The "C" Word

I kinda feel like what both of you are saying are actually illustrating my point.

First of all, my point isn't that they are EXACTLY the same.

My point is - you can love more than one kid. No one says you are a bad person/unable to commit/treating your kids poorly for having more than one kid/loving more than one kid.

I am NOT saying that they're exactly the same type of relationship. Obviously they're not, in so many ways.

But the things that both of you wrote back:

PokéGirl especially ends up feeling left out, or shorted by all sorts of things ("DanceGirl got a piece of candy!" "Yeah, but you just had a cookie!" // "You went to the mall with DanceGirl! I want to go to LocalComicShop and buy Magic Cards with you!").

Most people I know who grew up in multi child households are very well aware of how one quarter of a cake can be bigger than the other 3 quarters.

Lots of parents - while they may feel love and may act in love ways toward their children - are not entirely equipped with sufficient time, money and energy to be able to maintain all of those relationships and keep them healthy.

If they were, it wouldn't be so common for people to grow up with mental health problems that came from their childhoods.


How many times have we heard a variation on these scenarios here?

One partner is upset that the hinge spends more time/energy/focus on the other partner.

Someone is concerned that their hinge partner is beyond polysaturated and doesn't have the time/energy/money to maintain all their relationships.

People get into poly and then get out of it, because they feel like it made them crazy/mentally ill/insecure/deeply unhappy.

To paraphrase YouAreHere: Just because you love your partners doesn't mean the balance is always correct, or that they're feeling all that great about it all the time.

I think the biggest differences between poly/having kids are that - in poly - the people on both sides of the equation have more tools to address them. Unhappy partners can break up with a partner, which kids certainly can't do to parents unless there is gross abuse/neglect. Unhappy partners (hopefully) have more emotional tools and life experience than children to go to another partner about any of the above examples and try to work through them.

Though based on some of my poly experiences, and some of the children I've known, I'm not going to say that being adult means you're naturally better equipped than a child to work through these things. I've seen emotionally aware children that had great parents be far more able to express their feelings clearly to their parents than some adults can do when trying to talk to another adult about their feelings.

But, those exact examples that you both brought up are things that I can point out to someone who does have kids and is familiar with them and use as examples of situations that arise in poly and can be worked out by all parties, much more equally than children, yes. Though OTOH, one thing I HAVE heard people say is that - as the kids get older - parenting multiple kids often involves watching the kids work out conflict between each other for themselves, or helping kids figure out what needs to be done to help them feel better/more secure (versus when they're younger, and parents are more often needed to take the lead and do those things for the children) and then providing feedback on whether or not the proposed solution is workable.

Similar to a conflict happening between partners and those two needing to go to a 3rd partner/metamour and saying: We think that X solution might help with this problem we're having. How do you feel about that solution? Are you comfortable with it? Will it work for you?

Does that make sense?

Again, not saying they're exactly the same. They are definitely not exactly the same. But a lot of the problem-solving dynamics can be similar, and to get back to my original point, people don't generally say "having multiple children is unfair to all the kids/shows a lack of commitment to your first child" in the same way that they might say "having multiple partners is unfair to all your partners/shows a lack of commitment".
 
Ah... Yes, I need to remember the topic of the thread. :eek: I'll back off a bit on my vehement dislike of the analogy in this case. Where I really hate the analogy is when it's used to explain how poly people can love more than one person, because the two types of love just don't relate at all for me. Apples and elephants.

In terms of commitment, though, it *does* illustrate how the two scenarios would be similar. You're absolutely right. :p

So... because my train of thought derails constantly, I just had this thought pop up:

Some poly folks get miffed when they hear mono folks say, "I could never do that." Yet, here I am thinking about my friends who have more than 5 kids and I say to myself the exact same thing (well, at my age, I'm also saying, "Oh Dear God, no!!"). It's not a judgment call on them, but it's certainly not something I would ever want to do for myself, for various reasons.

I may actually be tempted to bring out a "child analogy" of my own the next time I have a conversation with someone who's miffed about being told "I could never do that," just to see if there are situations in which that holds true for them... and if so, then why is one such statement offensive while the other isn't?

(Maybe the answer is that we're emotionally connected to things that are perceived as attacks on our identity. When we're detached from that identity, it's not so emotional, and not such a knee-jerk reaction.)

Just ruminating and threadjacking again. Come back, brain! Come back!! :eek:
 
While I was writing, I had a moment of "what are we talking about here again? Oh yeah, commitment! Am I writing about commitment? Oh yeah, this is commitment related!" :)

I think we need some thread spin offs, because based on what you and IP wrote, I'm wondering if there's any kind of...correlation? Relation? Between relationship style based on childhood experiences.

Mainly the idea that people who came from multi-child homes who felt like they never got enough might be more adverse to poly than those raised in a home where everybody worked together to make love/time/affection plentiful. Being an only child, I have no idea how any of that works, but I've garnered (over the years) and amazing array of stories from friends with siblings that range from loving all their siblings, to loving one & hating one, or hating all of them, or hating the parents for having so many siblings, or hating how the parents treated them and/or a particular sibling...

And I'm hijacking too. Definitely the subject of a new post. :)

But in terms of commitment, and looking back at the original post, I think I already said I want to say about the kid thing. When it comes to being committed to multiple people, I also wonder if work scenarios or other family scenarios that have a sort of "commitment-lite" to them would make helpful examples. Like if someone has multiple siblings and they are close to them. My understanding is that some families, there is tension between certain siblings at times, but they're all sort of committed to working things out and staying a family together, one that meets on holidays and shares their lives a lot. Does that translate at all?

Or at work, if someone works on a team. I would guess that everybody makes a commitment to work together to get something done. In that case, it's way less emotional (hopefully) that deeper relationships (though there are those people for whom their job is their life), but there is that idea of committing to work with a group of people, even if you maybe don't like all of them. My work, I have my job, which is one sliver of the overall process. I work closely with 2 other people, who manage the facets of our product that are closely linked to my part. Then there are 3 other people, who work more with the 2 people I work with (but rarely work directly with me). Sometimes we all have different goals and needs. Sometimes those goals and needs conflict. But we all work together to commit to getting our widget make the right way and to the market place at the right time. There are arguments and compromises, and sometimes painful talks where you have to let go of your ego and acknowledge that what you want ISN'T the most important part of things right now and let your desires take a back seat to someone else's desires.

Hope that makes sense, and is maybe helpful to the originally subject, even if it isn't a great analogy.
 
I think we need some thread spin offs, because based on what you and IP wrote, I'm wondering if there's any kind of...correlation? Relation? Between relationship style based on childhood experiences.

Mainly the idea that people who came from multi-child homes who felt like they never got enough might be more adverse to poly than those raised in a home where everybody worked together to make love/time/affection plentiful. Being an only child, I have no idea how any of that works, but I've garnered (over the years) and amazing array of stories from friends with siblings that range from loving all their siblings, to loving one & hating one, or hating all of them, or hating the parents for having so many siblings, or hating how the parents treated them and/or a particular sibling...

And I'm hijacking too. Definitely the subject of a new post. :)

I probably won't be any help there, except as an outlier on your chart. I was an only child until I was 15. :p

I love the ebb and flow of conversations. :D

At any rate, getting back on topic, it *was* tough for me to figure out how Chops could be committed to both me and Xena. In practice, no, there usually aren't huge conflicts between our needs, but when I think of life-partnery, living-together types of things (especially when Chops considers both homes to be "home" to him), and he's not here when something craptacular happens (mold in the cellar, 2 feet of snow and the snowblower isn't working), I have taken it as "he's not here for me when he said he would be," and I have felt abandoned.

I have had to compromise on what my expectations of "commitment" are. I know he wants to be there for the both of us (and would split himself in two if he could), but he can't. Not with circumstances being what they are (the two homes 1.5 hours apart). I've found that for me, it's a workable (if not ideal) compromise. For others, I know it wouldn't be - they would need or want more out of a committed partner. I still occasionally question it for myself, to be honest, but come to the conclusion that it works, even if it's hard at times.

How can he be committed to both me and Xena? Because we're both willing to accept what that "commitment" offers... and what it doesn't. Commitment, it seems, is in the eye of the beholder.
 
I'm an only child whose parents didn't particularly want children at all... So I didn't get much time or attention. Hubby insists that's why I'm polyamorous, because I didn't have enough love earlier in my life.

I also had three "uncles" when I was growing up. My dad's best friend from high school and the friend's two partners, who lived as a committed triad for about 20 years, until my dad's friend passed away. They were the healthiest relationship I witnessed, so Hubby thinks that has something to do with it too.

I believe I *am* poly in the same way I *am* straight, but it is possible that Hubby's right that the reason I currently act on it is to bring more love into my life. Though given my typical tendency to reject love and refuse to believe it, I'm not entirely sure about that...
 
Interesting thread on commitment. I really struggle with the "how can you say our relationship is serious/committed, if you have someone else to live with" kind of thinking. Breaking it down to specific promises also helped me to understand.

Hubby insists that's why I'm polyamorous, because I didn't have enough love earlier in my life.
I wonder if this is a prime reason to pursuing polyamory for some people, and for how many. It kind of resonates with what I see with my partner, and why I think we are involved (need for a similar kind of attention, perhaps coming from a earlier lack). In my case, I think the same need rather translates into monogamous (co)dependency tendencies.
 
Well the children analogy isn't going to work for MK, Cat or Elle because none of them will ever have kids...lol.

I doubt if Cat would ever want another woman staying in her house, unless she was having sex with them. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want to live with two or more partners anyway.

I do travel for a living but it is hit or miss as to when I would even get to either location.

My main concern is in the future when I retire from this line of work. Then I would want everybody in the same area. Owning a small apartment building would be awesome.

So if I can just talk everyone into moving to Seattle and pitching in for a small apartment complex...lol
 
I suppose some people might define commitment as, "absolute loyalty to a particular partner." In other words, "I'll never break up with you no matter what." Using that definition, you couldn't be "committed" to two people because either of them could put an ultimatum to you, to wit, "You have to break up with me or with the other person."
 
I suppose some people might define commitment as, "absolute loyalty to a particular partner." In other words, "I'll never break up with you no matter what." Using that definition, you couldn't be "committed" to two people because either of them could put an ultimatum to you, to wit, "You have to break up with me or with the other person."

I would look at that as the person putting forth the ultimatum is the one breaking up.

"If you don't break up with the other person I will leave you."
 
I agree ... though I also wonder if some people might take a rather sloppy view of the logistics there.
 
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