What a mess!

S

SeBa

New member
I was in a 10-year relationship (with Joel, monogamous) when I discovered I loved my best friend too (Luke, monogamous). After a very long period in which me and Joel talked about the whole thing, he agreed to let me explore the new relationship. He wasn't totally ok with it. He "did it for me," as he says. There were some "rules":
- nobody (except the three of us) has to know about my new relationship (neither relatives, friends... )
- Luke and I see each other only when Joel is at work
- don't rush things (so Joel could get used to the situation)

It's been 7 months now, and after some "fights," we have eliminated the second rule (or it was almost impossible for me and Luke, who lives out of town, to stay together).

But after all this time, Joel is not working yet, and everything else stays the same. Nobody knows about me and Luke. We have to hide. It's horrible because I'm always nervy when we go out. If someone sees us it would be a disaster for Joel. There's no opportunity to plan holidays, nights out and so on. I have to split the time because Joel doesn't want to be in the same place with Luke. He's jealous and he's worried about the others. So the three of us never go out together or discuss the relationship/problems. To be honest, Luke and Joel don't talk each other at all.

Luke feels alone, left out and has started to hate Joel. He's tired because of the restrictions, tired of hiding our relationship, not living a "real" relationship. Joel says he doesn't know how to "work" on things, and he's ok like that. I feel pressured, and I know Luke won't endure this situation for long. I'm desperate. I don't know what to do.:(
 
I'm pretty much in the same boat with my girlfriend and it sucks. At some point something has to give. Its an unhealthy situation. Your husband is going to have to relax his stance on communicating and working on it or you are probably going to have to end one of the two relationships. That is how this always seems to boil down. The resentment between the two metamours is poison. It may kill both relationships.
 
Yes, I know that I'll probably need to choose, it's too complicated and I feel so frustrated. And yes, that resentment is already poison. It won't end well, I know, but I can't accept I can't do anything to avoid this.
 
Joel needs to understand that he cannot control your feelings for Luke by restricting your access to him. He can only change your feelings for him. If he is going to consent to you having a relationship with Luke, he needs to give you the freedom to maintain it and you have to continue to meet his needs from you as well. Has either if them considered seeing other people? I think you should actively suggest it and do what you can to facilitate it so everyone has a good example of how this can be beneficial for all.

As for family, it's really your decision on whether you want to tell your family but if you all know each others families, you could unintentionally out someone.
 
I agree, but Joel continues to say that he can't handle the pain, the whole situation, that he doesn't want to see me and Luke together (kissing, hugging, holding hands, talking for too long).

He's very scared about other's judgement. He says they wouldn't understand and he can't bear questions, critics and all the rest.

At the moment they don't want to see nobody else but me. They are so, so, so monogamous. I believe we have to solve our "triad" problem first.
 
SeBa said:
At the moment they don't want to see nobody else but me, they are so, so, so monogamous. Than, I believe we have to solve our "triad" problem first.
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Just for your edification you guys are a "V", not a "triad". A triad would suggest that all three members are romantically involved with each other. A V just means two parties are romantically in love with the third (you).

There is a difference between a monogamous person, and a person who wants YOU to be monogamous. It is apparently possible for poly folk to date monogamous people, but as far as I can tell, it is not possible for poly folk to date someone who wants them to be monogamous.

I would say you are currently in the second group.

SeBa said:
He wasn't totally ok with it. He "did it for me," as he says.
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Sounds like that 'sacrifice' is working out really well for him, like most sacrifice does. He did it because he figured you would dump him if he didn't. So, he did it for himself and has regretted it ever since.

SeBa said:
Nobody knows about me and Luke. We have to hide. And it's horrible, because I'm always nervy when we go out. If someone sees us it would be a disaster for Joel.
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Why? Is Joel the pope and you guys live in Vatican City?
 
I suggest you read around the boards. Read the morethantwo website. Read the books Opening Up, and Ethical Slut.

You can't be polyamorous and have all this ill will, refusal to communicate, open resentment. Poly means all parties are willing and accepting and approving of their SO's others, not grudgingly allowing it and hating it and grumping about it all the time.
 
It seems like you went ahead with it despite Joel not agreeing to do it with joy in his heart. He was "doing it for you." He could have articulated his own limits better. That's on his end of it.

On your end of it, in your eagerness to go ahead, perhaps you ignored the big ol' "NO!" that he was saying, non-verbally. You didn't do enough talking amongst the three of you about agreements changing over time, identifying the skills needed to run a good polyship over time, rather than launching it and then crashing right back down from lack of preparedness.

I mean that kindly, I'm not judging here. I know you are hurting. :( Sometimes it happens this way. The thing to do is to regroup. Having had this experience, you could try to move it FORWARD, rather than staying stuck.

IME, when "words" and "actions" do not match, believe the actions. Talk is cheap when not backed with actions.

So now there's this situation you all co-created where all players are miserable.

You are the hinge. You could make the call to "land the polyship." Take some time out to regroup. Have a talk in trio to sort all this out, up to and including talking out some "breaking up" possibilities:
Break up with Joel
Break up with Luke.
Break up with both

Ask your partners how they would feel about those, and how they feel about:

  • Not polyshipping at all anymore with this combo of players.
  • Not polyshipping like this anymore. Do it another way instead. What agreements would need adjustments for all to be better?
  • Staying how it is with no changes. (<--- I can't see any of you picking that when all are sad. :( )

Your 3-person polyship is flying wonky like this. There's smoke coming out. You can choose to land it now, or choose to keep "flying wonky" until you crash and burn. I suggest landing it. You all choose to own it and do the relationship maintenance required.

The crew members need more training (all of you),
The crew members need to be allowed to leave with grace on land, and not jump out a window,
The polyship agreements are wonky and need repair/restructure,
Or all the above.

I'm not sure which. Maybe you all don't know either. This could be the time to assess what it is you have going on here and FIND OUT. I do know you cannot carry on this way, with no changes, and expect "healthy" or "fun" for all of you as outcomes.

Maybe these could help you:

But before going down those roads, take a head count. Who is still WILLING and ABLE to undertake this mission? To me, it sounds like Joel is NOT really willing, and NOT really able, with his skills at this time. It is not kind of you to plunge on ahead anyway. :(

And if you and/or Luke are pussyfooting about communication, maybe yours and Luke's skills could use strengthening too. You might be WILLING, but not yet ABLE.

There are also hinge skills. In this polyship, that means YOU. Sometimes the hinge has to make the call to end something, because you love your sweeties and want them to have LONG-TERM health, even if it means short term breakup suckage; because you love YOURSELF and don't want to burn out. 100% of your effort is still only 33% of the total fuel required to run a three-person thing. :(

You could all sit down to talk and identify where in this particular polyship the things that need to happen are, and who is going to take what part of it on their plate. That doesn't mean you do it all because you are the hinge. You will burn out.

But you as the hinge could assume some leadership herem at least lead to the "talking it out" space. It doesn't even matter right now towards WHAT exactly... just not HERE anymore. What are the strengths? What are the weaknesses? What could you all do here? Get things moving FORWARD.

Hang in there! I hope you can pull through this hard time one way or another. Stay together and be healthy, or part and be healthy.

Galagirl
 
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Thank you all very much!

Marcus, you're right, they would prefer I was monogamous. Joel shares polyamorous ideas, but he stays mono, Luke doesn't understand how can I love two people, but he says he accepts that.

Joel's too bound to his family and doesn't want them to know. He says they'd judge and he can't bear it right now. So we have to hide everything, from our friends too. So hard!

I've read all I found (books, forums...), but maybe isn't enough. This is my first poly relationship and I don't know what to do.

Yes, we have to talk, as soon as possible, but I'm scared because Luke is so full of hate. He's mad at Joel and doesn't want to see him. On the other hand, Joel thinks Luke is rushing everything.

GalaGirl, I agree with every single word you say. We have to move, but I don't know how. I can't imagine the three of us in the same room, talking gently, in a mature way... seems impossible!
 
Well, maybe you could examine the HOW of talking together. If not in "face time" with all in the same room, and all agreeing on some conflict resolution method... then HOW to execute it. Over Skype, by email, snail mail, with a counselor?

Maybe everyone could turn in talking points to make a bullet list, and that's ALL for the first time out. Next appt, tackle some of it. Then if anyone freaks out and emotionally floods, you agree to stop. You can put a star on the bullet you got to, and put it all away til the next appointment to talk some more.

Nobody says you have to break down the elephant in one sitting. Take it in baby steps.

But if nobody is willing to bend on limitations, then you all could accept the limitations will NOT change in time. These are not "soft limits" you face, but "hard limits," and as much as everyone likes each other, this polyship cannot fly.

Free everyone, because you love them, and don't want to anyone to be suffering with no end in sight. There is nothing wrong with changing it to friends. A good friend is nothing to sneeze at.
 
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