coming up, you've been fast asleep in your relationship.

7. (to A) Tell me honestly. You weren't even masturbating at all, were you? You can breathe easy. It is derailed now.

8. (to B) You know, this isn't a conversation being reported, it is the nth rerun of some stale conversation with known triggers being replayed compulsively.


And so on.

A knows fully well that he hasn't been handling telling B about sex with other people. Frankly, A sounds a bit done with B and doesn't particularly care if he tells it well.

B is taking the conversation into areas she knows she will not like. Does it anyway.

Completely predictable conversation for both A and B. Known, well defined triggers, triggered anyway. Screams of a power struggle between the two, except to what end? B probably wants the relationship to continue or enter some state she has identified as ideal, regardless of A's ability to attain it. A's fine with whatever the state of the relationship as long as he doesn't have to do anything to keep it happening.

Don't see what remains to be salvaged here other than pride, perhaps.

The thread says "judge me" - so I am offering my absolutely uncensored perceptions. These would ordinarily be tempered with the awareness that I don't have any context for this conversation, I could be wrong, etc. I have no idea whether you are A or B.
 
Thank each and every one of you for your honest input. It is highly appreciated and has helped me reflect a lot.

Sine
 
Back
Top