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Lifeisinteresting

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Hello all, I have quick question. My wife recently got a girlfriend, we're about two weeks in and I haven't met her yet. She knows about me, but she's not sure she wants to date a married women so my wife is trying to "protect" their new relationship and hopes that we'll be able to meet after her girlfriend feels safer in their relationship.
So my question is, How should I look at this. We're pretty new to this (we've had a little experience with a triad poly? Thing a few years ago where we both dated the same women.) I'm really wanting to meet her, I'm not looking to start a relationship with her, but I'd really like to be friends. Does anyone have experience with this kind of thing? And a follow up question, if we do become friends how should I address my needs. Currently I just talk with my wife about time/scheduling, texting, overnight stays, etc.. And then she talks to her gf. So right now I'm wanting to change our txting rules? not really rules but guidelines. I have no problem with her gf txting whenever, but when she's over at her gfs place we don't txt very much. She says that her gf is just one of those people that finds it rude to txt when you're hanging out with someone plus it just reminds her that my wife is in another relationship. So my follow up question is, should I only talk to my wife about my needs, or should I cut out the middle man.. woman heh and talk to her gf?
 
Your wife is the "hinge" between you and her girlfriend. As such, discussing their relationship, including its effects on you, is *her* responsibility, not yours.

Not everyone wants to be friends with their partner's other partners. Her girlfriend might never feel comfortable meeting you, and that's okay. But even if you and she do become friends, it isn't up to you to talk to her about problems you have with your wife's relationship with her, or needs you have. Talk only to your wife about them, and let her handle things with her girlfriend.

Personally, I hate playing go-between with my partners, but to me it's preferable to them having contact if they don't want to, or to them talking behind my back about things that involve me. And if one of my metamours contacted me out of the blue to say something like "I need you to not text our mutual partner while I'm with him," I would probably break up with that mutual partner. I'm a big fan of avoiding drama, and for me, that tends to mean avoiding metamours.
 
Thanks for the advice, I'll talk with my wife about the txting thing. I can't help but wonder about the part of us not being friends. We have two small kids and my wifes gf has two teenage kids. I'm concerned that if we can't find ways to overlap these two relationships more there just isn't going to be time for us to fulfill all our relationship and parenting obligations. Our kids are too young to understand the open marriage thing, but her kids know my wife is married and they're able to have family time with my wife there. I'd like to be able to do the same with our kids. Going to parks, movies, family stuff. I know my wife would be discreet about their relationship around the kids until they were older, but other than that it feels like the best way for everyone to have enough time together.
 
Hello Lifeisinteresting,

It sounds like the main problem here is that you want more/direct contact with your wife's girlfriend, but said girlfriend wants less/no contact with you. I don't know when this will change, but it could be awhile. It could even be forever, who knows. If this girlfriend isn't willing to meet up with you, and be in contact with you, what can you do? It's not like you can force it upon her. For now, I'm afraid you'll have to go through your wife to talk about things that pertain to the girlfriend (your metamour). Later, if/when your metamour becomes willing to meet with you, you can start addressing her directly. In the meantime, you'll just have have to wait and see how the time issues work out with respect to the kids. If it can't be done without more overlap, it can't be done. You'll know soon enough if that is the case.

Perhaps the main problem here is that your metamour doesn't want to date a married woman (your wife). She'll have to make peace with your existence before she will be willing to meet up with you.

Hopefully things will work out.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
Why do you have to be present for your wife and her girlfriend to spend time with your kids? If the issue is your wife spending time with the children, she and her girlfriend could bring the kids out someplace, or even to the girlfriend's house. That still isn't a reason for the girlfriend to have to be friends with you. None of the things you mention are automatically "family stuff," and your wife's girlfriend might not want to be "family" with you.

Some people simply don't want "kitchen table" poly, which is what you seem to be looking for. Some of us have no interest in being one big happy family with our partners' other partners. Your wife's girlfriend may be this type of person, or she might want more time with your wife before she meets you.

She also might be afraid that if she meets you, you'll make a move on her. That seems to be an unfortunately relatively common reaction from men who meet their wives' girlfriends, and she may have encountered that before.
 
kdt26417 said:
Hello Lifeisinteresting,

It sounds like the main problem here is that you want more/direct contact with your wife's girlfriend, but said girlfriend wants less/no contact with you. I don't know when this will change, but it could be awhile. It could even be forever, who knows. If this girlfriend isn't willing to meet up with you, and be in contact with you, what can you do? It's not like you can force it upon her. For now, I'm afraid you'll have to go through your wife to talk about things that pertain to the girlfriend (your metamour). Later, if/when your metamour becomes willing to meet with you, you can start addressing her directly. In the meantime, you'll just have have to wait and see how the time issues work out with respect to the kids. If it can't be done without more overlap, it can't be done. You'll know soon enough if that is the case.

Perhaps the main problem here is that your metamour doesn't want to date a married woman (your wife). She'll have to make peace with your existence before she will be willing to meet up with you.

Hopefully things will work out.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
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I think you're right with the main problem being her uncertainty of dating a married women at all. My wife said that she would have no problem meeting me.. she doesn't have anything against me, but my wife thinks it would just cause the end of their relationship. My wife said She would meet me, like me, and then think that she's interfering with our marriage.. and back out of things. /shrug I'm not really overly worried about it, I just wish things were a little more settled is all, but I'm feeling positive overall. My metamour and I exchanged xmas gifts via my wife so I feel like we're on a good track to one day be friends. I'd just prefer sooner than later is all

thanks,
John
 
KC43 said:
Why do you have to be present for your wife and her girlfriend to spend time with your kids? If the issue is your wife spending time with the children, she and her girlfriend could bring the kids out someplace, or even to the girlfriend's house. That still isn't a reason for the girlfriend to have to be friends with you. None of the things you mention are automatically "family stuff," and your wife's girlfriend might not want to be "family" with you.

Some people simply don't want "kitchen table" poly, which is what you seem to be looking for. Some of us have no interest in being one big happy family with our partners' other partners. Your wife's girlfriend may be this type of person, or she might want more time with your wife before she meets you.

She also might be afraid that if she meets you, you'll make a move on her. That seems to be an unfortunately relatively common reaction from men who meet their wives' girlfriends, and she may have encountered that before.
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I don't need to be present, it was more of, making it easier on them. Two small kids are a handful so the idea was we could all hang out then they could leave and I'd have the kids. but there isn't any reason I couldn't just show up when they where done and take over. Just feels .. a little shady.. like there is something being hidden or something, but it's fine really. If she doesn't want to meet me that's between my wife and her. I'm not sure what "kitchen table" poly is, and i'm .. not sure about "one big happy family" If things move that way in time i'll think about it but for right now i'm just wanting friendly interactions. Saying HI, being cool with the idea of me, if I happen to be be dropping my wife off for a date or something to wave and say hi. Just being pleasant adults dating the same women. This is her first time dating a married woman so I'm thinking she hasn't encountered a husband hitting on her.
This does bring up a question tho, I currently have no want to date/hit on/have sex/ anything with my wifes gf. But if I did "make a move"/hit on her, would that be wrong? When I look at that situation I see an adult hitting on another adult, if they want to do something they can, if one or both don't then they don't. My wife would probably laugh at me if her gf shot me down and that would be all that happened.
 
My wife recently got a girlfriend, we're about two weeks in and I haven't met her yet. She knows about me, but she's not sure she wants to date a married women so my wife is trying to "protect" their new relationship and hopes that we'll be able to meet after her girlfriend feels safer in their relationship.
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"Safer" how? If she basically doesn't want to date a married woman, and she's dating one... then she's going against her own grain.

Are both she and Wife and pretending like Wife is not married so they can have the relationship? If so... They aren't being very honest with themselves or each other.

Don't hit on the GF. Esp if you find the whole thing weird/shady.

Let it unfold over time. She either will become more secure about it or she will stick with not wanting to date married women and bow out.

But it's largely out of your hands. You cannot make someone be your friend faster than they want to be or even at all. So hope for the best and just let it be what it will be.

Galagirl
 
GalaGirl said:
"Safer" how? If she basically doesn't want to date a married woman, and she's dating one... then she's going against her own grain.

Are both she and Wife and pretending like Wife is not married so they can have the relationship? If so... They aren't being very honest with themselves or each other.

Don't hit on the GF. Esp if you find the whole thing weird/shady.

Let it unfold over time. She either will become more secure about it or she will stick with not wanting to date married women and bow out.

But it's largely out of your hands. You cannot make someone be your friend faster than they want to be or even at all. So hope for the best and just let it be what it will be.

Galagirl
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I ment safer like more secure, my wife thinks she just needs more time for her to see that it can work. I think she's in the process of figuring out if it's against her grain, but yah time will tell.
You know, It's not in the for real shady, we all know about each other and my wife is pretty honest with her gf about me.. *for the most part, I'd prefer more honest but again my wife feels it would scare her off if she was more honest* I think the way it works is out of sight out of mind, basically her gf forgets my wife is married until I txt or something, then she remembers, pulls back emotionally/physically for a little bit then forgets again and is good. On my wifes side she just down plays or omits stuff with me in it so it won't remind her gf that she's married. So overall not really shady, but not really all out in the open either :/
Chuckle I have no want to hit on the GF for a few reasons. She's a bit older, still attractive but not really my thing. And I'm not really sure I'm poly, *not sure of the right terms here* When my wife and I dated the same women a few years it was really fun but just too emotionally draining.. and it took a lot of time and energy, I think I might just prefer more of the mono thing. My wife has the energy and desire so I'm supportive but I'm fine with her being the only one with other relationships.
I might not be able to make anyone be my friend but I can sure try real hard lol. No really, I'm going to just be me, I ask my wife to tell her gf hi for me. Got her/her kids a xmas gift. *honestly I helped my wife do all her christmas shopping for her gf and kids, but her gf doesn't know that because my wife thinks she wouldn't like it.. /sigh* and we've relayed thank yous and stuff via my wife so overall things are moving in a positive way. Just a bit slowly is my only complaint. heh
 
I'm not sure what "kitchen table" poly is, and i'm .. not sure about "one big happy family."
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Kitchen table poly *is* basically being "one big happy family." It's when people spend time with their partners, and their partners' other partners, like they're a family or at least very close friends. The term, as I understand it, comes from the idea that everyone can sit around the kitchen table all friendly-like and have a meal together, and everyone socializes. It's what one of my partners prefers, and what I strongly DON'T prefer; I call it his "poly-Borg collective" and choose not to be part of it.

This does bring up a question tho, I currently have no want to date/hit on/have sex/ anything with my wifes gf. But if I did "make a move"/hit on her, would that be wrong? When I look at that situation I see an adult hitting on another adult, if they want to do something they can, if one or both don't then they don't. My wife would probably laugh at me if her gf shot me down and that would be all that happened.
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Whether it would be wrong or not depends entirely on whether you, your wife, and her girlfriend would feel like it was wrong. That isn't a question that has a generally right or wrong answer.

For *me*, yes, it would be wrong. There's no chance of me getting involved with one of my partners' other partners, or with one of my partners getting involved with another of my partners, thank gods; I only date guys and they only date women. But I won't even get involved with someone who's friendly with one of my partners unless they became friends through me, and if one of my partners chose to get involved with one of my friends, I would end the relationship. Too much entanglement makes me nauseated. (That said, I am friends with one partner of my boyfriend's, but she was involved with him long before I was, and she and I became friends *after* I started seeing him.) But for you, your wife, and her girlfriend, it might be perfectly fine. That would be a discussion to have with your wife, and for her to have with her girlfriend. Different people have different opinions on it.

I wouldn't advise hitting on your wife's other partner(s) without talking to her first, though. But that's me. Other people would say do what you want, you're an adult and don't need permission; I don't see it as asking permission, but as being considerate and respectful of your partner. The difference being you aren't asking if it's okay with her and letting her answer make your decision; you're just letting her know you're planning to do this, and giving her a chance to voice her opinion even if you ultimately go against it.
 
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Re (from Lifeisinteresting):
"I'm not sure what 'kitchen table' poly is ..."
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Let's say there's a V (three people). When someone says, "kitchen table poly," I picture the three people sitting around the kitchen table in the morning drinking coffee. The conversation is casual and easygoing. The point is, the three people are very relaxed in each other's company. When something needs to be discussed, they discuss it. No one has to go "through" anyone else.

The other kind of poly is "parallel poly." In the V that I mentioned, there is a hinge person and the two legs of the V (each leg is a person who is romantically involved with the hinge, but the legs are not romantically involved with each other). In parallel poly, the legs would seldom or never spend time together, and seldom or never be in contact with each other. Each leg carries on with his/her relationship with the hinge, but never the twain legs shall meet. Never would you see the three people sitting around the kitchen table together. It would only be the hinge and one of the legs at a time.

Right now, you, your wife, and her girlfriend have parallel poly. However, you want something more like kitchen table poly. There's nothing wrong with either style, it's strictly a matter of preference.

Re:
"I currently have no want to date/hit on/have sex/anything with my wife's girlfriend. But if I did 'make a move'/hit on her, would that be wrong?"
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I don't see a problem with it theoretically. Not sure if the girlfriend would freak out though.
 
FWIW, if I had known someone "for two weeks," I wouldn't put them together with my kids in ANY sort of quasi-parenting role. No matter how I parse the motivations, there's definitely a creepiness factor.

It looks as though there's some kind of a rush to turn a casual new friend (about whom you know pretty much nothing) into a Life Partner, & at that ASAFP. That sort of pressure is NOT a symptom of good decision-making ability.

In reality, they don't have "a relationship" yet except in the sense that you have "a relationship" with the girl who usually seats you at your favorite cafe, or the guy at the counter of your nearest convenience store. At two weeks, even calling her a "girlfriend" stretches the whole thing out of shape.

You need to have a chat with your spouse, about how fantasizing that a fuckbuddy is somehow "a partner" DOES NOT qualify her to be a member of the family. She is in no way known well enough for you to even begin guessing at how much crazy might be lurking.

It is NOT good that everyone thinks she needs to be protected from honesty, especially when the new BFF is already playing "I only feel comfortable doing you if I know no penis has been there." How is it that your spouse doesn't hear warning bells??

When you look down the road & see that the bridge might be collapsed, it's best to apply the brakes BEFORE getting to the ragged edge.
 
Ravenscroft said:
FWIW, if I had known someone "for two weeks," I wouldn't put them together with my kids in ANY sort of quasi-parenting role. No matter how I parse the motivations, there's definitely a creepiness factor.

It looks as though there's some kind of a rush to turn a casual new friend (about whom you know pretty much nothing) into a Life Partner, & at that ASAFP. That sort of pressure is NOT a symptom of good decision-making ability.

In reality, they don't have "a relationship" yet except in the sense that you have "a relationship" with the girl who usually seats you at your favorite cafe, or the guy at the counter of your nearest convenience store. At two weeks, even calling her a "girlfriend" stretches the whole thing out of shape.

You need to have a chat with your spouse, about how fantasizing that a fuckbuddy is somehow "a partner" DOES NOT qualify her to be a member of the family. She is in no way known well enough for you to even begin guessing at how much crazy might be lurking.

It is NOT good that everyone thinks she needs to be protected from honesty, especially when the new BFF is already playing "I only feel comfortable doing you if I know no penis has been there." How is it that your spouse doesn't hear warning bells??

When you look down the road & see that the bridge might be collapsed, it's best to apply the brakes BEFORE getting to the ragged edge.
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Hey, little bit of s miscommunication. They've been "dating two weeks " they've been friends .. about a year or so. Going out to concerts, grabbing lunch here and there. So not really close friends but friends. My wife had
known her kids long before anything was going on. I just never happened to of crossed her path.
Any way, we both think of her as "good people" I'd have no problem with her babysitting my kids.
I know this is a bit non romantic, but she works really well on paper. She's a bit older, with kids, jobs, just a real stable person. My wife likes that shes very knowledgeable and puts her at ease with the sex. (This is my wife's first real lesbian relationship ),they already know each other, She actually works basically across the street from her. may sound silly but being able to grab lunch together is pretty nice.
Anyway, for me she's a known quantity, my wife likes her, and I honestly I think she's a good girlfriend to my wife. I'm not going for kitchen table but I'm also not going for full parralel either. Given what I know about her we really would enjoy hanging out, but I'd be fine with. Just being friendly and not hiding from each other. It's just bad luck that we hadn't met before.
About the honestly thing, everyone does not feel that way. I would much rather my wife be fully open with her. She knows my wife and I have a good relationship but just doesn't like being reminded of it. I think it's more her problem with the poly stuff rather than the penis. Heh but yah that's really the only warning bell. She's just not sure she can be in a poly relationship.
 
KC43 said:
Kitchen table poly *is* basically being "one big happy family." It's when people spend time with their partners, and their partners' other partners, like they're a family or at least very close friends. The term, as I understand it, comes from the idea that everyone can sit around the kitchen table all friendly-like and have a meal together, and everyone socializes. It's what one of my partners prefers, and what I strongly DON'T prefer; I call it his "poly-Borg collective" and choose not to be part of it.



Whether it would be wrong or not depends entirely on whether you, your wife, and her girlfriend would feel like it was wrong. That isn't a question that has a generally right or wrong answer.

For *me*, yes, it would be wrong. There's no chance of me getting involved with one of my partners' other partners, or with one of my partners getting involved with another of my partners, thank gods; I only date guys and they only date women. But I won't even get involved with someone who's friendly with one of my partners unless they became friends through me, and if one of my partners chose to get involved with one of my friends, I would end the relationship. Too much entanglement makes me nauseated. (That said, I am friends with one partner of my boyfriend's, but she was involved with him long before I was, and she and I became friends *after* I started seeing him.) But for you, your wife, and her girlfriend, it might be perfectly fine. That would be a discussion to have with your wife, and for her to have with her girlfriend. Different people have different opinions on it.

I wouldn't advise hitting on your wife's other partner(s) without talking to her first, though. But that's me. Other people would say do what you want, you're an adult and don't need permission; I don't see it as asking permission, but as being considerate and respectful of your partner. The difference being you aren't asking if it's okay with her and letting her answer make your decision; you're just letting her know you're planning to do this, and giving her a chance to voice her opinion even if you ultimately go against it.
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Thank you for the explanation :) I'm still new to these terms.
If you wouldn't mind could you tell me why your preference is against the "Borg collective " grin. I really don't have enough experience with this to have a good opinion. From your experience what are the pro cons of kitchen table poly?
About me hitting on the gf, even if I was, which I'm not, but if i had interest I would ask my wife first. Not because I need permission but because it feels rude not to.
 
kdt26417 said:
Re (from Lifeisinteresting):


Let's say there's a V (three people). When someone says, "kitchen table poly," I picture the three people sitting around the kitchen table in the morning drinking coffee. The conversation is casual and easygoing. The point is, the three people are very relaxed in each other's company. When something needs to be discussed, they discuss it. No one has to go "through" anyone else.

The other kind of poly is "parallel poly." In the V that I mentioned, there is a hinge person and the two legs of the V (each leg is a person who is romantically involved with the hinge, but the legs are not romantically involved with each other). In parallel poly, the legs would seldom or never spend time together, and seldom or never be in contact with each other. Each leg carries on with his/her relationship with the hinge, but never the twain legs shall meet. Never would you see the three people sitting around the kitchen table together. It would only be the hinge and one of the legs at a time.

Right now, you, your wife, and her girlfriend have parallel poly. However, you want something more like kitchen table poly. There's nothing wrong with either style, it's strictly a matter of preference.

Re:


I don't see a problem with it theoretically. Not sure if the girlfriend would freak out though.
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Thank you for the clear explanation, and yah I was strictly thinking theoretically. I have no interest in actually doing anything.
Do you have any opinion about what style works best? I have no experience but it would seem that parallel poly would be harder for long term relationships and seems like it just adds restrictions with scheduling.
Any knowledge on this would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
 
Lifeisinteresting said:
Thank you for the explanation :) I'm still new to these terms.
If you wouldn't mind could you tell me why your preference is against the "Borg collective " grin. I really don't have enough experience with this to have a good opinion. From your experience what are the pro cons of kitchen table poly?
About me hitting on the gf, even if I was, which I'm not, but if i had interest I would ask my wife first. Not because I need permission but because it feels rude not to.
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I'm against being part of the "poly-Borg collective" because I have an aversion to being forced into contact with someone solely because they're dating the same person I am. In general, I have no desire to be friends with my partners' other partners, and would be just as happy if I didn't even meet them. It's mainly because I have an extreme imagination, and I don't want the mental image of my partner with someone else; the easiest way to avoid that mental image is not to know who their other partners are.

I don't have any experience with kitchen table poly, so I have no idea what the pros are. For me, the cons would be feeling forced into contact with someone I might not even like, having to be social when it's not something I'm particularly strong at, and having the aforementioned mental images.

To be honest, even thinking about it starts making me rage-ish. The idea just plain makes me feel sick. And angry.

Parallel poly works just fine for me. The one partner I have who currently has other partners, I've been with for over two years, and it's always been parallel poly. His preference, I think, is for kitchen table, but he respects me enough to go by my comfort level. The pros of parallel are that I don't have to interact with someone I don't want to interact with, and I control how much, if anything, I know about my partner's other partners. As far as I'm concerned, there are no cons to it.
 
I helped my wife do all her christmas shopping for her gf and kids, but her gf doesn't know that because my wife thinks she wouldn't like it.
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I guess it's just their relationship doesn't feel like two weeks in. Sex toys for Christmas gifts. Spending a decent amount of time sleeping over. Just feels more like they're in month two of their relationship
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You helped wife buy sex toys for xmas for her GF or 2 weeks? I think you need to pull back a bit and not be so involved. If wife asks you for help like that you could say "No, thank you."

I could be wrong... but you seem impatient watching their relationship develop and like you want to rush it along. Like you want it to be "done and settled" already. Are you anxious about something?

I have no experience but it would seem that parallel poly would be harder for long term relationships and seems like it just adds restrictions with scheduling.
Click to expand...

What schedule restrictions are you worried about?

Galagirl
 
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