Sex too soon?

M

MsEmotional

Member
In relationships — poly or otherwise — is there such a thing as having sex too soon?

I ask because I am confused about a situation I am going through right now.

I am having a really difficult time reading Whiskers. He seems not that into me. I am finding myself pulling away from him because I am feeling like he isn’t investing all that much in me....and I think he can tell that I am feeling weird and is therefore trying to be “nice” but that is just making me feel more confused.

I talked to my therapist and she said that direct communication is my friend and I should talk to him about the confusion I am experiencing and ask him to clarify his thoughts/intentions. Okay, so I am planning to do that...

But in the meantime, I am wondering if some of the issue is that we had sex too soon? Like, we had sex when we both felt comfortable and wanted it, but maybe sex falsely escalated the degree to which I believe we should be able to communicate, when actually we aren’t there yet? I think he is still in the “getting to know you stage” — which makes sense and I don’t exactly fault him for being in that stage, but it feels odd to be still in the flakey “we’re still feeling each other out” stage of dating when you are having sex.

So, if I did have sex with him too soon (for me, for his level of interest in me, for our level if communication with each other) what do we do now?
 
You are your own worst enemy.

My advice is STOP OVERTHINKING. When you find yourself starting find a distraction. Get involved in something that will require your undivided attention. Go play with your kids. Do a hobby. Listen to music and dance like a mad woman.

I had sex with Butch on our third date. Murf it was the second date. I just enjoy the moment.
 
For me, physical intimacy brings about a giddiness about the other person and a wish to act partner-y, which is exaggerated in the days after said intimacy, and happens even with people I have otherwise no relationship, or a friend relationship, with. Not all people react the same though, and also I'm observing that with more experience I'm slightly more able to separate this giddy sunshiny longing for the person I was intimate with from the expectations I've put on a partner, i.e. the link intimacy=partnership is being weakened.

Something similar may be going on with you, where you have certain expectations connected to sex. Doing what you already did in your first post - reminding yourself that there's no reason for the relationship to suddenly make a jump ahead on all fronts - is certainly a good strategy.

If there is something you need from Whiskers after you've had sex, like clarification or reassurance, I agree with your therapist that direct communication is your friend.
 
Hi MsE,

Some people are into casual (NSA) sex, and that is fine ... but, I am thinking that for you, sex comes with an emotional connection. It's possible that Whiskers is a relatively-casual-sex type of guy, which would explain why he is less inclined to get more involved with you even after sex. On the other hand, if this is mostly a matter of, you wanted/expected an increased level of communication, it may just be that Whiskers is less of a communicator than you are, it might not have much to do with the timing of the sex.

As far as what to do now (if you did have sex too soon), I'm not sure if that genie can be put back in the bottle. Even if you stopped having sex with Whiskers, you would still know that you *had* had sex with him (at least one time), and that knowledge would no doubt affect how you feel. On the other hand, maybe you feel less inclined than you did to have sex with him, when the relationship is less close than you thought it was. I guess you just have to decide if sex with him is something you want right now.

If you can identify a specific need in this relationship, such as you need more communication with him, you could just tell him that and then go from there. After all, what looks like closeness to him may differ from what looks like closeness to you. Does that make sense?

Hopefully you and he can work things out.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
Isn't it more like that Whiskers is giving you space to deal with you being in limbo regarding your relationship with Ponytail? Or, possibly, that Whiskers is pulling away in case you decide to end things with him to make Ponytail happy.

Sex too soon is not the problem. You are definitely overthinking.
 
You are all very wise. Thank you.
 
I don't think there is a thing as too soon as long as both people want to enthusiastically.

I fucked my husband on our first date. My new boyfriend wanted to wait a little while first and he expressed that. We waited four dates before having sex, and that worked fine too.

I generally prefer sooner rather than later because it helps me assess if there is good sexual chemistry before putting in too much time, but of course all within what my partner wants, too. The person at the slowest speed decides the sexual pace.
 
"Too soon" is EXTREMELY subjective. It has nothing to do with whether you're poly or mono; it has only to do with *you* as a person. (Where "you" means "anyone," not specifically MsEmotional.)

For me, "too soon" to have sex with someone is before I feel comfortable with them. But I tend not to be sexually interested in someone I don't have an almost-instant "click" with when we meet, meaning that if I have sex with someone, it's usually someone I'm comfortable with from the moment we say hello to each other. So it's entirely possible for me to have sex with someone the night I meet them, even if it isn't a "date," as happened with Hubby. Some people would say that's too soon, but *for me*, it wasn't because we had that instant comfort with each other.

On the flip side, with my boyfriend, a few weeks went by before sex happened, and because he's hard to read and didn't act like the guys I'd been involved with previously, and a few weeks had gone by with almost no physical affection and zero mention of sex, I had actually decided he was only interested in me platonically until the night I was at his place with other friends, and after they left he asked if I wanted to spend the night with him. (I'd actually become so certain he wasn't interested in anything sexual with me that it literally took me about two hours to realize that was what he was asking for...To be fair, he wasn't exactly clear, or at least not clear enough for overly-literal me.)

I also occasionally go to parties where sex and kink happen, and sometimes I hook up with guys there whose names I find out as they're approaching me for sex. But that's a different situation, because context... these are parties where that kind of thing is expected (in the sense that people know it's going to happen, not that it *has to* happen).

So yeah. "Too soon" depends on the people involved.

I will say, MsEmotional, after rereading your OP... first of all, I agree with Dagferi. You are sometimes your own worst enemy (this is coming from someone who has the same tendency), and you are overthinking. I have to wonder if you're thinking that Whiskers thinks you had sex too soon because that's actually what *you* think and you're projecting it onto him? I wonder that because it seems to be the conclusion you immediately jumped to, and because you say it's "weird" to be still getting to know each other when you're having sex. (Personally, for me that wouldn't be weird at all, as noted above; that's how the majority of my relationships and some of my friendships have gone. But again... this is subjective.) It's totally valid if, for you, sex needs to be a thing that doesn't happen until *after* the getting-to-know-you stage is over, but if that's the case, it might be good in the future to make sure you and the guy are in agreement that you are both past that stage.

Also, though, again because I have the same tendency, I think that for you, sex or a declaration of a relationship *does* lead you to expect more communication and emotional connection than might be warranted at that stage, or than the other person is able to provide at that point. That doesn't mean it won't develop, just that, as you said, you escalate it beyond where it actually is.

I would suggest you *try* to stop thinking and wondering so much, because all you're doing is creating problems where there might not be any, and if you continue, it's very likely that by the time you actually do get around to talking to Whiskers, you'll have already set your mind on, "We had sex too soon and that's why this is happening," and you'll go into the conversation from that standpoint, which will color how the entire conversation goes. Instead, try reminding yourself that you have no way at all to know what's in his head--and neither do strangers on an internet forum--and stop speculating about it. If *you* feel that you and he had sex too soon, that's something you need to examine; why did you do it, and why do you feel that it was too soon? But you don't know if that's what *he* feels, and you won't until you ask him.
 
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KC43 said:
I will say, MsEmotional, after rereading your OP... first of all, I agree with Dagferi. You are sometimes your own worst enemy (this is coming from someone who has the same tendency), and you are overthinking. I have to wonder if you're thinking that Whiskers thinks you had sex too soon because that's actually what *you* think and you're projecting it onto him? I wonder that because it seems to be the conclusion you immediately jumped to, and because you say it's "weird" to be still getting to know each other when you're having sex. (Personally, for me that wouldn't be weird at all, as noted above; that's how the majority of my relationships and some of my friendships have gone. But again... this is subjective.) It's totally valid if, for you, sex needs to be a thing that doesn't happen until *after* the getting-to-know-you stage is over, but if that's the case, it might be good in the future to make sure you and the guy are in agreement that you are both past that stage.

Also, though, again because I have the same tendency, I think that for you, sex or a declaration of a relationship *does* lead you to expect more communication and emotional connection than might be warranted at that stage, or than the other person is able to provide at that point. That doesn't mean it won't develop, just that, as you said, you escalate it beyond where it actually is.

I would suggest you *try* to stop thinking and wondering so much, because all you're doing is creating problems where there might not be any, and if you continue, it's very likely that by the time you actually do get around to talking to Whiskers, you'll have already set your mind on, "We had sex too soon and that's why this is happening," and you'll go into the conversation from that standpoint, which will color how the entire conversation goes. Instead, try reminding yourself that you have no way at all to know what's in his head--and neither do strangers on an internet forum--and stop speculating about it. If *you* feel that you and he had sex too soon, that's something you need to examine; why did you do it, and why do you feel that it was too soon? But you don't know if that's what *he* feels, and you won't until you ask him.
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I should clarify that I wasn’t worried that *he* thought it was too soon. I was just confused as to what I should do, given that I had assumed a level of investment that he isn’t ready to give and I feel awkward and weird to be “getting to know” someone at the same time as having sex with them.
 
FWIW?

I had assumed a level of investment that he isn’t ready to give and I feel awkward and weird to be “getting to know” someone at the same time as having sex with them.
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Well if you assuming things (behavior) leads to feeling awkward and weird(feelings that ensue) -- you could stop assuming.

I think you sometimes assume things then go on impulse and then overthink it later when you realize "Hey... I assumed some things. Maybe they don't think like me."

I think you could STOP assuming things and communicate more directly as your therapist advises.

Talk BEFORE the thing.

In future? If you are going to expect a certain level of investment after sharing sex? Say so. Tell the person that so they know. Ask what they expect. Then decide together whether or not to share sex at this time from a place of full info or wait.

If you want to have "no strings, no expectations" sex... stop putting expectations of a certain level of investment on it and expect nothing. Then say so. Tell the person that so they know you expect nothing. Ask what they expect. Then decide together whether or not to share sex from a place of full info at this time or wait.

So, if I did have sex with him too soon (for me, for his level of interest in me, for our level if communication with each other) what do we do now?
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At this point it if feels awkward? Could STOP sharing more sex til you talk about expectations to make sure you are on the same page.
Could keep it simple and take action rather than overthinking and doing "what if this, what it that?" and making yourself confused.

It seems you skipped talking about expectations before sharing sex and now you feel weird sharing MORE sex without knowing if you are on the same page. Talk it out even if the expectation is "no expectations yet." Then at least you both are CLEAR on that and can decide if you will give continuing consent or not.

Galagirl
 
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GalaGirl said:
At this point it if feels awkward? Could STOP sharing more sex til you talk about expectations to make sure you are on the same page.
Could keep it simple and take action rather than overthinking and doing "what if this, what it that?" and making yourself confused.

It seems you skipped talking about expectations before sharing sex and now you feel weird sharing MORE sex without knowing if you are on the same page. Talk it out even if the expectation is "no expectations yet." Then at least you both are CLEAR on that and can decide if you will give continuing consent or not.

Galagirl
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Yes, my plan is definitely to talk about it and to not have sex until I feel like I have a better understanding of what underlying expectations I have. Keep in mind, I am super inexperienced with this...I have only had PIV sex with two people...ever. And those were both long-term relationships in which I am still currently involved. So while I recognize that I am making assumptions, I don’t have much experience to go off of when it comes to anticipating where I am making assumptions and where I am correctly interpreting a person’s actions and words.

I guess what I am saying is that I am planning to talk to him more directly, but I am trying to figure out how to make that conversation as direct and clear as possible. Like, if he were to ask me if I had an expectation that he text me x number of times a day, I wouldn’t say yes. But if you asked me if I had an expectation that he, you know, smile at me like he means it, I would say yes. But that is totally not quantifiable.

So what options are available when you want to talk to someone about the level/reciprocity of the relationship? And if I decide that I don’t want to consent to more sex without more investment, how do I frame that? Do I say, “let’s stop having sex until/unless you like me more?”
 
I think part of the problem here is that you don't *think* he's that invested in you.... but as you said, you're struggling to read him. So it sounds like you really don't even know.

I think the first convo you need to have is "hey, I'm feeling like you're still sorta not that into me, or just feeling pretty casual about this, but I really can't tell because I can't read you. So can we talk about where things stand?" And then once you have a better sense of how he feels about you, and what sort of behaviors he does when he's into someone, THEN you can figure out, ok, how does that related to the level of sexual intimacy that I want with this person.
 
I have only had PIV sex with two people...ever. And those were both long-term relationships in which I am still currently involved. So while I recognize that I am making assumptions, I don’t have much experience to go off of when it comes to anticipating where I am making assumptions and where I am correctly interpreting a person’s actions and words.
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I think you tell yourself self-limiting things. :(

I think you could stop making it be only about the people you have had PIV sex with. Take a step back and view your OTHER relating experiencing with people -- friends, coworkers, family, etc. You have many relating experiences with them. You also keep a blog thread where you can look back to where you maybe assumed something and it went another way to help you learn.

Because "direct communication" and "not making assumptions" and "learning to read body language" and "correctly interpret someone's words" and/or "do active listening" are relationship/communication skills that can apply to ALL your relationships. Not just the PIV sexual ones.

I guess what I am saying is that I am planning to talk to him more directly, but I am trying to figure out how to make that conversation as direct and clear as possible.
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Well... could do it in two ways off the top of my head. First a direct way.

DIRECT

Step 1: Obtain consent to converse.

"Whiskers, can we talk for like an hour? Is this a good time or shall we set an appointment? I wanted to talk to you about things on my mind and our relationship. (Wait for consent and/or set an appointment. Don't dump things on people from the sky. Esp not right before work.)​

Step 2: When appointment time rolls around...

"Whiskers, I was feeling weird recently. We talked enough to agree that we wanted to share sex. Which was fun. But I realized we didn't really talk if that was going to be a one time thing or what.

To me? We are still in the "getting to know you" place. By the time I share sex with someone I'm usually further along in the relationship and know the partner pretty well. So even though I wanted to share sex and am happy we did? I think I may have shared sex too soon for me, for your level of interest in me, for our level if communication with each other. Or maybe I'm wrong. I would like to clear that up.

What is your level of interest in me? I'm interested in developing things with you, but I cannot tell how into me you are with all the other stuff going on -- like Ponytail breaking up with me or not breaking up with me. I wanted to check in on that.

What is our level of communication? I think we're still getting to know each other. Sometimes you seem laid back or aloof -- or maybe I'm misreading that because I'm still learning you? I know someone is into me when they do (list behaviors.) What do you normally do to show interest?

My preference for sex is to hold off before going there again and let some of this other stuff catch up before letting the physical side get too far ahead of the rest. I want a more balanced approach to growing this relationship.

What you want out of the relationship? What are your thoughts about how to balance these things out?"​

Something like that. Don't overthink it. Just get it out there.

WORK IN PROGRESS

Or... a more "work in progress" way. You could print this whole thread and give it to him to read with something like...

"I am not great at direct communication. So I apologize if this seems circle-y. For me it is a bold step.

I wanted to update you on what's been on my mind lately. I'm working on direct communication with my therapist and hope to improve. I also asked online for help.

But I don't want to shelve this conversation until I'm finally good at it. So here, even if a bit wonky.

Please read and let me know your thoughts. I care to know."​

Pick one or the other and call it good enough. Don't fall into the overthinking trap again and start spinning new circles.

Take action and move it forward would be my suggestions.

Confidence is grown by doing. Not from sitting around.

GL!
Galagirl :)
 
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Okay, so here are some of the thoughts I have so far... obviously the conversation will flow as it will need to, but these are the thoughts that I have in my head for possible things I might say, depending on how things go.

“I have a hard time reading you. In general, I tend to be pretty perceptive and I am comfortable with my ability to read social situations. But when the signals I am getting are ambiguous or contradictory, I tend to fill in the gaps with my own narrative. Sometimes that narrative is accurate and sometimes it is inaccurate — but by and large it just isn’t productive and so I am trying to be more direct in my communication.”

“I tend to be pretty comfortable being vulnerable. I usually make the first move, I am fine being in the driver’s seat. But that doesn’t mean that I am comfortable charging ahead without clear signals.”

“You strike me as more reserved than I am, which is fine, but it makes me have a hard time reading your level of interest when the vulnerability that I put out is not mirrored back.”

“Do you remember that time when you told me how online dating makes you feel? You likened talking to strangers online to playing catch with a person who makes no effort to catch the ball or throw it back to you. The ball bounces off of the other person and then you apologize and go to pick it up for them...then you try to throw the ball to them again. Honestly? That’s kind of how I have been feeling in our interactions too. I feel like I initiate a conversation and you may or may not respond, you might respond but not really engage, etc. It’s the same with asking out....last week I asked if you were busy on a specific date. Now if you were interested in seeing me but not available on October 20, what I would expect is for you to respond with a specific alternative date. Instead, you said you’d be willing to get together ‘some other date’ which leaves me in a strange position. I mean, I have a whole calendar of days in front of me, so if you want me to just guess at which days will work for you, I can. But like I said, I don’t really know if that’s what you want me to do. So it feels, to me, like I threw the ball to you, you kind of caught it and rolled it back towards me...so now I am left with the choices of leaving the ball on the ground and hoping you might pick it up when you are ready to play catch, walking up to the ball and kind of kicking it back to you as well, or picking up the ball and throwing it back. Because it is my general personality to schedule, plan, and communicate, my instinct is to just keep tossing you the ball, but in doing so without reciprocation, I have more opportunities to create narratives in my head about what your intentions are — and when I create my own narratives, I am not always kind to myself.”
 
Sounds like a good plan so far.
 
Good enough. Or could go even simpler. I quote just to visually block it off:

“I have a hard time reading you. When I get mixed signals I'll guess and sometimes I guess wrong. So I am trying to be more direct and just ask you.

“I'm ok making the first move and asking you out. But that doesn’t mean that I am comfortable charging ahead without clear signals. How do you show actual interest?

“Last week I asked you out. You said you’d be willing to get together ‘some other date." You did not suggest what date would be good for you. Is that you interested and wanting to go out or is that you letting me down easy? It's too vague for me. I cannot tell if you are actually interested. Could you please be willing to be more specific? Like...

If you don't want to go out that week, say "No, thanks. Not this week."

If you do and like my suggested date, say "yes, thanks. That date works."

If you do want to get together but want a different date, suggest a specific date rather than "some other date." "Yes, but not X date. How about Y date?"

Could you be willing to do that?"
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You say "I tend to be pretty comfortable being vulnerable" but then you don't seem to want to just put it out there.

Put it out there. Be direct.

As for sharing more sex? If you don't want to until you know each other better? Just don't share more sex. If he asks why, tell him the truth. You enjoyed it but think you jumped the gun a bit and want to spend some time getting to know each other better first. Rather than let the physical part jump way ahead of the rest.

Galagirl
 
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GalaGirl said:
Good enough. Or could go even simpler. I quote just to visually block it off:



You say "I tend to be pretty comfortable being vulnerable" but then you don't seem to want to just put it out there.

Put it out there. Be direct.

As for sharing more sex? If you don't want to until you know each other better? Just don't share more sex. If he asks why, tell him the truth. You enjoyed it but think you jumped the gun a bit and want to spend some time getting to know each other better first. Rather than let the physical part jump way ahead of the rest.

Galagirl
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Thank you! This kind of simplification is exactly what I needed.
 
Glad it helped you some.

Sometimes keeping it super simple and "easier to digest" is better when communicating with someone.

1 topic per conversation, and using shorter sentences. In this case, how he shows interest when you ask him out.

I encourage you to work with therapist on more direct conversation and less overthinking. Also asking clarifying questions in the moment.

Cuz when I read that I thought "Why didn't she go 'Could you be willing to clarify? When you say 'some other date' -- Is that letting me down easy that you don't want to go out this week? Or you telling me you need time to check your calendar and you will get back to me tomorrow?"

To ask and solve it in the moment would have saved you all the time spent overthinking it. YKWIM?

Now you have to go back and ask the clarification questions. Which is good, and it gets it solved. But it's the longer way around.

Maybe "more action, less over thinking" could serve you better?

Galagirl
 
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GalaGirl said:
You say "I tend to be pretty comfortable being vulnerable" but then you don't seem to want to just put it out there.
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You’re right. It’s not hat I feel comfortable being vulnerable (although that’s how my therapist framed it), it’s that I feel comfortable showing my feelings.

I should maybe frame this more as “I tend to be pretty comfortable taking initiative and showing interest, but this can leave me feeling vulnerable and uncertain if don't get clear signals that that interest is reciprocated.”
 
You’re right. It’s not that I feel comfortable being vulnerable (although that’s how my therapist framed it), it’s that I feel comfortable showing my feelings.
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I will gently disagree. Because when asking him out you were uncertain/confused. And didn't seem to want to show it in the moment. Where you could have shown it and gone "I'm confused. When you say "some other date" is that letting me down easy or that you needing time to check your calendar?"

I'm not trying to nitpick here. Just saying... you could become more comfortable showing your feelings to the people in real life that need to see it. You express your emotions more freely here, but it's like you hold back with the people in your real life.

I should maybe frame this more as “I tend to be pretty comfortable taking initiative and showing interest, but this can leave me feeling vulnerable and uncertain if don't get clear signals that that interest is reciprocated.”
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I organize things as (behavior) then (feelings). I believe after X action or thinking behavior, Y feelings will ensue. I would frame it as "I am willing to take initiative and show interest by asking him out. (action behavior) If I don't get clear signals that interest is reciprocated, I think he is not interested (thinking behavior). Then I feel vulnerable and uncertain. (feelings that ensue)"

Organized like that? It tells me what to do to fix the uncertainty/wrong thinking or assumption. I need more info to become certain.

I could ask clarifying questions like what does he mean by "some other date? "

Or ask for clearer behavior I CAN deal with like the list above:

  • If you don't want to go out that week, say "No, thanks. Not this week."
  • If you do and like my suggested date, say "yes, thanks. That date works."
  • If you do want to get together but want a different date, suggest a specific date rather than "some other date." "Yes, but not X date. How about Y date?"

So maybe organizing thoughts that way could help you also. So you can keep this stuff easier on you and overthink less?

Galagirl
 
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