New, want it to work, but struggling at times

Consider a psychiatrist rather than a psychologist.

Also, if she has seen a therapist and is still having trouble, consider seeing a different one. They're each unique in their skills, insights, and techniques, and sticking with one that isn't working might be as much about the doctor as the patient.

*hug*
 
Good advice, but it's the old 'You have to admit you have a problem' issue. She would never think she needs a psychiatrist. And what's worse is that she loves her psychologist. I am thinking that if I can get a joint session with the current psychologist I can broach subjects like 'What else can we do?' without seeming threatening.

I really want to thank you all. I have no one in the world that I can talk to about this problem, and you have all been so great. I would be lost without you. Well, I am lost, but I would be more lost. ;)
 
sagency said:
Consider a psychiatrist rather than a psychologist.
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Why? So they can prescribe? That's not always best. I think it's the rapport, methodology, and caring of the therapist that is most important. You can have very intense and healing therapy without medication.

Mine was a very experienced therapist, but not a doctor. She has an MSW. But when she told me she wanted me to take antidepressants, I found a psychiatrist to prescribe, and just saw him for med management. The meds (SSRIs) were not good for me, though, and I stopped taking them. Instead, I went to the health food store and began taking 5-HTP, which the doc also approved of as an alternative. Much better results! But I discovered that remedy through the recommendation of a professor of mine, who is a clinical psychologist.

My point is, there are wonderful therapists out there who are not shrinks (My therapist from years ago was a reverend, and the best I ever could've asked for. I saw him for about 7 years.) If you haven't seen good results with her current one, ask for recommendations from people you know.
 
It's too soon to say if we need to change. She went to one session and has another this week. At the first session, what I understand was discussed was that my wife needs to 'Work on herself,' and while doing so, 'Have fun with the threesome.' No feedback on the relationship between her and Trent.

Who knows what will come from this week's session?

I am 60% committed to keep trying. But honestly, 40% of me wants to walk and let her take the time to see what she wants. And when I say walk, I mean move out. Then I'd become the weekend dad and she'd have all the freedom she wants. It's hard to not be bitter or angry. I am trying so hard to control emotions. But I wear my heart on my sleeve, so it's a real challenge.
 
RobertCourage said:
Then I'd become the weekend dad and she'd have all the freedom she wants.
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If this were to happen, she'd have less freedom instead of more, and you would actually have more freedom than you had before, because she'd have to be there for the kids during the week, and you'd get to be happy-fun-time Dad, and then send the kids back to her.

Does she not realize this, or is the scenario you described your vision?
 
nycindie said:
Why? So they can prescribe? That's not always best. I think it's the rapport, methodology, and caring of the therapist that is most important. You can have very intense and healing therapy without medication.
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I understand your point, NYCindie. Perhaps you might consider mine. Don't leave anything off the table, prescription meds, homeopathic remedies, another therapist, etc.

I personally do not like medications, but I know for some they help. (If a doctor throws pills at you as a fix, be very careful though. Pills may be easy, but they're often not an answer, just a leg up while addressing the real problems.)

The worst therapist I ever had was a psychiatrist. The best was a psychologist. But that doesn't mean I should let that personal anecdotal evidence bias my suggestions when offering ideas as to what might help RC's wife.

My concern is that no matter how much RC's wife adores her therapist, if she is still going off the deep end, then perhaps the therapist is not as effective as needed. RC joining in some sessions is a good start and may be all that's needed, but let's not be blind to the idea that wifey might benefit from a change of tactics.
 
It might be helpful if she came here, too. I would be interested to hear her side of this. Who knows? Those who have been through this could help her, and therefore you, and your family. Is it possible for her to read some stuff here?
 
Regarding the freedom comments, heres some data to help clarify the picture.

How things are today (and have been for a while): I travel Monday through Thursday. I am typically home Friday through Sunday. When needed for big events, e.g., important doctor visits, etc., I modify my schedule to support the family. When I am home I do all I can to help with the kids, the chores, etc. I think that is my responsibility and I don't mind doing it.

I asked my wife if she wanted me to find a job where I would be home more. This would mean less time alone, and more time for her to deal with me. Her decision was to have things stay the way they are because it keeps me out of her hair, and gives her time to be with Trent, and keeps our financial situation stable. So given that decision, I have a hard time with her complaining about a lack of support.

If I move out (separation) I don't know where I would go... probably her parents' house, or a cheap rental. She would still have the kids all week while I travel. Then I would come home and take ownership of the kids. I would likely have to be at the house to do so (since the house would still need maintenance-- grass, pool, cleaning, etc.). So she would have to disappear on the weekends while I was home taking care of things. And I would then leave at night and go sleep somewhere else. That would be the arrangement. So the freedom she would gain is when I am home and she is not on the weekends. Her Monday through Thursday would be the same (which sucks during summer, but summer only has 7 weeks left). Then the kids go back to school and her days become a little easier.

So there's no easy answer to the logistics of this. And the impact on the kids is paramount. This is when I wonder if separation makes sense. My responsibilities at home would remain unchanged. The kids would be deeply affected. My wife's week would be unaffected. Which means it's almost easier for me to suck it up, stay at home, keep the kids oblivious, and occasionally have nice moments with my wife (and occasionally want to die because of the impossibility of the situation).

Sorry for the long note. I am at work and my brain is going a mile a minute and that's reflected here!
 
I'm sorry. I just don't get it. Doesn't she want to spend any time with the kids? They are hers, aren't they? I thought the bond between mother and child was supposed to be stronger than any other bond known to humankind.
 
She does love them and enjoys them. But she's burnt out. She wants time to be herself and not answer to anyone. That's what she told me.
 
She should be the one to find someplace else to hole up over the weekends. It's your home and your kids. If she doesn't like it, she can vacate on the weekends, IMO.

She turned down the idea of a nanny, so why not get a housekeeper to come in once a week instead? (I would kill for one. :p) Also get the kids in some summer all-day activities. That makes a world of difference, even if it's just one or two days a week or even a half day. I fully understand feeling like a single parent 4-5 days a week. It can be extremely draining, both emotionally and physically.

It does sound like she is feeling desperate, depressed, and grasping at anything within reach.

I think going to therapy with her would be a good idea.
 
RobertCourage said:
She wants time to be herself and not answer to anyone. That's what she told me.
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I'm going to judge her now, according to this new information.

Well, la-dee-da. I want "time to myself" and to not have to "answer to" anyone, too. I had that once, when I spent 30 days in a psychiatric hospital. Oh, but I forgot, I did have to answer to "anyone."

How I do wish I could spread my wings and fly away! Away, away, away from all the oppressive things in my life that my husband's ample paycheck has been so generously providing for me all these years! It's just cramping my style!

What, you ask? Of course I expect to still reap the benefits of said ample paycheck while I find my true self and eschew the weight of my adult responsibilities! And in order to do so, I must leave now and go have sex with my 10-years-younger hipster man-child-friend!

This is something that only wealthy people get to do. It is not something the rest of us have the privilege of doing. Oh damn. There goes the dreaded "p" word (privilege). Well, I guess rich people have problems too. I just keep forgetting.

Seriously, you'd better get her on here to give us her side of the story. I have quite an imagination, and when you add alcohol to that, there's no telling where this might end up eventually.
 
OK. I am going to keep in mind that we're getting only your side of the story. Going with that... your wife is acting like a spoiled toddler. I get burnout, I get overwhelming responsibility, I get needing breaks, I get needing me time. I was a military wife for years and would go 6 months at a time with NO breaks from the children when my husband was out to sea. As a mom, you suck it up, find ways to cope, figure out how to have kid-free time and find ways to express yourself without pulling the chute and jumping out of the plane. It's called being a grown-up.

When you say the therapist said to have fun with the threesome, I'm getting the feeling perhaps your wife is not telling her therapist the whole story... or hasn't yet (it can take quite a few sessions to get into everything), including her wanting to run away and just be with Trent by herself.

I think couples counseling would be very valuable-- maybe with a different counselor though, it's usually best to not go to couples counseling with the same therapist that is one of the partner's personal therapist. She can continue to see hers, but I do think maybe you need to see one together so that both of your views/sides/issues can be addressed. The fact that she is being offered help (nanny/housekeeper, etc.) and keeps saying no and then complaining, to me, seems like something deeper is going on. Maybe some sort of midlife crisis-- hate to be cliche-- but it does happen that sometimes the responsibility builds up and the person then feels like the ONLY solution is to leave it all behind.

Regardless, I think couples counseling will be helpful, whether you decide to separate or not. If nothing else, they can help you and her clarify what's going on, and be a support person if you do decide to separate.
 
Minxxa said:
OK. I am going to keep in mind that we're getting only your side of the story. Going with that... your wife is acting like a spoiled toddler.
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Spoiled TEENAGER. What would a parent say to a teenager who wanted "freedom to do as I please"? This is what MY parent said:

"If you want your freedom so much, get your own job, your own place, and pay for your own freedom with your own money."

And that is exactly what I did. Do I get "tired" of my "freedom"? You bet. But unfortunately I am not independently wealthy so I have to buy my own freedom or else figure out a way to have someone else buy it for me. My husband only makes enough money to barely afford his own freedom. And yet, somehow we manage.
 
NeonKaos said:
Spoiled TEENAGER. What would a parent say to a teenager who wanted "freedom to do as I please"?
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I've been having the same thought go through my head lately whenever I hear of people just freaking out that they have some responsibility and they "want to do whatever they want and not answer to anyone."

"What would you say if your child was acting/behaving and talking like you are right now?"


:eek:
 
Minxxa said:
"What would you say if your child was acting/behaving and talking like you are right now?":eek:
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It's even worse when the teenager is the one to recognize your bad behavior and calls you on it and you hear your own words coming back at you. :eek:
 
Another side to the coin, just to play devil's advocate:

I think pretty much everyone has those feelings and fantasies from time to time, of needing to get a break from everyday responsibilities. Most of us know we can't get away with that.

So... how much of her behavior was enabled by the OP? How much of not wanting to rock the boat or avoiding the reality of the situation was being done by the spouse who is now complaining about it? They started out both taking part in threesomes with her current boyfriend. Did RC (the OP) conveniently overlook the ramifications, and keep his blinders on to avoid really seeing indications that something was wrong or bothering her, so he could get his jollies by watching another guy bang his wife?

He seems to have indicated that she's had emotional/relationship issues in the past, so where was he in "cleaning house" and making sure that she -- and their relationship -- was strong enough to handle this? Before letting a new person into the equation? It's easy to throw up one's hands and place blame when one's comfort zones are maxed out, but what was the part he played in getting there? Things didn't get this rocky all by itself, and she didn't start accumulating such dissatisfaction in a vacuum. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt, y'know.
 
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Damn. Just typed a response and lost it. So here it goes again.

1. Regarding the threesome. Everyone went into that with eyes wide open and rules. It was all about fun and sex. Rule was if there were feelings developing (during threesome or outside of threesone) she was to tell me immediately so it would be able to be addressed. It's not like we didn't talk about the risk. We did. And we had an agreement. Instead of adhering to that agreement she chose to keep her feelings a secret, and worse, pull away from me.

So I am guilty of being naive and trusting her. I should have known that, given her state of mind and past history, this is what would happen.

2. Regarding the 'suck it up and be an adult' theme I see in the responses, I have to say she works hard for the kids. The schedule and logistics are crazy most of the time. And doing it alone would drive anyone crazy. I appreciate all she does and I understand her frustratin. But I don't agree with her solution. I don't run from my problems. And I respect the deals I have made with people I love. I wish she could see that I love and support her, no matter what. But the newness of him is too powerful and she is lovestruck.

I am sure that she would paint a slightly different story if she posted here. But the general story would be consistent with what I have written.
 
RobertCourage said:
It was all about fun and sex. Rule was if there were feelings developing (during threesome or outside of threesone) she was to tell me immediately so it would be able to be addressed. It's not like we didnt talk about the risk. We did. And we had an agreement. Instead of adhering to that agreement she chose to keep her feelings a secret And worse, pull away from me.
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And again I ask, as I did earlier in the thread, why it is perfectly fine to you for another man to use your wife's body to get off, but not to love and care about her? Why do you approve of her being a wet slit for fucking, but not a person who wants and needs love and passion? Do you see how that could be a way of looking at her as your property, and nothing more than a sex toy to be passed around? There's a dichotomy there, when you "allow" one but not the other, and I think perhaps there's important information in there for you to consider. She has to look at her part, of course, and why she went along with that. But you encouraged it, yet wonder why she wants an escape hatch from her life.

FYI, I pose these questions not as a criticism but as a way to look at what elements you may have contributed. We must always ask ourselves the tough questions in order to gain clarity and insight. If knowledge is power, self-knowledge is... everything!
 
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Because sex is primal, physical, does not mean that my marrriage may end and is short lived. Because an orgasm releases stress and feels good.

A relationship is not short lived. It does put my marriage and family at risk. And it takes away time from the limited amount of time we have together. And it makes me feel like I am a failure as a husband.

Maybe that sounds like bullshit. But that's what I feel.
 
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