Lost

[MissKitty]

not sure if my previous post worked so I am going to attempt to post another one, it did say there was an error so I am assuming it did not go through, so forgive me if I double post.

I am a bit lost and confused, and nothing I do seems to help my situation, it is a rather complicated situation, at least in my mind it is, I am in a mono/poly marriage, me being the mono one and my husband being the poly one, it did not start out that way, not up until about three years ago, he wanted to try something new and I agreed to try it with him, he found a woman willing to try it as well, the other woman lived a few states away, so we already knew it would be a bit difficult, I had never met the woman face to face, mostly just phone calls, texts and occasional skype, he did however take a trip to meet her once, we all agreed to take things slow and see how things developed, the two of them did end up falling in love, I was not sure of my feelings and I knew it would be hard, I tried my best to accept what was happening, deciding if i wanted to do this or not, I expressed all my feelings, trying not to blame anyone for anything and in return i expressed that i did not want my feelings torn apart, because it's natural after all, or at least I thought.

one of my concerns was I did not want to rush or be forced, but seeing as how quickly things were moving with them, i felt left behind because my feelings were not to their level and that caused issues with them, I felt horrible because i was holding them back and every time i tried to express any ill feelings I got shot down and blamed, so the only thing i could think to do in order to ensure their happiness was to destroy my own and told them to do whatever they wanted and I would catch up, well as time went on I noticed that she was literally trying to push me out of the picture, when i expressed this to my husband, he did not believe it, the longer this went on the more i began to lose myself and felt i no longer belonged.

I found someone for myself during this time and i kind of felt a bit better because i didn't feel left out or alone, but i still felt like I was losing my husband because the other woman was all about her and her feelings and mine no longer mattered and i was wrong, things spiraled out of control and as me and my husband call it, I went nuts, whatever it was, all i know is i was in so much pain i wanted it to end and the only thing i knew to do was to get out of the situation, and I said I wanted a divorce.

That was a few months ago, I no longer talk to the other woman, i have no contact with her, I am still with my husband and we are trying to repair our marriage, the other woman is still kind of in the picture, but that is slowly fading, he finally see's that what I have been telling him was in fact truth.

Now just a few days ago he comes to me telling me he has found another woman he wants to try with, and my first reaction was, oh not again, I had just gotten back to myself and he does it again, the only difference with this one is, she is not that far away, and he works with her, I have met her already, we all hung out, went to dinner, then ended up staying the night at her house, probably not the best thing in the world to do on the first meeting, but i was out numbered, not really all that much of a problem, first impression of her is I do seem to like her, she is a very nice person, no problem there, but like the last one they seem to be on a whole other level than I am, they are wanting to move in a quicker pace than I am ready to go, and it seems to be causing issues already.

I don't know what to do, I have expressed my feelings about the pace, I still want to move slowly, considering it is a new relationship, or whatever it is, they both seem very comfortable with each other and moving forward, and yet again I feel like the outcast, that is how i feel anyway, because they seem to move at the speed of light and i move at the speed of a slug, I don't see a problem with moving slow, esp when I am the one trying to figure out who I am and where I belong in this, I am not doing this for myself, least not till i figure out if this is what i truly want, I am doing this for him because I love him and I want to make him happy and this is what makes him happy, but I also don't want to be a problem because I am not ready when they are.

I don't know what to do or who to talk to that seems to understand what I am feeling, I have tried talking to my husband and he is concerned that he is hurting me like last time, so in the mix of it all we are both worried we are hurting each other, and trying not to hurt the other woman in the process, I know this makes them happy and I am willing to sacrifice my own happiness for his and hers, I told them to go ahead and do what they wanted and I would catch up at my own pace, knowing that it could potentially end up badly, but i didn't know what else to do, I am lost and need a bit of advice.

sorry if this so so long but i couldn't really express what was going on uless i told my entire story

 

[Dagferi]

Adding people to a broken marriage on shaky ground is never a good idea.

Why is your husband adding another partner when you need to work on your marriage?

 

[tenK]

I think it was Einstein who said that "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result". You tried telling him to go off and do his own thing, promising to 'catch up' later last time, and it crashed and burned. Why are you saying the same thing again now???

You need to get to the root of your feelings BEFORE he acts out on his crushes/desires. Or else he needs to find another lover with the patience of a saint, who is willing to go at an absolute snail's pace (including not at all). In all honesty, you are barely healed from his last foray. She may be a different person, and you may like her a little better than his last girlfriend, but you and your husband are still the same people, and THAT'S why this is not going to work. Please stand up for your own feelings and tell him you're not ready. No one should ever need to sacrifice their happiness for another, especially with no finish-line in sight, or any kind of discussion about how that sense of sacrifice can be adjusted in time. You're a human being, not a door mat. He won't thank himself if you have a nervous breakdown and end up resentful and hating him, so you're doing this as much for his own benefit as your own.

 

[GalaGirl]

I am sorry you struggle. It sounds like horrible poly hell.

If the present goal is to repair marriage, why's he dating again so soon?

That sleepover on the first date -- was that just sleep or sex? Why are you "outnumbered?" Why is it not a 3-yes system if it was sex? All participants happy to be there?

Do you understand consent? Not just for sex, but consenting to participate in a poly network? If it is not for you after trying it on, you are allowed to withdraw you participation. Do you feel confident doing that?

http://metro.co.uk/2015/07/01/brill...xual-consent-means-in-everyday-terms-5274497/

I am not doing this for myself, least not till i figure out if this is what i truly want, I am doing this for him because I love him and I want to make him happy and this is what makes him happy, but I also don't want to be a problem because I am not ready when they are.

Why are you doing this "for him" rather than for you? I think you are finding out that that doesn't work.

I see you are personalizing it. YOU are not the problem. You are HAVING or EXPERIENCING some problems. I think you might mean you don't want to be BLAMED. If so...Who is blaming you? You? Him?

Is the problem that you don't want to respect your own limits/preferences? That you are NOT wanting to participate in poly networks. And you try to ignore a core value with you and do it anyway? In order to avoid dealing with you and husband not being compatible?

Because no matter how you slice it, there's problems here. And you all contribute to the situation making to some degree. It isn't like 100% one person's fault.

• Healthy people I know would not want such a sacrifice made -- a loved partner going against their own grain like that.
  
• Healthy people I know would not offer it.
  
• Healthy people I know wouldn't want a messy couple in their poly network for long. They'd remove themselves to be free of it.

I think you are learning that you cannot place his happiness above your own. He can have lots, even up to 49% of your love and attention. But you have to keep 51% for yourself. You put your own oxygen mask on first.

I don't know what to do or who to talk to that seems to understand what I am feeling, I have tried talking to my husband and he is concerned that he is hurting me like last time, so in the mix of it all we are both worried we are hurting each other, and trying not to hurt the other woman in the process,

So you guys see the hurt... and keep going ANYWAY hoping the hurt magically goes away somehow? Is he also conflict avoidant?

I know this makes them happy and I am willing to sacrifice my own happiness for his and hers, I told them to go ahead and do what they wanted and I would catch up at my own pace, knowing that it could potentially end up badly, but i didn't know what else to do, I am lost and need a bit of advice.

Well, you succeeded. You said you were willing to sacrifice your own happiness for his and hers. And you did.

Now you come to find that it doesn't feel so hot to sacrifice. AGAIN. Last time you were so upset you wanted divorce. Why do more of same?

When are you going to decide to handle conflict resolution straight up and advocate for what you need? Lean INTO it, rather than away? To me you sound conflict avoidant, and try to be "nice" about it and let whatever other people want happen so in the short term, you do not have to deal with conflict resolution. While hoping they notice or appreciate the self sacrificing. Yet in the long term, it comes back around to bite you. And you do not like that.

Conflict avoidance just breeds more conflict later.

I think you could stop avoiding conflict resolution. Seek a poly counselor, and work with them to improve your problem solving skills so you feel confident going into conflict resolution instead of running away from it.

Could also work on HOW you guys do poly. Your husband moves too fast and seems to take you for granted. You barely get past the old "cowgirl" GF he was blinded by for a long while, and he wants to leap into a new thing rather than making repairs first.

And here's you choosing to go along for the ride again, having to trust that he will pace himself, and not get blinded by NRE again.... while he's being blinded by NRE again. Rather than saying "NO. I do not consent to participate in a new poly network with new people until we have done marriage repair work first."

Both of you are busy co-creating an unhappy situation. Could get on with co-creating a better one. Rather than worry about getting blamed for pointing out the problems, I think you get on with problem solving steps. With a counselors help you could be doing :

1) ID problems
2) Brainstorm solutions
3) Pick some to try
4) Give it time to work/happen
5) Assess if that works out of not.

• Yes -- keep doing it
• No -- figure out what to try instead and try THAT on.

You have ALREADY tried "just go along with it anyway" and find it does not work. TWICE. No longer need to test that solution over and over. Been proven not to be good here.

So do something different. Seek a counselor. And in the meanwhile, read that poly hell article together.

Perhaps these too:

Avoid the Pitfalls and Reap the Rewards of Polyamorous Relationships

Fourteen Steps to Opening a Monogamous Relationship

Making Peace with Jealousy in Polyamorous Relationships

Unmasking the green eyes monster

Opening Up resources
​

Galagirl

 

[MissKitty]

I didn't really get much of a chance to ask why he wanted to start a new relationship not long after the other one crashed and burned, he blames it on his feelings, he couldn't help how this new woman made him feel, I do kind of get that, considering how he is and how much love he wants to give to other people, I just wanted a chance to fully recover from the last one that kind of blew up in my face.

I know what his goal is in all of this he tells me everyday, he has it in his head that all three of us can be like one big happy family, nothing but love all around and whatever else they want to do that don't involve me.

the sleepover was just that a sleepover, no sex, he wanted all of us to sleep in the same bed and just snuggle, but I told him I was not ready for something like that just yet considering I just met the woman that night, he did understand but also didn't see what the big deal was, that is the problem he don't seem to understand my feelings, he claims he does but in truth it's hard for him to see a problem with it, well that's easy in my eyes, he is comfortable with this type of lifestyle whereas I am not quite there yet and trying to explain to him that it is going to take time, is like telling him the world will end tomorrow.

I am willing to give this a chance, I don't really have any problem exploring another type of lifestyle, I just want the chance to get there at a pace I am comfortable with and everyone else is willing to accept as well.

when I say that I was doing this for him, as of right now yes I am doing it for him, because I have not yet gotten a chance to decide if I wanted to do this for me, again if given a chance and a bit of time I will eventually figure out what is right for me, that right there seems to be the problem i never get enough time, even when I tell him these things take time, he just kind of instantly thinks it will never happen, I really wish he would stop assuming the worst of me and give me a chance.

Yes I am wrong when I say i sacrifice my own happiness for his, because that was the biggest downfall of the first relationship among other things, in all honesty I guess I just get tired of hearing the complaints of how long I am taking and I just say "do whatever"

I really need to get him to do some research or better yet have him talk to someone who knows a bit more about this stuff than we do, and perhaps give us a bit more insight that way he can get a better understanding of all the steps we need to take as a couple, that way we don't end up like we did last time with our marriage on the line, because that is not acceptable to me, this is not why we are doing this, so I guess my biggest problem with all of this is time..how do i make them both understand that it will take time and that I am not trying to cause issues because of the speed I am at, and can our marriage really survive if given time i decide i don't want this?

 

[tenK]

I know what his goal is in all of this he tells me everyday, he has it in his head that all three of us can be like one big happy family, nothing but love all around and whatever else they want to do that don't involve me.

This is a common desire of people going into polyamory for the first time. The thing is, it's quite naive to assume that just because it's what HE wants, that there will be two women (you and another) that also want the same thing. Not everyone is suited to sharing their personal space with other adults. You don't even know if this lifestyle will work for you even if you never have to interact with the other woman yet. To go into this expecting a) you will give your consent to being in a polyamorous relationship just because you want him to be happy, and b) you will go the extra step of giving up your space and playing happy families in the bargain is…well, it's completely unrealistic of him. Also: what if YOU want to have relationships of your own? Ask him how he would feel about you inviting another man to live with the pair of you instead. Is he happy in this scenario? If not, why not? After all, it's the same thing he's asking you to consider, is it not?

I told him I was not ready for something like that just yet considering I just met the woman that night, he did understand but also didn't see what the big deal was, that is the problem he don't seem to understand my feelings, he claims he does but in truth it's hard for him to see a problem with it, well that's easy in my eyes, he is comfortable with this type of lifestyle whereas I am not quite there yet and trying to explain to him that it is going to take time, is like telling him the world will end tomorrow.

This is not good. Even when you are completely direct with him about your status ('not ready for this') he pushes you. It doesn't sound like he respects you very much. It's all 'me, me, me' like a whiny child. Until he can respect your boundaries, I wouldn't want to even be in a monogamous relationship with him, let alone a poly one. He doesn't have to understand your feelings completely - it can be hard for someone with a poly mind-set to get a person with a mono-mindset and vice versa - but he can understand English, and what 'I'm not ready to share a bed, even platonically' means, right? That's all he needs to know in this context.

I really need to get him to do some research or better yet have him talk to someone who knows a bit more about this stuff than we do, and perhaps give us a bit more insight that way he can get a better understanding of all the steps we need to take as a couple

I think this is a really good idea. Get him to join here, let him ask questions, speak to people who are good at being a hinge (that's what he is in this scenario, someone acting as a hinge between two lovers). As I said above, I think he's being unrealistic. Being a hinge is HARD WORK. It takes great communication skills, a lot of compassion, the ability to manage your own emotions, as well as to take into account the emotions of multiple others. He might WANT to be in a poly relationship, but it looks like he's lacking some of the necessary skills right now for doing so in a non-destructive way. Those skills can be learnt, but he has to be willing to read up on things, honestly appraise his current skill set, and commit to improving himself.

can our marriage really survive if given time i decide i don't want this?

Maybe not. But your marriage also won't survive you being rail-roared into something you hate. If it turns out you and he are truly incompatible as marriage partners then that will obviously be sad. However, it is better to figure that out sooner rather than later so that both of you can be free to pursue the kinds of relationship structures that bring out the best in each other. A marriage that ends is not a failure. You can still be in each others lives as friends (or co-parents if you already have children). But you could also be free to have a monogamous relationship that fulfils you, without this stress.

 

[Tinwen]

I really wish he would stop assuming the worst of me and give me a chance.

Did you tell him this? I remember when I was all in NRE, my partner said something similar. Our relationship didn't survive anyway, but it helped me see some of my personal bias.

 

[GalaGirl]

I mean this kindly, ok? It may not be what you want to hear.

I think you have big trouble on your hands.

he blames it on his feelings, he couldn't help how this new woman made him feel

Blaming his "feelings" is not taking personal responsibility for his behavior choices. It's like he's not in the driver's seat -- "feelings" are.

You want to try logic and reason in your approach -- with seeking a counselor or someone/something to guide you in first poly steps. That's great. But he doesn't want that -- he wants to jump right in all crazy. You guys are not compatible in approach or in risk tolerance. He's more risky than you.

You could NOT agree to participate. Because I think you already know you don't like his way of doing poly NOW. You don't have to give it more time to see if poly is for you or not here. You already know poly WITH HIM is not looking like it is for you.

I also think his behavior is just crackers. And that she's ok with that? She's either crackers too, or else he's not told her stuff. I don't think healthy people would hear about the recent cowgirl GF blow up and think "Well, the first thing I want to do is jump into bed to cuddle with the eager beaver jumping the gun husband and the upset/cautious wife!"

If he's going to be picking out unhealthy partners over and over, then I don't think you are going to get any relief. Just more drama.

he has it in his head that all three of us can be like one big happy family, nothing but love all around and whatever else they want to do that don't involve me.

I don't see how he plans to achieve this "loving togetherness" when he rushes you/ignores your reasonable concerns. Ignoring your concerns is a good way to alienate you and kill whatever love you have for him over time.

he wanted all of us to sleep in the same bed and just snuggle, but I told him I was not ready for something like that just yet considering I just met the woman that night, he did understand but also didn't see what the big deal was,

That sounds like minimizing your feelings when you have very reasonable and rational objections. Not cool.

that is the problem he don't seem to understand my feelings, he claims he does but in truth it's hard for him to see a problem with it

Could believe him when he tells you that he understands and doesn't care and it isn't his problem. They are YOURS. So he doesn't have any problems.

He sounds super selfish. Are you willing/able to see that?

trying to explain to him that it is going to take time, is like telling him the world will end tomorrow.

Sounds like he acts out at you by pitching a fit of some kind when he doesn't get his way.

I am willing to give this a chance, I don't really have any problem exploring another type of lifestyle, I just want the chance to get there at a pace I am comfortable with and everyone else is willing to accept as well.

Sounds reasonable to me -- but he's not wanting to be "reasonable." He wants to rush in.

I don't see how he plans to balance needs in his multi relationships when he cannot balance (his needs vs your needs) in the one relationship with you.

Unless his plan for all his relationships is "my needs always first, screw everyone else's."

he just kind of instantly thinks it will never happen, I really wish he would stop assuming the worst of me and give me a chance.

Are you partnered with a thinking disordered person? Because it seems like it. First emotional reasoning. Then jumping to conclusions. Then fortune telling doom. Then more emotional reasoning. Just reading your post is exhausting.

in all honesty I guess I just get tired of hearing the complaints of how long I am taking and I just say "do whatever"

Hon, that is grinding you down to get his way. That's an abuse tactic. I don't see how bullying behavior is supposed to inspire "love all around."

I really need to get him to do some research or better yet have him talk to someone who knows a bit more about this stuff than we do,

While you are right that part of successful poly is HOW people go about it? Another part is starting with healthy partners to begin with. And yours doesn't sound quite right to me.

I think you could seek a counselor to talk to. And in the meanwhile do some research into healthy relationships, cognitive distortions and abuse tactics.

how do i make them both understand that it will take time and that I am not trying to cause issues because of the speed I am at, and can our marriage really survive if given time i decide i don't want this?

You are not causing issues. You are reporting them.

If their rushing behavior leads to problems, and they respond by blame shifting? Flipping it around on you so they don't have to consider changing their behavior? Mind games are another abuse tactic.

You can ask if he will read poly hell with you and talk with you about it. But since he doesn't care about how you feel, I'm not confident that will help any here.

I think his idea of "loving togetherness" is you shut up and go along for the ride without complaining.

I think you could stop worrying about the marriage surviving or not. That you will discover in time. What you could worry about right now is your own well being, and if you are being treated well. If he's consistently not treating you well? You could walk away. Be free from all this drama.

Again, please seek a counselor to help you sort out all these complicated things. I really think you could use the support on the local level. You have bigger problems here than "new to poly."

I'm sorry you have to deal in all this.

Galagirl

 

[kdt26417]

Hello MissKitty,

Just responding to your first post here, it seems to me that your husband is all caught up in a state of NRE and is not handling it well like he should. I think he should slow down for you and at least meet you on some middle ground somewhere.

Looking at the remainder of the thread, people have gave some really good advice and I especially like GalaGirl's last post above.

You aren't doing anything wrong. If anything, you have set the good example of how poly ought to be done.

I hope things will get better for you. Keep us posted if you're willing.

With sympathy,
Kevin T.