My Poly Relationship: Abuse or not?

[SelkieSiun]

Hello to all my Polyamorus friends! I was recently involved in a break up that I would like all of your opinions on if you feel so inclined.

I am a 24-year-old lesbian woman. Beginning of July of this year, I met a 26-year-old girl whom I shall refer to as “Mary.” Mary and I had met through a party and over the course of July we chatted and came to become good friends. After a month of talking, I confessed that I had a crush on her, but was informed that she was dating a 19-year-old autistic asexual transboy whom I shall call “Mark.”

After a few weeks, she and I decided to engage in a sexual relationship with each other with Mark’s approval. However, this only served to intensify my feelings for her and confessed that I was in love with her. For over a month she insisted that the feelings were not mutual, that she only saw me as a friend. This admission later changed when I told her that I was feeling “used for my body only” and, after discussing things with Mark, Mary admitted that she too loved me and that we could date as well.

From the beginning I felt that nothing Mary and I did was kept private. Everything had to be shared/approved/discussed with Mark no matter how small. As time went on Mary assured me that both Mark and I were equals to her and that she loved us both equally. I had not yet met Mark (He lives in Colorado, Mary lives in Tennessee and I live in Georgia) and plans were made for the three of us to spend a weekend together. As the weekend grew closer, I told Mary that I was “hoping to also like Mark” and that “I hope I will have feelings for them.” The weekend finally came, and to my horror, Mark was one of the most uncomfortable people I have ever been around. They constantly asked for Mary to buy them things, would refer to strangers as “humans” to their face, refused to let me sit shotgun with Mary even when I asked and was incredibly rude to me when I tried to comfort them after they shared a very personal trauma with me at dinner.

A couple days later, Mary asked what I thought of Mark. Being an honest person, I told her the truth. That there were things about him that both concerned me and made me very uncomfortable. I was very detailed in what he did/said and how it made me feel. Mary said she understood, but exactly a week later, she called me back saying she was breaking up with me. She stated that what I had told her was me trying to manipulate her into dumping Mark and that she couldn’t tolerate being with someone who spoke about him like that. For several hours I was on the phone crying, apologizing and promising to make things better but it didn’t matter. She said she would think about it and then ended the conversation. The next day I tried to contact her but she had apparently given her phone to Mark to keep me from reaching out to her. Every time I called Mark would answer the phone, telling me things like “you need to leave her alone” “you’re too damaged for her” and “it would be best if you never contact her again.” I still to this day have never had a second conversation with Mary, even when I emailed her asking for a second phone call just to discuss things.

So my question is, was I out of line with what I said or is there something more going on here? I genuinely don’t know what to think or feel and would appreciate it if Poly couples could give their own opinions on what they make of this?

-Selkie

EDIT
This just came to my attention that I did not mention this. I also have Autism and grew up my entire life in ASD programs with most of my friends also being on the spectrum.

 

[GalaGirl]

A couple days later, Mary asked what I thought of Mark. Being an honest person, I told her the truth. That there were things about him that both concerned me and made me very uncomfortable. I was very detailed in what he did/said and how it made me feel. Mary said she understood,

FWIW? She asked you what you thought. You spoke your truth. You are not comfortable around Mark. That's not being out of line. She ASKED.

Later she cut you off because she didn't like your opinion or wasn't yet ready to see Mark that way. Or Mark himself didn't like it when she reported back and made her end it.

She doesn't sound like she has any privacy -- he wants to know everything and be all up in her business.

Either way? I think it is a bullet dodged for you. Both sound wonky right now and you are better off free of their drama.

Mark "hovering" so much -- and possibly cutting Mary off from others who would make her question his behavior sounds weird. Maybe some of these ring more bells:

https://speakoutloud.net/intimate-partner-abuse/male-perpetrators-domestic-violence/mens-tactics

Should Mary come seeking your help to leave Mark? You will have to decide how involved you want to be or if you want to keep your distance and instead point her to women's shelters and other groups that might be able to aid her in leaving an abusive dynamic if she is indeed in one.

It def sounds weird.

Nobody deserves abuse.

www.speakoutloud.net

It's ok to feel concern for Mary, but at the same time... look out for you. Last thing you need is Mark showing up with a gun. It sounds dramatic, but I've seen crazy happen with friends of mine who were abused and were trying to leave. That whole jealous rage thing of "If I cannot have you, nobody can!" is not a joke. Domestic violence can and does happen. And the leaving time is the dangerous time.

Galagirl

 

[tenK]

I think you need to examine how appropriate YOUR behaviour is in the context of this as well, before leaping to conclusions about the nature of Mark and Mary's relationship. Many of the things you list as being indicative of something dark or 'off' about Mark seem to me to be fairly typical of someone with relatively high functioning autism. Perhaps Mary could have given you more insight before your trip as to how autism affects Mark specifically, and more info about any quirks in his personality, and that could have helped, but it seems to me like you are judging him very harshly. I have family members with autism, and whilst everyone is different, I certainly know for them that a relative stranger trying to offer physical comfort would be very unwelcome. Meeting people with autism can be awkward and uncomfortable: sometimes making eye-contact or expressing affection publicly is hard for them, and sometimes there is no 'politeness filter' and thoughts come out bluntly and without sugar coating. Personally I find that refreshing, but your mileage might vary. I also think you also went into that meeting with the (slightly creepy, in my opinion) hope that you would find Mark attractive and 'develop feelings' for him. Why? That seems wildly inappropriate to me. Having preconceived expectations can lead to disappointment, which can in turn lead a neutral event to being perceived as a negative one. Is there any of that going on here?

The lack of privacy in your relationship is a real concern, but again, I think this could be related to Mark's autism, or simply ill-considered couple privilege, and not a sign of possessive or controlling behaviour. We see many people on this forum with an 'open book' policy. It's not always recommended or a good thing, but we typically don't start worrying that there are abuse issues underlying it. Normally it's a sign of a couple inexperienced with polyamory, making unrealistic rules for one another in order to deal with insecurity. Definitely a legitimate reason for you to think twice about getting involved with Mary, but I don't think it's a sign of anything untoward in their relationship.

Speaking personally, if a lover of mine found my partner intolerable and warned me off of them, then they would politely be shown the door. I don't require my lovers to interact with my partner at all, but I do require them to trust my judgement, know I know what's best for me, and treat the important people in my life with respect and compassion. That being said, she asked a simple question, you gave an honest answer. If you and he getting along well was a pre-requisite for you and her continuing a relationship, then I think she should have been clear about that from the outset. Either way, it sounds like you and Mary are not a great match, so I agree with GalaGirl in that this may be a bullet dodged.

 

[FallenAngelina]

I agree with TenK that what you perceived to be strange behavior sounds to be in keeping with what can be normal for someone on the autism spectrum. (My 13 year old son has autism.) To say that autism is a spectrum actually is misleading - it's more like an enormous web. There's no line from "severe" to "functioning," there are just millions of individuals, each with his individual quirks, strengths, possible super abilities, challenges and super sensitivities. You judged him without much education about autism (understandably) and both of them, in turn, felt attacked and judged you back. Judgement usually leads to abrupt and tearful partings, unless the parties are open to finding a more compassionate approach.

Being with autistic people has taught me the wonderful lesson in general that ALL people have reasons for behaving the way that they do. When you're with a special needs person, it's pretty apparent, but each of us has a unique world inside. All of us make assessments of others and sometimes it's negative. What's helpful for me is to keep in the forefront of my mind that there's no such thing as a "negative person" or a "toxic person" or a "broken person," for every person is a vast web of quirks, strengths, possible super abilities, challenges and super sensitivities. Someone with autism is just someone who has little ability/interest to conform socially and thereby subvert (hide from view) the unique and complex workings of his inner web.

I know your question is about poly and you're getting some good responses about that. I just wanted to address the autism aspect and encourage you to take this as an opportunity to look more deeply into what perception of others actually is. We constantly perceive people through our own filters and make assessments according to our own way of thinking, but no other person is a statue. You see this in your opening post: You have one way of perceiving Mark and Mary has quite another. Instead of worrying about whether you or they behaved "the right way," take this as an opportunity to expand how you assess people in general.

 

[SelkieSiun]

humbo keilor Rd

I actually have Autism myself and grew up my entire life with dozens of autistic friends. This did not feel like that.

 

[FallenAngelina]

TenK, I actually have Autism myself and grew up my entire life with dozens of autistic friends. This did not feel like that.

You all live in three different states and met in person for one weekend under a pressure cooker of circumstances and intentions, so how you felt would be enormously influenced by all of that. What you describe of Mark sounds "normal" to me if he is on the Spectrum. Most ASD people do not have dozens of friends and can have what appears to be a very limited intimate life, not "abusive" in nature, but extremely insular for sure. All the same, you judged him harshly, they judged you back and there is upset all around. It's done, it's over. You can either feel crappy about what happened or you can learn from what happened.

 

[GalaGirl]

I agree with FallenAngelina. It is done. Leave it be.

Whether this weird weekend was weird because of autism or because there's abuse going on, or a bit of both, or neither? The bottom line is that you did not feel good there. And it is over. You don't have to do a weekend like that again.

It's ok to feel sad after a break up and wonder what was going on with the weird.... but after a certain point? I think you could decide to move on and could stop guessing what that was. We are all guessing here. The ones who know for sure what's going on between Mark and Mary are Mark and Mary.

Be ok not knowing their detail things. Could get back to living your regular life, and heal. Could take comfort in the fact that Mary knows how to contact you if she wants to talk to you later down. And if she does not? You have moved on. You are not postponing living your life waiting. YKWIM?

Galagirl

 

[powerpuffgrl1969]

I agree with Fallen Angelina and Gala Girl. While you many never get the answers you are seeking, that is something that happens a lot in interpersonal relationships. The idea of "closure" is a myth, and labelling a relationship as possibly abusive doesn't make an difference in this case. Don't invest any more time and energy in something that's just not going to happen. You can be using that time to heal and maybe find someone(s) who is more suited to you.

 

[kdt26417]

Hi Selkie,

I'm really sorry Mark and Mary treated you that way, they were both unkind. They have a strange relationship, but it's what they want, and there's not a lot you can do to change that. Let them depart from your life. There will be others who will treat you better.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.