Total newcomer, need some insight...

[mumbles]

Hello all,

I need some help. I only have one friend close enough to talk about this with.

It all started with a slightly peculiar conversation with my wife, Kiara. We were discussing threesomes, and who we would have if we did. The topic came to one girl in particular, my friend Kelsey, because we both knew I had a crush on her, though we hadn't mutually acknowledged it prior to then.

I'd briefly considered an affair with her, but it was easily dismissed. I love Kiara with all my heart and I wasn't going to do anything to jeopardize our marriage.

So back to the discussion. Basically, we were both aware of how I felt about Kelsey. Kiara is pretty sexually adventurous, but not really interested in a threesome. To make a long story short, we talked a bit about if it would be okay for me to go out and "play" with Kelsey.

To be clear, I'm not emotionally attracted to her. She's just a good friend that I'm really sexually attracted to. I could never see myself with her in any kind of committed relationship or anything like that. My wife is where it's at, for me.

So, we've been talking on and off about it. It was surprising to me that Kiara was relatively open to the idea (it wasn't my plan at all), and she seems pretty open to it now. But I have two problems.

First, I just can't convince myself that she's really alright with it. I still feel like I'd be wronging Kiara, even if she told me to go out and "have a good time."

Second, and perhaps more or less trivially, I'm not 100% sure that Kelsey is actually that interested in me. I suspect she is. From what I can tell, there's been a lot of sexual tension between us, but with me being married, she's never been particularly overt. We flirt quite a bit, and we hang out a lot, mostly with Kiara around, occasionally not.

So the question is, assuming we go forward, how how do I have this discussion with Kelsey? I've run it through my head a million ways, and the best thing I can think of is to just ask her if she has any feelings for me. If so, we can continue the conversation, and if not, I can tell her I was "just checking," to put Kiara at ease (or something like that.)

Any comments? I need help!

 

[Tonberry]

I have a few comments.

First, I had a suggestion: flirt with Kelsey in front of Kiara (if Kiara is fine with that). If you kiss her, do it while Kiara is around, etc. It would then be obvious to her that Kelsey is okay with it. It would be awkward, but less awkward than an "Is he cheating?" situation.

Secondly, you wanted to ask if she had feelings for you, and only go ahead if she said yes. But you don't have feelings for her, you only want sex. It seems unfair to me to lead her on if she does has feelings for you. It's important that you're clear with her that you only want sex, not a romantic relationship.

And finally, what if you do develop feelings for her later? Is Kiara okay with that, as well? That's a common problem, I hear. Some swingers develop feelings for a playmate and are introduced to polyamory that way. Unfortunately, this can also cause a lot of hurt. Some people are fine with the sexual aspect, but not with the emotional one at all. Check with Kiara exactly where she stands on this, so you can be sure.

 

[mumbles]

Thanks for the response.

1. That's a good suggestion, and I have flirted with Kelsey in the past around Kiara. I think she was aware of how I felt, but never held it against me. I am hyper-sexed, I suppose, and Kiara understands that pretty well. (We have been been together 10 years, married for 3.)

Re: kissing, that's probably a good idea - but I'm not sure how to get to that point from basically friends with sexual tension. And I'm not sure Kelsey's interested, although I guess there's only one way to find out... In the previous example, I assumed I would just say, "Kiara and I have talked about this, and it's all alright." Now that you mention it, though, I suppose it would make it clearer. Kelsey could think I was lying. Who knows?

I could probably fool around a little bit with both of them in the room, but I'm not sure where to go from there. Kiara is pretty clearly not interested in a threesome. Maybe it would just be to kind of bring her slowly on board to the idea?

2. I probably used the wrong words. Feelings are complicated, of course, but I can say with certainty that what I'm talking about is 100% sexual attraction. I could go on, but suffice to say there's enough about her that I'm in no way interested in any other form of relationship - part of the reason why I think it might work. What I meant by feelings was if Kelsey's attracted to me sexually, basically.

I guess the way I have envisioned it, it would just be a FwB thing, for fun, maybe until Kelsey finds a steady boyfriend. (Ironically, I'm her go-to wingman for picking up guys. I seem to have a knack for chatting folks up.) Something like, "Hey, if you're jonesing, we can hook up, no questions asked, and if not, absolutely no worries."

I should also add that Kiara and I were both virgins when we met, and to this day we're each other's "one and onlys." When we were talking we both expressed regret that we've never had ANY other partners.

3. Obviously I can't predict the future, but I have no interest in a full poly relationship; I just want some fun with a friend I trust. From what I can tell, Kiara is actually okay to the idea of the sex, just like you said. Neither of us would be okay with an emotional involvement, and I know for a fact that I don't want one.

Kiara made the comparison that "it's not much different than watching porn," and that's kind of how I feel about it.

I'd love to hear what you have to say to this.

 

[GroundedSpirit]

Hey Mumbles,

I think Tonberry hit on many of the points (and cautions) that came immediately to my mind too. It IS a slippery slope. Once you start there's all kinds of directions it could drift. Some of those could be wonderful; some could be disaster.

Maybe the most important thing to remember and plan for is that if you and Kelsey really clicked in bed, more than likely you'll both want it to continue. And THAT is when it gets tricky.

I don't know your wife. And maybe there are these types of pieces you don't know either. Fantasy is one thing. Reality is often different. We might think it would be all innocent fun. And maybe, if it were a total stranger at some place we'd never be again, it could be. Doesn't sound like the case here.

Is Kiara a 'thinker' type? Maybe you should engage the thinker about all the directions this could take, then see how she feels.

I also like what Tonberry suggested about a kiss when all together. Not just a little peck. A nice long, deep tongue kiss, groping hands etc. THEN see how you all feel about it.

Kiara might well be the type to want to offer you something hot for a little variation. It can be a good feeling to do this for someone you love. But you need to play the part out to the extreme, because there's no telling it won't go there once you start. The sexual chemistry. The love that might develop. More of a full sharing in each other's lives. Play the scenerio out to the max and all see how it feels, just in case.

 

[mumbles]

Thanks, good advice. One thing I really didn't consider at all was where it could lead. I just assumed it would be easy to pull the plug on things.

Kiara is complicated, I guess. Maybe you can help me with this. She's never been very adventurous past the standard items, but she's always been a good lover, and has always satisfied my needs, within reason. I've been unsatisfied before, but I understand that it's me with the hyper-drive; I'd say her sex drive is good too, but not like mine. I guess I'm just saying I've never held it against her.

Now, there are two things--

1. She's sought help for some (albeit fairly mild) depression. Been on meds for some time now, and she's doing great, basically back to the person I fell in love with.
2. I've noticed that since I was getting a little more flirty with Kelsey, she's been more sexually attentive. I figure either she's a little jealous and trying to get my interest back where it belongs, or she just likes the idea of me being "in demand," or maybe a combination of both.

I bring up the meds because I can't be sure there isn't a correlation there, too. There probably is. She's been significantly happier and more confident on them, for what it's worth.

So confused. We're having Kelsey over this weekend. Not sure if I should try to get anything started or not. Probably not.

 

[Tonberry]

I guess I'm just saying I've never held it against her...

How do you have sex then?

I think a very important thing would be to choose your words carefully. Here you said you'd ask her if she had feelings for you. It meant something to you, I read it as something different. If you had phrased it that way with her, it could have ended badly. I think using words like "Are you attracted to me?" or something would be better. Also, try to be clear from the get-go that you do not have feelings for her beyond friendship and aren't expecting them to develop, or even that you don't want them to develop.

It might seem a bit weird and awkward to talk about that, but you do want things to be very clear with her, as she could have misconceptions.

Also, you might want to ask yourself-- what if she does have feelings for you? What then? Do you still pursue the relationship for the sex aspect only, or do you drop it? What if she has no feelings now, but develops them later?

It's good to think of different scenarios that might arise. This way, if they do, you're prepared. If they don't, good!

You could keep flirting with Kelsey while she's over, maybe try going a little further. I agree it's hard to know step by step what to do, since it's often more like one big leap... But it's usually best to improvise on the moment rather than plan every little action. It's more natural.

 

[mumbles]

How do I have sex with her? Many, many ways.

But yeah, I see what you're saying. And being a little clear and business-like is sort of how I was planning on approaching it. You make a good point about being clear with the language, too.

If she really had feelings for me, I would have to call it off. It wouldn't be fair to her. And she's a good friend. I actually want her to meet someone cool. I'm just thinking of occupying her time (just a teensy bit) while she's on the hunt, for fun. If she developed feelings, I'd have to nix it. Just say, we're friends, that's it.

Thanks for talking this out with me. It's a great help! You have no idea.

 

[redpepper]

This thread has one big red flag on it for me... maybe because you are not describing yourself as polyamorous. Maybe because all I see is your selfish want to fuck your friend. Sorry, but it just doesn't sit well with me. I am glad that you are thinking of others other than yourself (excuse me, your cock). At least that is promising.

I hear you when you say Kelsey is a good friend. I hear you when you say you will just back away if emotions get sticky. I hear you when you say that you just want to fuck her. But what does that say to her? What does that say to Kiara about her worth as a sexual woman?

As a woman who has been used in this way, it says, "You are worth nothing to me other than the hole between you legs." Presented any other way and it still adds up to that. You want to masturbate in her. Yup, I agree with Kiara-- watch some porn and you will create less damage. Kelsey is your friend. She trusts you, relies on you and appreciates your help where men are concerned. You will likely jeopardize all that, and add to her lack of self worth, and cause her to distrust men.

Kiara is leading the way in this, it seems. Fuck her senseless and use it to better your relationship. She sounds just awesome to me. Why wreck it? Why not enhance it? That is what my poly is about, anyway, enhancing love, and creating more, not creating less and pushing it for a fuck.

That being said, if you had mentioned love in there for one moment, I would have a world of ideas for you! But you haven't. You have said you are not interested in polyamory. I'm sorry, but unless there is some change in your feelings about Kelsey, then I don't have anything for you.

 

[redpepper]

Welllll, as it seems to go, my bf Mono thinks I have been too aggressive. I likely have come across that way, and if so, then I apologize. I am blunt and passionate about things sometimes, and it comes across as aggressive to others who don't know me. I'm sure you are a good guy; I just forget that people have not lived what I have and can see my concern as judgement. I am not judging; I am trying to save your friend from possible heartbreak if you and she decide to get it on without thought. I know you and Kelsey are not me. I realise that I only know part of the story. It might go swimmingly, and if it does, then that is awesome. I hope that regardless of that, I have at least given you some food for thought.

I wish you all the best and good luck.

 

[vodkafan]

Welllll, as it seems to go, my bf Mono thinks I have been too aggressive. I likely have come across that way, and if so, then I apologize. I am blunt and passionate about things sometimes, and it comes across as aggressive to others who don't know me. I'm sure you are a good guy. I just forget that people have not lived what I have, and can see my concern as judgement. I am not judging; I am trying to save your friend from possible heartbreak if you and she decide to get it on without thought. I know you and Kelsey are not me. I know that I only know part of the story. It might go swimmingly, and if it does, then that is awesome. I hope that regardless of that. I have at least given you some food for thought. I wish you all the best and good luck.

I think you were pretty much right on the money, Redpepper. Several red flags went up for me. A big one is about Kiara being depressed and on medication. Maybe, Mumbles, you should be thinking 100% about Kiara, and making her all better, before you think about chasing down someone else?

 

[mumbles]

That's alright, Redpepper. It's nice to hear it from all angles, because I certainly can't see them all.

My wife's medication isn't a negative concern. I actually tried to keep her off of it for quite a while, and she finally insisted, and she's been perfectly happy and adjusted since. I might add, if it matters, that she'd been depressed all her life, and says she is finally feeling like "she should."

Thanks for the thoughts, folks. I appreciate it.

 

[mumbles]

Negative concern? Sorry, I'm a little nervous composing my thoughts, especially after that tongue lashing. j/k. It was a helpful perspective. Now that I have a second, I do want to respond a little bit. I think it's helping me get my head on straight.

First of all, I never claimed to be polyamorous, or really pursuing that arrangement. Kiara and I are so very in love, and our relationship gets tighter and stronger every year. I guess the arrangement I'm talking about would be more akin to swinging. It was my understanding the definitions on these things tended to be kind of vague. If I'm treading in the wrong forum, ticking people off, I heartily apologize. I kind of thought this forum covered all topics, even though it's titled polyamory. If it matters, I got here from a link that suggested it would be helpful.

Anyway, I'm not a veteran poster, so forgive my lack of quoting. I'll just kind of address each line item:

I don't think I would even want to go so far as intercourse with Kelsey; honestly, more like a foot rub and some fooling around. I don't know, it's confusing.

I really appreciate what you're saying about Kelsey. To be totally honest, I hadn't really considered her feelings at all! I've been so fixated on Kiara, and what's motivating her to encourage this.

If it matters, I know Kelsey is extremely sexually adventurous. I wouldn't even be considering this if she weren't. I guess what I'm saying is, based on her behavior, I can see it not being too big of a deal.

That being said, it does get me thinking... She might just be too damn good a friend to want to risk hurting her. I could never forgive myself if I did end up hurting her badly. There is a possibility that I would. Maybe this is hard to swallow, but I just hadn't thought that it was even possible, just because it's hard for me to think that someone other than Kiara could be emotionally attracted to me. We're perfect for each other. No one gets me like she does, and vice versa.

On the same point, what did really speak to me was:

"Kelsey is your friend. She trusts you, relies on you and appreciates your help where men are concerned."

That is basically the exact nature of our relationship. I'd almost be her gay bestie, if only I were gay. (Though I'm not gonna lie, I do have a good eye for dudes. )

Now that I think about it, Kelsey might actually be closer to me than I realize, and it might be because she trusts me, and isn't threatened by me, because she knows I'm married. I guess if I can take anything away from what you said, it's that she's a person too, and it's not fair to just consider myself and Kiara in the equation, and treat someone I regard as a good friend as an object, which is really how I was thinking about it, in hindsight!

As far as Kiara leading the way-- she did bring it up. She'd picked up on it already. And I don't know why, but she's never been very jealous. To put it in perspective, I've slept over at Kelsey's house before, when Kiara was out of town, and vice versa. Of course, nothing's ever happened. Our hanging out is more like a guy's night out. No drinking and driving, of course, so we crash at each other's places every now and then, y'know, on the couch. I don't know if that's really material to the situation, but, eh.

I should add, Redpepper, that we both discussed this. Kiara was intrigued by the idea of "going off the reservation" herself. In a weird way, I guess we were both lamenting the fact that neither of us have had any other sexual partners. Upon thinking about her having another partner, of course, my very initial reaction was a brief twinge of jealousy, but immediately erased by a feeling of excitement. For instance, I know Kiara has a "thing" for Black guys, and it made me excited to think of her getting to hook up with a guy she liked. I'd just be really eager to find out if she liked it, and how much (and if she learned any tips for me-- we're both always adding to the repertoire). She said, "Would it make you jealous?" And we both just shrugged, and realized that no, it wasn't really bothering either of us.

I think the right thing to do is to let Kiara make the calls. I like the idea of hanging out together and just being close. The attraction is there, yeah, and I guess I can't say that I don't care for Kelsey on some emotional level, being as close as we are. I don't know if I mentioned it, but it may not be clear that Kiara and Kelsey are friends, as well, just not as close friends as Kelsey and I are. We actually grew up together. I met Kiara a little later.

 

[redpepper]

Thanks for your reply. Mumbles. You remind me of my non-sexual bf. We don't have sex, but are close enough that we consider each other a partner. He also is married to a woman that he met when he was very young. When I met him, they had been only with each other. He was tempted to try out other women just for experience, and so was she. She dated my husband for a short time, and now they are friends. We spend a great deal of family time with them, and go on trips, camping, etc., together 3-4 times a year.

We both realized that we had feelings for one another. But by the time I met him on a dating site, I'd met Mono, too. I met them during the same timeframe, but fell for Mono instantly, and more slowly for my NSBF. By the time I realized it, and so had he, Mono and I had made our boundaries and had agreed to adding no more men into my life, sexually. I had been swinging, dating, having one-offs for a long time at that point, and was tired of the way I had been treated. I am and was fine with agreeing to no more sexual partners with men. This didn't mean that I was to have no relationships that were connected. So my NSBF and I decided that this was how our relationship was going to be.

He thought he was not a person that would connect sex with emotional connection, and still doesn't know one way or another. He has been able to explore for himself what sex with others is about. His wife has had several one-night stands, two lovers, and done a whole lot of swinging since then, and he has watched and participated some. He is unsure he needs or wants more.

His wife is now seeming quite a different person. She comes across differently somehow, and although I think she is wonderful, I worry about her self esteem and feelings of self worth because of all her adventures. I hope she is okay, but I know full well what giving one's body away does to someone who is easily emotionally attached during sex, and as a result of it, rather than detached. For me, it meant cutting my mind away from my body, and eventually led to my not caring what I did with my body, because I felt nothing and it felt nothing.

I totally get that you want to experience something that you haven't before and I don't see anything wrong with that. I just am worried about your approach thus far. This is something that you have not experienced before and you seem to be taking it very lightly, as if there are no real people involved. Sex with others can change EVERYTHING about the relationship. I can almost guarantee that one of the three of you will be changed afterwards.

This is not to say don't do it. Just be aware of this and work out as much as you can ahead of time. Just walking away is not an option if you want to have integrity and care about your friend. Her being sexually adventurous does not mean she is easy and it will be a breeze. You don't know her relationship with her adventures. She might be struggling with them inside. They might've been one-night stands and not with friends. They might've been due to a number of reasons that perhaps she has not shared details about with you.

All of the past leads to now. What people have said and done in the past means nothing when sex is initiated and happening... it's what to do with the energy it creates afterwards, keeping in mind the past and what changes happened during sex. I am talking for the two women... but also for you! You don't know what you will feel. It sounds to me like you could have the capacity to experience more love and closeness and connection than perhaps you anticipate or want at the moment. Something to consider, perhaps.

 

[SNeacail]

What RP said.

The truth is, you already do have feelings for Kelsey, which may be why you are so drawn to want sex with her. You may just be someone who can't do casual sex..You may need that emotional connection first.

I would not use Kelsey to satisfy your need to experiment. Instead, keep her as your close friend. My husband has a close friend that for years we have all called his other wife. There is no sexual relationship, and I think if that were added, it would destroy what they do have (mostly due to her background and issues).

Just out of curiosity, are you coming from a strong religious background?

 

[mumbles]

Thanks for the words, guys. I hope I'm not bothering you guys; it feels so good to have some people to talk with. I don't want to stop, even if I'm just going over things.

@SNeacail: Kiara and I are both atheists; we see the world as a brief opportunity to live and enjoy ourselves and experience things. When you believe there is no afterlife (we look at it differently than a belief, of course, but I don't want to offend anyone), you realize that paradise is here, every day we get to be here and be together, and be with our friends, and have fun.

Clearly that perspective matters a lot. Things would be drastically different if we both (or really, Kiara) came from a religious background. We were both raised Catholic, and we both came to our atheism on our individual terms.

You might even call us hedonists, *shrug*.

@redpepper: One thing I've noticed and have been comforted by, is how open you guys are to emotional closeness.

A little more background... So, Kelsey and I were friends growing up, as I mentioned; not as close back then as now. She was kind of quiet and usually in the background. I remember the first time we really connected was way back in high school. Long story short, I'd just been rejected pretty hard, and she was there to comfort me. That moment has always stuck out, because it was really awkward for me, and I felt like I really didn't have a friend in the world (so dramatic, I know).

Anyway, I only saw her every now and then during college; and during college she grew out of her shell, so to speak. After college, I moved away for a few years to take a decent job. Kiara and I hated it there, so we eventually saved up and moved back here, basically to be near our friends.

It's since we've moved back that I've had a closer relationship with Kelsey. It started slow, I guess. And I'd be lying if I said I didn't make myself available to her. I found she was really easy to talk to, and she became my only female confidant. Now, during this time, I was definitely getting confusing feelings. Like I said, I'm attracted to her sexually, and maybe now it's time to admit to myself that there is an emotional involvement, however it's defined.

So, as this was happening, I was really worried about infidelity. I felt like I was crossing a line, by sharing what I was sharing with her. I read about "emotional infidelity," which, according to most of those definitions, I'd probably committed. It's hard to gauge. I shared details about my marriage with her, talked about some things that were bothering me. My marriage was actually doing okay. We were getting along fine, etc. We were just in an odd rut. Odd that, basically we had been getting along 'too' well, if that makes sense, and the status quo disruption was strange at first. It's hard to explain. Anyway, I shared that with Kelsey, and she gave me good help from a woman's perspective, and it helped a lot.

I guess that was a long way of saying, it never occurred to me that it might be okay for me to bond with Kelsey more, and to be closer friends than I felt comfortable being, and that could be totally alright. I do care about her; I think trying to deny that fact was a bit of mental gymnastics on my account, and it took being called on it to really realize that.

Redpepper, you're right. When it's a friend you care about, it's just different, and I think anything contrary to that is in the realm of fantasy. It's like... if everyone's 'net' happiness goes up because of it, that's a good thing, but you don't want to do anything that would cause a net loss. That's just not what this is about.

So I guess here's where it stands... Kiara is open to the idea, or at least mulling it over. Next time it comes up I'm going to talk to her about how it would effect Kelsey, and each of our relationships.

It was a relief that Kiara didn't judge me for my feelings about Kelsey, and now it's in the open and I don't have to feel shitty about it. I'm going to just do what feels right. And if "something" were to happen organically, and feel right, then maybe I'll let that happen. But I'm not going to screw Kelsey over and fuck with her head..That has to be the number-one priority.

Another confession, Kelsey has regretted some things she's done, and has told me such. She was a hard-partying girl in those days. It's shitty of me to have thought that she'd act how I was thinking-- sort of just how you described.

I think what's been made clear to me is, when it comes to people that are your close friends, you've already passed casual sex. When you could have it with someone anonymous, when it's a close friend there's just no way around it. You have to consider their feelings because they're going to be a part of you.

So to add to that, what I'm hearing is, "Yes, of course it could work. That's obviously what this is about," with the huge BUT it's just not as simple as fooling around-- it's entering into a different social contract. And that's a big deal, like a commitment.

We're going to just keep hanging out, spending time with the three of us. We'll see what happens.

 

[mumbles]

While I'm at it, I'm curious what anyone has to say about Kiara's increased sex drive/curiosity. I touched on it earlier, but it wasn't the central point.

Basically she's become a LOT, LOT more confident in how she looks. I've always thought she was sexy, but she never did. It seems like her whole outlook changed when she started to "feel" sexy and powerful.

The other thing is, knowing what I know, there almost has to be some correlation between her and my relationship with Kelsey. But I can't tell if it's her trying to keep my attention on her, or if she's intrigued by the idea that I might be "in demand." It's hard to say. I do know if she were really jealous she'd have no problem telling me. That's a trust thing, and we trust each other to be 100% honest. But then again...

 

[SNeacail]

It seems like her whole outlook changed when she started to feel sexy and powerful.

This can make a world of difference. I get way more ramped up when I have been exercising regularly, I know I'm not really sexy (too overweight), but I do start feeling powerful, and it definitely affects my need/desire for sex.

The other thing is, knowing what I know, there almost has to be some correlation between her and my relationship with Kelsey. But I can't tell if it's her trying to keep my attention on her, or if she's intrigued by the idea that I might be "in demand." It's hard to say. I do know if she was really jealous she'd have no problem telling me; that's a trust thing...

I would suspect it is a combination of all of the above. Are you communicating with each other more? Are you discussing your likes and dislikes more? All of these things can also make a difference.

Does Kiara know that you share intimate details of the marriage with Kelsey? I had a problem with this quite a few years ago, but I'm not sure I would have the same issues today, as I'm in a completely different place with regard to their (and our) relationship. The biggest problem, was that I had no idea he was sharing such personal details with her until she brought it up one time. I really don't like finding out stuff by accident.

You say you are atheists, but were both raised Catholic. I would guess this Catholic background and its values play a big role in your idea of what is okay and not okay regarding marriage and relationships. We have spent most of our lives having people pound into us that it can only be one way, and anything else is wrong, that we have a hard time breaking that conditioning.

 

[redpepper]

Have you talked about this on any other forums? Swinging ones, perhaps? The mandate seems to be no emotional bonding, yet you seem to have a history and deep friendship already. I would wonder what would be said about that on a swinging forum. I don't know any swingers that would have been content to rub my feet. The idea is to take, not to give, or to give so as to take, if you see what I mean.

It's strange, the increased sex drive thing. I think it's the communication and honesty that does it, and respect for feelings, too. All that goes a long way for me sexually, as I have alluded to already. Take care of someone and have integrity and people think you're hot and want to seduce you. I don't think its that you are in demand. That's your ego talking. I really think it's that you are treating her well and staying honest about your needs, while respecting hers. She is proud to be with you, I think, and finds that sexy. From a woman's perspective, and from my own, that's what makes people fuckable. Enjoy!

 

[Derbylicious]

This isn't sitting well with me. It seems like you're almost trying to find a way to trick Kelsey into being a bed buddy. It's all well and good that Kiara is on board with this, but Kelsey is a complete person too, not just a sex toy. If the two of you had met at a swinger's event, and both mutually just wanted no-strings-attached sex, that would be one thing, but here you are with a friend, whom you claim to really like, and it seems to me that you are reducing her to nothing more than body parts.

It's very hard to predict what kind of emotions are going to come out of having sex with someone. Even if you both decide ahead of time that you are not going to become romantically involved with each other, sometimes these feelings happen. From what you said, if either of you developed feelings, then you would pull away. I can't imagine that would do much for her sense of self worth, if she happened to fall in love with you.

If you want to pursue this relationship, go for it, but I would suggest talking to Kiara about the possibility that it might become more than just a FWB scenario. Once feelings are involved, things can get pretty messy pretty quickly. If all you want is NSA sex, you might be better off at a swinger's club. You can then continue to have the sexual-tension friendship with Kelsey and just enjoy it for what it is. Getting involved with a friend either ends very well or very badly. Are you willing to lose her as a friend if things don't go well? Would that be worth the sex to you?

 

[mumbles]

I haven't talked about this anywhere else. I just stumbled here the other day. What I read made it sound like this was more of a catch-all, with a primary focus.

Anyway, I just had a good conversation with Kiara. I'm going to let her read up, and maybe weigh in, if she's up to it.